All things James

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
Luke was a gentile and a doctor. He had never been to any sort of religious school. He just made a dilight study on his own. We know a lot about Mary for example from Luke and his discussions with her. Even though it was John that Jesus asked to take care of Mary. John does not talk very much about her.
How does this reply of yours address my post there?
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
The Gospel of Luke was written by a Gentile.
Even if Luke was indeed a Gentile, he was writing his account of Jesus's life on Earth, for the sake of Theophilus .

That does not mean he was preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom to the Gentiles. Before Paul was raised, a Gentile could only be saved by being a Jew.
 
Dec 30, 2019
1,266
290
83
Even if Luke was indeed a Gentile, he was writing his account of Jesus's life on Earth, for the sake of Theophilus .

That does not mean he was preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom to the Gentiles. Before Paul was raised, a Gentile could only be saved by being a Jew.
Paul - Luke & Mark when on missionary trips together. They took the gospel to the ends of their world the same way every generation has reached the whole world. When Paul and Mark had a falling out it was Luke that reconciled them.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,465
6,722
113
Frequently our Father uses the past tense about an event that has not occurred to affirm it is set and nto to be changed. Also He will repeat an event to be, spoken that is, also as an affirmation of its certainty.
 
Jan 12, 2019
7,497
1,399
113
Paul - Luke & Mark when on missionary trips together. They took the gospel to the ends of their world the same way every generation has reached the whole world. When Paul and Mark had a falling out it was Luke that reconciled them.
Do you think Paul was preaching to the Gentiles the Gospel of the Kingdom?
 

tanakh

Senior Member
Dec 1, 2015
4,635
1,041
113
77
Its obvious that the whole of the NT was originally addressed to first century Christians but that doesn't mean that there are not
lessons to be learnt for us now. The Bible is a message to mankind in whatever age they happen to be in.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
4,044
1,325
113
Australia
To which tribe do you belong?

1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
Jesus is the true vine.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
Joh 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

can i be one of these branches? can anyone choose to abide in Christ?
Because of Jesus i have become a son of Abraham, a son of God.

When Israel rejected Jesus He started sending His branches over the wall, we are all able to join the root stock.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
4,044
1,325
113
Australia
The book of James contains doctrinal truths for the Jews living in the last days of the tribulation as they will be scattered and will face all kinds of trouble.

1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

The term twelve tribes is used all throughout Scripture, and is always a reference to the nation of Israel as a whole and never to a called out group from that nation. Genesis 49:28, Exodus 24:4, 28:21, Ezekiel 47:13. And the NT is no different: Matt 19:28, Luke 22:30, Acts 26:7, Revelation 21:12. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel. In order to make James a Christian epistle would mean to contradict every other usage of this term in Scripture. It is certainly not a reference to the diaspora.
To separate the Jews and the gentile today is to go against the teachings of Paul, 1 Cor 12:12. The Jews needed the message in James day and need it today but we are all saved in the same way by the same gospel. The Jews are no different to us, we all need Jesus. different cultures may require different means to help them and James may have been aiming his message at the Jewish culture in his day. but to presume that it is exclusive to them is wrong.
If it was Gods will to put it in the bible for us to read today, don't ignore part of His truth for us.
Luk 22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
The verse above was spoken to Simon, peter. you can apply it to yourself or ignore it.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
To separate the Jews and the gentile today is to go against the teachings of Paul, 1 Cor 12:12. The Jews needed the message in James day and need it today but we are all saved in the same way by the same gospel. The Jews are no different to us, we all need Jesus. different cultures may require different means to help them and James may have been aiming his message at the Jewish culture in his day. but to presume that it is exclusive to them is wrong.
If it was Gods will to put it in the bible for us to read today, don't ignore part of His truth for us.
Luk 22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
The verse above was spoken to Simon, peter. you can apply it to yourself or ignore it.
Exactly my point! The address “twelve tribes” is always, throughout the Bible a reference to the whole nation of Israel. To make James a Christian epistle violates every other usage. The Church is not the twelve tribes of Israel. There are no twelve tribes in the body of Christ. James is addressing the entire nation during the tribulation.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
Luk 22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
The verse above was spoken to Simon, peter. you can apply it to yourself or ignore it.
Verse 31, the Lord is speaking about the disciples, thus the plural form “you.” Verse 32, the Lord addresses Peter, thus the singular form “thee.”

Luke 22
31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.
 
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
113
The address “twelve tribes” is always, throughout the Bible a reference to the whole nation of Israel.
It's to the saved people among the nation of Israel scattered in the world.

To make James a Christian epistle violates every other usage.
Saved Jews are Christians.

There are no twelve tribes in the body of Christ.
No, but there are saved Jews in the twelve tribes of Israel.

James is addressing the entire nation during the tribulation.
James is addressing the saved Jews in the nation of Israel during the time he wrote it.
 

FlyingDove

Senior Member
Dec 27, 2017
1,275
436
83
All scripture was written for us. Not all scripture is written to us.

Scripture Study Tips:

When dissecting any verse of scripture. Ask yourself, of whom, to whom, with what words, what time, where, to what intent, with what circumstances, considering what is written before and what follows any single verse context.
^^^Myles Coverdale, Bible theologian/translator^^^

James was written between 38 & 49 AD. I listed 9 sources below that ALL say written before 50 AD

James is writing to Israelites still required to observe Mosaic laws, circumcision etc. The gentile Gospel of salvation isn't found in James Epistle.

The council at Jerusalem takes place 50-51 AD. Where after a vigorous debate (Acts 15:5-24) the Apostles conclude gentiles are not required to be circumcised or adhere to Mosaic laws (Acts 15:24).

Romans 15:4 (A) For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning,
(NOTE: ALL scripture is written for our learning. However, ALL scripture isn't written for our DOCTRINE. Example: Are we required to bring a sin sacrifice to the Temple priest?)

http://biblehub.com/summary/james/1.htm James 48-49 AD

https://www.biblegateway.com/resources/commentaries/IVP-NT/Jas/Historical-Context James written between A.D. 40 and 50

https://www.blueletterbible.org/study/eo/jam/jam000.cfm James 49 AD

https://www.gotquestions.org/Book-of-James.html James 45 AD

http://www.freebeginning.com/new_testament_dates/ James 38 AD

http://bibleq.net/answer/2737/ James late 40's

http://www.biblestudy.org/beginner/when-was-new-testament-written.html James 40-41 AD

https://bible.org/article/introduction-book-james James 45-49

http://www.biblicalstudies.com/bstudy/expostudy/james.htm James written around 46 AD

https://bibleview.org/en/bible/actspartone/james/ James 45-50 AD
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
It's to the saved people among the nation of Israel scattered in the world.


Saved Jews are Christians.


No, but there are saved Jews in the twelve tribes of Israel.


James is addressing the saved Jews in the nation of Israel during the time he wrote it.
That’s false commentary stuff. The term twelve tribes is always a reference to the entire nation of Israel and never to a called out group from that nation, meaning Christians. You violate every other usage. I’m not willing to do that.

There are obviously those in the audience that have not received the word and their souls are not saved.

James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
All scripture was written for us. Not all scripture is written to us.

Scripture Study Tips:

When dissecting any verse of scripture. Ask yourself, of whom, to whom, with what words, what time, where, to what intent, with what circumstances, considering what is written before and what follows any single verse context.
^^^Myles Coverdale, Bible theologian/translator^^^

James was written between 38 & 49 AD. I listed 9 sources below that ALL say written before 50 AD

James is writing to Israelites still required to observe Mosaic laws, circumcision etc. The gentile Gospel of salvation isn't found in James Epistle.
Yes, James was written before Paul’s epistles, and yet, God has supernaturally placed the book after Paul’s epistles. Why? Because that’s where it fits chronologically, after the Church Age, written to the Jews during the tribulation.
 
Nov 16, 2019
3,441
860
113
James 1:21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
Saved people are able to reject the word that is able to save them too. This is not solely an exhortation to unsaved people.

We know James is talking to saved people in the church (which is primarily Jewish at this time) by this:

"1My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism." - James 2:1

You have to remember that the nation of Israel was about the business of putting believing Jews to death. There is no way James is addressing a letter to them.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
Saved people are able to reject the word that is able to save them too. This is not solely an exhortation to unsaved people.
Saved people have already received the word and their souls are already saved, hence they’re saved.🤦‍♂️
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
We know James is talking to saved people in the church (which is primarily Jewish at this time) by this:

"1My brethren, do not hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ with an attitude of personal favoritism." - James 2:1
James is a Jew and is addressing his fellow brethren. Paul does this as well when addressing his Jewish brethren according to the flesh.

Yes, if a Jew has faith during the tribulation, they should do so without respect of persons.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,954
1,528
113
The book of James contains doctrinal truths for the Jews living in the last days of the tribulation as they will be scattered and will face all kinds of trouble.

1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.

The term twelve tribes is used all throughout Scripture, and is always a reference to the nation of Israel as a whole and never to a called out group from that nation. Genesis 49:28, Exodus 24:4, 28:21, Ezekiel 47:13. And the NT is no different: Matt 19:28, Luke 22:30, Acts 26:7, Revelation 21:12. There is no justification for taking this as anything other than an address to the twelve tribes of Israel. In order to make James a Christian epistle would mean to contradict every other usage of this term in Scripture. It is certainly not a reference to the diaspora.
When looking at the chapter (Revelation 21) that was set aside as holy for the use of the twelve tribes as gates and twelves apostles as wall of the temple. The Temple, the believers make up the city prepared as His wife. She is made up of many lively stones that does make up the spiritual house of God the church

Twelve a remnant of the 27 apostles listed. The purpose of twelve set aside is to exclusively reveal His chaste virgin bride the church in Revelation 21. Having no other purpose whatsoever. . . .as sent with the gospel ones

Twelve is a word used in parables to represent the fullness of the authority of Christ in respect to a multiple of nations .

Apostles according to the golden reed the measure of faith to represent the walls of the city prepared as his bride the church. The apostle Judas missing to represent the spirit of judgement.. . as one that falls backward

Revelation 21 King James Version (KJV)And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof. Revelation 21: 1-15


Twelve tribes as gates according to the golden measure (the measure of faith unseen eternal)They represent all the saints on the old testament side using one nation to represent all the nations. the tribe of Dan missing form the description of the bride of Christ to represent the same as Judas those who fall backward or break neck as the spirit of judgement.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
17,177
3,700
113
You have to remember that the nation of Israel was about the business of putting believing Jews to death. There is no way James is addressing a letter to them
There are no twelve tribes in the body of Christ and if James is addressing Christian Jews then he is contradicting Paul. They simply are addressing different audiences.