Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot

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It's too late to edit so I'll add this. Faith would actually be unnecessary for the pre selected unto Salvation, under the five points of salvation premise.

Micaiah-imla said:
I like that text font you put the scriptures in; made for pleasant reading.
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Thank you. I'll use that font from now on. I like that it is pleasant for someone to read when I use it. Thank you again.
 
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Micaiah-imla said:
I have never heard of these men before.

I have been reading the scriptures for many years and never came the conclusion that man has absolutely no choice in matters of faith.

But what I do see in scripture is that God works in whatever way He pleases. God is not limited in His work with man; the scriptures clearly speak of BOTH the free will of man and God's all-knowing ability to predestine whatever he chooses to predestine.
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You've received hand me down teachings of them unawares as this error has permeated churches. It will take God to open your eyes to this and your error of losing salvation.

Nothing in Scripture teaches man has free will, or that he can use it to decide for heaven. Besides that, man isn't saved via will in the first place as mans will has absolutely nothing to do with it, John 1:13.

Furthermore Jesus taught we are not free until in him, in will, or by any means free; John 8:34-36. We are only free when he sets us free.
 
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preacher4truth said:
You've received hand me down teachings of them unawares as this error has permeated churches. It will take God to open your eyes to this and your error of losing salvation.

Nothing in Scripture teaches man has free will, or that he can use it to decide for heaven. Besides that, man isn't saved via will in the first place as mans will has absolutely nothing to do with it, John 1:13.

Furthermore Jesus taught we are not free until in him, in will, or by any means free; John 8:34-36. We are only free when he sets us free.
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But, since his eyes aren't open, how do you know God will do that?
 
preacher4truth said:
You've received hand me down teachings of them unawares
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Really?

Are those men's words in scripture? (The ones that you mentioned; Armini-whatever and the other one who I don't care to remember at the moment).

Of course not!

So please spare me the false accusation!

Because holy scripture is all I spend my time reading.

And having spent my time exclusively in scripture I have not come to the place where you are on this issue.

Does God also pre-select people to not find true doctrine in scripture?
 
eternally-gratefull said:
Romans 9 is about God chiding isreal Not choosing to save one baby and condemning another to hell before they are born

Sometimes when you study you have to set preconceived notions behind.

Hardening ones heart means strengthening their desire to do what they really want to do to begin with
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Yes, the Jacob/Esau love/hate dynamic is best understood by acknowledging that Jacob and Esau are identified in Scripture as nations = Jacob (Israel) being those who will believe and be saved, and Esau being the enemies of God who will suffer the second death.

Also, as to the hardening of the heart, this is also shown clearly in Scripture with Pharaoh, who hardened his own heart multiple times before God further hardened it in order to show forth His supremacy and power over Egypt's many false gods. Each of the plagues deal with specific false gods :)
 
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preacher4truth said:
You've received hand me down teachings of them unawares as this error has permeated churches.
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I really appreciate the laugh there preacher4truth .... oh the irony

Let's see I can do bit of a lineage....

Augustine of Hippo influenced by NeoPlatonism
Augustine of Hippo begat John Calvin
John Calvin begat Hugenots
John Calvin begat John Knox etc.,
John Calvin begat The Puritans
The Puritans begat Westminster Confession
then we have the "hand me down teachings" of Edwards, Spurgeon, Packer, Martin Lloyd-Jones, Sproul, Piper, Keller, White etc., etc.,

And I suspect you have read each and every one...;)
 
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preacher4truth said:
Nothing in Scripture teaches man has free will, or that he can use it to decide for heaven
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What a bunch of goop.

John
3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.
3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.
3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.
3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
 
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soggykitten said:
I imagine the five points of pre salvation peoples have an explanation as to how those wonderful Bible images comport with their beliefs.
People for as many centuries as it has existed have twisted the Bible like a pretzel to have it mean what they need to believe about themselves,
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This, is excellent, with particular emphasis on 'what they need to believe about themselves.' yes. that's it exactly. that goes for more than tulip.
 
Magenta said:
Also, as to the hardening of the heart, this is also shown clearly in Scripture with Pharaoh, who hardened his own heart multiple times before God further hardened it in order to show forth His supremacy and power over Egypt's many false gods
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Yes and that is the example Paul used.
 
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preacher4truth said:
It is a bit interesting that of the many posts in here with the vitriol, anger, and ad hominem she picked yours out of all of them to call it "passive aggressive."

Hmmmmm. Seems a tad out of touch with reality. :whistle:
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I have a talent for sorting out a problem real quick. Sadly, it is not often seen as the blessing it actually is. Mostly I just leave it alone these days, but sometimes the 'ick' factor is just too strong.

I never said a word to you though.
 
preacher4truth said:
You've received hand me down teachings of them unawares as this error has permeated churches. It will take God to open your eyes to this and your error of losing salvation.

Nothing in Scripture teaches man has free will, or that he can use it to decide for heaven. Besides that, man isn't saved via will in the first place as mans will has absolutely nothing to do with it, John 1:13.

Furthermore Jesus taught we are not free until in him, in will, or by any means free; John 8:34-36. We are only free when he sets us free.
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Amen!
 
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eternally-gratefull said:
If that’s what you think this is. Then you are mistaken

He made a comment to you. I just asked him to practice what he preaches. You know what he did. Are you now saying what he did was ok?
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No one is perfect on this thread bro....including me.....let’s try and stop the snide personal remarks...that’s all I’m trying to say.....I’m even drawing myself into that negative talk again.......it’s childish and no need for it,
Let’s try and stay on topic if that’s ok.xx
 
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