"For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus."—1 Timothy 2:5
Nothing here about a pope.
Nothing here about a pope.
The protestant reformation.
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kaylagrl
Guest
How do you know you are part of the true church and everyone else isn't? And you totally didn't answer any of my points.
I didn't say that I'm the only one. Though I notice you have this tendency to twist whatever I say and launch into personal attacks, though I have not launched into any personal attack against you or for that matter any of the others here that have launched into personal attacks on me.
This is frankly amazing footage. So this is what protestantism has given us (among so many other terrible things); clear proof they are of the kingdom of Pandemonium.
No one "changes things" within the Catholic church. That was already proved by John Wycliffe and the Reformers. So for a "born again" person to remain within Catholicism is to support False Christianity. Indulgences -- for example -- are still an integral part of the Catholic church.
Looks like many posters have gone off on tangents instead of actually talking about the Reformation. Christians are commanded to make righteous judgments, which means both the pros and the cons of the Reformation should be presented. And there is absolutely no question that many fine, outstanding Christians have been a part of the Protestant Reformation. Even more importantly, had it not been for the Reformation, Bibles would not be freely available in all languages today. It was the insistence of the Reformers that the Word of God be made freely available to ordinary people.
At the same time, one of the most shameful things which came out of the Reformation was the persecution and extermination of genuine Christians -- such as the Anabaptists -- because they refused to go along with certain ideas of the Reformers. The Reformers also ignored the fact that the state had no business in regulating religion, or making churches into "state churches".
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pottersclay
Guest
Reguardless of your view about a true church....the church cant save you only christ can.
The bride of christ is found as a virgin, holy and righteous because she is in christ not in a church.
What is the true church?....those that hear beleive and do the will of the father.
We are not here to promote a church...or to judge others....but to do the work of the father.
The church is hidden in plain sight in the old testament. It becomes a light on a hill for all to see in the new.
The bride of christ is found as a virgin, holy and righteous because she is in christ not in a church.
What is the true church?....those that hear beleive and do the will of the father.
We are not here to promote a church...or to judge others....but to do the work of the father.
The church is hidden in plain sight in the old testament. It becomes a light on a hill for all to see in the new.
That is it right there, the Virgin Bride! She is our Kingdom, praise Jesus he will have his Virgin Bride. Death to Mystery Babylon Mother of Whores and Abominations. Two women, two kingdoms, one dies horrifically, one lives forever! Praise the King of Kings Lord Jesus Christ, he will miserably slaughter the Whore's children and he will save the children of the Virgin Bride and wipe our toil and tears away forever!
"Separation of Church and State" is a lie invented by Communists, Freemasons and other enemies of Christendom. You have Abortion because of it. 2 Billion Innocent Children, including in Christian-Majority Countries, have been slaughtered in Abortion-Killing. This would never ever have happened if there had been no separation of Church and State as is God Almighty's Eternal Design.
Jesus Christ is King of kings. Here is what Catholic Poland, staunchly pro-life, declared recently: Jesus Christ as King of their country.
"In a ceremony at the Church of Divine Mercy in Krakow last week, Jesus was declared the king of Poland.
The ceremony, attended by Poland's President Andrzej Duda, marked the end of the Catholic Church's Year of Mercy.
People from around the country came together and declared Christ king over their country and their hearts.
"In our hearts, rule us, Christ! In our families, rule us, Christ! ... In our schools and universities, rule us, Christ! ... Through the Polish nation, rule us, Christ! ... We pledge to defend your holy worship and preach Thy royal glory, Christ our King, we promise!" they prayed.
Their bold statement was a reminder that God comes before everything.
"We entrust the Polish people and Polish leaders to you," the prayer continued. "Make them exercise their power fairly and in accordance with your laws. ... rule us, Christ! Reign in our homeland and reign in every nation – for the greater glory of the most Holy Trinity and the salvation of mankind." https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/cwn/2016/november/poland-declares-jesus-king-of-the-country
There should be Religious Freedom for all, but the Church should inform the State on questions of Faith and Morality impacting Public Life like Abortion.
Jesus Christ is King of kings. Here is what Catholic Poland, staunchly pro-life, declared recently: Jesus Christ as King of their country.
"In a ceremony at the Church of Divine Mercy in Krakow last week, Jesus was declared the king of Poland.
The ceremony, attended by Poland's President Andrzej Duda, marked the end of the Catholic Church's Year of Mercy.
People from around the country came together and declared Christ king over their country and their hearts.
"In our hearts, rule us, Christ! In our families, rule us, Christ! ... In our schools and universities, rule us, Christ! ... Through the Polish nation, rule us, Christ! ... We pledge to defend your holy worship and preach Thy royal glory, Christ our King, we promise!" they prayed.
Their bold statement was a reminder that God comes before everything.
"We entrust the Polish people and Polish leaders to you," the prayer continued. "Make them exercise their power fairly and in accordance with your laws. ... rule us, Christ! Reign in our homeland and reign in every nation – for the greater glory of the most Holy Trinity and the salvation of mankind." https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/cwn/2016/november/poland-declares-jesus-king-of-the-country
There should be Religious Freedom for all, but the Church should inform the State on questions of Faith and Morality impacting Public Life like Abortion.
Sounds kind of perverse to me.
History of the claim to be Vicar of Christ
https://thetruthaboutcatholicism.com/new-blog/2015/6/13/who-is-the-vicar-of-christ
This outlandish assertion came relatively late in the history of the Papacy. To begin with, the Bishop of Rome claimed to be the vicar of Caesar and his successors the rightful heirs to the Caesars. The city that had been the seat of power for the Roman Empire became the city for the Bishop of Rome to exercise his authority. Gradually other Bishops and national monarchs accepted him as vicar and successor to Caesar with the same supreme title of “Pontifex Maximus”. Next the Bishops of Rome claimed to be “The vicar of the prince of the apostles”7, that is, the vicar of Peter.8 Thus in the early fifth century Bishop Innocent I (401-417AD) insisted that Christ had delegated supreme power to Peter and made him the Bishop of Rome. Following this he held that the Bishop of Rome as Peter’s successor was entitled to exercise Peter’s power and prerogatives. Boniface III, who became Bishop of Rome in 607, established himself as “Universal Bishop”, thus claiming to be vicar and master of all other bishops. It was not until the eighth century, however, that the particular title “Vicar of the Son of God”9 was found in the fraudulent document called “The Donation of Constantine”.10 Although this notorious document was proven false in the early sixteenth century, the Bishops of Rome have used the title “Vicar of Christ” since the eighth century. This title has been the Pope’s supreme claim to spiritual and temporal supremacy. The taste of divine power, with which the title resonates, has proven to be addictive. The “Vicar of Christ” is able to recognize no authority other than his own. He looks upon himself as Master of all, and boldly proclaims, “The First See is judged by no one.”11
If it is your fate, just eat and be merry!
Frog legs are the delicacy whether you like it or not!
Rev 16:12And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 14For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
A little thirsty? How about some wine?
19And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
What wrong dinner party? Then better learn to like wine and frog legs.
Frog legs are the delicacy whether you like it or not!
Rev 16:12And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. 14For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
A little thirsty? How about some wine?
19And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
What wrong dinner party? Then better learn to like wine and frog legs.
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kaylagrl
Guest
Nah, if I were launching personal attacks you'd know it. I'm direct, always. Now to answer my question, how do you know you are a part of this group. And so far, yes you seem to think you're the only one, at least here. So share with the rest of us so we can be part of this group too.
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kaylagrl
Guest
They are all and literally not metaphorically, don't seem like personal attacks to you? And rather generalized.
Here's the story of the so-called modern-day reformation; it goes like this: Back in the day, the religious establishment (Catholicism) hid and suppressed the truth from the people. Since a lot of people couldn't read and because the Roman Catholic Church forbade them to read the scriptures for themselves anyway, they remained in ignorance. When Martin Luther came along and when Bibles started being printed in the languages of the people that all changed. It was a legitimate reformation; doctrines had deliberately been suppressed and hidden from people.
Fast forward. The modern-day reformers try to say the same thing: that is, the religious establishment has quenched the spirit and hidden the truth from the people. But this doesn't work. People have had access to the scriptures to read and study for themselves for a long time; no one can hide anything. The modern-day reformers have given us barking like dogs, roaring like lions, walking on hands and knees on the floor like animals, being slain in the spirit (that is, lying on the floor and going into a trance), running, shaking, speaking gibberish which they call tongues, fits of laughter, "drunkenness" in the spirit. There are probably many more but all this is done in the name of not quenching the spirit. I'd like to know where any of this has been hidden in scripture and has only recently been rediscovered. If you don't buy into it you're labeled a religious Pharisee. This is their go-to put down.
Fast forward. The modern-day reformers try to say the same thing: that is, the religious establishment has quenched the spirit and hidden the truth from the people. But this doesn't work. People have had access to the scriptures to read and study for themselves for a long time; no one can hide anything. The modern-day reformers have given us barking like dogs, roaring like lions, walking on hands and knees on the floor like animals, being slain in the spirit (that is, lying on the floor and going into a trance), running, shaking, speaking gibberish which they call tongues, fits of laughter, "drunkenness" in the spirit. There are probably many more but all this is done in the name of not quenching the spirit. I'd like to know where any of this has been hidden in scripture and has only recently been rediscovered. If you don't buy into it you're labeled a religious Pharisee. This is their go-to put down.
Hello Xavier
Jesus did not say. "You are petra" to Peter, nor did I indicate that, as I had said Peter was Petros: there are two different words used, one for Peter (Petros), and one signifying Christ (petra), the Rock of salvation. Jesus is building His church, the body on Christ, on Himself. I am not sure how you got that wrong? Peter had just made a confession of faith in Christ. This is what the church is built on; others have told this to you as well. I cannot see it having to do with governance, for Christ is the Head of His own Body. There are a plethora of Scripture verses concerning God being the Rock of salvation, even one saying there is no other. Here is a sampling of them:Psalm 78:35
And they remembered that God was their rock , And the Most High God their Redeemer.
Genesis 49:24
But his bow remained firm, And his arms were agile, From the hands of the Mighty One of Jacob (From there is the Shepherd, the Stone of Israel),
Deuteronomy 32:15
"But Jeshurun grew fat and kicked-- You are grown fat, thick, and sleek-- Then he forsook God who made him, And scorned the rock of his salvation.
2 Samuel 23:3
"The God of Israel said, The rock of Israel spoke to me, 'He who rules over men righteously, Who rules in the fear of God,
Psalm 42:9
I will say to God my rock , "Why have You forgotten me? Why do I go mourning because of the oppression of the enemy?"
Isaiah 30:29
You will have songs as in the night when you keep the festival, And gladness of heart as when one marches to the sound of the flute, To go to the mountain of the LORD, to the rock of Israel.
2 Samuel 22:32
"For who is God, besides the LORD? And who is a rock , besides our God?
Psalm 18:31
For who is God, but the LORD? And who is a rock , except our God,
1 Samuel 2:2
"There is no one holy like the LORD, Indeed, there is no
one besides You, Nor is there any rock like our God.
Isaiah 44:8
'Do not tremble and do not be afraid; Have I not long since announced it to you and declared it? And you are My witnesses Is there any God besides Me, Or is there any other rock ? I know of none.'"
Deuteronomy 32:31
"Indeed their rock is not like our rock , Even our enemies themselves judge this.
Deuteronomy 32:37
"And He will say, 'Where are their gods, The rock in which they sought refuge?
Psalm 144:1
Blessed be the LORD, my rock , Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle;
Deuteronomy 32:4
"The rock ! His work is perfect, For all His ways are just; A God of faithfulness and without injustice, Righteous and upright is He.
Psalm 92:15
To declare that the LORD is upright; He is my rock , and there is no unrighteousness in Him.
Psalm 62:7
On God my salvation and my glory rest; The rock of my strength, my refuge is in God.
Psalm 28:1
To You, O LORD, I call; My rock , do not be deaf to me, For if You are silent to me, I will become like those who go down to the pit.
Psalm 31:1-3
In You, O LORD, I have taken refuge; Let me never be ashamed; In Your righteousness deliver me. Incline Your ear to me, rescue me quickly; Be to me a rock of strength, A stronghold to save me. For You are my rock and my fortress; For Your name's sake You will lead me and guide me.
Psalm 61:2
From the end of the earth I call to You when my heart is faint; Lead me to the rock that is higher than I.
Psalm 71:3
Be to me a rock of habitation to which I may continually come; You have given commandment to save me, For You are my rock and my fortress.
Isaiah 26:4
"Trust in the LORD forever, For in GOD the LORD, we have an everlasting rock .
Psalm 94:22
But the LORD has been my stronghold, And my God the rock of my refuge.
2 Samuel 22:3
My God, my rock , in whom I take refuge, My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold and my refuge; My savior, You save me from violence.
Psalm 18:2
The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock , in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold.
Psalm 95:1
O come, let us sing for joy to the LORD, Let us shout joyfully to the rock of our salvation.
2 Samuel 22:47
"The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock ; And exalted be God, the rock of my salvation,
Psalm 18:46
The LORD lives, and blessed be my rock ; And exalted be the God of my salvation,
Psalm/19/14']Psalm 19:14
Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart Be acceptable in Your sight, O LORD, my rock and my Redeemer.
Psalm 62:2
He only is my rock and my salvation, My stronghold; I shall not be greatly shaken.
Psalm 89:26
"He will cry to Me, 'You are my Father, My God, and the rock of my salvation.'
Isaiah 17:10
For you have forgotten the God of your salvation And have not remembered the rock of your refuge. Therefore you plant delightful plants And set them with vine slips of a strange god.
Isaiah 8:14
"Then He shall become a sanctuary; But to both the houses of Israel, a stone to strike and a rock to stumble over, And a snare and a trap for the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus says the Lord GOD, "Behold, I am laying in Zion a stone, a tested stone, A costly cornerstone for the foundation, firmly placed. He who believes in it will not be disturbed.
PPsalm 118:22
The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief corner stone.
Matthew 21:42
Jesus said to them, "Did you never read in the Scriptures, 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone; THIS CAME ABOUT FROM THE LORD, AND IT IS MARVELOUS IN OUR EYES'?
Mark 12:10
"Have you not even read this Scripture: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone;
Luke 20:17
But Jesus looked at them and said, "What then is this that is written: 'THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone'?
Acts 4:11
"He is the STONE WHICH WAS REJECTED by you, THE BUILDERS, but WHICH BECAME THE CHIEF CORNER stone.
1 Peter 2:6-7
For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for those who disbelieve, "THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED, THIS BECAME THE VERY CORNER stone,"
Matthew 21:44
"And he who falls on this stone will be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."
Luke 20:18
"Everyone who falls on that stone will be broken to pieces;
but on whomever it falls, it will scatter him like dust."
Romans 9:32-33
Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone, just as it is written, "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A rock OF OFFENSE, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."
1 Peter 2:4-8
And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God, you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ. For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD, I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."
Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other Name
under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.
Grace and Peace brother - I have to disagree with the history you've been taught. My education has been much different.
England, Scotland, Ireland and much of Europe was evangelized way before even Constantine's day. Isso. or Iso - Jesus, was known about by the locals and churches had been formed long before the time that the "church of Rome" (not yet the Roman Catholic Church) began their move into those lands. Many Celtic and druidic communities had already begun to convert to Christianity although there was much in-fighting. But there were many Christians long before Constantine, and the RCC wasn't even a dream yet.
The edicts of Constantine, to "better organize" Christianity, weren't done until well into his reign. Constantine's involvement started with the Edict of Milan around 315ish(?) and grew, arguably for the worse imho. But that involvement didn't really escalate until after the founding of Constantinople in 330ish(?). That would be about the same time Helena, his mother, supposedly found the "true cross" and the whole royal family was getting into this "new religion" that here-to-fore was illegal, lol.
So, the notion, that arguably modern historian's hold to, that the RCC started in 314 is preposterous! A rational mind would tell us that the idea of a "State Religion" that was illegal a year prior, wouldn't have been accepted by the citizenry of Rome. Those people loved their ancient God's and enjoyed sending Christians to the colosseums, throughout the empire, to be slaughtered. Can you imagine what the citizens of any modern, western nation would do if Christianity was enforced upon them? It had to take years before the change would be accepted.
Anyway, the Emperor started mixing politics and religion a little later, thereby giving the church in Rome a sense of higher authority over the then other existing churches; churches in Laodicea, Philidelphia, Jerusalem, Alexandria, etc., etc. But even before Constantine, the church in Rome had become somewhat obtuse, then again, there was already a lot of disagreement between them all... differences were becoming harder and harder to resolve. But none of them had yet conceded all power/authority to the church at Rome - regardless of what the Emperor thought, because the other churches weren't all part of the Roman Empire.
Regardless, as Constantine's power grew, so did the power of the church at Rome, and being typical of men, that power corrupted. As the Roman Empire expanded, the Roman church. with Constantine's guidance, began subjecting all/any Christian community to their line of thinking. The well-established churches in the "British Ilses", as with every other area under Rome began to be persecuted and forced to submit to Roman authority. Groups like the Ceile De and the Culdee were branded heretical... as with many, many others. Those communities weren't always "named" but definitely followers of Christ. They were segregated by distance and mostly isolated. And one by one, the Roman church took them over or killed them.
Patrick was taught about Jesus from the Ceile De after being taken a slave by Irish raiders - he was virtually agnostic before then and didn't follow his grandfather's belief as per the Roman church.
I could go on and on - but I realize that I'm not going to change anyone's view of history. The point is, that the RCC has "back-dated" a lot of our history and injected their mythos into because the wanted to and had the extreme power and (self-assumed) authority to do just that. It justified their claim to supremacy in all things Christian. It was a power-grab, and it worked.
But read the real history of the early church for yourselves... pray God for discernment and remember that history is often written by the victors... just men, and then very fallible.
God Bless.
Hi Again brother!
Just a point-in-fact... Jesus added the name Peter, to Simon - making it Simon Peter, long before the Matt. 16:16, right? Back in Matt. 3, I believe.
I truly believe that Jesus meant that the "rock" he was referring to was, as has been pointed out by others, not Peter the man but the fact that Jesus is the Son of God.
Blessings.
Where did you get your credentials in biblical Greek?
That nobody else had been called "Peter" is utterly irrelevant. You completely overlook the fact that Jesus also called him Satan. There too, the Lord's meaning is plain... and your interpretation is plainly wrong.
Peter, as an apostle, was only one stone in the foundation of the temple of the Lord. Christ Himself is the chief cornerstone, not Peter.
"Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone."—Ephesians 2:19-20
"Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone."—Ephesians 2:19-20
For those with the Spirit, it is clear that He did say that.
But, I mean, if 3 (or more!) Billion dollars of reparations paid to victims of child and adult sexual abuse since 1950 can't convince you to run from the Roman Church, what chance do I have, eh?
https://www.bishop-accountability.org/