Ukraine and Russia: Truth and Propaganda

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Jan 5, 2022
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"A higher plane," hehe
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#41
Great, well there are a couple of key laws that are just like the laws of physics. You can counteract the law of gravity for awhile with the law of aerodynamics, but eventually the law of gravity always wins.

If you buy those bombs you will ultimately use those bombs, it is a hard and fast rule.

Never underestimate the stupidity of man another hard and fast rule.

Then of course you have murphy's laws, if something can go wrong it will go wrong, another hard and fast rule.

Also, the Bible tells us that man will kill 1/4 of all humans on the planet with the opening of the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse. So you tell me, apart from nuclear bombs is there any way to kill off close to 2 billion people?
Well, there's biowarfare. The COVID jab damage has been done already, just takes time for the population to see the effects.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
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#42
Good News

I just learned that Biden has 30 years of foreign policy experience and knows Putin and Xi way better than Trump did so the best thing about him being president is that he won't act recklessly to get us into WWIII. True Afghanistan did not go as one might have hoped but that was Trump's fault and true Russia has invaded Ukraine and threatened to go nuclear but that also is all Trump's fault. So we can all rest easy knowing that Biden is in charge with both hands firmly on some little girl's shoulders. "Stop sniffing that girl's hair and focus on this nuclear war with Russia!"
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#43
Great, well there are a couple of key laws that are just like the laws of physics. You can counteract the law of gravity for awhile with the law of aerodynamics, but eventually the law of gravity always wins.

If you buy those bombs you will ultimately use those bombs, it is a hard and fast rule.

Never underestimate the stupidity of man another hard and fast rule.

Then of course you have murphy's laws, if something can go wrong it will go wrong, another hard and fast rule.

Also, the Bible tells us that man will kill 1/4 of all humans on the planet with the opening of the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse. So you tell me, apart from nuclear bombs is there any way to kill off close to 2 billion people?
That is not the point I was trying to make. I am saying that the US will have the means to retaliate. And other nations likewise. Or even into joining the attack on the West. I have no doubt that nuclear war will happen. It's when, not if.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#44
Well, there's biowarfare. The COVID jab damage has been done already, just takes time for the population to see the effects.
Sure, another 70 years and lots of people of this generation will die.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#45
If China makes a move on Taiwan they lose. Given the right equipment troop ships are an extremely vulnerable target. Taiwan has the right equipment.

Taiwan is a tropical mountainous island, the hardest target to invade, and paratroopers would be suicide without a land based invasion at the same time.

China cannot take out Taiwans airbase because it is dug in underneath a mountain and faces east to the Pacific. As long as the US, Japan and Australia protect the Eastern coastline China cannot get to it.

Taiwan has satellites, AWACs, Drones, Cruise missiles they are well equipped to sink Chinese ships. Not only so but every single person in Taiwan has gone through several years of military training so it is very easy for them to mobilize trained personel.

Then you haven't even considered a counterattack. China attacks Taiwan you can say good bye to the Yangtze river basin, 500 million people and their entire industrial base. The 3 gorges dam will be blown up immediately. Take out a few of china's biggest dams and 10% of their power grid goes down in a country that already has rolling blackouts.
China's economy is inextricably linked to the West. The only thing that prevents China imploding is a good standard of living for most people. China cracking down on Hong Kong is one thing. It's another entirely to attack Taiwan. They've already shot themselves in the foot by restricting imports from Australia. That's a major reason for their electricity generation problems. And the take up of EV's is not helping. Having said that, they have a massive naval ship building program. It's hard to imagine it's purely defensive. China takes a far longer term view than the Western world. How would the world react if China simply blockaded Taiwan and imposed a no-fly zone? Would the Aus/UK/US alliance go to war over it? I don't know. History says no way. I'm inclined to agree.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
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#46
China's economy is inextricably linked to the West. The only thing that prevents China imploding is a good standard of living for most people. China cracking down on Hong Kong is one thing. It's another entirely to attack Taiwan. They've already shot themselves in the foot by restricting imports from Australia. That's a major reason for their electricity generation problems. And the take up of EV's is not helping. Having said that, they have a massive naval ship building program. It's hard to imagine it's purely defensive. China takes a far longer term view than the Western world. How would the world react if China simply blockaded Taiwan and imposed a no-fly zone? Would the Aus/UK/US alliance go to war over it? I don't know. History says no way. I'm inclined to agree.
China doesn't have the navy to blockade Taiwan because the US, Japan and Australia would be able to keep the Eastern coast open
 
Jan 5, 2022
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"A higher plane," hehe
www.youtube.com
#47
China doesn't have the navy to blockade Taiwan because the US, Japan and Australia would be able to keep the Eastern coast open
Yeah, that would provoke a direct confrontation with the US Navy. China has flirted around with this but hasn't outright pushed it. (For example in the South China Sea area.)

I wonder how advanced and numerous China's submarine fleet is. THAT would be the best tool for a naval blockade in waters patrolled by other powers.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#48
China doesn't have the navy to blockade Taiwan because the US, Japan and Australia would be able to keep the Eastern coast open
You need to get up to speed with China's progress. It's already the world's largest naval power as far as number of ships. It's not the most experienced but it's well armed. China has a substantial submarine fleet. My hope is that they build their ships out of the same rubbish steel that they export to Australia. The first big storm will sink half their fleet.

China has a pretty good air force also. Will Japan/US /Australia go to war over Taiwan? I don't know. I'm doubtful.
 

Gideon300

Well-known member
Mar 18, 2021
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#49
Yeah, that would provoke a direct confrontation with the US Navy. China has flirted around with this but hasn't outright pushed it. (For example in the South China Sea area.)

I wonder how advanced and numerous China's submarine fleet is. THAT would be the best tool for a naval blockade in waters patrolled by other powers.
7 nuclear powered and around 57 diesel electric. That's a lot. It's reasonably advanced, maybe not as good as the US. However, China is improving its technology all the time. It costs a lot less to build in China also. "Hypo Hysterical History" has an excellent rundown on you tube. One limitation has been mentioned by others. There is a huge maintenance cost to a large fleet. China is not traditionally a naval power. They will have a sharp learning curve compared to Japan, the US and the UK. Even Australia has a longer naval history.
 

JohnDB

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2021
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#50
Ukraine was once one of the oligarchy of the USSR. In fact it was considered the crown jewel of the USSR power.
Putin wants it back.
Sure they have had issues with corruption...they were once part of Russian isolationism.

However...things have changed...and been changing. They were cleaning up the corruption but by bit. Sure a few people were wanting things to remain as they always have been.
And the Russian disinformation campaigns have been going full tilt for over two years now. Many people in this thread are repeating that nonsense verbatim. If it wasn't so easy to spot it would be of a better quality.

Russia has been planning this for the last four to five years under Putin. He was waiting for Trump to leave office and he then had the hiccup of Coronavirus. But he used his disinformation campaigns to create mask and vaccine fears. (It didn't help much)

Ukraine was increasing it's alliance with western civilization through trade and trade agreements...it didn't want to trade as much with Russia because the money was lousy. (Indeed they have some great products at great prices including computer chips)

The Ukrainians themselves are actually the most valuable resource there. Highly educated and skilled population. And as their trade with Europe evolved it was coming out of poverty. Which is what was Russia's biggest fear. It wants access to those goods as well. Without them Russia is no better than Saudi Arabia...a single product country. Ukraine's unemployment was dropping with every new trade deal.

So... Russia has been working heavily towards annexation of Ukraine.

However, most of the people there are tired of Russian influence. They usually are a peaceful people. But now due to Russian brutality they are forming civilian militias. This is going to cause occupation instead of annexation. Another Afghanistan for them. (They failed under Carter when they invaded Afghanistan and Carter almost pushed the big red button)

Same story here...
Sure there's a lot of short term stuff that makes for headlines. Ignore it. The end of Russia is coming. The sanctions, air flight restrictions, and shipping is getting cut off. They are going to be impoverished and broke. When soldiers don't get paid they don't follow orders. And very very soon Russia is going to be broke. Watch the gold market... Russia is dumping gold to shore up the Ruble...when it reverses and they begin to buy gold they will be in real trouble.
 

ZNP

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Sep 14, 2020
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#51
You need to get up to speed with China's progress. It's already the world's largest naval power as far as number of ships. It's not the most experienced but it's well armed. China has a substantial submarine fleet. My hope is that they build their ships out of the same rubbish steel that they export to Australia. The first big storm will sink half their fleet.

China has a pretty good air force also. Will Japan/US /Australia go to war over Taiwan? I don't know. I'm doubtful.
Taiwan is the manufacturer for the most sophisticated computer chips. When you are looking at the chips that go into our most powerful computers Taiwan is critical, if China were to seize control of that then they would clearly become the world's superpower.
 

ZNP

Well-known member
Sep 14, 2020
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#52
You need to get up to speed with China's progress. It's already the world's largest naval power as far as number of ships. It's not the most experienced but it's well armed. China has a substantial submarine fleet. My hope is that they build their ships out of the same rubbish steel that they export to Australia. The first big storm will sink half their fleet.

China has a pretty good air force also. Will Japan/US /Australia go to war over Taiwan? I don't know. I'm doubtful.
Japan has the most modern and sophisticated navy so although it is smaller than China it is well capable of defending the sea between Taiwan and Japan. The US still has a superior navy to China though much of that Navy might be elsewhere and unable to focus on Taiwan, still keeping a lane open between the US and Taiwan would certainly be something our Navy is capable of. Australia has the smallest Navy of these four and yet could certainly lend assistance at the Southern tip down by the Philippines. The US has satellites so it is quite simple to keep an eye on China.

Although the US, Australia and Japan might shy away from the Taiwan straight as being provocative if China were to attack Japan, the US or Australia in these international waters protecting Taiwan's East coast then they would turn this deal with Taiwan into a world war.

What people don't understand is that China cannot stand in a world war, they have way too many vulnerable targets in their country that would cripple them that they cannot defend against.

For example the only way they are able to feed the people is that during the harvest season their military goes to the farms to help bring in the crops and then all the trains nationwide are used to move that food to the coast. If you take out trains and bridges the country will starve. The last two years have been very bad harvests so they are truly on a razor's edge. Then you have the hydro electric dams. It is very easy for us to take out a dam with a cruise missile. Some of these dams would cause catastrophic damage to their industrial base (3 gorges, etc) and if you take out the big ones you will cripple their electric grid.

The other thing is that Taiwan has been preparing for this invasion for the last 70+ years. They have sleeper cells in China ready to take out the trains and power grid. They are dug into Taiwan far more than Vietnam ever was. Compare them to the Falkland islands and they are far superior in every way. Compare this invasion to D day and Taiwan has a very long list of advantages that Germany didn't have.

I was in Taiwan for eight years and saw first hand, it would be a disaster for any military to try and invade this island.
 

ZNP

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Sep 14, 2020
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#54
Six years ago, a man on this site prophesied what Russia would destroy America and how it would happen:

What is the point in being a prophet? - Christian Chat Rooms & Forums
I have posted many prophecies both from the Bible and from recent dreams and visions in the blog "Summary of Bible references on the Rapture"

They show that Babylon does refer to the US, that our judgement will come in an hour, and that yes, it comes from Russia, along with other countries (Iran, N. Korea, and military bases in Venezuela and Cuba).
 

ZNP

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Sep 14, 2020
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#55
 

Gideon300

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Mar 18, 2021
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#56
Japan has the most modern and sophisticated navy so although it is smaller than China it is well capable of defending the sea between Taiwan and Japan. The US still has a superior navy to China though much of that Navy might be elsewhere and unable to focus on Taiwan, still keeping a lane open between the US and Taiwan would certainly be something our Navy is capable of. Australia has the smallest Navy of these four and yet could certainly lend assistance at the Southern tip down by the Philippines. The US has satellites so it is quite simple to keep an eye on China.

Although the US, Australia and Japan might shy away from the Taiwan straight as being provocative if China were to attack Japan, the US or Australia in these international waters protecting Taiwan's East coast then they would turn this deal with Taiwan into a world war.

What people don't understand is that China cannot stand in a world war, they have way too many vulnerable targets in their country that would cripple them that they cannot defend against.

For example the only way they are able to feed the people is that during the harvest season their military goes to the farms to help bring in the crops and then all the trains nationwide are used to move that food to the coast. If you take out trains and bridges the country will starve. The last two years have been very bad harvests so they are truly on a razor's edge. Then you have the hydro electric dams. It is very easy for us to take out a dam with a cruise missile. Some of these dams would cause catastrophic damage to their industrial base (3 gorges, etc) and if you take out the big ones you will cripple their electric grid.

The other thing is that Taiwan has been preparing for this invasion for the last 70+ years. They have sleeper cells in China ready to take out the trains and power grid. They are dug into Taiwan far more than Vietnam ever was. Compare them to the Falkland islands and they are far superior in every way. Compare this invasion to D day and Taiwan has a very long list of advantages that Germany didn't have.

I was in Taiwan for eight years and saw first hand, it would be a disaster for any military to try and invade this island.
Maybe you did not read what I said. China does not have to invade Taiwan. A blockade would bring them to their knees. It would take some time. You would know that the Chinese are way more patient than the average Westerner. You seem to think that the US/Australia/UK/Japan would got to war to defend Taiwan. It's possible, but I doubt it. I'm hoping that Xi has seen the mess that Putin has made of invading Ukraine and think again regarding Taiwan.
 

ZNP

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Sep 14, 2020
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#57
Maybe you did not read what I said. China does not have to invade Taiwan. A blockade would bring them to their knees. It would take some time. You would know that the Chinese are way more patient than the average Westerner. You seem to think that the US/Australia/UK/Japan would got to war to defend Taiwan. It's possible, but I doubt it. I'm hoping that Xi has seen the mess that Putin has made of invading Ukraine and think again regarding Taiwan.
You can't impose a blockade on Taiwan if the US keeps the shipping lanes on the East coast open, hence my point concerning the three navies of Japan, the US and Australia
 

JohnDB

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Jan 16, 2021
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#58
Ukraine has had a couple of civil wars...so there is a LOT of internal conflict coming out of there...also a lot of misinformation.
It's like asking about the American civil war ten years after it was over...were the two sides happy?
Just saying...
 

ZNP

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#59
 

iamsoandso

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2011
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#60
And then again Taiwan could be just a little piece of candy at the moment to China in that after SWIFT and the island it has Russia on all they would need to do is wait,,,,,,,and then stop exporting all goods from China to Europe and the US and instantly we would no longer have 300.00 dollar 55 inch tv's at Walmart,Kmart,,,no more Dollar stores and no more 3M mask for a dollar. We would then need to reverse things like us making 20.00 an hour and outsourcing our manufacturing back to 3.65 an hour or less. In short if China waits,,then stops sending us the stuff they manufacturer with slave labor then it will crumble everyone's economy but China's. So Taiwan,,,why not dominate the earth?