50 Reasons For a Pretribulational Rapture By Dr. John F. Walvoord
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Runningman said:
I thought you did pretty good. You don't seem like a much of a dispensationalist.
Do you believe that God will authorize animal sacrifices again for Israel during the great tribulation?
Another misreading by this poster. Runningman asked if God WILL AUTHORIZE3 ANIMAL SACRIFICES again in the Trib. The answer is NO. Of course He won't authorize such activity. Why not? Because His Son ALREADY made the ultimate sacrifice for sin.
The first 18 verses of Hebrews 10 is about Christ's once for all sacrifice and ends with this:
And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.
I thought you did pretty good. You don't seem like a much of a dispensationalist.
Do you believe that God will authorize animal sacrifices again for Israel during the great tribulation?
Another misreading by this poster. Runningman asked if God WILL AUTHORIZE3 ANIMAL SACRIFICES again in the Trib. The answer is NO. Of course He won't authorize such activity. Why not? Because His Son ALREADY made the ultimate sacrifice for sin.
The first 18 verses of Hebrews 10 is about Christ's once for all sacrifice and ends with this:
And where these have been forgiven, sacrifice for sin is no longer necessary.
VCO said:
I just had to put @FreeGrace2 on my ignore list for Divisive behavior.
I would like to encourage everyone who does not like his Divisive behavior, to do the same.
Yeah, that's what they also say about ignorance. Whatever.
I just had to put @FreeGrace2 on my ignore list for Divisive behavior.
I would like to encourage everyone who does not like his Divisive behavior, to do the same.
Yeah, that's what they also say about ignorance. Whatever.
That is a return. I think I told you before, it is not a return until HIS FEET touch the Ground. This is the RETURN:
Zechariah 14:4 (NASB)
4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south.
THAT IS A RETURN, and anything less is not.
HE STOPS IN THE CLOUDS during the Rapture.
That is part of the Jewish ritual of Receiving the BRIDE.
HE is not allowed to go near the Brides old dwelling place, HE has to designate a member of HIS wedding party to go on from that place to Call Out the BRIDE. He has chosen to designate the Archangel to Call Out His Bride.
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Look again, He does not interfere during the First Half of the SEVEN YEAR COVENIENT with ISRAEL.
Daniel 9:27 (NASB)
27 "And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."
That is a week of YEARS, that he is talking about.
The Antichrist Beheads any one who refuses the MARK of submission to him as god.
It says the Abomination is ON THE WING of the Temple.
I think he will have public executions on the Wing of the Temple, probably a guillotine.
How does he get it up there, there is a secret staircase that goes up there for the TRUMPETERS to call the People.
OOPS, wrong page! Oh well.
Of course Jesus stops in the clouds. He arrives with all the saints already in heaven because they died. And all the living saints are "gathered to Him". So of course He stops. Otherwise, He would CRASH into the living believers coming up to "meet Him in the air", per 1 Thess 4:17.
However, this is where this poster errs greatly. He believes Jesus makes that famous U-turn and takes all the resurrected and raptured believers back to heaven. But he has NOT provided ANY verses that either say this or describe this.
When the Bible is SILENT on a subject, so should we.
However, we don't have to be silent about Jesus coming at the Second Advent, when He gathers all the living saints to Himself in the air, clouds for the resurrection and changing per 1 Cor 15:52. That we don't have to be silent. Jesus raptures living believers when He returns at the Second Advent. 2 Thess 2:1-3 very plainly says so.
The action "caught up TOGETHER [/AT THE SAME TIME]" refers to both the "we which are ALIVE and remain" *and* the portion who had been "the DEAD IN Christ" who will "rise first" just BEFORE the "caught up TOGETHER [/AT THE SAME TIME]" action occurs (i.e. the SNATCH-action G726 [harpazo]... our glorified/perfected bodies are what is "caught up TOGETHER [/AT THE SAME TIME]")
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("noted")
When we study, we should always consider everything in the context of the verse, the passage, the chapter, the book, etc. - whatever context(s) give significance to the meaning.
It will take me a while - it is time-consuming looking at so many details from multiple passages along with looking up word definitions, etc. (whatever may be needed) - it is not a simple small undertaking...
When we study, we should always consider everything in the context of the verse, the passage, the chapter, the book, etc. - whatever context(s) give significance to the meaning.
It will take me a while - it is time-consuming looking at so many details from multiple passages along with looking up word definitions, etc. (whatever may be needed) - it is not a simple small undertaking...
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There are lots of misconceptions ingrained in your propositions. It's not your fault as you are really
just perpetuating false doctrines that have been long established in the Church.
Two salient ones are the dislocation of Daniel's 70th week out of the first century,
and confusion over Jesus's second coming, which was also in the first century,
his third coming obviously being future.
Until you address the wrong ideas undergirding your complicated schemas, you will continue to be in error and somewhat
marginal.
just perpetuating false doctrines that have been long established in the Church.
Two salient ones are the dislocation of Daniel's 70th week out of the first century,
and confusion over Jesus's second coming, which was also in the first century,
his third coming obviously being future.
Until you address the wrong ideas undergirding your complicated schemas, you will continue to be in error and somewhat
marginal.
Excuse me? Jesus is declaring that the end is ***NOT*** immediately. The fact that you incorrectly attributed the statement to the Temple is yet another error.
Of course DTW is once again spot on with his exegesis of these passages.
Come on Old Sage and get with the program. This is intermediate level difficulty stuff at best.
I actually think it's nearest to beginner level to be very honest.
Of course DTW is once again spot on with his exegesis of these passages.
Come on Old Sage and get with the program. This is intermediate level difficulty stuff at best.
I actually think it's nearest to beginner level to be very honest.
I have been telling them this type of thing for a long time now...
I have warned them concerning the Daniel's 70th week error many times...
But - what makes you think Jesus came back during the 1st century?
What verses of scripture apply?
(which you will no-doubt say were fully fulfilled at that time and are not referring to His "next" coming)
In your view, which verses refer to which coming?
Every place in scripture that refers to His 'coming' seems to indicate that there is only one [more] 'coming'.
How do you reconcile this with your view?
I have warned them concerning the Daniel's 70th week error many times...
But - what makes you think Jesus came back during the 1st century?
What verses of scripture apply?
(which you will no-doubt say were fully fulfilled at that time and are not referring to His "next" coming)
In your view, which verses refer to which coming?
Every place in scripture that refers to His 'coming' seems to indicate that there is only one [more] 'coming'.
How do you reconcile this with your view?
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I missed this one, sorry. Immortal cannot ever die, and is the Glorified Body, and Christ is the Life giving force in that body.
In the mortal body the life giving force is the blood.
This should help:
1 Corinthians 15:50-54 (HCSB)
50 Brothers, I tell you this: Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, and corruption cannot inherit incorruption.
51 Listen! I am telling you a mystery: We will not all fall asleep, but we will all be changed,
52 in a moment, in the blink of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we will be changed.
53 For this corruptible must be clothed with incorruptibility, and this mortal must be clothed with immortality.
54 When this corruptible is clothed with incorruptibility, and this mortal is clothed with immortality, then the saying that is written will take place: Death has been swallowed up in victory.
1 John 5:11 (NIV)
11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
Colossians 3:4 (ESV)
4 When Christ who is your life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory. {<--That is HEAVEN!}
NOW, scripture says that LIFE is in the BLOOD, here on earth, but in HEAVEN LIFE IS IN THE SON.
Leviticus 17:14 (GWT)
14 This is because the life of any creature is in its blood.
So I have said to the people of Israel:
Never eat any blood, because the life of any creature is in its blood.
Whoever eats blood must be excluded {from the people}.
You've got an entire Bible that says: nope! You've got that all wrong.
That brand of eschatology is amateur hour my friend. Nobody who actually knows what they're talking about believes anything like that for one single solitary second.
Maybe it's time you sat at the feet of someone who actually knows what they're talking about such as Walvoord or TDW......
So let me ask you what is to become of the covenant to Abraham and the Israelites?
That brand of eschatology is amateur hour my friend. Nobody who actually knows what they're talking about believes anything like that for one single solitary second.
Maybe it's time you sat at the feet of someone who actually knows what they're talking about such as Walvoord or TDW......
So let me ask you what is to become of the covenant to Abraham and the Israelites?