Use of masks during COVID-19 not always the answer, says epidemiologist

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

I feel like I've totally overdosed on everything about masks of late, and I've done a fair bit of reading on the subject. Here' the link to the article cited in the subject line:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/nb-wearing-masks-1.5560578

One of the most distressing things about the whole mask debate for me is how it's having people turn on each other....those who don't wear masks calling those that do "sheep". Those who do wear them accusing those who don't as being selfish. I really wish it would stop.

Here's the thing, in many jurisdictions it is now required. In my Canadian province of Ontario many cities are now mandating face coverings including Toronto, Ottawa and Kingston. I want to leave the whole debate aside and just deal with facts, because it is such a contentious issue.

The linked article has an epidemiolgist and University of Toronto professor advocating that masks should be worn, especially in grocery stores where social distancing can be difficult. He makes some points though on using them safely however, and the biggest thing he cites is not to wear them for too long, for himself he limits use to 2 hours, and then he boils the mask before using it again. Why boiling? Because of research that warns that cloth can be an ideal breeding ground for bacteria, with a lot of bacteria now being drug resistant.

I don't know what research he is referencing, but I suspect it's the same research I read in the British Medical Journal (BMJ). As far as I am aware this is the only study ever done that looked at cloth masks specifically and the researchers reccomended against using cloth masks in medical settings because of the increased risk of infection. Personally, given the research, I don't fault those who aren't comfortable with cloth face coverings.

Here's the conluding statement from that research paper:

This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection. Further research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines need to be updated.

Here's the link: https://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/4/e006577

Be well and God bless all.

 

[Magenta]

My understanding is that wearing a mask more protects others from us rather than the other way around.

If everyone wore masks, then, we would all be safer.

Thank you, and may God continue to richly bless you as well

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

My understanding is that wearing a mask more protects others from us rather than the other way around.

If everyone wore masks, then, we would all be safer.

Thank you, and may God continue to richly bless you as well

I'm all for protecting others, but not if it means subjecting myself to the risk of a respitory infection because some cheap piece of cloth is contaminated with bacteria....a lof of bacteria is drug resistant now and an infection could be worse than covid for some.

Canada is only just starting to bring in cloth masking rules, while in the United States they have been in place for a month or so now....maybe that's why American case numbers are exploding higher, people keep touching masks that are infected. Most people aren't trained in how to use PPE properly or are just lazy and take the thing off and stuff it in a pocket.

 

[oldethennew]

just fyi,
hub and I live in a very small community - we and our friends/neighbors/local news, we just have NOT heard
of people being 'infected' with anything other than the occasional 'flu', seriously... and also, just guessing
from going out and coming in, grocery shopping, it's about 7 out of 10 who do NOT wear masks, except those who are REQUIRED,
such as Home Depot, Publix, Walmart, etc,. but this seems to be declining even though the 'media' is 'pushing it'...
remember,
we live in a very 'old-school' kind of community who looks out for its own in ways that most of the U.S.A.
has left behind...
hub and I have not worn a mask while shopping, which is usually the only reason we leave our farm -
except to sometimes pay our electric-bill in cash...

 

[Lanolin]

thats sad, wear what you can to be safe, wash you hands, practice socal distancing, good hygiene, stay home, be kind etc.
anyway being called sheep isnt an insult., Jesus is after all the lamb of God. He never thought so. I would rather be called a sheep than a goat.

At my the bookshop masks are optional and provided. At school they werent provided, but hand santitisers were.

I read a story to the children about masks, the book was called 'My mask' and was about children in vietnam who wear masks regularly, after the SARS epidemic. Even when it was over, people still wore them, they made their own and come in many colours and nobody shuns anyone just cos they wear one. If you are riding on the road its probably best to wear one anyway to stop dust going into your lungs.

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

Here are the guidelines for properly wearing, handling and washing cloth masks....it's complicated, but then doing things properly and safely is seldom easy. I see so many people stuffing cloth masks in and out of pockets...ugh. Thinking that SARS-Cov-2 is so dangerous and easily transmissible on the one hand, then risking bringing a viral load of it home in their pockets another.

From The World Health Org:

Remove the mask without touching the front of the mask, do not touch the eyes or mouth after mask removal. Either discard the mask or place it in a sealable bag where it is kept until it can be washed and cleaned. Perform hand hygiene immediately afterwards.

Non-medical masks should be washed frequently and handled carefully, so as not to contaminate other items.
If the layers of fabrics look noticeably worn out, discard the mask.

Clothing fabrics used to make masks should be checked for the highest permitted washing temperature. If instructions for washing are indicated on the clothing label, verify if washing in warm or hot water is tolerated. Select washable fabrics that can be washed. Wash in warm hot water, 60°C, with soap or laundry detergent. Non-woven polypropylene (PP) spunbond may be washed at high temperatures, up to 125°C.(72) Natural fibres may resist high temperature washes and ironing. Wash the mask delicately (without too much friction, stretching or wringing) if nonwoven materials (e.g. spunbond) are used. The combination of non-woven PP spunbond and cotton can tolerate high temperatures; masks made of these combinations may be steamed or boiled.

Where hot water is not available, wash mask with soap/detergent at room temperature water, followed by either i) boiling mask for one minute OR ii) soak mask in 0.1% chlorine for one minute then thoroughly rinse mask with room temperature water, to avoid any toxic residual of chlorine.

 

[Lanolin]

well in my handbook of COVID-19 prevention you didnt just wear a mask, you wore goggles and a boiler suit and gloves and immdediately disposed of or washed with hot soapy water afterward. You also wiped you shoes to avoid contamination.

this is how chinese medical staff did not die of covid when treating patients. They built entire makeshift hospitals and had triages and changed layouts so that entry and exit points were monitored. They screened everyone online first.

they had resporitory masks, for infected patients treated with cholorxyquinine and also chinese herbs for patient recovery...

 

[JohnR7]

Non-medical masks should be washed frequently

I use UVC light. I can buy a 60 watt equivalent led for around $12 and screw it into a clamp on shop light with a reflector shield. It leaves a mess if you are trying to kill germs. UV light does prevent them from growing which does not leave a mess. Also we can put things out in the sun like they use to do in the old days. Even they would dry their clothing in the sun. The sun can destroy this virus by breaking down it's protein cover in as little as 90 seconds. Also I prefer Hydrogen Peroxide over bleach.

 

[JohnR7]

this is how chinese medical staff did not die of covid when treating patients.

The wolf warrior major general chen wei claims she has 4,000 health care workers who cared for Covid patients without getting sick.

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

I use UVC light. I can buy a 60 watt equivalent led for around $12 and screw it into a clamp on shop light with a reflector shield. It leaves a mess if you are trying to kill germs. UV light does prevent them from growing which does not leave a mess. Also we can put things out in the sun like they use to do in the old days. Even they would dry their clothing in the sun. The sun can destroy this virus by breaking down it's protein cover in as little as 90 seconds. Also I prefer Hydrogen Peroxide over bleach.

I'm not wearing a mask, it hasn't been required in my area and frankly I don't think it's warranted at this time based on everything we know. I was shopping at my local grocery store and the lady in front of me pulled her's down to check the expiry date on a loaf of bread....touching the outside of the mask which all the experts say is where the virus would go (along with other possible pathogens), she then returned the loaf to the shelf....and this is typical of the behaviour I'm witnessing of people who are wearing masks.....

I'm putting my trust in God frankly, His will not mine. If I get the virus and die...this life isn't the end. I'm not going to try and catch it, but I'm not going to turn my world any more upside down than it already has been.

 

[Scribe]

I feel like I've totally overdosed on everything about masks of late, and I've done a fair bit of reading on the subject. Here' the link to the article cited in the subject line:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/nb-wearing-masks-1.5560578

One of the most distressing things about the whole mask debate for me is how it's having people turn on each other....those who don't wear masks calling those that do "sheep". Those who do wear them accusing those who don't as being selfish. I really wish it would stop.

Here's the thing, in many jurisdictions it is now required. In my Canadian province of Ontario many cities are now mandating face coverings including Toronto, Ottawa and Kingston. I want to leave the whole debate aside and just deal with facts, because it is such a contentious issue.

The linked article has an epidemiolgist and University of Toronto professor advocating that masks should be worn, especially in grocery stores where social distancing can be difficult. He makes some points though on using them safely however, and the biggest thing he cites is not to wear them for too long, for himself he limits use to 2 hours, and then he boils the mask before using it again. Why boiling? Because of research that warns that cloth can be an ideal breeding ground for bacteria, with a lot of bacteria now being drug resistant.

I don't know what research he is referencing, but I suspect it's the same research I read in the British Medical Journal (BMJ). As far as I am aware this is the only study ever done that looked at cloth masks specifically and the researchers reccomended against using cloth masks in medical settings because of the increased risk of infection. Personally, given the research, I don't fault those who aren't comfortable with cloth face coverings.

Here's the conluding statement from that research paper:

This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection. Further research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines need to be updated.

Here's the link: https://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/4/e006577

Be well and God bless all.

It's not that complicated. If it can stop about 85% it is going to stop it about 85% of the time. That will have an effect on the numbers. Wear glasses too. Maybe you'll dodge it in a store by those two precautions. I need to remember the glasses.

 

[Dude653]

Apparently right-wingers think being reckless and irresponsible makes them patriotic Americans

 

[Lion222]

Masks are as only good if you wear the properly.
If they are of a quality of material that can filter out the problem.
If they came up with one that could filter out racism that would be sweet!
Only good if you handle them properly.
Do not really do much if your nose is sticking out.

Apparently pulling your shirt over you mouth qualifies as a mask these days.
Are very good for accusing your political rival of something horrible or uncaring.
No longer need to be certified at being able to do anything at all.
Come in very handy during protests, race riots, sporting events and other such group gatherings, much like t-shirts or hats.
Have you see the new MAGA mask? just kidding.
Everyone telling you they don't really do anything wears them everyday in there job and just thinks most are too dumb to put them on right. (see previous comment about nose sticking out)

"Give a person a mask and they will show you their true face"

 

[Lion222]

Pr 22:3 - The prudent sees danger and hides himself, but the simple go on and suffer for it.

 

[Scribe]

Masks are as only good if you wear the properly.
If they are of a quality of material that can filter out the problem.
If they came up with one that could filter out racism that would be sweet!
Only good if you handle them properly.
Do not really do much if your nose is sticking out.

Apparently pulling your shirt over you mouth qualifies as a mask these days.
Are very good for accusing your political rival of something horrible or uncaring.
No longer need to be certified at being able to do anything at all.
Come in very handy during protests, race riots, sporting events and other such group gatherings, much like t-shirts or hats.
Have you see the new MAGA mask? just kidding.
Everyone telling you they don't really do anything wears them everyday in there job and just thinks most are too dumb to put them on right. (see previous comment about nose sticking out)

"Give a person a mask and they will show you their true face"

Did you write that yourself? Well done!

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

Required in my part of Ontario Canada starting Monday at noon.....my county has 0 identified cases currently, and only 21 since the pandemic started...all resolved with 0 deaths.

I use the word "identified" cases because I think it's still in our area circurlating....its just that it hasn't made anyone sick. Now that masks are required I'm afraid people who've been staying out of shops and groceries are going to think that it's suddenly safe next week, and given that so many people are constantly touching the outside of their masks ( a nice wet and warm breeding ground for SARS-Cov-2) and touching products and putting them back....I will not be surprised if we have an outbreak....

 

[soggykitten]

I feel like I've totally overdosed on everything about masks of late, and I've done a fair bit of reading on the subject. Here' the link to the article cited in the subject line:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/nb-wearing-masks-1.5560578

One of the most distressing things about the whole mask debate for me is how it's having people turn on each other....those who don't wear masks calling those that do "sheep". Those who do wear them accusing those who don't as being selfish. I really wish it would stop.

Here's the thing, in many jurisdictions it is now required. In my Canadian province of Ontario many cities are now mandating face coverings including Toronto, Ottawa and Kingston. I want to leave the whole debate aside and just deal with facts, because it is such a contentious issue.

The linked article has an epidemiolgist and University of Toronto professor advocating that masks should be worn, especially in grocery stores where social distancing can be difficult. He makes some points though on using them safely however, and the biggest thing he cites is not to wear them for too long, for himself he limits use to 2 hours, and then he boils the mask before using it again. Why boiling? Because of research that warns that cloth can be an ideal breeding ground for bacteria, with a lot of bacteria now being drug resistant.

I don't know what research he is referencing, but I suspect it's the same research I read in the British Medical Journal (BMJ). As far as I am aware this is the only study ever done that looked at cloth masks specifically and the researchers reccomended against using cloth masks in medical settings because of the increased risk of infection. Personally, given the research, I don't fault those who aren't comfortable with cloth face coverings.

Here's the conluding statement from that research paper:

This study is the first RCT of cloth masks, and the results caution against the use of cloth masks. This is an important finding to inform occupational health and safety. Moisture retention, reuse of cloth masks and poor filtration may result in increased risk of infection. Further research is needed to inform the widespread use of cloth masks globally. However, as a precautionary measure, cloth masks should not be recommended for HCWs, particularly in high-risk situations, and guidelines need to be updated.

Here's the link: https://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/5/4/e006577

Be well and God bless all.

There's a new phrase out now, mask shaming. And as you can guess, it pertains to attacks on people in public who aren't masked.
Weird. Remember when if you walked into a store with a mask on people looked at you funny? Now, it's the other way around.

 

[soggykitten]

B safe. Found this at Twitter. Imagine this as a mask mandate. The headache you'd have at the end of the day.

 

[StrugglingTilMyReward]

There's a new phrase out now, mask shaming. And as you can guess, it pertains to attacks on people in public who aren't masked.
Weird. Remember when if you walked into a store with a mask on people looked at you funny? Now, it's the other way around.

I've heard the term myself, as well as "superiority of the mask".....in my area there are exceptions for people with conditions like COPD, asthma....basically any condition that makes breathing through a mask dificult, as well as those with mental conditions where wearing a a mask can cause anxiety or other issues. I hope and pray that if someone is confronted over not wearing a mask....I hope I am around. I've seen too many social media posts that go something like: "I have asthma and I wear a mask, so that is not a valid excuse".....people arrogantly assuming that their situtation is exactly the same as everyone else's.

 

[Lanolin]

if you are handling quarantine or in isolation, with known cases then you DO need to wear PPE. If you think you may be at risk, wear one.
If you are not, and its safe, then you ought to be fine, just dont go to close to people if possible.

in shops many have put up perspex screens. its like a sneeze guard that you would have over salad bars. I dont know about you but many people have to be face to face with hundreds of people EVERY day in their work. How do you think they feel?

if your work consists solely of looking at a computer screen and you dont have to share your computer then I would say you are safe. But lots of people do not have jobs like that. surprise.