Once Saved Always Saved is True.

[Charlie24]

He is talking about physical death here. Not spiritual death.

John said a child born of God can’t sin. Because they have been born of God (sin here being in the habitual ongoing sense)

if I child of God can’t sin, how can they fall away

also, john said whoever sins has never known or seen God

so if one sins (habitual ongoing sin ) how can we say they were ever saved, if they never knew God.

Have you changed your mind? Have you really gone back to we can sin ourself out of salvation in affect placing us under law?

I totally and whole-heartedly disagree! But I will not carry on this contention with the arrogance of someone who can't make their points without slandering the one they disagree with. I believe a device has been given for times such as this, I have no choice but to use it. Off to ignore you go!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I totally and whole-heartedly disagree! But I will not carry on this contention with the arrogance of someone who can't make their points without slandering the one they disagree with. I believe a device has been given for times such as this, I have no choice but to use it. Off to ignore you go!

Lol,

So its ok for you to slander people

I did not slander you I asked a question.

If you do not like getting asked questions, maybe this is not the place for you

Continue in you legalistic jumbo jumbo and not understanding the word of God.

I will pray for you

and I will pray for those who attempt to show you the trueth and afre falsly accused by you

 

[soberxp]

Can you calm down and stop quarrel.

I think all people can be saved because we have a kind God.
I know, because I learned this from God, although I am also confused about the description of revelation.
The ultimate right to interpret is in the mercy of God .

Exodus 33：19

Rome 9：15 - 9：18

For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

 

[tourist]

Ouch?

It's supposed to be funny. I guess I have to s-p-e-l-l it out for you. Instead of typing EG for Eternally Gratefully, I typed ET. Then they started a thread about ET-the character from the 1980's movie, ET? Sheesh.....

I hope that clears that up--it was to Eternally Gratefully in any case, so not sure why you're even responding.

Wonder if ET hast a middle initial - maybe A, then EAT would fit right in on the What's For Dinner thread.

 

[tourist]

These no longer exist. The KJV has never been proven to contain errors, however, that is for another thread.

Not sure what this has to do with ET.

 

[Aerials1978]

Ezekiel 18:24

"But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die."

The Old Testament folks were saved the same way we are, by faith in Jesus Christ!

Those before the Cross looked forward to the coming Messiah and acknowledged faith in Him through the sacrifice of an innocent animal which represented Christ.

After the Cross we look back to the Messiah who sacrificed Himself for our sins.

The point I am making is that the "righteous" in Ezek. 18:24 is a believer in the Messiah who is saved, but has turned from that righteousness by no longer believing. The righteousness he had came from faith, he now no longer has that faith!

All that he did that was good while he believed is no longer acknowledged by God and he is condemned by no longer having faith.

He lost his salvation by no longer having faith, which gave him the righteousness.

I could see where you may have come to that conclusion by referring to the OT which was exclusively given to the Hebrews. Based on your understanding of scripture, can a person remove their name from the book of life by their own conscience decide to do so?

 

[Charlie24]

I could see where you may have come to that conclusion by referring to the OT which was exclusively given to the Hebrews. Based on your understanding of scripture, can a person remove their name from the book of life by their own conscience decide to do so?

We know from Rev. 22:19 that a believers name can be removed from the Book of Life.

How can their name be removed from the Book of Life if it's not already in the Book of Life?

We can use all the scripture we want to say man cannot lose his salvation, but we plainly see that it is possible!

 

[Jocund]

We know from Rev. 22:19 that a believers name can be removed from the Book of Life.

How can their name be removed from the Book of Life if it's not already in the Book of Life?

We can use all the scripture we want to say man cannot lose his salvation, but we plainly see that it is possible!

A good point and a good question.

If we look at the KJV and search "blot" we find some references to this concept of being removed or having one's name blotted out of the book of life. But we see in Rev 3:5 a promise not to have the names blotted out for "he that overcometh"

And from 1 John:

"For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith." - 1 John 5:4 KJV

 

[Mem]

Wonder if ET hast a middle initial - maybe A, then EAT would fit right in on the What's For Dinner thread.

As long as you make sure you don't feed him after midnight...no, wait, that was Gizmo. Ok, nvm.

 

[tourist]

As long as you make sure you don't feed him after midnight...no, wait, that was Gizmo. Ok, nvm.

Yeah, Gizmo, a little gremlin if I recall correctly.

 

[Aerials1978]

We know from Rev. 22:19 that a believers name can be removed from the Book of Life.

How can their name be removed from the Book of Life if it's not already in the Book of Life?

We can use all the scripture we want to say man cannot lose his salvation, but we plainly see that it is possible!

That passage from Revelation is directed at those who are not saved. No individual that truly belongs to the Lord will try intently distorted His Gospel. Think of the doctrines of Mormonisms, JW, and even some Protestant denominations. They preach another Christ.

 

[Laura798]

Maybe I should have spelt it differently: oouuchhh.

Oh Jocund, Im sorry- what a classic scene—i had completely forgotten it! I thought you thought i was making of fun of eternally grateful! 😕

Loved seeing that scene again and my apologies for misunderstanding. Ps actually Ouch was a clever response.😉

 

[Charlie24]

That passage from Revelation is directed at those who are not saved. No individual that truly belongs to the Lord will try intently distorted His Gospel. Think of the doctrines of Mormonisms, JW, and even some Protestant denominations. They preach another Christ.

If that person is not saved, how did their name get in the Book of Life?

Why did Jesus this in Rev. 3:5?

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

There are some that "did run well" as Paul said! But in the end they "fell from grace" as Paul also said!

 

[Laura798]

Maybe I should have spelt it differently: oouuchhh.

In fact, I love using memes--now I have another in my pocket--thanks to you!

To Everything There is a Season
…2a time to be born and a time to die, a time to plant and a time to uproot, 3a time to kill and a time to heal, a time to break down and a time to build, 4a time to weep and a time to laugh"--Ecclessiastes 3:3

 

[Aerials1978]

If that person is not saved, how did their name get in the Book of Life?

Why did Jesus this in Rev. 3:5?

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

There are some that "did run well" as Paul said! But in the end they "fell from grace" as Paul also said![/QUOTE

Again, that passage does not indicate that one can lose their salvation by their own means. You have read it in conjunction with the text as a whole and other scripture.

Paul in Galatians is addressing those that believe that the law justifies them before God.

Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
Galatians 5:2-4

Also Jesus made this statement:

This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day
John 6: 39

To reiterate this, the writer or Hebrews says:

so that by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have taken refuge would have strong encouragement to take hold of the hope set before us. This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, a hope both sure and steadfast and one which enters within the veil, where Jesus has entered as a forerunner for us, having become a high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek.
Hebrews 6: 18-20

God does not lie nor renege on His word. Once secured(Before the foundation of the world) one is always secure.

 

[Charlie24]

No one is going to lose salvation if they continue to believe!

I'm sure that all of us here will believe until the end, so there is no problem here to argue!

 

[Aerials1978]

No one is going to lose salvation if they continue to believe!

I'm sure that all of us here will believe until the end, so there is no problem here to argue!

Would you say that a person sets their own destiny then? There is no argument, it’s just apply scripture correctly.

 

[Charlie24]

Would you say that a person sets their own destiny then? There is no argument, it’s just apply scripture correctly.

Salvation is a choice. That would mean that the destiny of man is decided by each individual as to whether he will meet the demands of God for salvation!

On the other hand, the Calvinist will argue against this until the cows come home!

 

[Laura798]

If that person is not saved, how did their name get in the Book of Life?

Why did Jesus this in Rev. 3:5?

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

There are some that "did run well" as Paul said! But in the end they "fell from grace" as Paul also said!

Charlie,

It's curious that person's on this forum, say we aren't listening, but they themselves aren't either--you stated the plain scripture--"will blot out their name from the BOOK OF LIFE." This is said this in other places of scripture as well.

The Book of Life represents God's record of those who will receive the gift of eternal life--if God has their name written there, then they were once counted among the righteous.

He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. ( Revelation 3:5–6)

Who is being spoken to here? "The one who OVERCOMES" We've said this many times in many ways yet, they will not listen:

Christ has commanded us to abide in him AND Obey Him--if we don't need to obey, and our salvation is secure then we could do whatever we wanted, which is why the church is rife with sin and is no longer preaching the gospel! We are not legalist. We do not believe we can ever our salvation, we are simply doing what Christ called us to do. OSAS is another secret heresy that Satan has infiltrated the church with to weaken the faith and good works of many --and to cause them to fall away.

"May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous."--Psalm 69:28

"32 But now, please forgive their sin—but if not, then blot me out of the book you have written.”..."3 The Lord replied to Moses, “Whoever has sinned against me I will blot out of my book. "--Exodus 32: 32-33

Judas fell away. Did God know the future? Of course--he doesn't live in the past, present or future, but even Jesus prayed for the cup to pass from Him even though He knew the outcome--Why? Because nothing is impossible for God. God could bring about His purpose without Judas betraying Him.

"He [Judas] was one of our number and shared in our ministry."--Acts 1:17

There are many IF verses. It is clear that a person can be saved and then be lost--this has NOTHING to do with works based salvation. I am serene and secure in my salvation---because it Him in me that does the work, AS LONG as I ABIDE and OBEY. Abiding and believing works can save you are TWO different things!

"If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.-"-15:6

The following verse cannot be more clear--it is emphasized by saying it in a variety of ways--the only way anyone can deny what it says is by re-interpreting it; what I hear from the OSAS camp typically is, "Well it really isn't saying that." Just as Satan said to Eve, "Did God really say...?"

"…It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age— and then have fallen away—to be restored to repentance, because they themselves are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting Him to open shame.…"--Hebrews 6:4-6

 

[Laura798]

That passage from Revelation is directed at those who are not saved. No individual that truly belongs to the Lord will try intently distorted His Gospel. Think of the doctrines of Mormonisms, JW, and even some Protestant denominations. They preach another Christ.

Aerials, that makes no sense. If a teacher has an attendance sheet and you attend that school, you are on the sheet--if you get kicked out of that school, your name will be removed from the attendance sheet.

It is GODS BOOK OF LIFE--it is written by GOD HIMSELF. Why would God write an unsaved person's name in the Book of Life since He knows the end from the beginning? He clearly is showing us that we can be LOST even though once we were FOUND.

We are all Israel--there were those of Israel that DID NOT ENTER God's REST--what is this rest? When we go to be with Him and live with Him in the heavenly kingdom and eternity.

Therefore, as the Holy Spirit says, “Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion, as on the day of testing in the wilderness, where your ancestors put me to the test, though they had seen my works for forty years. Therefore I was angry with that generation, and I said, ‘They always go astray in their hearts, and they have not known my ways.’ As in my anger I swore, ‘They will not enter my rest.’” (Hebrews 3:7-11).