What place does works have in the life of a Christian?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#1
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#1
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
 
F

ForestGreenCook

Well-known member
#2
Jul 8, 2018
8,441
1,213
113
#2
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
Click to expand...
If you look up the meaning in Greek, for salvation, it means "a deliverance". there is an eternal deliverance, and there are many deliverances that the regenerate receive as they sojourn here in this world. Praying, and repenting is something that the regenerated spiritual man does, and when God forgives them, they have just been delivered (saved) from the consequences of that sin.

This salvation (deliverance) is given because of man's good works. Eternal deliverance (salvation) is given by God's sovereign grace, without the works of man.

Matt 25:32, puts it this way; And before him shall be gathered all nations, and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats.
 
D

DiscipleA

Active member
#3
Apr 17, 2020
160
39
28
Northeast Pennsylvania USA
#3
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
Click to expand...
Works are required, but it's not the works that saves us. It's God's grace that saves us.

To gain God's grace we must show we believe by our works. Because saying we believe is not as powerful as acting like we believe.
 
Rosemaryx

Rosemaryx

Senior Member
#4
May 3, 2017
3,754
4,119
113
63
#4
James 1:22
But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
 
B

Bbrdrd

Banned
#5
Apr 2, 2020
1,144
425
83
#5
The issue with works is one of completeness. Faith is all that matters, but from true faith works will flow. In fact, some kind of work is inevitable from us. No amount of works can put God in our debt or make it so God owes us anything, but at the same time God is pleased with the types of work that flow from a righteous character. The only thing we need to worry about is allowing the gospel to transform us and the works that please God will flow out naturally.
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#6
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#6
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
Click to expand...
///God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him./// No God gives the gift of salvation to all those that believe. 1 cor 1.21 . It was Jesus obedience that counted ,because we could not do it .
 
T

throughfaith

Well-known member
#7
Aug 4, 2020
10,467
1,593
113
#7
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
Click to expand...
So you've got a mixture of unconnected / out of sequence verses there . ?
 
Blik

Blik

Senior Member
#8
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
#8
Bbrdrd said:
The issue with works is one of completeness. Faith is all that matters, but from true faith works will flow. In fact, some kind of work is inevitable from us. No amount of works can put God in our debt or make it so God owes us anything, but at the same time God is pleased with the types of work that flow from a righteous character. The only thing we need to worry about is allowing the gospel to transform us and the works that please God will flow out naturally.
Click to expand...
So if we work without faith, it is working in vain. But if we cooperate with Jesus in our work, if we work through Him, we insure that God chooses us to be given salvation.

We are human, I don't think work ever comes naturally without our cooperation with Christ.
 
B

Bbrdrd

Banned
#9
Apr 2, 2020
1,144
425
83
#9
Blik said:
So if we work without faith, it is working in vain. But if we cooperate with Jesus in our work, if we work through Him, we insure that God chooses us to be given salvation.

We are human, I don't think work ever comes naturally without our cooperation with Christ.
Click to expand...
Not at all. Nothing we do has additive value to our salvation, but flows out from it. The "works" we do come through our changing desires as the gospel transforms us. It's not an effortless process as we do need to be self-disciplined, but it doesn't ensure that God chooses us to do so as our only role is to receive what God offers. If we allow the gospel to transform us we will find ourselves desiring the things that please God and so what effort there is involved will be a secondary concern.
 
Corban

Corban

Banned
#10
Jun 11, 2020
1,370
424
83
73
#10
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.

Salvation is not something we gain by our works, it is a free gift. Eph. 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God.

Some say we have to choose between works and faith for salvation. If God gives us salvation as a gift, it is not something we have worked for. However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.

Revelations 22:12 “Look, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to each person according to what they have done.

John 5: 28 “Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29 and come out—those who have done what is good will rise to live, and those who have done what is evil will rise to be condemned
Click to expand...
Well done. You have touched a point that tightens some people's stomach muscles. The answer is relatively simple. Before the fall of man, man was give something to DO. Genesis 1:26-28 shows how man is constructed and what he was constructed for - to subdue and then rule. After the fall man needed to be saved BUT he is saved for a PURPOSE. Ephesians 2:8-10 says;

8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."

The grand example that the Holy Spirit gives to the Churches is Israel (1st Cor.10:1-11). Israel are saved by a Lamb and its blood, but the GOAL of this salvation was that Israel, especially the firstborn, would conquer a Land. 430 years before, God outlined His plan to Abraham - the taking, subduing and ruling of a choice Land - Canaan. Israel BELIEVED Moses and were saved from the angel of death. Israel OBEYED Joshua and subdued the Land.

To be SAVED from God's retribution, be reconciled, justified and set apart MUST be achieved by God. Man has neither the standing nor the strength to achieve these things. But once set in the right standing BY God, man must COOPERATE with God to DO what God wants. God, in His wisdom, knowing who He is dealing with, sets a REWARD ... NOT for faith, but for WORKS. That reward is that (i) you may be a guest at Christ's Wedding Feast, and (ii) you may be a co-king with Christ to rule the Nations after Christ returns and sets up His Kingdom on Earth (Matt.19:28, 24:44-47, 25:1-30; Lk.12:44, 19:17-19). Conversely, any Christian who was saved by Christ's works, BUT does not do the works ordained by God for him, will be banned from this Kingdom for 1,000 years (Matt.24:48-51, 25:10-13, 25-30; Lk.19:20-26; 1st Cor.6:9-10; Gal.5:21; Eph.5:5 etc.). A disobedient Christian does not lose what Christ achieved for him, but he loses his position in the Kingdom. Israel were saved by the Lamb, but all 600,000 fighting men but two did not make it into the Kingdom of Israel. Moses was one of those who did not make it. Sobering!
 
Benadam

Benadam

Banned
#11
Aug 14, 2019
1,374
307
83
#11
The disciple does the works of Christ who is living in him/her. Those are the only works that will escape the fire when the Day reveals their quality.
 
Nehemiah6

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
#12
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
#12
Blik said:
We are not saved by works, but I think the Lord values our works.
Click to expand...
Correct. Good works are a necessity for the process of sanctification. As James makes it quite clear, faith without works is "dead" -- not genuine faith. He calls that "true religion".
 
E

EleventhHour

Guest
#13
#13
Blik said:
However, God chooses who He gives this gift to. God chooses to give this gift to those who love and obey Him.
Click to expand...
At what point does the person earn the reward of salvation?

My bible states that salvation is a gift and it is given by grace through faith and I see no mention of God choosing a person based on merit?

My bible also states...

Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
Romans 4:4
 
tourist

tourist

Senior Member
#14
Mar 13, 2014
42,550
17,022
113
69
Tennessee
#14
In the book of James it states that faith without works is a dead faith. Works are of paramount importance in humbly serving the Lord. Works in themselves do not save but rather are an outward manifestation of a saving faith in Jesus Christ.
 
G

garee

Banned
#16
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
#16
Blik said:
So if we work without faith, it is working in vain. But if we cooperate with Jesus in our work, if we work through Him, we insure that God chooses us to be given salvation.

We are human, I don't think work ever comes naturally without our cooperation with Christ.
Click to expand...
We are saved by works .Works cannot be separate of faith "the unseen will". It is Christ who works in us to both will (faith ) and do (work) that good pleasure of His will. He promises us he will not forget the good works he works in us with us. When we offer them towards the power of His name

Faith is a work .No work no faith.

Faith the will without the power to perform is dead.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#18
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
#18
EleventhHour said:
At what point does the person earn the reward of salvation?

My bible states that salvation is a gift and it is given by grace through faith and I see no mention of God choosing a person based on merit?

My bible also states...

Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
Romans 4:4
Click to expand...
However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.
 
dcontroversal

dcontroversal

Banned
#19
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
#19
The following is clear! Any and all works that may be produced, are produced by Christ through us and why HE GETS ALL THE GLORY!

However, to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.
 
jackrosie

jackrosie

Banned
#20
May 19, 2020
3,050
1,275
113
#20
There is great joy that comes out of the heart of a believer when they work for the Lord...

It fills the Lord with delight that delight is felt in the heart of a believer,as that is where the Lord dwell.

Amen.all works are produced by us through Christ,we play no part...a good reminder,thanks,God gets all the glory.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.