Back-loading Works into the Gospel:
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Hello John, the phrase "in the faith" is used several times in the NT, by Luke (in Acts), as well by Paul and Peter. As far as what it means, like so many other words, phrases, verses, etc., it's important to look carefully at what the verse or passage that it's found in is saying, as well, at the overall context (I am, BTW, aware that you are already aware of this fact). This is necessary concerning the phrase, "in the faith", because it means different things in different passages in the Bible.
In the case of 2 Corinthians 13:5, I believe that taking a careful look at what the verse itself says (particularly the second half) is enough to conclude what the meaning is, though the surrounding context is helpful as well. I also believe that the KJV translation makes the meaning clearer, so here is v5 again in that translation.
The context (which includes the first 10 verses of Chapter 13) is one of Paul defending his Apostleship to some troublemakers in the church at Corinth (to those who were questioning whether it .. and he .. were the real McCoy/the genuine article .. or not). Paul, as their undoubted father in the faith, tells them to examine and test themselves to see if they are "in the faith" (which in this case seems to clearly mean "in Christ"), and that if they discover that they are genuinely saved, then ~they themselves~ are the Apostle's testimony and evidence that both he and his apostleship are, indeed, the genuine article (because the WONDERFUL/WONDROUS transformation that took place in the lives of so many of the Corinthians could scarcely have come through a false teacher. ~MacDonald, W. Believer’s Bible Commentary).
You make an interesting point however, and I intend to look into it further. All of my commentaries, except two of them (MacDonald and MacArthur) see "in the faith" in v5 as being equivalent in meaning to "in Christ" (MacArthur and MacDonald seem to see v5's "in the faith" both ways, MacArthur going so far as to divide the verse into a first and a second half).
And just FYI, MacDonald agrees with you (and so do I) that the Scriptures are our principle source of assurance, at least in the sense of 'first and foremost', but he (like every other theologian) goes on to say that our assurance is also tied in with the things that accompany our salvation .. Hebrews 6:9, with the "fruit" that results from God's mighty work in us to change us, regenerate and save us, and make us His workmanship, as wholly new creatures in Christ. MacDonald also says that such evidence/"fruit" in the lives of true believers is something that becomes more and more apparent in a maturing believer (which is why he points to the Scriptures as that which is first and foremost among the things that give us assurance that we are truly saved).
God bless you!
~Deut
In the case of 2 Corinthians 13:5, I believe that taking a careful look at what the verse itself says (particularly the second half) is enough to conclude what the meaning is, though the surrounding context is helpful as well. I also believe that the KJV translation makes the meaning clearer, so here is v5 again in that translation.
2 Corinthians 13
5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, ~except ye be reprobates?~
The context (which includes the first 10 verses of Chapter 13) is one of Paul defending his Apostleship to some troublemakers in the church at Corinth (to those who were questioning whether it .. and he .. were the real McCoy/the genuine article .. or not). Paul, as their undoubted father in the faith, tells them to examine and test themselves to see if they are "in the faith" (which in this case seems to clearly mean "in Christ"), and that if they discover that they are genuinely saved, then ~they themselves~ are the Apostle's testimony and evidence that both he and his apostleship are, indeed, the genuine article (because the WONDERFUL/WONDROUS transformation that took place in the lives of so many of the Corinthians could scarcely have come through a false teacher. ~MacDonald, W. Believer’s Bible Commentary).
You make an interesting point however, and I intend to look into it further. All of my commentaries, except two of them (MacDonald and MacArthur) see "in the faith" in v5 as being equivalent in meaning to "in Christ" (MacArthur and MacDonald seem to see v5's "in the faith" both ways, MacArthur going so far as to divide the verse into a first and a second half).
And just FYI, MacDonald agrees with you (and so do I) that the Scriptures are our principle source of assurance, at least in the sense of 'first and foremost', but he (like every other theologian) goes on to say that our assurance is also tied in with the things that accompany our salvation .. Hebrews 6:9, with the "fruit" that results from God's mighty work in us to change us, regenerate and save us, and make us His workmanship, as wholly new creatures in Christ. MacDonald also says that such evidence/"fruit" in the lives of true believers is something that becomes more and more apparent in a maturing believer (which is why he points to the Scriptures as that which is first and foremost among the things that give us assurance that we are truly saved).
God bless you!
~Deut
Well you GOT to know the difference In willful sinning, and Ignorant sinning, And when
Satan is playing with Your MIND. And when Satan puts something in OUR minds, if we resist Satan, And the things that Satan puts in our minds, And not dwell on it, we have not sinned, it is when we Dwell on it is when we sin, I am in the Flesh And HAFT TO fight off Satan just like YESUAH DID, He was temped just like us,
HEBREWS 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin.
Then HE will Flee FROM US IF we resist, and we have not SINNED. but if we do not fight, to keep it off our mind and Dwell on it, yes then we have sinned and need to get forgiveness from YESUAH .
HEBREWS 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
1 COR 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].
[ He tells us here that he will not let us be tempted above that we can bear but will make A way to escape, ]
[ AND HE does mean without SINNING ]
Satan is playing with Your MIND. And when Satan puts something in OUR minds, if we resist Satan, And the things that Satan puts in our minds, And not dwell on it, we have not sinned, it is when we Dwell on it is when we sin, I am in the Flesh And HAFT TO fight off Satan just like YESUAH DID, He was temped just like us,
HEBREWS 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as [we are, yet] without sin.
Then HE will Flee FROM US IF we resist, and we have not SINNED. but if we do not fight, to keep it off our mind and Dwell on it, yes then we have sinned and need to get forgiveness from YESUAH .
HEBREWS 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.
1 COR 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].
[ He tells us here that he will not let us be tempted above that we can bear but will make A way to escape, ]
[ AND HE does mean without SINNING ]
AMEN AND AMEN, I am to tell people what the BIBLE SAY, and GOD'S WORD WILL judge US all, But if I tell someone what the BIBLE says , IT IS NOT me THAT judges them, BUT GOD'S WORD, And when they Reject it. it is NOT me that JUDGE BUT GOD, And they are rejecting GOD, when they reject it,
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only if you interpret it right
the law leads to faith, hence it is established when we understand the law properly, and as a schoolmaster it leads us to Christ.
Christ fulfilled the law
through faith we establish the law is just and good and perfect and we are sinners.
we can. It fulfill the law. The very law people claim to follow condemns them where they stand
the law leads to faith, hence it is established when we understand the law properly, and as a schoolmaster it leads us to Christ.
Christ fulfilled the law
through faith we establish the law is just and good and perfect and we are sinners.
we can. It fulfill the law. The very law people claim to follow condemns them where they stand
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OT...
Genesis 2:15
The Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to work it and keep it.
Psalm 37:3
Trust in the Lord, and do good; dwell in the land and befriend faithfulness.
Psalm 37:27
Turn away from evil and do good; so shall you dwell forever.
Proverbs 3:27-28
Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due, when it is in your power to do it. Do not say to your neighbor, “Go, and come again, tomorrow I will give it”—when you have it with you.
Proverbs 14:23
In all toil there is profit, but mere talk tends only to poverty.
Ecclesiastes 3:12
I perceived that there is nothing better for them than to be joyful and to do good as long as they live;
Isaiah 1:17
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause.
Jeremiah 17:10
“I the Lord search the heart and test the mind, to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his deeds.”
Gospels...
Matthew 5:16
In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
Luke 10:27
And he answered, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself.”
John 3:19-21
And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.
John 5:28-29
Do not marvel at this, for an hour is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment.
John 14:15
“If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
Acts 10:38
How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him.
NT...
Romans 2:6-10
He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
1 Corinthians 15:58
Therefore, my beloved brothers, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain.
1 Corinthians 16:14
Let all that you do be done in love.
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.
2 Corinthians 9:8
And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that having all sufficiency in all things at all times, you may abound in every good work.
Galatians 5:16
But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.
Galatians 6:9
And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up.
Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Philippians 4:13
I can do all things through him who strengthens me.
Colossians 3:23-24
Whatever you do, work heartily, as for the Lord and not for men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the inheritance as your reward. You are serving the Lord Christ.
2 Thessalonians 3:13
As for you, brothers, do not grow weary in doing good.
1 Timothy 6:18-19
They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
2 Timothy 2:21
Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from what is dishonorable, he will be a vessel for honorable use, set apart as holy, useful to the master of the house, ready for every good work.
2 Timothy 3:17
That the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.
Titus 1:16
They profess to know God, but they deny him by their works. They are detestable, disobedient, unfit for any good work.
Titus 2:7
Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity,
Titus 2:14
Who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.
Titus 3:1
Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work,
Titus 3:5
He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Titus 3:8
The saying is trustworthy, and I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works. These things are excellent and profitable for people.
Titus 3:14
And let our people learn to devote themselves to good works, so as to help cases of urgent need, and not be unfruitful.
Hebrews 6:10
For God is not unjust so as to overlook your work and the love that you have shown for his name in serving the saints, as you still do.
Hebrews 10:24
And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works,
Hebrews 13:16
Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.
James 2:14-17
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
James 2:26
For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead.
James 3:13
Who is wise and understanding among you? By his good conduct let him show his works in the meekness of wisdom.
James 4:17
So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.
1 Peter 3:13-17
Now who is there to harm you if you are zealous for what is good? But even if you should suffer for righteousness' sake, you will be blessed. Have no fear of them, nor be troubled, but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect, having a good conscience, so that, when you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ may be put to shame. For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God's will, than for doing evil.
Revelation 20:12
And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done.
Genesis 2:15
The Lord God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to work it and keep it.
Psalm 37:3
Trust in the Lord, and do good; dwell in the land and befriend faithfulness.
Psalm 37:27
Turn away from evil and do good; so shall you dwell forever.
Proverbs 3:27-28
Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due, when it is in your power to do it. Do not say to your neighbor, “Go, and come again, tomorrow I will give it”—when you have it with you.
Proverbs 14:23
In all toil there is profit, but mere talk tends only to poverty.
Ecclesiastes 3:12
I perceived that there is nothing better for them than to be joyful and to do good as long as they live;
Isaiah 1:17
Learn to do good; seek justice, correct oppression; bring justice to the fatherless, plead the widow's cause.
Jeremiah 17:10
“I the Lord search the heart and test the mind, to give every man according to his ways, according to the fruit of his deeds.”
Gospels...
Matthew 5:16
In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
Luke 10:27
And he answered, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind, and your neighbor as yourself.”
John 3:19-21
And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed.
John 5:28-29
Do not marvel at this, for an hour is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment.
John 14:15
“If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
Acts 10:38
How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power. He went about doing good and healing all who were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him.
NT...
Romans 2:6-10
He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.
1 Corinthians 15:58
Therefore, my beloved brothers, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that in the Lord your labor is not in vain.
1 Corinthians 16:14
Let all that you do be done in love.
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.
2 Corinthians 9:8
And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that having all sufficiency in all things at all times, you may abound in every good work.
Galatians 5:16
But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.
Galatians 6:9
And let us not grow weary of doing good, for in due season we will reap, if we do not give up.
Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.
Philippians 4:13
I can do all things through him who strengthens me.
Colossians 3:23-24
Whatever you do, work heartily, as for the Lord and not for men, knowing that from the Lord you will receive the inheritance as your reward. You are serving the Lord Christ.
2 Thessalonians 3:13
As for you, brothers, do not grow weary in doing good.
1 Timothy 6:18-19
They are to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, thus storing up treasure for themselves as a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is truly life.
2 Timothy 2:21
Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from what is dishonorable, he will be a vessel for honorable use, set apart as holy, useful to the master of the house, ready for every good work.
2 Timothy 3:17
That the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work.
Titus 1:16
They profess to know God, but they deny him by their works. They are detestable, disobedient, unfit for any good work.
Titus 2:7
Show yourself in all respects to be a model of good works, and in your teaching show integrity, dignity,
Titus 2:14
Who gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.
Titus 3:1
Remind them to be submissive to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good work,
Titus 3:5
He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
Titus 3:8
The saying is trustworthy, and I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works. These things are excellent and profitable for people.
Titus 3:14
And let our people learn to devote themselves to good works, so as to help cases of urgent need, and not be unfruitful.
Hebrews 6:10
For God is not unjust so as to overlook your work and the love that you have shown for his name in serving the saints, as you still do.
Hebrews 10:24
And let us consider how to stir up one another to love and good works,
Hebrews 13:16
Do not neglect to do good and to share what you have, for such sacrifices are pleasing to God.
James 2:14-17
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
James 2:26
For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead.
James 3:13
Who is wise and understanding among you? By his good conduct let him show his works in the meekness of wisdom.
James 4:17
So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.
1 Peter 3:13-17
Now who is there to harm you if you are zealous for what is good? But even if you should suffer for righteousness' sake, you will be blessed. Have no fear of them, nor be troubled, but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect, having a good conscience, so that, when you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ may be put to shame. For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God's will, than for doing evil.
Revelation 20:12
And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done.
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The class is not put away,
it is in session until someone comes to Christ
at that point they graduated that class, and need to go to other classes because that class fulfilled its purpose
to continue in that class would be like going back to the same school,, why would you go back to elementary school when you already graduated? You will never grow
it is in session until someone comes to Christ
at that point they graduated that class, and need to go to other classes because that class fulfilled its purpose
to continue in that class would be like going back to the same school,, why would you go back to elementary school when you already graduated? You will never grow
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How is the class in session for the person if that person isn't aware the class exists if they're never told about it? Only when they know about the class can they know about their need to go to Christ.
"With the law comes the knowledge of sin." (Rom 3:20), but without knowledge of the law there is no knowledge of sin (Rom 4:15)
"With the law comes the knowledge of sin." (Rom 3:20), but without knowledge of the law there is no knowledge of sin (Rom 4:15)
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