The Saving results of the Death of Christ !

[ForestGreenCook]

John 3 says he died for the world that whoever’s believes will have eternal life

it dies not say he died for whoever he chose so they will have eternal life. You can not remove believe

he who does not believe is condemned already,

he who believes is not condemned

the only things that seperates the condemned from the non condemned is belief vs non belief

2: 13 is correct, if after I come to faith, my faith fails, he will still keep his promise.

we are talking about how one is saved and why and who has the possibility to be saved not what happens after

So, belief is a product of being saved, and not the cause of being saved. Who do you say, has the possibility to be saved? Does the natural man described in 1 Cor 2:14 have the possibility to be saved?

 

[ForestGreenCook]

John 3 says he died for the world that whoever’s believes will have eternal life

it dies not say he died for whoever he chose so they will have eternal life. You can not remove believe

he who does not believe is condemned already,

he who believes is not condemned

the only things that seperates the condemned from the non condemned is belief vs non belief

2: 13 is correct, if after I come to faith, my faith fails, he will still keep his promise.

we are talking about how one is saved and why and who has the possibility to be saved not what happens after

John 10;26-28, says only his sheep hear his voice.

 

[brightfame52]

The problem isn't that the religion of man doesn't understand eternal salvation it is the religion of man itself.
Faith in Christ is not religion because religion is merely a word used to describe a set beliefs and religious practice but the bond and relationship we have with him far exceeds a bitter word like that.

God is all knowing and knew what would happen before it even began so on one hand it makes sense why some believe in predestination or pre elction however we can cherry pick all the scriptures we want but without looking deeper we might as well not post scripture at all.
There is a certain pattern God has always had all throughout the bible, he always gives a chance of repentence he always warns what will happen if we don't he always tells us or warns us before he does anything but he knows what will happen before it does right? So why then does he give chances? Why does he warn why does he allow call for repentance?

This is pointless if only those who are his from before hand could be saved

Did you read and understand the Op?

 

[brightfame52]

And CHRIST died for the WHOLE world and since GOD made the world for man and men Are In the world then this would Include man,right? So then CHRIST died for all men so that Whosoever believes In him should not perish but have Everlasting life.

Christ died for the Whole world of the Saved. His Sheep. His death effected their Salvation.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

it did for those who believe

for those who are still in unbelief, they still have the ability to repent. Because his death offers life to them also,

we were in unbelief once,

He quickened us while we were still in unbelief (spiritually dead in sins).

Only those that have had their hearts exchanged in the new birth will repent of breaking a spiritual law. The natural, unregenerate, man, who still has a heart of stone, will not repent of breaking a spiritual law that he cannot discern, and thinks it to be foolishness.

 

[brightfame52]

you can’t glorify Christ based on a false precept. If anything, it takes away from christ

his death is glorified, in the fact that all who willingly believe, his goal, is saved,

him having to send people to hell does also not take away from him, because he offered them salvation, they rejected it.

either way, Christ is glorified

It takes away from Christ to say He died for people who are lost. That automatically mean you don't believe in the Saving Death of Christ. That doesn't Glorify Christ or God period.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

And?

those who do not believe are condemned

those who do are not condemned

what does that have to do with chastening?

you seem to be unsure of what we are discussing take a step back and take a breath

So, tell me what those that believe not are condemned to?

 

[brightfame52]

He quickened us while we were still in unbelief (spiritually dead in sins).

Only those that have had their hearts exchanged in the new birth will repent of breaking a spiritual law. The natural, unregenerate, man, who still has a heart of stone, will not repent of breaking a spiritual law that he cannot discern, and thinks it to be foolishness.

Correct, man's heart naturally is without repentance Rom 2:5

But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So, tell me what those that believe not are condemned to?

There is only one condemnation spoken of in scripture, Satan and his angels are doomed for the same condemnation

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Correct, man's heart naturally is without repentance Rom 2:5

But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;

That’s why God works to change ones heart

but man still has to decide

 

[ForestGreenCook]

I disagree, jesus fulfilled the law. As John said, behold the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world

Jesus made it clear

he said he who believes is not condemned

he who does not believe is condemned already

he did not say he who breaks the law is condemned already, we all have broken the law. So In effect we are all cursed,

jesus became that curse, so that whoever believes will not perish but has eternal life

Believing or not believing has nothing to do with whether you go to heaven or hell. You are basing your theory of who is going to heaven or to hell by John 3:18, but the word "condemned" has no reference to be condemned to hell, not according to the Greek interpretation of the word "condemned". It does, however, interpret it to mean; avenge, conclude, punish, decree, call in question, etc.

 

[brightfame52]

That’s why God works to change ones heart

but man still has to decide

This is partly true and partly false, so it's false.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

There is only one condemnation spoken of in scripture, Satan and his angels are doomed for the same condemnation

I use the Strong's concordance, and sometimes Thayer's. Have you taken time to see how that Strong's interprets the word "condemned" in John 3:18?

 

[ForestGreenCook]

That’s why God works to change ones heart

but man still has to decide

God allows mankind to make choices as to how mankind wants to live his life as he sojourns here on earth, but the choice of mankind's eternal inheritance is only made by God's sovereign grace, without mankind's deciding.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

It will and it does. It gets much easier once you accept the truth.

Then use the scriptures to harmonize, instead of just quoting your opinions.

 

[ForestGreenCook]

The Bible says that Jesus lost Judas. You are a very deceitful man.

John 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

God raised Pharaoh for a purpose and also Judas. who was not among those that Christ died for.

 

[oyster67]

So you think that all of the old testament saints, are never born again?

Jesus' blood covers them also. Remember that God transcends time. Don't underestimate the power of the Blood. Do you really not understand these things?

 

[brightfame52]

God allows mankind to make choices as to how mankind wants to live his life as he sojourns here on earth, but the choice of mankind's eternal inheritance is only made by God's sovereign grace, without mankind's deciding.

The inheritance is for the Sheep not mankind Matt 25:34

Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world

Those on His left hand don't inherit, but their portion is everlasting fire Matt 25:41

 

[oyster67]

You are not justified through your faith, but through the faith "of" Jesus, not "in" Jesus, Gal 2:16.

Wrong.

Galatians 3:11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, [it is] evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

 

[seed_time_harvest]

Christ died for the Whole world of the Saved. His Sheep. His death effected their Salvation.

Sounds like you are saying that CHRIST did not die for all men.That wouldn't be fair,no one WANTS to be eternally damned.

GOD loves righteousness and dieing for some and not All wouldn't be fair and right.Also If CHRIST didn't die for all ,then all men wouldn't have a choice.That's not how GOD IS.

Hebrews 1:7-10
King James Version

7 And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

8 But unto the Son [he saith], Thy throne, O God, [is] for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness [is] the sceptre of thy kingdom.

9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, [even] thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

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John 3:14-16
King James Version

14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:

15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

16 For God SO loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.