As a thief in the night

[Pilgrimshope]

Good day, Pilgrimshope!

I agree with you, in-part, meaning that the results of those four angels who are told not to harm the earth, nor sea, nor any tree, is not just the 6th trumpet where those angels kill a third of mankind. But the results are all of the previous trumpets and bowl judgements as well:

1st Trumpet = a third of the earth and the trees are burned up

2nd Trumpet = Something like a huge mountain all ablaze (asteroid coming through the atmosphere?) being thrown into the ocean with a third of the creatures of the sea being killed and a third of the ships.

3rd Trumpet = A third of the rivers and fresh water contaminated, so that many people die from drinking the water.

4th Trumpet = No direct destruction of the earth, sea or trees. Only a third less light on the earth during the day and night.

5th Trumpet = Demonic being released from the Abyss to torment the inhabitants of the earth for 5 months

6th Trumpet = Four evil angels and their demonic army of 200 million kill a third of mankind

7th Trumpet = Satan and his angels cast out of heaven and restricted to the earth. (Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea; with great fury the devil has come down to you, knowing he has only a short time.”

The bowl judgments are also included in the destruction of the earth by those four angels.

do you think the “third part “ begins here ? And connects to those “ bowl” judgements

“A third part of thee shall die with the pestilence, and with famine shall they be consumed in the midst of thee: and a third part shall fall by the sword round about thee; and I will scatter a third part into all the winds, and I will draw out a sword after them.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭5:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬


“Thou shalt burn with fire a third part in the midst of the city, when the days of the siege are fulfilled: and thou shalt take a third part, and smite about it with a knife: and a third part thou shalt scatter in the wind;

and I will draw out a sword after them.

Thou shalt also take thereof a few in number, and bind them in thy skirts. Then take of them again, and cast them into the midst of the fire, and burn them in the fire; for thereof shall a fire come forth into all the house of Israel.

Thus saith the Lord God; This is Jerusalem: I have set it in the midst of the nations and countries that are round about her. And she hath changed my judgments into wickedness more than the nations, and my statutes more than the countries that are round about her: for they have refused my judgments and my statutes, they have not walked in them.

Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I, even I, am against thee, and will execute judgments in the midst of thee in the sight of the nations. And I will do in thee that which I have not done, and whereunto I will not do any more the like, because of all thine abominations.”
‭‭Ezekiel‬ ‭5:2-6, 8-9‬ ‭KJV‬‬

And is that where this comes from

“For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:21‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[Cabrillo]

@Pilgrimshope I totally agree that the thief comes on suddenly and UNEXPECTEDLY!

When I was a child you NEVER saw homosexuality on t.v.,now it is in just about everything we watch even news and talk shows.

We have become complacent regarding the SINS OF THE WORLD and have let them creep into our churches also!

Homosexuality
Adultery
Swingers
Drug addicts
Alcohol consumers
Abortion
Racism
Ect.

I look and think could Noah's or Lot's days be any worse than today?


We must shake ourselves and awake out of our deep sleep to be ready!

It's intentional because the more we see it the more we are tenderized and start to feel its acceptable. My wife divorced me because a so called christian marriage counseler said "it's better to commit the sin of divorce and ask for forgiveness than to remain in unhappiness." (There was no adultery).

I got kicked out of that fellowship because All divorced people were reckoned to be adulterers and thus no divorced people were allowed to remain members of that Christian Assembly. Now even gays men and lezbo's get ordained. We are concidered self rlghtous these days in some churches if we openly oppose them. The Devil is taking over. No question in my mind.

Many know his words but they think the word of God has passed it's expiration date. It's not going to stop till the Lord returns. I'm not shocked any more. Rather, I expect it to get much worse. I don't try to make rapture a math problem or science project. I just say, Get ready, stay ready, be ready in plain English. Even some scoffers say that I take the word too serious and it's all good because the Lord died for all sin's. My come back is that it still dosn't give us a liscense to sin.

BTW; I was calibob, Let no one think it is a decption. My laptop was stolen while I was in the hospital and it was just easier to start a new account than try to retrieve the stolen information, passwords etc. I'm in Long Beach awaiting VA housing. I'm getting medical treatment that single men don't qualify for in Oklahoma. Nice to share again with you and the rest.

 

[Nehemiah6]

it seems as if it’s going to be without warning if we aren’t looking

Actually you have taken two separate things and combined them together. Never a good idea.

THE RAPTURE
"The thief in the night" applies to the imminent, unexpected, and unannounced coming of Christ for His Church at the Rapture. A thief comes in the night in the same manner -- when least expected. Hence all the admonitions to Christians to be watchful and sober.

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. (Mt 24:42-44) The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, (Mt 24:50) Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh. (Mt 25:13 from the Parable of the Ten Virgins)

THE SECOND COMING: "TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT"
But when Christ comes to judge the world, it will be evident to the whole world, and therefore all the kindreds of the earth will mourn in fear and trepidation. So there is a demarcation between what applies to the Church and what applies to the world. Now please note what happens at the Second Coming: Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7) And the reason for this coming is given in Jude: And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2 THESSALONIANS: THE SECOND COMING WITH ALL THE SAINTS AND ANGELS
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

As I have been saying over and over again, people are making A MISHMASH of the Rapture (one event) and the Second Coming (another event). And you have done the same thing.

 

[Gardenias]

Oh how I would love to sit down and talk to some of you over ☕!

I have a really hard time with Revelations but the bits I've gleaned over the years have kept me more vigilant.

My one and only prayer now is God plz send someone to my family,the homeless,the prostitutes and junkies, prisoners, any and all who will listen!

May the Holy Spirit go before them and prick the hearts of those with conviction.
Let it be someone who has the right spirit and right gifts to reach them.

We must wake up believers,wipe the slumber from our eyes and be about the Lord's business!

 

[Gardenias]

It's intentional because the more we see it the more we are tenderized and start to feel its acceptable. My wife divorced me because a so called christian marriage counseler said "it's better to commit the sin of divorce and ask for forgiveness than to remain in unhappiness." (There was no adultery).

I got kicked out of that fellowship because All divorced people were reckoned to be adulterers and thus no divorced people were allowed to remain members of that Christian Assembly. Now even gays men and lezbo's get ordained. We are concidered self rlghtous these days in some churches if we openly oppose them. The Devil is taking over. No question in my mind.

Many know his words but they think the word of God has passed it's expiration date. It's not going to stop till the Lord returns. I'm not shocked any more. Rather, I expect it to get much worse. I don't try to make rapture a math problem or science project. I just say, Get ready, stay ready, be ready in plain English. Even some scoffers say that I take the word too serious and it's all good because the Lord died for all sin's. My come back is that it still dosn't give us a liscense to sin.

BTW; I was calibob, Let no one think it is a decption. My laptop was stolen while I was in the hospital and it was just easier to start a new account than try to retrieve the stolen information, passwords etc. I'm in Long Beach awaiting VA housing. I'm getting medical treatment that single men don't qualify for in Oklahoma. Nice to share again with you and the rest.

Welcome back to you!
This one word I despise but it's most characteristic of today's churches COMPLACENCY.

We are actually allowing the enemy room by complying with the junk that's in buildings called churches.
He said we were in the world and prayed the Father NOT take us out of the world but to keep us from the evils of the world.
I cling to the word of God and hold tightly to the Holy Ghost guidance!

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Actually you have taken two separate things and combined them together. Never a good idea.

THE RAPTURE
"The thief in the night" applies to the imminent, unexpected, and unannounced coming of Christ for His Church at the Rapture. A thief comes in the night in the same manner -- when least expected. Hence all the admonitions to Christians to be watchful and sober.

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. (Mt 24:42-44) The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, (Mt 24:50) Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh. (Mt 25:13 from the Parable of the Ten Virgins)

THE SECOND COMING: "TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT"
But when Christ comes to judge the world, it will be evident to the whole world, and therefore all the kindreds of the earth will mourn in fear and trepidation. So there is a demarcation between what applies to the Church and what applies to the world. Now please note what happens at the Second Coming: Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7) And the reason for this coming is given in Jude: And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2 THESSALONIANS: THE SECOND COMING WITH ALL THE SAINTS AND ANGELS
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

As I have been saying over and over again, people are making A MISHMASH of the Rapture (one event) and the Second Coming (another event). And you have done the same thing.

this isn’t a pre trib rapture thread .

And yeah don’t they ask him two seperate questions there ?

“And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? (Jerusalem and the temples destruction )

and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭24:3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I think often a person has their own thoughts and “ so everyone else is mistaken and are misconstruing things “ because we don’t ourselves see it the same

we’re all free to believe as we will and I don’t agree with your interpretations , but that’s alright with me that’s part of why we discuss things rather than accuse others of misconstruing things we see differently, just because it’s not how we ourselves might think or perceive.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Welcome back to you!
This one word I despise but it's most characteristic of today's churches COMPLACENCY.

We are actually allowing the enemy room by complying with the junk that's in buildings called churches.
He said we were in the world and prayed the Father NOT take us out of the world but to keep us from the evils of the world.
I cling to the word of God and hold tightly to the Holy Ghost guidance!

that’s all we really can do in my own belief also . Cling tightly to his word in Christ and trust that he is the one to save us from the wrath coming upon the world . And that he will deliver us into eternity to be with him forever

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Actually you have taken two separate things and combined them together. Never a good idea.

THE RAPTURE
"The thief in the night" applies to the imminent, unexpected, and unannounced coming of Christ for His Church at the Rapture. A thief comes in the night in the same manner -- when least expected. Hence all the admonitions to Christians to be watchful and sober.

Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up. Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. (Mt 24:42-44) The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, (Mt 24:50) Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh. (Mt 25:13 from the Parable of the Ten Virgins)

THE SECOND COMING: "TO EXECUTE JUDGMENT"
But when Christ comes to judge the world, it will be evident to the whole world, and therefore all the kindreds of the earth will mourn in fear and trepidation. So there is a demarcation between what applies to the Church and what applies to the world. Now please note what happens at the Second Coming: Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7) And the reason for this coming is given in Jude: And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

2 THESSALONIANS: THE SECOND COMING WITH ALL THE SAINTS AND ANGELS
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; 10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.

As I have been saying over and over again, people are making A MISHMASH of the Rapture (one event) and the Second Coming (another event). And you have done the same thing.

so His coming isn’t the time he “ raptures “ us ?

“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I would submit to you that one group is going to be gathered to him the day he returns and at the same time the other group ( the world ) will experience this the same day of his return and tethering of the people

“And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe in that day.”
‭‭2 Thessalonians‬ ‭1:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

seems like the same day with two different results he will appear with his angels and gather his people and those left will experience the wrath of his coming same day two different results

but again that’s just what it says in my own view , and I’m no authority to say you have it wrong just submitting to you some thoughts and scripture .

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Oh how I would love to sit down and talk to some of you over ☕!

I have a really hard time with Revelations but the bits I've gleaned over the years have kept me more vigilant.

My one and only prayer now is God plz send someone to my family,the homeless,the prostitutes and junkies, prisoners, any and all who will listen!

May the Holy Spirit go before them and prick the hearts of those with conviction.
Let it be someone who has the right spirit and right gifts to reach them.

We must wake up believers,wipe the slumber from our eyes and be about the Lord's business!

On a hill overlooking glory someday, in eternity I’ll enjoy the conversation also sister! I’m not sure about your taste in music but

 

[Gardenias]

On a hill overlooking glory someday, in eternity I’ll enjoy the conversation also sister! I’m not sure about your taste in music but

Thank you!
I love a music all kinds...except rap.
This was my Mom's favorite song.
She sang it at the sink looking out the windows
I've played it more thank once crying in love of our saviour and his family.

Thank you and I'll be looking for you❤️

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Thank you!
I love a music all kinds...except rap.
This was my Mom's favorite song.
She sang it at the sink looking out the windows
I've played it more thank once crying in love of our saviour and his family.

Thank you and I'll be looking for you❤️

🙂 I’ll be the one shining shoes and hoping to be included

 

[Nehemiah6]

seems like the same day with two different results he will appear with his angels and gather his people and those left will experience the wrath of his coming same day two different results

This is about as BIZARRE a scenario as one can imagine. TOTAL NONSENSE AND UNBIBLICAL.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

This is about as BIZARRE a scenario as one can imagine. TOTAL NONSENSE AND UNBIBLICAL.

so you didn’t read the scripture and instead went for an insult and that is biblical 😊



For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:16-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe in that day.”
‭‭2 Thessalonians‬ ‭1:7-10‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I’m not sure it’s nonsensical but it does seem to be quite different from what you think. It seems rather plain and fits perfectly with what Jesus said eill
Happen upon his return

“But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.

And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭13:24-27‬ ‭

but I digress because it seems as if your only interested in conflict to anyone who doesn’t tell You , you are right about every subject

 

[Mofastus]

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

Acts 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

Hey kids let's all sing it together now: I Don't know !

 

[Mofastus]

I got kicked out of that fellowship because All divorced people were reckoned to be adulterers and thus no divorced people were allowed to remain members of that Christian Assembly. Now even gays men and lezbo's get ordained. We are concidered self rlghtous these days in some churches if we openly oppose them. The Devil is taking over. No question in my mind.

John 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.

1 Corinthians 3:22 Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;

1 Corinthians 3:23 And ye are Christ's; and Christ is God's.

It's all about Jesus !!!
and thank you for your service!

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Good day!

I believe that we will experience the chaos right up to the time that the church is gathered, but that we will be gathered to the Lord prior to that first seal being opened, which initiates God's wrath.

Regarding the comparison of Noah, think of it this way: current believers in Christ represent Noah. God told Noah that He was going to flood the earth and for him to build an ark. It took Noah a 100 years to build it and during that time he was preaching to the people about God's coming wrath via the flood, but they did not believe. Likewise, believers have been telling people that the church is going to be gathered (which is our ark), as well as the wrath that is to follow. And just as it was at the time of Noah, so it will be with the Lord rescuing His church and the following wrath.

"They tell how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead—Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath.

I would also mention that the sudden destruction is likened unto a woman having birth pains, which would demonstrate that the sudden destruction will take place over a period of time. For regarding birth pains, they start out mild and far apart and then get closer together and more intense. This would describe the time of God's wrath via the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments, i.e. plague of wrath, after plague of wrath. In other words, the sudden destruction is not going take place all in one day, but over that seven year period. With just the 4th seal and 6th Trumpet (a fourth and a third, respectively), over half the earth's population will have been killed during the first 3 1/2 years. And that is not including the fatalities resulting from trumpets 1, 2 and 3, nor the fatalities from the bowl judgments. By the time that sudden destruction is completed, the majority of the earth's population will have been decimated and all human government dismantled.

I think you are waiting for seven year periods and angels to pour out bowls looking at revelation as a literal book but this is how we will be saved from the wrath

Most of us from every generation will love our lives and pass away from the world but in the last generation , just before this moment

“And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe in that day. Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:”
‭‭2 Thessalonians‬ ‭1:7-11‬ ‭KJV‬‬

just before that sudden moment this will happen

“For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭4:15-18‬ ‭


I think many look at revelation as a literal book of physical events but what we are seeing is an apocalypse that’s showing us a vision not from earths point of view but from heavens point of view

John is seeing a spiritual apocalypse he’s seeing the spiritual events happening on earth not looking from earth seeing physical events

but I do understand your view I have had Amit of discussions with you out it but I just think that you ought to read the literal things on scripture and understand revelation is not something we’re going to see but it’s something John was looking from heaven back into earth seeing because it’s a revelation of things not seen or understood on earth , but revealing meaning of prophecy

it’s going to be sudden when he comes he’s going to gather his people who are still alive that day and destroy those who are left with the world . Gods wrath is going to be ignited that day with everlasting fire but he’s going to deliver his people still living on earth an instant

Most everyone will already have loved and passed through this world but if we are here that day

“In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away:

and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.

Remember Lot's wife.

Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭17:31-36‬ ‭KJV‬‬

believers will be caught up with the lord , unbelievers will be left to that flaming fire that returns with Christ and the tree how that generation will be saved from wrath

but most generations already have lived and died and won’t be involved in that day and we can be saved from the wrath of the lake of fire now through him

 

[Pilgrimshope]

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?

Acts 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

Hey kids let's all sing it together now: I Don't know !

amen , but we do know how

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21:1-5‬ ‭KJV‬

I think we aren’t supposed to know when by design so we will live each day as of tomorrow coild
Be that day

 

[Pilgrimshope]

First I would submit that, the four living beings, the Ker-oob, are not the same angels as those who are standing at the four corners of the earth to harm the earth, sea and trees.

My point was/is, that everything that happens regarding the earth, sea and trees will be the result of those four angels who are told to not harm the earth, sea and trees until the 144,000 are sealed.



I agree that the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments will affect the entire world.



I see the four horsemen as not being specific to Israel, but God's wrath upon the entire earth. In support of this, at the fourth seal, Death and Hades personified, are given authority to kill a fourth of the earth's population. There is no way that Israel could meet that number of a fourth, but demonstrates the general population on the earth.



The group above are those who will become believers after the church has been gathered and during the time of God's wrath, those who will come out of the great tribulation, which is the last 3 1/2 years of that seven year period. In further support of this, when asked who they are, John doesn't know, even though he had just written letters to the seven churches. The fact that we are being introduced to this group and that John doesn't know who they are, demonstrates that it is not the church, but another group.



The gathering of the church found in 1 Thess.4:16-17, is shown to be a group event which takes place almost simultaneously, with the dead resurrecting first, then the living being transformed immortal and glorified and caught up with them. At that time the entire church from beginning to end will be with the Lord in the air, where He will then take the entire group back to the Father's house to those places that He went to prepare for us.



And I see it as it taking place chronologically, ergo the seals, trumpets and bowl judgments each numbered one thru seven.

And same here. I also appreciate your input and am just putting out there the why's and how comes of what I believe from scripture.

yes I respect your view we just fundamentally disagree about revelation. But I’m glad and welcome other view points also

I find a difference in the dead in Christ to be raised up in the end , and the living in Christ who have repented and accepted his judgement of eternal
Life.

“And I seek not mine own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth. Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:50-51‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:22, 24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?”
‭‭John‬ ‭11:25-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I do believe that he’s able to make us live eternally unceasingly

To a man facing his demise

“And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.”
‭‭Luke‬ ‭23:43‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I don’t Think he was saying some day in the future after you go wait in the grave I believe he’s saying today your going to be with me in paradise . I believe there’s also a group who’s going to be saved from this group the last day

“Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”
‭‭John‬ ‭5:28-29‬ ‭KJV‬‬

so there are those who have fallen asleep in Christ and those who have come alive in Christ by accepting the gospel and approaching the throne of grace now repenting and following after the lords word accepting the judgement today and walking in him today brings a promise from enochs time


“By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

And I seek not mine own glory: there is one that seeketh and judgeth. Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.”
‭‭John‬ ‭8:50-51‬ ‭KJV‬

then there’s the dead who are raised up to face the judgement because they refused it in this life

“And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭20:12-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

I think there’s a lot at play in scripture some see it others see other things but the gospel offers eternal
Life now by faith so we don’t have to be among the dead

 

[Mofastus]

I think we aren’t supposed to know when by design so we will live each day as of tomorrow coild
Be that day

it's today we live

Matthew 6:34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Psalms 118:24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

 

[Pilgrimshope]

it's today we live

Matthew 6:34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Psalms 118:24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

amen today is the day of salvation

“And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed. The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭13:11-12

“But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light. Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light. See then that ye walk circumspectly, not as fools, but as wise, Redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.”
‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:13-17‬ ‭KJV‬‬

“But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭3:13-15‬ ‭KJV‬‬

‭‭
“(For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)”
‭‭2 Corinthians‬ ‭6:2‬ ‭KJV‬‬