TONGUES is a precious gift from God
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Whoever told you that words are the cause of life and death - other than in a precept of citing a Scripture which when pressed falsely - the fool speaks curses? I don't curse women or children - and neither do I speak to cause death or in a pretence to give life.
Don't confuse your mind with rivers of living water - albeit that I have seen on this forum that you speak to those who are not even here and speak healing into their bodies by which you pass into the air that which you believe you have received in the Spirit as a gift - and must be released by speaking words.
So if it seems as though I condemn these things then be certain that not only do I condemn them - but I have been given authority to tear them down also. Yet I do not curse woman and children. So in that meaning - I do indeed divide - and divisions are confusing unless you humble yourself - and resist granting to others a liberty that is not yours to give.
Don't confuse your mind with rivers of living water - albeit that I have seen on this forum that you speak to those who are not even here and speak healing into their bodies by which you pass into the air that which you believe you have received in the Spirit as a gift - and must be released by speaking words.
So if it seems as though I condemn these things then be certain that not only do I condemn them - but I have been given authority to tear them down also. Yet I do not curse woman and children. So in that meaning - I do indeed divide - and divisions are confusing unless you humble yourself - and resist granting to others a liberty that is not yours to give.
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and you accuse me of having no love, having a miserable life, no relationship with God and various other things pulled out of your overworked imagination
I know the words of my Savior and your words are not inspired by the Spirit of God. you are in a personal mud slinging contest with some of us here and you have started it
you HIDE behind your idea of tongues in order to sound holy, but your words are sifted and nothing is left
I speak and pray in tongues, having received that gift when I was I think about 18 and have been saved from the age of 5
never one time has the Holy Spirit placed the idea of 'cursing' others with words of anger couched in 'love' as you do
in fact, God has admonished me regarding anger at those who are intent on undermining the truth and making fun of the warnings we have been given from Christ Himself
you don't own tongues and God forbid anyone should believe they are to be used as you have used them
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I saw that also. typical of tv promoters of themselves who send out all kinds of messages to folks who are busy tending their vegetable gardens
every attempt by some to use the Holy Spirit like a third hand on the end of their arm is being made and so many fall for it. itching ears
but we were also warned the devil would appear in that thread.
why would we want to see that spirit? shouldn't we see God if His hand is passing by and healing?
smh
every attempt by some to use the Holy Spirit like a third hand on the end of their arm is being made and so many fall for it. itching ears
but we were also warned the devil would appear in that thread.
why would we want to see that spirit? shouldn't we see God if His hand is passing by and healing?
smh
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I Corinthians 14..this is what the Bible says about tongues...all still true, but sadly very much abused by 'tongues' enthusiasts who render these instructions forgotten and do harm because of it
Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. 2 For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. 3 On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. 4 The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. 5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up.
6 Now, brothers,[a] if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching? 7 If even lifeless instruments, such as the flute or the harp, do not give distinct notes, how will anyone know what is played? 8 And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? 9 So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. 10 There are doubtless many different languages in the world, and none is without meaning, 11 but if I do not know the meaning of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. 12 So with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the Spirit, strive to excel in building up the church.
13 Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also. 16 Otherwise, if you give thanks with your spirit, how can anyone in the position of an outsider[b] say “Amen” to your thanksgiving when he does not know what you are saying? 17 For you may be giving thanks well enough, but the other person is not being built up. 18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19 Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue.
Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. 2 For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. 3 On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. 4 The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. 5 Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up.
6 Now, brothers,[a] if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching? 7 If even lifeless instruments, such as the flute or the harp, do not give distinct notes, how will anyone know what is played? 8 And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? 9 So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. 10 There are doubtless many different languages in the world, and none is without meaning, 11 but if I do not know the meaning of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. 12 So with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the Spirit, strive to excel in building up the church.
13 Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also. 16 Otherwise, if you give thanks with your spirit, how can anyone in the position of an outsider[b] say “Amen” to your thanksgiving when he does not know what you are saying? 17 For you may be giving thanks well enough, but the other person is not being built up. 18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19 Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue.
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20 Brothers, do not be children in your thinking. Be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature. 21 In the Law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord.” 22 Thus tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers, while prophecy is a sign[c] not for unbelievers but for believers. 23 If, therefore, the whole church comes together and all speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are out of your minds? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all, 25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed, and so, falling on his face, he will worship God and declare that God is really among you.
Orderly Worship
26 What then, brothers? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. 27 If any speak in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn, and let someone interpret. 28 But if there is no one to interpret, let each of them keep silent in church and speak to himself and to God. 29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. 30 If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent. 31 For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged, 32 and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. 33 For God is not a God of confusion but of peace.
As in all the churches of the saints, 34 the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. 35 If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.
36 Or was it from you that the word of God came? Or are you the only ones it has reached? 37 If anyone thinks that he is a prophet, or spiritual, he should acknowledge that the things I am writing to you are a command of the Lord. 38 If anyone does not recognize this, he is not recognized. 39 So, my brothers, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues. 40 But all things should be done decently and in order.
Orderly Worship
26 What then, brothers? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. 27 If any speak in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn, and let someone interpret. 28 But if there is no one to interpret, let each of them keep silent in church and speak to himself and to God. 29 Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. 30 If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent. 31 For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged, 32 and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. 33 For God is not a God of confusion but of peace.
As in all the churches of the saints, 34 the women should keep silent in the churches. For they are not permitted to speak, but should be in submission, as the Law also says. 35 If there is anything they desire to learn, let them ask their husbands at home. For it is shameful for a woman to speak in church.
36 Or was it from you that the word of God came? Or are you the only ones it has reached? 37 If anyone thinks that he is a prophet, or spiritual, he should acknowledge that the things I am writing to you are a command of the Lord. 38 If anyone does not recognize this, he is not recognized. 39 So, my brothers, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues. 40 But all things should be done decently and in order.
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Precious friend, sorry about the Misunderstanding; I am not against the
beautiful and very precious gifts from God. In fact, I just saw/heard a news
reporter on FOX, in Ukraine, who could "speak in tongues" - in SIX Different
languages. I believe he "studied and learned" them, because he could do
"his reporting job" better in Many Different countries. "Talent from God"?
Similar to this is my "belief about water baptism": I am not against it,
as "it is in The Bible." I simply point out that the right Question is not
being asked And Biblically answered, in order to solve All the Confusion
about it. In addition, God Gave us "math," Correct? So, IF HE Said "There
Is Only ONE Baptism, Today, Under GRACE, Then WHY do so many "believe
in TWO"? Can that kind of "math" possibly be correct?
Am I really "speaking against" God, His baptisms, And His Creation of
"math," by asking questions?
So, I don't think that talented people "speaking in tongues" is the same
thing as God's "gift of tongues" as a supernatural empowerment to get
His Word to Different groups in their own language, as God Clearly
Demonstrated in Act 2.
Further, I believe I was asking about "ALL THREE gifts" in the Bible. I
hear much about "the tongues AND prophecy," but Very Little about
"the word of knowledge." Is it not also "beautiful and very precious"?
If we're going to do two, shouldn't we do ALL three, that are
"beautiful and very precious gifts from God"? I do Not hear
anybody, Under God's GRACE, Today, say "That God Has Given"
anybody, the gift He "Gave Peter" as Clearly seen in
Acts 5:1-11, the gift of "the word of knowledge," Correct?:
1) IF the beautiful and very precious gift of "the word of knowledge"
is, in fact, in effect Today, Under GRACE, Then are not Many "going to
be in trouble," NOT obeying Christ, selling ALL they have, giving it
to "an apostolic successor" of Peter, with Peter's "keys to remit OR
Retain sins," going to "be dead," like Ananias and Sapphira?
Others who have NOT "sold everything" (As CHRIST Commanded), are
really "quick to judge me" that I don't "love Christ," because I do NOT obey
"ALL His Commandments," As HE Clearly Commanded In Matthew 28:19-20,
Correct?
2) So, IF "this gift" is NOT "in effect" today, then should we "find out"
From God, "Why Not"? And, HE Is the One who "combined All THREE
Together in 1 Corinthians 13:8-10, Correct?
Thus, (done my Best to ask again) just the same Serious question for
prayerful/Careful Consideration of ALL diligent BIBLE students:
"When That Which Is PERFECT Is Come, then that
which is in part (THREE gifts v. 8) shall be done away." (1Co 13:10)
IF God's Pure and HOLY Word Of Truth Is NOT PERFECT, THEN, please pray tell:
What is IT? IF it is IMperfect, then how can I (or anyone else) Trust IT,
Or The Almighty God, WHO Gave IT to us? Why would God "MAGNIFY..."
an IMperfect word "...ABOVE All Of His HOLY Name!" (Psalms 138:2)
Would not evading and Not answering this important question be like
"speaking against" God's PERFECT Word, and His Holy Name?
Precious friend, just wondering, and I apologize if I am asking the
wrong questions, or not "wording them" correctly?
GRACE And Peace...
beautiful and very precious gifts from God. In fact, I just saw/heard a news
reporter on FOX, in Ukraine, who could "speak in tongues" - in SIX Different
languages. I believe he "studied and learned" them, because he could do
"his reporting job" better in Many Different countries. "Talent from God"?
Similar to this is my "belief about water baptism": I am not against it,
as "it is in The Bible." I simply point out that the right Question is not
being asked And Biblically answered, in order to solve All the Confusion
about it. In addition, God Gave us "math," Correct? So, IF HE Said "There
Is Only ONE Baptism, Today, Under GRACE, Then WHY do so many "believe
in TWO"? Can that kind of "math" possibly be correct?
Am I really "speaking against" God, His baptisms, And His Creation of
"math," by asking questions?
So, I don't think that talented people "speaking in tongues" is the same
thing as God's "gift of tongues" as a supernatural empowerment to get
His Word to Different groups in their own language, as God Clearly
Demonstrated in Act 2.
Further, I believe I was asking about "ALL THREE gifts" in the Bible. I
hear much about "the tongues AND prophecy," but Very Little about
"the word of knowledge." Is it not also "beautiful and very precious"?
If we're going to do two, shouldn't we do ALL three, that are
"beautiful and very precious gifts from God"? I do Not hear
anybody, Under God's GRACE, Today, say "That God Has Given"
anybody, the gift He "Gave Peter" as Clearly seen in
Acts 5:1-11, the gift of "the word of knowledge," Correct?:
1) IF the beautiful and very precious gift of "the word of knowledge"
is, in fact, in effect Today, Under GRACE, Then are not Many "going to
be in trouble," NOT obeying Christ, selling ALL they have, giving it
to "an apostolic successor" of Peter, with Peter's "keys to remit OR
Retain sins," going to "be dead," like Ananias and Sapphira?
Others who have NOT "sold everything" (As CHRIST Commanded), are
really "quick to judge me" that I don't "love Christ," because I do NOT obey
"ALL His Commandments," As HE Clearly Commanded In Matthew 28:19-20,
Correct?
2) So, IF "this gift" is NOT "in effect" today, then should we "find out"
From God, "Why Not"? And, HE Is the One who "combined All THREE
Together in 1 Corinthians 13:8-10, Correct?
Thus, (done my Best to ask again) just the same Serious question for
prayerful/Careful Consideration of ALL diligent BIBLE students:
"When That Which Is PERFECT Is Come, then that
which is in part (THREE gifts v. 8) shall be done away." (1Co 13:10)
IF God's Pure and HOLY Word Of Truth Is NOT PERFECT, THEN, please pray tell:
What is IT? IF it is IMperfect, then how can I (or anyone else) Trust IT,
Or The Almighty God, WHO Gave IT to us? Why would God "MAGNIFY..."
an IMperfect word "...ABOVE All Of His HOLY Name!" (Psalms 138:2)
Would not evading and Not answering this important question be like
"speaking against" God's PERFECT Word, and His Holy Name?
Precious friend, just wondering, and I apologize if I am asking the
wrong questions, or not "wording them" correctly?
GRACE And Peace...
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This is the type of uninformed generalised comment that damages your credibility. Most Pentecostals and Charismatics I know are godly people who love Christ, faithful to His Word, and who worship God in spirit and in truth. It is a concern when you show a lack of love for Christian brethren by denigrating them in this way. Jesus commanded us to love one another, and John says that he who does not love does not know God for God is love. Paul persecuted the church, and when Jesus confronted him on he Damascus Road He asked, "Why are you persecuting Me?" This shows me that denigrating Charismatic believers, along with any other Christians, is actually denigrating Christ Himself. That is why you need a change of heart toward Charismatic believers and make a bit of an effort to get to know them better.
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Money-related Testimony #2
Not long after becoming Mayor of a certain small town, we rediscovered a decades-old problem with our sanitary sewer system which handles the drainage of residential water (as opposed to the storm sewer which handles the drainage of rain water).
We tried the simple fixes like assuring sump pumps and downspouts ran to the correct sewer system, yet the problem remained. It looked like we were going to have to 'bite the bullet' and fix this problem with real money.
Well this wasn't our first significant issue, nor the first I've taken to prayer. So internally I say "Well God, You did a great job fixing the Police problem and the Public Works problem... You wanna give us a new sewer too?" Having said this half-heartedly in the middle of a council meeting I didn't exactly sit and wait for a reply. So, accidentally, I'd left it "laying at the foot of the cross" as people say.
We contacted an engineering firm, did a camera survey of our piping, and created photo album documenting the problems plaguing the southwest 1/3 of town.
MEANWHILE... a severe thunderstorm hits the area and the Governor declares our county a disaster zone. FEMA funds became available for damages proven to have been created or worsened by the storm. We already have "Before" photos. So we send the camera down again for "After" photos, and submit the application. Our reasoning was "Hey, maybe we'll get 7, 10 or maybe even $30,000". It was worth a shot.
NOTE: I’m abbreviating the remainder of the story.
While waiting, the engineers show us a cool new process of fixing sewers by re-lining them. (Pipe Re-lining Video here) We LIKE the relining option.
FEMA’s reply arrives: “We’re giving you $714,000”.
...We’re ecstatic...
We ask the engineers “Is that enough to re-line the pipes?” Engineers say “Yep.”
God says to me “But you didn’t ask for re-lined pipes.” I reply “Does that mean…??”
Someone notices FEMA’s numbers are based on a pipe depth of only 2 feet. (Ours are buried up to 28’ deep).
We submit a plan for re-lined pipes to FEMA along with a Thank-you letter and mention of the depth error.
FEMA replies “We acknowledge the depth miscalculation. We’ve increased your funding to $1.1 MILLION accordingly. We REQUIRE that you replace all damaged pipe with brand new. If it costs exceed that amount, we’ll cover that too.” (paraphrased)
Total cost of project $1.7 Million. FEMA covered $1.4 Million because we did a few extra projects while the ground was tore up.
CONCLUSION: Yep, it meant God was going to give us NEW, not relined sewer piping according to the original request. Is God good? (UNSPOILER ALERT: Yes. Yes he is.)
Thank-you Jesus!!
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
Not long after becoming Mayor of a certain small town, we rediscovered a decades-old problem with our sanitary sewer system which handles the drainage of residential water (as opposed to the storm sewer which handles the drainage of rain water).
We tried the simple fixes like assuring sump pumps and downspouts ran to the correct sewer system, yet the problem remained. It looked like we were going to have to 'bite the bullet' and fix this problem with real money.
Well this wasn't our first significant issue, nor the first I've taken to prayer. So internally I say "Well God, You did a great job fixing the Police problem and the Public Works problem... You wanna give us a new sewer too?" Having said this half-heartedly in the middle of a council meeting I didn't exactly sit and wait for a reply. So, accidentally, I'd left it "laying at the foot of the cross" as people say.
We contacted an engineering firm, did a camera survey of our piping, and created photo album documenting the problems plaguing the southwest 1/3 of town.
MEANWHILE... a severe thunderstorm hits the area and the Governor declares our county a disaster zone. FEMA funds became available for damages proven to have been created or worsened by the storm. We already have "Before" photos. So we send the camera down again for "After" photos, and submit the application. Our reasoning was "Hey, maybe we'll get 7, 10 or maybe even $30,000". It was worth a shot.
NOTE: I’m abbreviating the remainder of the story.
While waiting, the engineers show us a cool new process of fixing sewers by re-lining them. (Pipe Re-lining Video here) We LIKE the relining option.
FEMA’s reply arrives: “We’re giving you $714,000”.
...We’re ecstatic...
We ask the engineers “Is that enough to re-line the pipes?” Engineers say “Yep.”
God says to me “But you didn’t ask for re-lined pipes.” I reply “Does that mean…??”
Someone notices FEMA’s numbers are based on a pipe depth of only 2 feet. (Ours are buried up to 28’ deep).
We submit a plan for re-lined pipes to FEMA along with a Thank-you letter and mention of the depth error.
FEMA replies “We acknowledge the depth miscalculation. We’ve increased your funding to $1.1 MILLION accordingly. We REQUIRE that you replace all damaged pipe with brand new. If it costs exceed that amount, we’ll cover that too.” (paraphrased)
Total cost of project $1.7 Million. FEMA covered $1.4 Million because we did a few extra projects while the ground was tore up.
CONCLUSION: Yep, it meant God was going to give us NEW, not relined sewer piping according to the original request. Is God good? (UNSPOILER ALERT: Yes. Yes he is.)
Thank-you Jesus!!
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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How do you put a sad face on the scripture I posted Mr Shittim?
do you not know why so many people object to tongues or why so many think they are no longer in use?
do you have a problem with the way tongues should be handled according to Paul?
he wrote much of the New Testament but I suppose you asked God and He told you different?
your little faces are just you making sure people know you disapprove
do you have something to say about that chapter in I Corinthians? have you made some amendments?
or will you just place an x or some other notation of your inability to actually say why you feel or think a certain way?
do you not know why so many people object to tongues or why so many think they are no longer in use?
do you have a problem with the way tongues should be handled according to Paul?
he wrote much of the New Testament but I suppose you asked God and He told you different?
your little faces are just you making sure people know you disapprove
do you have something to say about that chapter in I Corinthians? have you made some amendments?
or will you just place an x or some other notation of your inability to actually say why you feel or think a certain way?
Most reliable and competent commentators teach that 1 Corinthians 13:10 relates to the end of the Church Age when Jesus comes again. The thought of a canon of Scripture never entered into Paul's mind when he wrote it. The interpretation that the "perfect" is the canon of Scripture is an invention of a 19th Century cessationist theologian. None of the church fathers, nor any theological commentary mentioned the cessationist interpretation of 1 Corinthians 13:10 before the 19th Century. So your whole argument, long as it is, goes down like a flaming zeppelin as the result of your interpretation of the verse not being supported by any commentators before the 19th Century.
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Yeah, God taught me a lot through that.
How I got there was a matter of prayer as well. Because I didn't run for the position. I didn't even ask God for the position. I was trying to pray for something totally NOT for myself. Why? Because I'd learned to be VERY effective at getting results in prayer for myself, but that was beginning to feel self-ISH.
So I set out to pray selfless-ly.
The first question was "Who should I pray for?". And I remembered Jeremiah 29:7:
And 1 Timothy 2:1-2 KJV
So I started praying for the city, and more specifically for the rulers of the city.
Second question was "If I'm trying to pray unselfishly, What should I pray for them to receive?" And I thought "What is it that I treasure most of things God has given me?" And the answer is "Wisdom".
So I started praying that God would grant wisdom to the rulers of my city.
The next question that came to mind as I was praying was "How much wisdom do I want them to have?" And I realized that we are often willing to pray for others to receive things... But secretly we mean "as long as what I receive is slightly better". Which would be just another form of selfish... and my goal was to pray UNselfishly.
So I prayed "NO, I don't want to pray selfishly. I don't want you to hold anything back . Give them wisdom. Give them wisdom like you've given me. Give the rulers of this town every bit of the wisdom you've given me."
You might have guessed by my emboldening it that the last sentence was important to the outcome. When I suddenly found myself elected mayor...and the shock wore off and I'd settled into the position (because I could see how he had trained me for it earlier in life) I eventually got around to asking him about it.
I said "I see HOW you trained me for the position. And how you miraculously brought it to pass. And I see that you're helping me do a good job. But I don't understand WHY you put me into the position in the first place."
He said "You asked me to give to the rulers of the city every bit of wisdom that you have. You didn't say I couldn't do it by putting you in AS the ruler of the city." Which was actually him "getting me back" for using a similar technicality on him when I first became a Christian.
I'll summarize that one in the next posting because I think I gave the details already in another thread.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
How I got there was a matter of prayer as well. Because I didn't run for the position. I didn't even ask God for the position. I was trying to pray for something totally NOT for myself. Why? Because I'd learned to be VERY effective at getting results in prayer for myself, but that was beginning to feel self-ISH.
So I set out to pray selfless-ly.
The first question was "Who should I pray for?". And I remembered Jeremiah 29:7:
"And seek the peace of the city whither I have caused you to be carried away captives, and pray unto the LORD for it: for in the peace thereof shall ye have peace." - Jeremiah 29:7
And 1 Timothy 2:1-2 KJV
"I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men; [2] For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. " - 1 Timothy 2:1-2
So I started praying for the city, and more specifically for the rulers of the city.
Second question was "If I'm trying to pray unselfishly, What should I pray for them to receive?" And I thought "What is it that I treasure most of things God has given me?" And the answer is "Wisdom".
So I started praying that God would grant wisdom to the rulers of my city.
The next question that came to mind as I was praying was "How much wisdom do I want them to have?" And I realized that we are often willing to pray for others to receive things... But secretly we mean "as long as what I receive is slightly better". Which would be just another form of selfish... and my goal was to pray UNselfishly.
So I prayed "NO, I don't want to pray selfishly. I don't want you to hold anything back . Give them wisdom. Give them wisdom like you've given me. Give the rulers of this town every bit of the wisdom you've given me."
You might have guessed by my emboldening it that the last sentence was important to the outcome. When I suddenly found myself elected mayor...and the shock wore off and I'd settled into the position (because I could see how he had trained me for it earlier in life) I eventually got around to asking him about it.
I said "I see HOW you trained me for the position. And how you miraculously brought it to pass. And I see that you're helping me do a good job. But I don't understand WHY you put me into the position in the first place."
He said "You asked me to give to the rulers of the city every bit of wisdom that you have. You didn't say I couldn't do it by putting you in AS the ruler of the city." Which was actually him "getting me back" for using a similar technicality on him when I first became a Christian.
I'll summarize that one in the next posting because I think I gave the details already in another thread.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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Here’s the summary of how my girlfriend (now wife)’s knees got healed:
I got baptized in Jesus’ name for remission of sins per Acts 2:38, and received the Holy Ghost with speaking in tongues (per Acts 2:38 & 39, etc.) not long after we started dating.
They then told me “Now you’re a believer”.
Soon after (probably the next day) I was at Girlfriend’s house. Her kids were on the floor in the living room (across from the couch I was sitting on) and she was crawling around tending them and trying to get them to go to sleep.
I’d noticed her knees popping LOUDLY as she crawled and asked her if that hurt. She says yes, it’s done that all her life.
Eventually she falls asleep on the floor beside them.
I had nothing to do so I started thinking about getting baptized, etc and how they’d called me a believer. And I remembered the promises in Mark 16:16-18
So I said to God “They said I’m a believer. YOU said the believers shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. You DIDN’T say they have to be awake when you do it.”
So I crawled next to her, laid hands on her knees, and prayed for her to be healed in Jesus’ name.
Then I got back up on the couch and waited for her to wake up.
When she woke, she was healed, and remains healed of that to this day.
That emboldened part of my prayer about healing was why I said “He (God) was getting me back”.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
I got baptized in Jesus’ name for remission of sins per Acts 2:38, and received the Holy Ghost with speaking in tongues (per Acts 2:38 & 39, etc.) not long after we started dating.
They then told me “Now you’re a believer”.
Soon after (probably the next day) I was at Girlfriend’s house. Her kids were on the floor in the living room (across from the couch I was sitting on) and she was crawling around tending them and trying to get them to go to sleep.
I’d noticed her knees popping LOUDLY as she crawled and asked her if that hurt. She says yes, it’s done that all her life.
Eventually she falls asleep on the floor beside them.
I had nothing to do so I started thinking about getting baptized, etc and how they’d called me a believer. And I remembered the promises in Mark 16:16-18
So I said to God “They said I’m a believer. YOU said the believers shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. You DIDN’T say they have to be awake when you do it.”
So I crawled next to her, laid hands on her knees, and prayed for her to be healed in Jesus’ name.
Then I got back up on the couch and waited for her to wake up.
When she woke, she was healed, and remains healed of that to this day.
That emboldened part of my prayer about healing was why I said “He (God) was getting me back”.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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Oh Sophie, if there was any good word in due season that I could speak to you that would give you life, I would say it…but, your heart is too full of anger towards me..you could not receive it.
So, I will speak to our Father in Heaven instead….
Dear Heavenly Father,
Have mercy on Sophie and me, whatever has hardened her heart towards me, please remove it and any hardness in my heart towards her, remove it also. We ask for Your Love to flow freely in us.
We love You Heavenly Father! In the Name and power and authority of Jesus Christ, we pray, amen and amen.
So, I will speak to our Father in Heaven instead….
Dear Heavenly Father,
Have mercy on Sophie and me, whatever has hardened her heart towards me, please remove it and any hardness in my heart towards her, remove it also. We ask for Your Love to flow freely in us.
We love You Heavenly Father! In the Name and power and authority of Jesus Christ, we pray, amen and amen.
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We’ll, let’s look at 1 Corinthians 13 in context…
Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.
For we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Corinthians 13:8-13 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 Corinthians 13:8-13&version=NKJV
I agree that the Word of God is PERFECT but, that’s not what Paul is referring to in 1 Corinthians 13.
It’s Love, GOD’S PERFECT LOVE in us. For when He (Jesus Christ the PERFECT ONE) appears, we shall appear also just like Him.
That hasn’t happened yet….so, NONE of the gifts of the Holy Spirit have ceased but they will when God’s Perfect Love is fully in us….at Christ’s return.
Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away.
For we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known.
And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.
1 Corinthians 13:8-13 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 Corinthians 13:8-13&version=NKJV
I agree that the Word of God is PERFECT but, that’s not what Paul is referring to in 1 Corinthians 13.
It’s Love, GOD’S PERFECT LOVE in us. For when He (Jesus Christ the PERFECT ONE) appears, we shall appear also just like Him.
That hasn’t happened yet….so, NONE of the gifts of the Holy Spirit have ceased but they will when God’s Perfect Love is fully in us….at Christ’s return.
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If I GIVE a set of 5 beds to a family with 5 kids... the kids will ask their mom or dad expectantly "Where'd you get these [matching] beds?!" The parents will probably be honest and say "A nice man gave them to us..." At which point the focus switches from the parents to the "nice" person. And the hope for future good fortune of a similar nature switches to "Finding another nice person to give us something we need". The kids are starting to learn to look for handouts instead of how to use what they have to better themselves, and the parents look a bit inept in the eyes of their children.
On the other hand, if I SELL the beds to a family with 5 kids... the kids will ask their mom or dad expectantly "Where'd you get these [matching] beds?!" The parents can honestly say "We bought them from a guy for only 10 bucks apiece!" Now the parents look like financial geniuses, and the kids can go to school with their heads held high thinking "Some people have more than we do, but I bet their parents can't find deals like MY parents do". And their internal focus will tend towards using their resources to search out similar good purchases. Which means they feel empowered to overcome their adversities with skill rather than hand-outs.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
On the other hand, if I SELL the beds to a family with 5 kids... the kids will ask their mom or dad expectantly "Where'd you get these [matching] beds?!" The parents can honestly say "We bought them from a guy for only 10 bucks apiece!" Now the parents look like financial geniuses, and the kids can go to school with their heads held high thinking "Some people have more than we do, but I bet their parents can't find deals like MY parents do". And their internal focus will tend towards using their resources to search out similar good purchases. Which means they feel empowered to overcome their adversities with skill rather than hand-outs.
Love in Jesus,
Kelby
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