So many anti charismatic smear jobs allowed?

[7seasrekeyed]

WHAT made those temple guards fall backwards to the ground?

if you have never really experienced the LIVING Jesus apart from the Bible, that is known His presence and fell on your own knees (I have and you cannot help but understand that He is all and all and nothing and no one compares), how can you for one minute try to answer this question?

never mind. we know why you asked it

 

[7seasrekeyed]

They were in the presence of Christ, who is God. But you are still missing the point. They were working for Christ's enemies. So if you want to take that example, then all who fall down in those Charismatic meetings are working for the enemy (the devil). Is that what you wish to conclude?

This whole "slain in the Spirit" business is not from God. So you can draw your own conclusions.

I remember once in particular, being alone at home...years back now...as I was praying and worshiping, I could not stand anymore and went backwards onto my bed. I was overcome by God's glory

I guess in your economy, I must be of the devil

the cessationist business is not from God

and most thankfully, MOST THANKFULLY, no one has to accept what you cranky old men have to say...you...Roger...mr united with Christ and several others on here who basically do NOT even believe what the Bible says and worse, you prevent others from seeking God

I have NEVER sought an experience. I ONLY seek God but God does grant to some who seek Him a glimpse into His eternal Spirit

I would say shame on you...but that's just cliche

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Love people who think they can speak for everybody.

I doubt he was including you. but since he quoted me, I don't think you have added anything of value to this thread, but rather have made a good number of ad hominim attacks actually illustrating one of the reasons the op created said thread in the first place

and since you seem to think you have the gift of discernment and can tell real Christians apart from the fake ones (your words from another thread), you must be over burdened with that great weight placed upon you

no wonder you get so irritated

you haven't been here very long yourself, but you are going to snap at newer members? what brand new day?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Has anyone actually read how Saul became Paul?
the Spirit of God literally drops Saul to the ground and during this time speaks to Saul.

3 And as he journeyed, he came near Damascus: and suddenly there shined round about him a light from heaven:

4 And he fell to the earth, and heard a voice saying unto him, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me?

5 And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: [it is] hard for thee to kick against the pricks.

6 And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord [said] unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

8 And Saul arose from the earth;

^
That is being "Slain in the Spirit" Biblically!

we also have the book of Revelation...John... I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, you do not know what that means if you reject all supernatural (normal for God) occurrences and call it all demonic

for that matter Paul states he does not know if he was in the body or out of the body taken up to paradise (he states I know a man, but most believe he was referring to himself) 2I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of it I do not know, but God knows. 3And I know that this man— whether in the body or out of it I do not know, but God knows— 4was caught up to Paradise. II Cor

there are other examples, but every one is dismissed by these cessationists because THEY have nothing to go by regarding personal experience and so have simply dealt with that sad testimony by calling everyone who DOES have a spiritual encounter with God, as delusional, demonic or even just crazy. and some here are way worse than others

I mean who would even bother to write about anything they have experienced to be made fun of and torn apart by these people who seem to delight in doing that very thing? and you will be told that it is not biblical because your exact experience is not in scripture...doesn't matter if hundreds or more have the same experience actually described in the Bible...like speaking in tongues

 

[7seasrekeyed]

You are judging those who speak their convictions as having wrongful motives. We are to speak the truth in love. It would bother my conscience not to speak out against the Charismatic movement, knowing what I know having survived it. You need to look at history and ask why all churches are not Charismatic. If the gates of hell will not prevail against the church?

very few have had the hellish time you have written about

it seems you may have got mixed up with some very ungodly people

whatever you survived was NOT...I repeat NOT...of God and you deciding that all people who are charismatic or whatever, are also practicing some sort of deception or involved in the demonic realm, is a direct reflection on your personal experience and not objective in the least

if anyone would stop and think about it, they will see that YOU had a bad experience while most of us are praising God and decidedly thankful for spiritual gifts

as far as judging goes, is that not exactly what YOU do in thread after thread of your creation? in fact, the op said nothing about judging. he was actually posting his experience in this forum and many of us can concur

who are you to decide we are all having the nasty experience that you claim you had? what was it in YOU that made you susceptible to such deception?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

You are using an old sales technique, called bait, and switch. Trying to sell Pentecostalism on the merits of genuine first-century Christianity, even including Jesus. Show some of today's alleged miracles to back your claims.

no. you do not recognize when someone is sincere since you do not suffer from that malady

the miracle for you is that as long as you have breath, God still calls

figure it out and stop attacking others with your anti-Holy Spirit rhetoric

 

[kaylagrl]

It's not you. It's the doctrine you espouse.

Paul told Timothy to teach sound doctrine. You could start a thread and explore the doctrine of redemption of sinners by grace through faith.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I believe in sound doctrine, totally. I disagree with your POV on tongues. One day we'll know which of us is right. But to say someone who believes in tongues is demon possessed is ridiculous, and some here believe that. I utterly disagree with OSAS but I don't believe anyone who does believe it is a child of the devil. smh The OP has started the thread they wish to start, maybe leave them to it.

 

[wolfwint]

Think about purpose.
God is a God of purpose.
What purpose does it serve to accuse the brethren?
To actually make accusation a part of their ministry.
It is one thing to misrepresent Gods word and twist that word of God to say the gifts are no more.
But it incubates the inevitable. That is the attacking of the body of Christ that believes their bible and KNOWS the risen Savior.

So the purpose is obvious.
And the fruit cannot serve anything.
Not even fit for an animal. Rotten fruit. Dead fruit.

They tell you so proudly "the jews are flawed. They seek a sign."
(Implying that full gospel believers are evil and seek a sign.)

But when Jesus was asked to authenticate his his office and personage he said to John,through his disciples, "THE LAME WALK THE BLIND SEE AND THE DEAD ARE RAISED" (my paraphrase)

So Jesus was evil verifying himself,authenticating himself through miracles???

I tell you it an evil,YES EVIL,in the body of Christ that would attempt to disenfranchise the very heart core and thrust of the ministry of Jesus.
HE AUTHENTICATED HIMSELF THROUGH MIRACLES.

HE IS ALIVE!!!!
HE IS RISEN!!!!
HE LEFT US IN CHARGE!!!!
HE ENDOWED US WITH GIFTS AND POWER!!!!
HE SAID TARRY IN JERUSALEM TILL YOU ARE ENDUED WITH POWER.!!!!
HE SAID THESE SIGNS SHALL FOLLOW THEM THAT BELIEVE...!!!!

DO YOU BEIEVE???

MAYBE YOU DON'T
MAYBE YOU ARE ON THE WRONG TEAM????

ARE THE ACCUSERS STANDING WITH THE APOSTLES OR STANDING WITH THE RELIGIOUS LAW KEEPERS (THOSE ATTACKING THE ONES OPERATING IN THE GIFTS)

IT IS THE SAME AS WITH THE EARLY CHURCH. PERSECUTION AGAINST THE BRETHREN.
ATTACKING THOSE THAT BELONG TO THE KING.

SICK PEOPLE ..those attackers.

Then look how many people where deceived through people which promissed them you need no Doktor, you need only faith to be healed from your sickness. They came to a healing Service sick and left it sick. The different to the ministrie of Jesus. Everyone who came to Him was healed.
I dont know any cessasionist which denys that God is doing miracles today ore is healing through prayer ore even because of
Grace. But what we See since 1901 are teachings which we dont find taught to any Christian church in the NT. Bible says we should proof the teachings and the Spirit who is behind. Thats we are doing.

 

[Absolutely]

They were in the presence of Christ, who is God. But you are still missing the point. They were working for Christ's enemies. So if you want to take that example, then all who fall down in those Charismatic meetings are working for the enemy (the devil). Is that what you wish to conclude?

This whole "slain in the Spirit" business is not from God. So you can draw your own conclusions.

You would be so happy in the company of the mockers when the people of God came down from the upper room.

I bet you would have said the devil knocked down paul and then commented "the Holy Spirit is a gentleman" ..."He only approves of "decent and in order"

God is not in your box or your powerless changed bible

 

[Absolutely]

I believe in sound doctrine, totally. I disagree with your POV on tongues. One day we'll know which of us is right. But to say someone who believes in tongues is demon possessed is ridiculous, and some here believe that. I utterly disagree with OSAS but I don't believe anyone who does believe it is a child of the devil. smh The OP has started the thread they wish to start, maybe leave them to it.

I dont get it either.
Nobody is putting a gun to their heads and telling them to stalk and attack the brethren.
They stalk like predators.
It is a spirit driving them.

The gifts and the Holy Spirit torment them. They can not stand it.

 

[garee]

Think about purpose.
God is a God of purpose.
What purpose does it serve to accuse the brethren?
To actually make accusation a part of their ministry.
It is one thing to misrepresent Gods word and twist that word of God to say the gifts are no more.
But it incubates the inevitable. That is the attacking of the body of Christ that believes their bible and KNOWS the risen Savior.

So the purpose is obvious.
And the fruit cannot serve anything.
Not even fit for an animal. Rotten fruit. Dead fruit.

They tell you so proudly "the jews are flawed. They seek a sign."
(Implying that full gospel believers are evil and seek a sign.)

But when Jesus was asked to authenticate his his office and personage he said to John,through his disciples, "THE LAME WALK THE BLIND SEE AND THE DEAD ARE RAISED" (my paraphrase)

So Jesus was evil verifying himself,authenticating himself through miracles???

I tell you it an evil,YES EVIL,in the body of Christ that would attempt to disenfranchise the very heart core and thrust of the ministry of Jesus.
HE AUTHENTICATED HIMSELF THROUGH MIRACLES.

HE IS ALIVE!!!!
HE IS RISEN!!!!
HE LEFT US IN CHARGE!!!!
HE ENDOWED US WITH GIFTS AND POWER!!!!
HE SAID TARRY IN JERUSALEM TILL YOU ARE ENDUED WITH POWER.!!!!
HE SAID THESE SIGNS SHALL FOLLOW THEM THAT BELIEVE...!!!!

DO YOU BEIEVE???

MAYBE YOU DON'T
MAYBE YOU ARE ON THE WRONG TEAM????

ARE THE ACCUSERS STANDING WITH THE APOSTLES OR STANDING WITH THE RELIGIOUS LAW KEEPERS (THOSE ATTACKING THE ONES OPERATING IN THE GIFTS)

IT IS THE SAME AS WITH THE EARLY CHURCH. PERSECUTION AGAINST THE BRETHREN.
ATTACKING THOSE THAT BELONG TO THE KING.

SICK PEOPLE ..those attackers.

Not so much proudly "the Jews are flawed" but rather we offer them the gospel in a hope it will humble them . Jews are simply used to represent flawed mankind as a shadow in ceremonies a picture of the unseen to the whole world not a self righteous, edifying tools of wonderment (no faith) .

God does not view their corrupted flesh any different than that of other nations. He use animals and plants to give us the understanding of natural seen, and supernatural not seen.

Salvation is not after the corrupted flesh of any man . Even the Son of man, Jesus said His flesh and blood profits for nothing, zero . its the unseen that can alone profit as eternal.

Tongues is prophecy as one of the many manners he does speak to us . Its not about whether his spiritual unseen gifts are still working as the new tongue of the believer. The tongue of the gospel prophecy from faith the unseen to the same unseen .Faith to faith. Face to face. The power of the gospel it as it is written cast out lying spirits

But rather oral traditions of men are that which does make the tradition of God's law without effect. Turning it upside down.

Scripture reveals the sign by which we can know who has need of the gospel (sola scriptural as it is written) . But as we are informed . They love there self edifying work of wonderment so they continue to mock God by making a noise without meaning and falling back as the spirit of judgment. Not having a desire stop the oral traditions of men "self-edifying". . "self righteous"

SICK PEOPLE ..those attackers who make noises and fall backward mocking God . They need the gospel. Not more wonderment's

One is too many a thousand not enough.

Marvel not. . believe prophecy . The I understand sign.

 

[Absolutely]

Half a gospel? Are you suggesting that the gospel must include a baptism of the Holy Spirit and evidence of speaking in tongues?

The gospel is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. Salvation is by grace received through faith.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Lol
The epistles were written by Holy Spirit Baptized men to other Holy Spirit baptized men.

You walked up to the barn got two ft away, shot both barrels and missed.

 

[Bbrdrd]

The only issue I have with charismatics is some have a tendency to neglect aspects of God that are not experiential. There are demons that perform wonders and lead people to worship men, but if someone is pointing to Christ and the Spirit is manifesting then I say great. I know from my own experience the Spirit of God is alive and active and working miracles to this day. Jesus promised we would do greater works than He did, and I don't think that just means bringing people to church. So while I don't trust many of the big names and theatrics of huxters it is not out of a denial that such things are possible.

 

[Absolutely]

The only issue I have with charismatics is some have a tendency to neglect aspects of God that are not experiential. There are demons that perform wonders and lead people to worship men, but if someone is pointing to Christ and the Spirit is manifesting then I say great. I know from my own experience the Spirit of God is alive and active and working miracles to this day. Jesus promised we would do greater works than He did, and I don't think that just means bringing people to church. So while I don't trust many of the big names and theatrics of huxters it is not out of a denial that such things are possible.

I also am not in favor of some of the antics.

The charismatics have shot themselves in the foot over a thousand times.
The error is there for sure.

But what I am seeing is such a perversion of "oversight by ignorance" that it is appalling.
The clowns are accusing clowns of being clowns.

Such doctrinal buffoonery that has no clue of propecy,demons,spirits,authority,gifts.....etc.

No clue...none

And yet these same ignorant brethren are the expert judges that go as far to blaspheme the Holy Spirit in their supposed "knowledge of scripture"

 

[Nehemiah6]

You would be so happy in the company of the mockers when the people of God came down from the upper room. I bet you would have said the devil knocked down paul and then commented "the Holy Spirit is a gentleman" ..."He only approves of "decent and in order" God is not in your box or your powerless changed bible

You can rant all you want but there is absolutely no biblical basis for this ridiculous phenomenon. Christ knocked NO ONE down. He always picked up the ones who needed His healing touch. And that is the bottom line.

Also, the Holy Spirit does not do something which Jesus would not do. There is not one recorded instance in the Acts of the Apostles (more precisely the Acts of the Holy Spirit) where an apostle or an evangelist knocked down anyone. That happens only in boxing rings.

 

[Dino246]

You can rant all you want but there is absolutely no biblical basis for this ridiculous phenomenon. Christ knocked NO ONE down. He always picked up the ones who needed His healing touch. And that is the bottom line.

Also, the Holy Spirit does not do something which Jesus would not do. There is not one recorded instance in the Acts of the Apostles (more precisely the Acts of the Holy Spirit) where an apostle or an evangelist knocked down anyone. That happens only in boxing rings.

... and because it didn't happen exactly like this in Scripture, God is forbidden from doing it? Um, no. By your logic, nobody would ever be healed of cancer, addictions, or even a toothache, because Jesus never healed anyone of those maladies.

God is not limited to repeating the events recorded in Scripture. He just won't contradict Scripture. There is a huge difference.

Perhaps you take the opposite approach: that what is expressly recorded in Scripture limits what the Holy Spirit can do today. If so, what do you do with John 21:25?

By the way, you are setting yourself up as God's judge when you say what "Jesus would not do" without framing it as your opinion.

 

[biker]

But what we See since 1901 are teachings which we dont find taught to any Christian church in the NT. Bible says we should proof the teachings and the Spirit who is behind. Thats we are doing.

Brother, this is not directed at you. But a portion of what you said reminded me of other doctrinal ideas that are very "new" and some Believers buy it like its Gospel.


Pre-Trib Rapture is a little over 140 years old, not taught in the first 18 Centuries, but people have bought it like it is solid gold. How can you buy Pre-Trib but not what the Power of God can do (by even using Scripture references and examples) when it comes into contact with a human being?

 

[biker]

I will further this thought. In the late 1800's, the man who conceived this idea was already considered a "Heretic." How does a Heretic become Gospel in a little over 100 years?

 

[notuptome]

Lol
The epistles were written by Holy Spirit Baptized men to other Holy Spirit baptized men.

You walked up to the barn got two ft away, shot both barrels and missed.

You did not answer the question. What do you mean by half a gospel?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Nehemiah6]

By the way, you are setting yourself up as God's judge when you say what "Jesus would not do" without framing it as your opinion.

We know what Jesus would or would not do through the Bible itself. Not based on any opinion. And neither the Father, nor the Son, nor the Holy Spirit knocked down the children of God, or those who came to Christ for healing.

And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. (Mt 8:3)

And when Jesus was come into Peter's house, he saw his wife's mother laid, and sick of a fever. And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them. (Mt 8:14,15)

But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (then saith he to the sick of the palsy,) Arise, take up thy bed, and go unto thine house. And he arose, and departed to his house. (Mt 9:6,7)

We could go through all the healing miracles of Christ, and discover that all were LIFTED UP, not CAST DOWN.