Jesus comes immediately AFTER the tribulation, there is no Left Behind Secret Rapture=Stop causing fear.

[Absolutely]

Gods people in the ark right before the flood.

Gathered and removed.

Noah and family over a mile into the sky.

Noah in ark extended family SHUT OUT.


10 VIRGINS....THE SAME

Noah in ark ....ark a type of heaven

5 wise in heaven

Noah gathered....door shut

5 wise virgins gathered .....door shut.

To top it off....both examples are BY JESUS IN THE SAME BREATH.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[Absolutely]

Here is a good find i made today.
Mat 24 :40 says "....then the flood came and "took" them all away"

It could mean noah was " taken"

Why? That word "taken" is "eren" g142 ....actually is; "lift,hoist, raise, as in raising an anchor"

Strong's Concordance
airó: to raise, take up, lift
Original Word: αἴρω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: airó
Phonetic Spelling: (ah'-ee-ro)
Definition: to raise, take up, lift
Usage: I raise, lift up, take away, remove.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Here is a good find i made today.
Mat 24 :40 says "....then the flood came and "took" them all away"

It could mean noah was " taken"
Why? That word "taken" is "eren" g142 ....actually is; "lift,hoist, raise, as in raising an anchor"

Strong's Concordance
airó: to raise, take up, lift
Original Word: αἴρω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: airó
Phonetic Spelling: (ah'-ee-ro)
Definition: to raise, take up, lift
Usage: I raise, lift up, take away, remove.

Hey Abs,

[re: v.39 "and took them all away" G142]

Consider a post I'd made on that, some time back:

[quoting old post]


Consider (alongside my points re: Matt24:38-39's use of the word "G142"):

"took [/take; G142]" (as used in the following) -


--Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."


--1 Corinthians 5:2 - "And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away [G142] from among you."


--Acts 8:33 [2x] (Isa53:8) - "In his humiliation his judgment was taken away [G142]: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken [G142] from the earth."


--John 11:48 - "If we shall let Him alone like this, all will believe in Him, and the Romans will come and will take away [G142] both our place and nation."



So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing)




[see that this Matthew 24 passage, along with their Q of Him in Matt24:3 which was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about (in the EARLIER setting of, and about) the Matt13:24,30,39,40,49-50 context, when the angels will "REAP" [note: this does not take place at our Rapture event!]... that is when "HE SHALL SEND" His angels to do "this" and "that" , but in our Rapture context, it is "the Lord HIMSELF" and we [alone, AS ONE] will experience "OUR episynagoges UNTO HIM" to the meeting of the Lord... IN THE AIR, and takes place in the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of Matt13/Matt24 )]


[end quoting old post]

____________

 

[Absolutely]

Hey Abs,

[re: v.39 "and took them all away" G142]

Consider a post I'd made on that, some time back:

[quoting old post]


Consider (alongside my points re: Matt24:38-39's use of the word "G142"):

"took [/take; G142]" (as used in the following) -


--Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."


--1 Corinthians 5:2 - "And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away [G142] from among you."


--Acts 8:33 [2x] (Isa53:8) - "In his humiliation his judgment was taken away [G142]: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken [G142] from the earth."


--John 11:48 - "If we shall let Him alone like this, all will believe in Him, and the Romans will come and will take away [G142] both our place and nation."



So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing)




[see that this Matthew 24 passage, along with their Q of Him in Matt24:3 which was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about (in the EARLIER setting of, and about) the Matt13:24,30,39,40,49-50 context, when the angels will "REAP" [note: this does not take place at our Rapture event!]... that is when "HE SHALL SEND" His angels to do "this" and "that" , but in our Rapture context, it is "the Lord HIMSELF" and we [alone, AS ONE] will experience "OUR episynagoges UNTO HIM" to the meeting of the Lord... IN THE AIR, and takes place in the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of Matt13/Matt24 )]


[end quoting old post]

____________

"""So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing"""

...and yet we see a ship ( ark) and
G142 " lifted, hoisted, raised" in context, but you choose every other meaning.

Iow you must pretend it CANNOT mean the primary meaning

 

[Absolutely]

Hey Abs,

[re: v.39 "and took them all away" G142]

Consider a post I'd made on that, some time back:

[quoting old post]


Consider (alongside my points re: Matt24:38-39's use of the word "G142"):

"took [/take; G142]" (as used in the following) -


--Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."


--1 Corinthians 5:2 - "And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away [G142] from among you."


--Acts 8:33 [2x] (Isa53:8) - "In his humiliation his judgment was taken away [G142]: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken [G142] from the earth."


--John 11:48 - "If we shall let Him alone like this, all will believe in Him, and the Romans will come and will take away [G142] both our place and nation."



So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing)




[see that this Matthew 24 passage, along with their Q of Him in Matt24:3 which was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about (in the EARLIER setting of, and about) the Matt13:24,30,39,40,49-50 context, when the angels will "REAP" [note: this does not take place at our Rapture event!]... that is when "HE SHALL SEND" His angels to do "this" and "that" , but in our Rapture context, it is "the Lord HIMSELF" and we [alone, AS ONE] will experience "OUR episynagoges UNTO HIM" to the meeting of the Lord... IN THE AIR, and takes place in the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of Matt13/Matt24 )]


[end quoting old post]

____________

are you aware you invoked "raised" as your primary example?
"""Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."""""
Yes he raised up a stone in context with sea/flood/water.

Lifted...hoisted...raised
As did the flood with the ark.

"The flood came and ...."raised" them.

The wicked went down and drowned.
The ark was taken...raised...lifted...hoisted..

Perfect harmony.

The wicked fled to higher ground.
The ark was raised long before the flood drowned the wicked.

 

[Absolutely]

Hey Abs,

[re: v.39 "and took them all away" G142]

Consider a post I'd made on that, some time back:

[quoting old post]


Consider (alongside my points re: Matt24:38-39's use of the word "G142"):

"took [/take; G142]" (as used in the following) -


--Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."


--1 Corinthians 5:2 - "And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away [G142] from among you."


--Acts 8:33 [2x] (Isa53:8) - "In his humiliation his judgment was taken away [G142]: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken [G142] from the earth."


--John 11:48 - "If we shall let Him alone like this, all will believe in Him, and the Romans will come and will take away [G142] both our place and nation."



So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing)




[see that this Matthew 24 passage, along with their Q of Him in Matt24:3 which was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about (in the EARLIER setting of, and about) the Matt13:24,30,39,40,49-50 context, when the angels will "REAP" [note: this does not take place at our Rapture event!]... that is when "HE SHALL SEND" His angels to do "this" and "that" , but in our Rapture context, it is "the Lord HIMSELF" and we [alone, AS ONE] will experience "OUR episynagoges UNTO HIM" to the meeting of the Lord... IN THE AIR, and takes place in the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of Matt13/Matt24 )]


[end quoting old post]

____________

Now isnt this interesting....pointing away from your assertion:


Thayers;
Buttmann (1873) Ausf. Spr. i., pp. 413, 439; (Winer's Grammar, 47 (46))); 1 future ἀρθήσομαι; (from Homer down); in the Sept. generally equivalent to נָשָׂא; to lift up, raise.
1. to raise up;

a. to raise from the ground, take up: stones, John 8:59; serpents, Mark 16:18; a dead body, Acts 20:9.

b. to raise upward, elevate, lift up: the hand, Revelation 10:5; the eyes, John 11:41; the voice, i. e., speak in a loud tone, cry out, Luke 17:13; Acts 4:24 (also in secular writings); τήν ψυχήν, to raise the mind, equivalent to excite, affect strongly (with a sense of fear, hope, joy, grief, etc.); in John 10:24 to hold the mind in suspense between doubt and hope, cf. Lucke (or Meyer) at the passage,

c. to draw up: a fish, Matthew 17:27 (ἀνασπᾶν, Habakkuk 1:15); σκάφην, Acts 27:17; anchors from the bottom of the sea, Acts 27:13, where supply τάς ἀγκύρας; cf. Kuinoel at the passage; (Winers Grammar, 594 (552); Buttmann, 146 (127)).

2. to take upon oneself and carry what has been raised, to bear: τινα ἐπί χειρῶν, Matthew 4:6; Luke 4:11 (Psalm 90:12 ()); a sick man, Mark 2:3; ζυγόν, Matthew 11:29 (Lamentations 3:27); a bed, Matthew 9:6; Mark 2:9, 11; Luke 5:24; John 5:8-12; τόν σταυρόν, Matt. ( Lachmann marginal reading); ; Luke 9:28; Mark 8:34; Mark 10:21 (in R L brackets); Mark 15:21; (λίθον) Revelation 18:21; to carry with one, (A. V. take): Mark 6:8; Luke 9:3; Luke 22:36. Both of these ideas are expressed in classical Greek by the middle αἴρεσθαι.

3. to bear away what has been raised, carry off;

a. to move from its place: Matthew 21:21; Mark 11:23 (ἄρθητι be thou taken up, removed (Buttmann, 52 (45)), namely, from thy place); Matthew 22:13 (Rec.); John 2:16; John 11:39, 41; John 20:1.

b. to take off or away what is attached to anything: John 19:31, 38f; to tear away, Matthew 9:16; Mark 2:21; to rend away, cut off, John 15:2.

c. to remove: 1 Corinthians 5:2 (cast out from the church, where ἀρθῇ should be read for Rec. ἐξαρθῇ); tropically: faults, Ephesians 4:31; τήν ἁμαρτίαν, John 1:29 (36 Lachmann in brackets), to remove the guilt and punishment of sin by expiation, or to cause that sin be neither imputed nor punished


Looking quite bad for the assertion of " the wicked taken away via the flood"

Btw are you thinking a tsunami?

It was rain and water from springs rising slowly

 

[Absolutely]

Hey Abs,

[re: v.39 "and took them all away" G142]

Consider a post I'd made on that, some time back:

[quoting old post]


Consider (alongside my points re: Matt24:38-39's use of the word "G142"):

"took [/take; G142]" (as used in the following) -


--Revelation 18:21 - "And one mighty angel took up [G142] a stone like a great millstone and cast it into the sea, saying: 'Thus Babylon will be cast down with violence, the great city, and shall never be found any longer."


--1 Corinthians 5:2 - "And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away [G142] from among you."


--Acts 8:33 [2x] (Isa53:8) - "In his humiliation his judgment was taken away [G142]: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken [G142] from the earth."


--John 11:48 - "If we shall let Him alone like this, all will believe in Him, and the Romans will come and will take away [G142] both our place and nation."



So, as I see it, it depends on "who" is doing the "taking" and "to what end / for what purpose" (as to whether a "positive" or a "negative" kind of thing)




[see that this Matthew 24 passage, along with their Q of Him in Matt24:3 which was BASED ON what He had ALREADY spoken to them about (in the EARLIER setting of, and about) the Matt13:24,30,39,40,49-50 context, when the angels will "REAP" [note: this does not take place at our Rapture event!]... that is when "HE SHALL SEND" His angels to do "this" and "that" , but in our Rapture context, it is "the Lord HIMSELF" and we [alone, AS ONE] will experience "OUR episynagoges UNTO HIM" to the meeting of the Lord... IN THE AIR, and takes place in the EXACT OPPOSITE SEQUENCE from that of Matt13/Matt24 )]


[end quoting old post]

____________

go back and re read it.
"""38 For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

39 And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

40 Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
41 Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

42 Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come.

Noah lifted( taken up)... vivid pretrib rapture
One taken left...vivid pretrib rapture
Jesus signs off both dynamics with
WATCH AND BE READY.

What seems to be the problem?

 

[DWR]

Do you believe the "resurrection" of US takes place at the "6th Trumpet / 2nd Woe"... like this passage refers to?:

Revelation 11 -
"11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.

[Let the readers note: Revelation 8:13 says these "3 Woes" (this ^ passage speaking of the "2nd Woe") are connected with the 5th, 6th, and 7th Trumpets events"--So the "2 Witnesses'" resurrection (not to mention their "ascend into Heaven") is connected with the "2nd Woe [/6th Trumpet's events]"]


--Is that when "OUR" resurrection and rapture takes place, according to your viewpoint??

[full disclosure: I do NOT believe that is when our resurrection / rapture takes place]


--[or] do you believe the "2W" will be "resurrected" AGAIN (all over again) with "the DEAD IN Christ" that "SHALL RISE FIRST" just prior to when the "caught up together [/at the same time]" (i.e. RAPTURE event [G726 / 'SNATCH / harpazo']) takes place?




Your viewpoint makes no sense of all this (to me, anyway).

I believe there is ONE resurrection of ALL whose names are written in the book of life.
This is the FIRST resurrection. Paul describes what happens and when it happens very clearly in I Cor. 15.
I believe this takes place when the seventh trump, Paul said the last trump, sounds.

You still have avoided my question, so I will ask again.
IF the "rapture of the church" church takes place and then seven years later the tribulation saints are resurrected in what is called the FIRST resurrection, just how can this be possible.
In your teaching, "the church" is not part of the FIRST resurrection therefore do not escape the power of the second death.
Explain to me in simple words how both the church and the tribulation saints can be in the first resurrection if their resurrections takes place at two different times separated by seven years.

 

[ewq1938]

I believe there is ONE resurrection of ALL whose names are written in the book of life.
This is the FIRST resurrection. Paul describes what happens and when it happens very clearly in I Cor. 15.
I believe this takes place when the seventh trump, Paul said the last trump, sounds.

You still have avoided my question, so I will ask again.
IF the "rapture of the church" church takes place and then seven years later the tribulation saints are resurrected in what is called the FIRST resurrection, just how can this be possible.
In your teaching, "the church" is not part of the FIRST resurrection therefore do not escape the power of the second death.
Explain to me in simple words how both the church and the tribulation saints can be in the first resurrection if their resurrections takes place at two different times separated by seven years.

Pretrib rapture also violates this:

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The dead in Christ are resurrected BEFORE the rapture happens yet Christians die in the Great Tribulation and are resurrected at the second coming. There is not two resurrections of the dead in Christ. All meant to die will die, then Christ descends from heaven with a shout and ALL the dead in Christ resurrect and then the living are raptured. Any other order is scripturally incorrect.

 

[TheLearner]

I think this analogy by ewq is kinda redundant inasmuch as the word "ουτος" essentially means "the same". There is no way to distinguish between "This" and "That" in Koine Greek except through the context. (ex. man attacked a girl. The same man was imprisoned. I think "The same" here may technically be paraphrased as "That" rather than "This" because the actions in question are not in the immediate past though both work.)

In the case of Matthew 24:34, there is no "generation" to refer to in the immediate past, and therefore the use of "that" would not work, but you can determine that Jesus was addressing "a generation" that is not specific to any "years", and that applies to everybody-the generation that was in front of Him. Hence, "This" generation seems to be correct. (Ref. Mat 3:17)

As for the word "Generation" there, as you see in Luke 11:30-32, it doesn't have to mean a set of people living at the same time. As was stated most evidently by Jesus in Mat 24:34, we're practically all in the same generation that they were in--an evil generation.

Interesting it matters what a greek word means in Jesus day.


Matthew 24:34

Easy-to-Read Version



34 I assure you that all these things will happen while some of the people of this time are still living.


32 “The fig tree teaches us a lesson: When its branches become green and soft, and new leaves begin to grow, then you know that summer is very near. 33 In the same way, when you see all these things happening, you will know that the time[d] is very near, already present. 34 I assure you that all these things will happen while some of the people of this time are still living. 35 The whole world, earth and sky, will be destroyed, but my words will last forever.

 

[HatedForNoReason]

...

 

[soberxp]

...

No matter what we will meet Jesus in heaven. or catch up. or sleep.

 

[lawrence101]

What it all boils down to is there ARE NO Scripture to back a Rapture Event before the Second Coming. Look at the years, months, days, hours, minutes, seconds literally wasted looking for Scriptures to explain TWO RAPTURES. Those precious moments could have been spent on doing what we are called to do, lead people to Christ.

Forgive my language here, but when it comes to trying to put Scripture speaking only about a one time single Rapture Event into the timing of Matthew 24, Revelation, Daniel, and others to create a [secret Rapture Event] between Christ's Ascension and His Second Coming, the stupid is real!

No , what it all boils down to is your twisted misunderstanding of scripture, nothing else. and makes everyone wonder what else you have interpreted wrong.

 

[AandW]

No , what it all boils down to is your twisted misunderstanding of scripture, nothing else. and makes everyone wonder what else you have interpreted wrong.

And you're the one who just revealed to be following a known heretics [Darby] writings. Good luck with that!

 

[Absolutely]

Pretrib rapture also violates this:

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

The dead in Christ are resurrected BEFORE the rapture happens yet Christians die in the Great Tribulation and are resurrected at the second coming. There is not two resurrections of the dead in Christ. All meant to die will die, then Christ descends from heaven with a shout and ALL the dead in Christ resurrect and then the living are raptured. Any other order is scripturally incorrect.

verses?

The dead rise at the coming on white horses?

 

[Absolutely]

And you're the one who just revealed to be following a known heretics [Darby] writings. Good luck with that!

Nobody ever heard of darby untill you guys strapped it on like a six shooter
....shooting blanks you think mean something

Total nothing burger.

All "messenger" centered.

The postrib rapture notion originated in the early church by men that saw the jews scattered and taken out of the picture.
Those early church believers were decieved.
1947-48 changed that false prism

Your basis...ironically...is deception

 

[DWR]

IF the "rapture of the church" church takes place and then seven years later the tribulation saints are resurrected in what is called the FIRST resurrection, just how can this be possible.
In your teaching, "the church" is not part of the FIRST resurrection therefore do not escape the power of the second death.
Explain to me in simple words how both the church and the tribulation saints can be in the first resurrection if their resurrections takes place at two different times separated by seven years.

Seems none of you pre-trib folks have an answer for my question.

 

[TheLearner]

And you're the one who just revealed to be following a known heretics [Darby] writings. Good luck with that!

What major doctrines does Darby deny?

 

[TheLearner]

Seems none of you pre-trib folks have an answer for my question.

Try rewording your questions into one simple question. thanks, daniel

 

[TheLearner]

No , what it all boils down to is your twisted misunderstanding of scripture, nothing else. and makes everyone wonder what else you have interpreted wrong.

The doctrine of a secret coming is not in Scripture at all.

1 Thessalonians 4:16
English Standard Version
16 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.