♦ Jesus was only glorified when God raised him from the dead. So we know that Jesus was not yet glorified when he was here praying in John 17:5. Because of John 7:39What is Oneness theology from the perspective of someone who believes it?
To me it is just simply John 17.
The only think I disagree with is your logic about why this point is unbiblical.When one examines the serious errors of this breakaway group of Pentecostals, it seems that they are actually a cult, like the Jehovah’s Witnesses. Some have actually described them as a “hidden cult”. And there are probably over 2.5 million people who have been deceived into following this cult.
There are several groups who hold to the doctrines of Oneness Pentecostals: United Pentecostal Church International, Apostolic World Christian Federation, Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, Church of the Lord Jesus Christ of the Apostolic Faith, Pentecostal Assemblies of the World.
SERIOUS DOCTRINAL ERRORS
According to Pentecostals – Statistics and Denominations:
‘There are 80 Pentecostal denominations that are classified as Jesus' Name or Oneness Pentecostalism (often self identifying as "Apostolic Pentecostals"). These differ from the rest of Pentecostalism in several significant ways.
[1] Oneness Pentecostals reject the doctrine of the Trinity. They do not describe God as three persons but rather as three manifestations of the one living God. [Note: This is the heresy of Modalism or Sabellianism]
[2] Oneness Pentecostals practice Jesus' Name Baptism—water baptisms performed in the name of Jesus Christ, rather than that of the Trinity. [Note: This is a rejection of the very words of Christ regarding baptism in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost]
[3] Oneness Pentecostal adherents believe repentance, baptism in Jesus' name, and Spirit baptism are all essential elements of the conversion experience. [Note: This is a rejection of the Bible doctrine of justification (salvation) by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption apart from any works of righteousness]
[4] Oneness Pentecostals hold that repentance is necessary before baptism to make the ordinance valid, and receipt of the Holy Spirit manifested by speaking in other tongues is necessary afterwards, to complete the work of baptism. [Note: This is a rejection of the Bible truth that not all Christians will speak in tongues, and also the meaning of the genuine gift of tongues]
This differs from other Pentecostals, along with evangelical Christians in general, who see only repentance and faith in Christ as essential to salvation. This has resulted in Oneness believers being accused by some (including other Pentecostals) of a "works-salvation" soteriology, a charge they vehemently deny. [Note: All cults deny that they are a cult].
Oneness Pentecostals insist that salvation comes by grace through faith in Christ, coupled with obedience to his command to be "born of water and of the Spirit"; hence, no good works or obedience to laws or rules can save anyone. For them, baptism is not seen as a "work" but rather the indispensable means that Jesus himself provided to come into his kingdom. The major Oneness churches include the United Pentecostal Church International and the Pentecostal Assemblies of the World.
https://www.liquisearch.com/pentecostalism/statistics_and_denominations
HISTORY
‘The founding date of the Oneness Pentecostal movement can be traced to a specific event: a revival meeting in Los Angeles on April 15, 1913. The culmination of the meeting occurred when Canadian revivalist R.E. McAlister baptized converts not according to the Trinitarian formula of the historic Christian Church, but in the name of Jesus only...
The next significant date in the development of the movement occurred exactly two years later, on April 15, 1915, when [Frank] Ewart gave his first sermon on Acts 2:38. David Reed believes that, despite the claims of Oneness Pentecostals that Ewart preached the message given to him by McCalister, Ewart did not actually develop his modalistic theology until after this sermon. Nonetheless, the approximate date for the development of Ewart’s teaching regarding the necessity of baptism in the name of Jesus only can be traced to this period.
Also on this date, Ewart rebaptized supporter Glenn A. Cook according to the Jesus only formula; Cook then rebaptized Ewart. This was the beginning of the rebaptism of thousands of Pentecostals. The Oneness movement quickly spread through Pentecostal churches, particularly the Assemblies of God. The AG debated the issue of baptism in Jesus’ name at their 1915 general assembly, and in 1916 defeated the movement in their denomination by requiring adherence to Trinitarian theology in the Statement of Fundamental Truths.
156 ministers subsequently left the AG to form an independent Oneness denomination. In January, 1918, the General Assembly of the Apostolic Assemblies merged with the Pentecostal Assemblies of the World, a denomination affiliated with the original Pentecostal revival on Azusa Street in Los Angeles...’
https://www.watchman.org/profiles/pdf/onenesspentecostalismprofile.pdf
This tells us that Pentecostals in general REJECT the teachings of Oneness Pentecostals. And so should all Bible-believing Christians.
STRICT CODE OF CONDUCT
On the plus side, Oneness Pentecostals believe in a strict code of conduct, but when it is tied to maintaining salvation, then it is unbiblical. Sanctification is not about *maintaining* salvation but working out your salvation with fear and trembling. Big difference.
‘Oneness movements’ emphases on personal holiness and healthy lifestyles are commendable. Nevertheless, the requirements for outward adherence to a strict moral code in order to maintain salvation inevitably leads to legalism and a lack of assurance of eternal life.’
http://www.marketfaith.org/the-hidden-cult-of-oneness-pentecostalism/
So that's oneness theology?♦ Jesus was only glorified when God raised him from the dead. So we know that Jesus was not yet glorified when he was here praying in John 17:5. Because of John 7:39
John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
♦ Similarly, Paul speaks about something given to us before the creation of the world. However that reality only was manifested in our time and space at the appearing of Jesus our Savior.
2 Tim 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
♦ Similarly, Jesus was the human Lamb slain from the foundation of the world (Rev 13:8) and this human Lamb was foreknown before the foundation of the world (1 Peter 1:20). Although he himself was not yet glorified, that glory was given by the Father to his human son before the foundation of the world. God the Father glorified Jesus when He raised him from the dead. Jesus is saying that his glorification was a done deal before creation because God the Father, in His love for his human son Jesus, had purposed it to occur.
Regarding your question as to why it is because it is a very important subject to understand biblically.Too often the C word is thrown around amid the church that it alone may segregate the one body from the savior of all.
Two points from my end of it.
When a teaching in the church has a date of entry over a thousand years after Christ, it isn't of Christ. This is the case of the trinity. God never said he is three. God said he is one. God said there is no savior beside him. Jesus said he and the father are one, not three. The idea that there are three separate persons in the scripture is known as poly-theism, or, tritheism. And is not of God nor of Christ but is of Tertullian. AD 160 to 225AD. Tri-theism, Polytheism, is pagan. Christians are not pagan.
Secondly, Peter, who walked with Jesus, said, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Matthew 28:19.
That's all I have to add to this incendiary discussion. So many threads on the same topic. Why?
Are you trying to say something?♦ Jesus was only glorified when God raised him from the dead. So we know that Jesus was not yet glorified when he was here praying in John 17:5. Because of John 7:39
John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
♦ Similarly, Paul speaks about something given to us before the creation of the world. However that reality only was manifested in our time and space at the appearing of Jesus our Savior.
2 Tim 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
♦ Similarly, Jesus was the human Lamb slain from the foundation of the world (Rev 13:8) and this human Lamb was foreknown before the foundation of the world (1 Peter 1:20). Although he himself was not yet glorified, that glory was given by the Father to his human son before the foundation of the world. God the Father glorified Jesus when He raised him from the dead. Jesus is saying that his glorification was a done deal before creation because God the Father, in His love for his human son Jesus, had purposed it to occur.
Oneness Pentecostaslism is Occult, as also are the Watchtower Society of Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Seventh Day Adventists, Islam, H.W. Armstrong Church of God, Christian Science, Church of Scientology, The Way International, Christadelphians, and others just like them. They are all harlots of the Vatican; the Roman Catholic Church. They all preach another Jesus, another gospel, and have another spirit, true to 2Corinthians 11When one examines the serious errors of this breakaway group of Pentecostals, it seems that they are actually a cult, like the Jehovah’s Witnesses. Some have actually described them as a “hidden cult”. And there are probably over 2.5 million people who have been deceived into following this cult.
There are several groups who hold to the doctrines of Oneness Pentecostals: United Pentecostal Church International, Apostolic World Christian Federation, Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, Church of the Lord Jesus Christ of the Apostolic Faith, Pentecostal Assemblies of the World.
[Note: All cults deny that they are a cult]
____________________Too often the C word is thrown around amid the church that it alone may segregate the one body from the savior of all.
Two points from my end of it.
When a teaching in the church has a date of entry over a thousand years after Christ, it isn't of Christ. This is the case of the trinity. God never said he is three. God said he is one. God said there is no savior beside him. Jesus said he and the father are one, not three. The idea that there are three separate persons in the scripture is known as poly-theism, or, tritheism. And is not of God nor of Christ but is of Tertullian. AD 160 to 225AD. Tri-theism, Polytheism, is pagan. Christians are not pagan.
Secondly, Peter, who walked with Jesus, said, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Matthew 28:19.
That's all I have to add to this incendiary discussion. So many threads on the same topic. Why?
I'm not sure if you are asking me, but not everyone is of the family of God.HMMMM do you like the
1 2 3 Doctrine?
Or do you like the
3 2 1 Doctrine?
Or are you good with the family of God doctrine like the bible actually puts it?
Yeah I know, they worship Him in vain, teaching as doctrines the precepts of men as if they are the words of God. Mat 15:9I'm not sure if you are asking me, but not everyone is of the family of God.
There are many false Christs; many false teachers, many false prophets, and so forth that preach another Jesus, another gospel, and have another spirit which is the spirit of error a.k.a. the spirit of iniquity a.k.a. the spirit of antichrist.
I suggest prayerful reading of Acts 20:28-31 Matthew 7:13-27, Matthew 24, 2Corinthians 6:14-18, 2Corinthians, Galatians 1:8-9, Philippians 3:17-19, 1John 2, 4 2John, 3John, 2Peter 2-3, Jude, Revelation 2-3 in the King James Bible. By prayerfully reading those passages, you can learn about the brute beasts a.k.a. antichrists a.k.a. false teachers a.k.a. false prophets a.k.a. enemies of the cross of Christ a.k.a. Satan's ministers and how to identify them, as so many masquerade in sheepskins to appear as being Christian ministers of righteousness, etc., and to know what The True and Living Lord Jesus Christ and His chosen Apostles have to say.
I'd suggest starting with Matthew 7:13-27 as The Lord Jesus Christ laid out severe consequences for those that opt not to heed what He has to say. There are so many that have opted not to do so, and that is why the world is so full of people going about to establish their own righteousness, including the following after false prophets and false teachers. Then there are those that are condoning to the deceitfulness because they hold to the doctrine of Balaam, and obviously are of the ones lying in wait to deceive.
Please clarify your position as to who you believe Jesus to be and/also who you believe Jesus not to be.♦ Jesus was only glorified when God raised him from the dead. So we know that Jesus was not yet glorified when he was here praying in John 17:5. Because of John 7:39
John 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)
♦ Similarly, Paul speaks about something given to us before the creation of the world. However that reality only was manifested in our time and space at the appearing of Jesus our Savior.
2 Tim 1:9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
♦ Similarly, Jesus was the human Lamb slain from the foundation of the world (Rev 13:8) and this human Lamb was foreknown before the foundation of the world (1 Peter 1:20). Although he himself was not yet glorified, that glory was given by the Father to his human son before the foundation of the world. God the Father glorified Jesus when He raised him from the dead. Jesus is saying that his glorification was a done deal before creation because God the Father, in His love for his human son Jesus, had purposed it to occur.
What do you mean by that?Please clarify your position as to who you believe Jesus to be and/also who you believe Jesus not to be.
I firmly believe that Jesus Christ is Lord God Almighty in the flesh.
Are you Oneness Pentecostal? If not, which religion and/or denomination do you affiliate with?What do you mean by that?
Are you saying Jesus is his own Father?
Or that God was no longer in heaven when Jesus was on the earth?
Or that God died?
Or that God is a man?
it just gets messy when you get away from the words the bible uses to describe who Jesus is.
A Son of His God and Father.
Child Born of God in kind.
Was within His Father from eternity past and came fourth from his father.
Is attributed the deeds of His Father.
The exact representation of His Father.
Existed in the form of his father (Spirit, Light and Fire)
Was less then His Father, not equal to or greater then.
Did not cling to that glorious form but in obedience to His Father took on the humble form of the Spirit of a man, in the body of a man.
Lived the life of a perfect man in dependence on God.
Lived the life we are to live in every aspect as our example and became our connection to God
Made peace with God and man through His self sacrifice and became our mediator.
Was raised from the dead and became our hope and the realization of Gods promises.
Remaking us into a new kind, race, priesthood, nation.
Remaking us into what He was, a man in union with the spirit of God, AKA a child of God.
With Jesus the first born and head over the rest of us, His fathers house.
Here is an interesting thought, was Jesus born again?
If it first birth was that of water does the bible every speak of Him being born a second time in regards to God spirit?