Is it a sin to drink alcohol

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Oct 25, 2018
2,377
1,198
113
Sorry to hear about that. I do not really respond to threats well, even if they only injure yourself.
Here's the thing, I have ZERO doubts you do not attend a church. In fact, if I was a betting man, I'd bet $ on it. You are no different than the 1 in a million dime store theologians who post tons of scriptures, but mend, bend, warp, twist, maim, harm, them in the process. You are no different than the many I have engaged with since 2007 on this site, and several others, who have no clue how to exegete, and are nothing more than a tumbleweed who just goes whichever way the wind blows. Who has no foundation for what they believe, as they make the scriptures say what they want them to say.

You are the epitome of "Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

I did not threaten you, so please do not use the persecution complex, k? FYI, do not respond, I have placed you on ignore. I am leaving you to your own demise.
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
2,375
504
113
58
HBG. Pa. USA
Read Acts 10-11 a litle more closely, then read Acts 15, then read 1 Peter 1:15-16, and Revelation 16:13, 18:2. "Unclean" right in the NT, for Christians. :) If you need the details, I would be glad to show more from the scripture, right from the very places (and others) cited.

Act_11:8 But I said, Not so, Lord: for nothing common or unclean hath at any time entered into my mouth.​

Long after the Cross.

Acts 10-11, notice, the entire point of the vision:

Act_10:28 And he said unto them, Ye know how that it is an unlawful thing for a man that is a Jew to keep company, or come unto one of another nation; but God hath shewed me that I should not call any man common or unclean.​
'P.S.' 'common' (koinon) and 'unclean' (akathartos; or abomination, bdelugma) are two differing things.
I'm amused by your "Disagree" to my statement. Do you think it was not the most biased piece of hogwash that I have had the misfortune of viewing? Who are you to assess my opinion anyway?

I also noticed that you have given (and received) more "Disagree" responses than anything else. Maybe you should re-evaluate your reasons for being on this site.
And God never mentions cleansing the unclean only the common.
And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
(Act 10:15 KJV)
 

lightbearer

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
2,375
504
113
58
HBG. Pa. USA
Here's the thing, I have ZERO doubts you do not attend a church. In fact, if I was a betting man, I'd bet $ on it. You are no different than the 1 in a million dime store theologians who post tons of scriptures, but mend, bend, warp, twist, maim, harm, them in the process. You are no different than the many I have engaged with since 2007 on these sites who have no clue how to exegete, and are nothing more than a tumbleweed who just goes whichever way the wind blows. Who has no foundation for what they believe, as they make the scriptures say what they want them to say.

You are the epitome of "Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

I did not threaten you, so please do not use the persecution complex, k? FYI, do not respond, I have placed you on ignore. I am leaving you to your own demise.
And yet you are not answering the points of his post. At least not on the last couple pages anyway. Whether he is a kjonliest, what his church affiliation is, or who his daddy is has no bearing on anything he has posted.

Placed him on ignore? lol

And btw you threaten him by giving him an ultimatum. You said "Unless you answer me, I do not wish to hear from you."
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,950
13,615
113
a nazarite vow is specifically only a temporary thing. it is specifically voluntary, not required. see Numbers 6.
Samson is an extraordinary case - he was declared a nazarite before he was even conceived ((Judges 13)) - so it was not of his own voluntary choice, as Numbers 6 specifies. and he was called a nazarite all his life, again contrary to what Numbers 6 specifies.

So his father went down to the woman. And Samson gave a feast there, for young men used to do so.
(Judges 14:10)
the word 'feast' here is interesting -- mishteh
Strong's gives: "From shathah; drink, by implication, drinking (the act)"

Brown-Driver-Briggs gives "an occasion for drinking, a drinking-bout"

it is literally, a drinking party. a banquet where wine is drank liberally. an occasion for carousing; a feasting where there is a definite connotation of free-flowing strong drink being involved.
see for example in 1 Samuel 25:36

Now Abigail went to Nabal, and there he was, holding a feast in his house, like the feast of a king. And Nabal’s heart was merry within him, for he was very drunk; therefore she told him nothing, little or much, until morning light
undoubtedly Samson also touched & came near thousands of dead bodies.
so Samson very likely drank, and was obviously in contact with corpses - he slew a thousand with his hands!

both of these are breaking the nazarite vow, as far as Numbers 6 says. a person who voluntarily made a nazarite vow specified the number of days, and if they broke the vow in any part, their days would start over. they had to make certain sacrifices for restarting their vow -- none of which, as far as the record shows, Samson ever did.

why did the strength never leave him until his hair was cut?
why is the touching of dead bodies and the drinking of wine given less importance in Judges 13-16 than the cutting of hair?
 

WithinReason

Active member
Feb 21, 2020
929
136
43
So his father went down to the woman. And Samson gave a feast there, for young men used to do so.(Judges 14:10)
the word 'feast' here is interesting -- mishteh
Strong's gives: "From shathah; drink, by implication, drinking (the act)"
Brown-Driver-Briggs gives "an occasion for drinking, a drinking-bout"
Samson sinned greatly, one piece at a time, against his vow, but he was already breaking with God, beginning here:
Jdg 14:1 And Samson went down to Timnath, and saw a woman in Timnath of the daughters of the Philistines.​
Jdg 14:2 And he came up, and told his father and his mother, and said, I have seen a woman in Timnath of the daughters of the Philistines: now therefore get her for me to wife.​
Jdg 14:3 Then his father and his mother said unto him, Is there never a woman among the daughters of thy brethren, or among all my people, that thou goest to take a wife of the uncircumcised Philistines? And Samson said unto his father, Get her for me; for she pleaseth me well.
Jdg 14:5 Then went Samson down, and his father and his mother, to Timnath, and came to the vineyards of Timnath: and, behold, a young lion roared against him.​
Jdg 14:6 And the Spirit of the LORD came mightily upon him, and he rent him as he would have rent a kid, and he had nothing in his hand: but he told not his father or his mother what he had done.​
Jdg 14:8 And after a time he returned to take her, and he turned aside to see the carcase of the lion: and, behold, there was a swarm of bees and honey in the carcase of the lion.​
Jdg 14:9 And he took thereof in his hands, and went on eating, and came to his father and mother, and he gave them, and they did eat: but he told not them that he had taken the honey out of the carcase of the lion.​
Jdg 14:10 So his father went down unto the woman: and Samson made there a feast; for so used the young men to do.​
He wasn't allowed to do any of those things.

The 'feast' simply means a 'feast', and is first used in Genesis 19:3, with Abraham and God, and the clean and unleavened, and likewise used in Genesis 21:8. It can mean either, see the rest of the uses in the scripture. In this instance, it was a 'wedding' feast, but this, among the gentiles of Timnath, the Philistines, so it is possible to have been with alcohol, though the context does not specifically say. In either case (grape juice or alcohol), Samson was slowly negating all of the Nazarite vow. His last break was the hair. This is a lesson about slowly backsliding, or leaving God, piece by piece, being overcome piece by piece. It is not a good example, nor blessed of God, even if it were alcohol, or even if it were juice of the grape.
Marriage with unbelievers was forbidden by God, and this is where it all started, with ungodly acquaintances influencing to forget and forsake God, then lust of the eyes, and flesh and pride of life:

See the following for comparison with the Genesis 6:2,4 KJB account:

See Abraham and Isaac in Genesis 24:3,37.​
See Esau and Jacob in Genesis 26:34,35, 28:8,9 [comparing to Jacob in Genesis 27:46, 28:1,6 KJB], 36:2.​
See Isaac and Jacob in Genesis 27:46, 28:1,6 KJB.​
See Jacob and Hamor in Genesis 34:9,14 KJB.​
See Moses in Exodus 34:15,16 KJB.​
See in Deuteronomy 17:17 KJB.​
See Balaam in Numbers 25:1,2,3 KJB.​
See in Judges 3:5,6,7 KJB.​
See Samson the Judge in Judges 14:1,2,3 KJB.​
See the Chronicles in 1 Chronicles 5:24,25 KJB.​
See Ezra in Ezra 9:1,2,11,12 KJB.​
See Nehemiah in Nehemiah 9:2, 10:28,29,30, 13:23,25,26,27 KJB.​
See Solomon in 1 Kings 11:1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 KJB.​

Many “Sons of God” “looked”/“saw” [“saw the daughters of men that they [were] fair” and “took them wives of all which they chose” [Genesis 6:2 KJB]] and "beheld" [Just as did Samson, “she pleaseth me well”, or King David who went after Bathsheba, the wife of Uriah the Hittite and his friend, through covetousness had Uriah killed in action “from the roof he saw a woman washing herself; and the woman [was] very beautiful to look upon” [2 Samuel 11:2, 12:9 KJB] and Solomon who “multiplied wives” and “loved many strange women” and all Israel who took of the “daughters of the land”], and then “lusted and coveted” and so were ensnared being “Vex[ed], Beguiled, To Commit Trespass Against The LORD, Commit Fornication, Eat things sacrificed unto Idols, worshipped idols” [Numbers 25:18, 31:16; Revelation 2:14 KJB]:
Jude 1:11 KJB - Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.​

See also the words of Jesus, as it was in the days of Noah and Lot:

Job 21:7,14, 22:15,16,17; Matthew 24:37,38; Luke 17:26,27; 2 Peter 2:5, 3:3,6.​

In the greater overall picture there is a like message and call for the “people of God” also today to “come out” of “Spiritual Babylon” [just as God had done with physical Babylon; Jeremiah 51:9; Isaiah 52:11 KJB] that “great Whore” [Revelation 17:1, 19:2 KJB]:

See 2 Corinthians 6:14,15,16,17,18; Revelation 18:4 KJB.​
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,950
13,615
113
@withoutreason you said a lot of words but nothing of value towards answering my question:

why did the strength never leave him until his hair was cut?
why is the touching of dead bodies and the drinking of wine given less importance in Judges 13-16 than the cutting of hair?
 

wolfwint

Senior Member
Feb 15, 2014
3,778
943
113
62
Samson sinned greatly, one piece at a time, against his vow, but he was already breaking with God, beginning here:
Jdg 14:1 And Samson went down to Timnath, and saw a woman in Timnath of the daughters of the Philistines.​
Jdg 14:2 And he came up, and told his father and his mother, and said, I have seen a woman in Timnath of the daughters of the Philistines: now therefore get her for me to wife.​
Jdg 14:3 Then his father and his mother said unto him, Is there never a woman among the daughters of thy brethren, or among all my people, that thou goest to take a wife of the uncircumcised Philistines? And Samson said unto his father, Get her for me; for she pleaseth me well.
Jdg 14:5 Then went Samson down, and his father and his mother, to Timnath, and came to the vineyards of Timnath: and, behold, a young lion roared against him.​
Jdg 14:6 And the Spirit of the LORD came mightily upon him, and he rent him as he would have rent a kid, and he had nothing in his hand: but he told not his father or his mother what he had done.​
Jdg 14:8 And after a time he returned to take her, and he turned aside to see the carcase of the lion: and, behold, there was a swarm of bees and honey in the carcase of the lion.​
Jdg 14:9 And he took thereof in his hands, and went on eating, and came to his father and mother, and he gave them, and they did eat: but he told not them that he had taken the honey out of the carcase of the lion.​
Jdg 14:10 So his father went down unto the woman: and Samson made there a feast; for so used the young men to do.​
He wasn't allowed to do any of those things.

The 'feast' simply means a 'feast', and is first used in Genesis 19:3, with Abraham and God, and the clean and unleavened, and likewise used in Genesis 21:8. It can mean either, see the rest of the uses in the scripture. In this instance, it was a 'wedding' feast, but this, among the gentiles of Timnath, the Philistines, so it is possible to have been with alcohol, though the context does not specifically say. In either case (grape juice or alcohol), Samson was slowly negating all of the Nazarite vow. His last break was the hair. This is a lesson about slowly backsliding, or leaving God, piece by piece, being overcome piece by piece. It is not a good example, nor blessed of God, even if it were alcohol, or even if it were juice of the grape.
Marriage with unbelievers was forbidden by God, and this is where it all started, with ungodly acquaintances influencing to forget and forsake God, then lust of the eyes, and flesh and pride of life:

See the following for comparison with the Genesis 6:2,4 KJB account:

See Abraham and Isaac in Genesis 24:3,37.​
See Esau and Jacob in Genesis 26:34,35, 28:8,9 [comparing to Jacob in Genesis 27:46, 28:1,6 KJB], 36:2.​
See Isaac and Jacob in Genesis 27:46, 28:1,6 KJB.​
See Jacob and Hamor in Genesis 34:9,14 KJB.​
See Moses in Exodus 34:15,16 KJB.​
See in Deuteronomy 17:17 KJB.​
See Balaam in Numbers 25:1,2,3 KJB.​
See in Judges 3:5,6,7 KJB.​
See Samson the Judge in Judges 14:1,2,3 KJB.​
See the Chronicles in 1 Chronicles 5:24,25 KJB.​
See Ezra in Ezra 9:1,2,11,12 KJB.​
See Nehemiah in Nehemiah 9:2, 10:28,29,30, 13:23,25,26,27 KJB.​
See Solomon in 1 Kings 11:1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8 KJB.​

Many “Sons of God” “looked”/“saw” [“saw the daughters of men that they [were] fair” and “took them wives of all which they chose” [Genesis 6:2 KJB]] and "beheld" [Just as did Samson, “she pleaseth me well”, or King David who went after Bathsheba, the wife of Uriah the Hittite and his friend, through covetousness had Uriah killed in action “from the roof he saw a woman washing herself; and the woman [was] very beautiful to look upon” [2 Samuel 11:2, 12:9 KJB] and Solomon who “multiplied wives” and “loved many strange women” and all Israel who took of the “daughters of the land”], and then “lusted and coveted” and so were ensnared being “Vex[ed], Beguiled, To Commit Trespass Against The LORD, Commit Fornication, Eat things sacrificed unto Idols, worshipped idols” [Numbers 25:18, 31:16; Revelation 2:14 KJB]:
Jude 1:11 KJB - Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.​

See also the words of Jesus, as it was in the days of Noah and Lot:

Job 21:7,14, 22:15,16,17; Matthew 24:37,38; Luke 17:26,27; 2 Peter 2:5, 3:3,6.​

In the greater overall picture there is a like message and call for the “people of God” also today to “come out” of “Spiritual Babylon” [just as God had done with physical Babylon; Jeremiah 51:9; Isaiah 52:11 KJB] that “great Whore” [Revelation 17:1, 19:2 KJB]:

See 2 Corinthians 6:14,15,16,17,18; Revelation 18:4 KJB.​
Bro., I can understand that you are against alcohol. I am too. But the Bibel, the word of God prohibits an christian not to drink alcohol. You cant convince with your out of the context uses verses.
 

WithinReason

Active member
Feb 21, 2020
929
136
43
Bro., I can understand that you are against alcohol. I am too.
The Bible is against drinking alcohol:

Pro_31:4 It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink:​
Hab_2:15 Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also, that thou mayest look on their nakedness!​
Pro_20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.​

and many such more. Yet, the clear texts, are thrown aside, and people take those texts where it simply reads 'wine' and attempt to have them all mean 'alcohol', when that is not how the scriptures uses the word in every case.
 

WithinReason

Active member
Feb 21, 2020
929
136
43
@withoutreason you said a lot of words but nothing of value towards answering my question:
I did tell you, but you refuse to listen. Your deafness/blindness is not my issue. It is yours. If I say it again, you will yet refuse it again.

The Holy Ghost was his strength, and God does not immediately leave anyone, even when there is sin. It is only when the Holy Ghost is blasphemed, does the strength go out. Notice the secret told, in that he finally relied upon his physical nature, rather than on God. The hair was merely the symbol (and do you even understand that symbol as given in scripture)?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,950
13,615
113
It is only when the Holy Ghost is blasphemed, does the strength go out.
so drinking alcohol, womanizing, and making oneself unclean with the dead aren't blasphemy, but hair cutting is?

i'm not sure you understand the portrait Samson is. :unsure:
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
37,950
13,615
113
Notice the secret told, in that he finally relied upon his physical nature, rather than on God.
are you talking about the riddle at his wedding?

But his father and his mother knew not that it came of the LORD,
that he should seek an occasion against the Philistines
(Judges 14:4 gnv)

 

Jackson123

Senior Member
Feb 6, 2014
11,769
1,371
113
Pro_31:4 It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink:
And you believe wine mean grape juice don't you?

So that verse mean the king prohibit to drink grape juice and the prince prohibit to drink a strong drink
 

WithinReason

Active member
Feb 21, 2020
929
136
43
And you believe wine mean grape juice don't you?
Not at all times, only contextually. The word 'wine' as defined by scripture, by secular and historical sources (already cited previous), has multiple uses/definitions, ranging from the pure juice of the grape, to the distilled and alcoholic liquid. The word 'wine' simply means that which comes from the 'vine'. See word etymology as already provided.

So that verse mean the king prohibit to drink grape juice and the prince prohibit to drink a strong drink
No. The context is speaking of that which destroys Kings, perverts judgment, makes one to forget (thus affecting the mind/brain/will) God's law, leading unto death, all of which speak to the corrupting influence of intoxication, alcohol. It has nothing to say about the blessed 'wine' (the pure juice of the grape, fruit of the vine), which strengtheneth mankind's heart/mind/body, is refreshing and invigorating (life giving).
 

WithinReason

Active member
Feb 21, 2020
929
136
43
are you talking about the riddle at his wedding?

But his father and his mother knew not that it came of the LORD,
that he should seek an occasion against the Philistines
(Judges 14:4 gnv)
No.