Refuting The Cessationism Doctrine: Spiritual Gifts, Tongues, Miracles Haven’t Ceased Since Pentecost!!

[Dave-L]

Even in such a brief diagram, you have ideas that you cannot back up with scripture, as I report there. Acts does not say that the apostles gave anyone the Holy Spirit. It certainly says nothing about the apostles giving Philip the Holy Ghost. The ones put forward to serve as the seven were supposed to be filled with the Holy Ghost before the apostles laid hands on them. It was a requirement they gave.

Also, Ananias said he was sent to Paul that he might receive his sight and be filled with the Holy Ghost. So Ananias was filled with the Holy Ghost.

To think that the apostles gave the Holy Spirit to those they laid hands on is problematic considering the statements of John the Baptist and Christ. John spoke of the One Who came after him baptizing with the Holy Spirit. Jesus spoke of the Father giving the Holy Spirit. 'Proceedeth forth from the apostles' is not in any version of the Nicene Creed, after all. The apostles were instrumental in the Samaritans receiving the Spirit and in others receiving spiritual gifts in some cases but not in all cases. But Ananias was instrumental in Saul of Tarsus being filled with the Holy Spirit.

Apostles had the Baptism. It is what verified their Apostleship.

“Truly the signs of an apostle were wrought among you in all patience, in signs, and wonders, and mighty deeds.” 2 Corinthians 12:12 (KJV 1900)

 

[G2RBeliever]

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father,and HE SHALL give you another Comforter,that He may abide with you for ever;

John 20: 22 And when He had said this He breathed on them,and saith unto them Recieve ye the Holy Ghost:

2Thessalonians 2:7 "For the mystery of INIQUITY doth already work: only He who now LETTETH will let until He be taken out of the way. "

 

[Dave-L]

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father,and HE SHALL give you another Comforter,that He may abide with you for ever;

John 20: 22 And when He had said this He breathed on them,and saith unto them Recieve ye the Holy Ghost:

2Thessalonians 2:7 "For the mystery of INIQUITY doth already work: only He who now LETTETH will let until He be taken out of the way. "

The gift of the Holy Spirit is for all believers. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit was only for the 12 Apostles and whom they laid hands on. Plus the gentiles in the outpouring in Acts 10.

 

[wolfwint]

Before 1908 I don't even know what my great grandparents names were ..
This is in Acts 2, this is the church and the church has been here ever since ..
15 For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

So you are a jew and Israel is living in peace? Otherwise you takeing verses out of the context and giving them your oen meaning.
That Peter quoted this in Acts 2, does not say that this fulfilling was compleate. Because the most jews rejectet Christ as Messajah.

 

[SpiritDove05]

Are you a jew? Is Israel living in peace? Then why you claim Joel for you?
That you speaking in tongues and have visions says nothing. People in cults do also.
Do you not wonder that since 1901 these gifts are taught in combination with the baptism of the Holy Spirit? This baptism with the Holy Spirit was not taught before in the churchhistory. Take f.e. australia. Before 1908 you will not find people there which were baptised with the Holy Spirit in combination with speaking in tongues.

bro! ur what the bible says, has been blinded by traditions of man, theres no cut off date 4 spiritual gifts are u kidding me? go read ur bible man, and joel is talking about all nations!! read acts 2:17

 

[Absolutely]

The only gifts that have ceased are the gifts listed in 1 Cor 13:8. The list has only three gifts that cease or end. All the other gifts continue and will continue.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Are you aware vs 8 showcases knowledge will vanish away?
You guys really cling to a doctrine that is not even plausable.
Oh wait...yes, knowledge ceasing describes the cessationist.
Great! You are scriptural. Knowledge has vanished from you,for vs 12 is your comprehension exam;

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

Did ANY of your teachers bother to keep reading for comprehension?

IT SAYS RIGHT THERE WHAT IS MEANT BY "THE PARTIAL SHALL BE DONE AWAY.
You could easily come out of a "knowledgeless" doctrine.
Pray before you read the bible or expose yourself to those CHANGING THE BIBLE.

Yes knowledge will/has ceased......for those in that foggy wonderland of changing their bibles.

Knowledge vanished away . How ironic.
The Holy Spirit definitely has a sense of humor.

 

[notuptome]

Are you aware vs 8 showcases knowledge will vanish away?
You guys really cling to a doctrine that is not even plausable.
Oh wait...yes, knowledge ceasing describes the cessationist.
Great! You are scriptural. Knowledge has vanished from you,for vs 12 is your comprehension exam;
12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
Did ANY of your teachers bother to keep reading for comprehension?
IT SAYS RIGHT THERE WHAT IS MEANT BY "THE PARTIAL SHALL BE DONE AWAY.
You could easily come out of a "knowledgeless" doctrine.
Pray before you read the bible or expose yourself to those CHANGING THE BIBLE.

Yes knowledge will/has ceased......for those in that foggy wonderland of changing their bibles.

Knowledge vanished away . How ironic.
The Holy Spirit definitely has a sense of humor.

I am aware that you are a drooling Pentecostal and unable to know what verse 8 is teaching because you refuse to believe it. You are an example of the seed that fell among the thorns and fails to grow to maturity. Mat 13

Your babbling will never produce knowledge. Without knowledge there is no understanding and no growth to wisdom.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[bojack]

So you are a jew and Israel is living in peace? Otherwise you takeing verses out of the context and giving them your oen meaning.
That Peter quoted this in Acts 2, does not say that this fulfilling was compleate. Because the most jews rejectet Christ as Messajah.

Ha, I am the church and I'm grafted in .. Peter defined it, right ?

 

[garee]

Only if every prophecy God ever gave was intended by Him to become Scripture. That's demonstrably false. Philip's daughters prophesied, but not a single prophecy of theirs is recorded in Scripture. Agabus was known as a prophet prior to his warning about the coming famine, so he must have prophesied reliably before that time.

God still speaks; He just isn't adding to Scripture today.

Everyone was not written down . He said to Peter if every time he performed a work of his faith and it was written down the whole world could not hold the volumes.

Only the ones he moved the hands of men as a work of His faith working in them, to both will and perform his good pleasure are recorded. .

What did Philip's daughters prophecy? Genesis, Ruth ? Samuel? To prophecy is simply to declare his revealed will.( no loop holes in sola scriptura) )

He warned us before hand .

 

[Lafftur]

The gift of the Holy Spirit is for all believers. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit was only for the 12 Apostles and whom they laid hands on. Plus the gentiles in the outpouring in Acts 10.

Yes, the Gift of the Holy Spirit is for ALL believers - just as the Gift of His Son (Yeshua/Jesus) for Salvation is for ALL believers - whosoever will believe.

We have to "RECEIVE" the Gift of Salvation in the Son by faith.
We have to "RECEIVE" the Gift of the Holy Spirit by faith.

It took faith from hearing the Word of God to RECEIVE the Gift of the Son for Salvation.
It will take faith again from hearing the Word of God to RECEIVE the Gift of the Holy Spirit for our baptism and filling with the Holy Spirit.

Just read ALL the scriptures in the Bible that mention the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost, the Spirit of Truth, the Promise of the Father.

May God bless your reading and hearing of God's Word, may you have ears to hear what the Spirit is saying and faith to believe, and a heart to receive because you love the Truth, amen.

 

[Dave-L]

Yes, the Gift of the Holy Spirit is for ALL believers - just as the Gift of His Son (Yeshua/Jesus) for Salvation is for ALL believers - whosoever will believe.

We have to "RECEIVE" the Gift of Salvation in the Son by faith.
We have to "RECEIVE" the Gift of the Holy Spirit by faith.

It took faith from hearing the Word of God to RECEIVE the Gift of the Son for Salvation.
It will take faith again from hearing the Word of God to RECEIVE the Gift of the Holy Spirit for our baptism and filling with the Holy Spirit.

Just read ALL the scriptures in the Bible that mention the Holy Spirit/Holy Ghost, the Spirit of Truth, the Promise of the Father.

May God bless your reading and hearing of God's Word, may you have ears to hear what the Spirit is saying and faith to believe, and a heart to receive because you love the Truth, amen.

Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit = you had the Holy Spirit before you could believe.

 

[Lafftur]

Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit = you had the Holy Spirit before you could believe.

No, I did NOT have the Holy Spirit indwelling me BEFORE I believed in Yeshua/Jesus as Savior.

AFTER the baptism of the Holy Spirit, He feeds me the Word of God and gives me understanding and eventually, I bear fruit - the Fruit of the Holy Spirit which is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness and temperance.

 

[garee]

This is not the teaching of scripture. The Bible does not teach that God does not give prophecies. Prophecies were given after James referred to the 'perfect law of liberty' disproving your point, and your interpretation of the word 'perfect' in this case.

I did not say God does not prophecy when men declare His word. we plant the seed prophecy he can cause new life and growth.

Words like prophet, prophecy, prophesy or prophesying from my own experience have many new meaning added which can change the outcome or intent of the author. Prophecy is simply scripture, the word of God . To prophesy is to declare the tongue or will of Gods word. . . nothing more and nothing less.

it would appear the words perfect law are used in different ways

James was not the cut off. Revelation is the last chapter of the book of prophecy the Bible or called book of the law . What we had in part up until now today we have the perfect or complete There are no laws missing by which we could know him more intimately . We walk by faith .

The perfect law that is spoken of in James would seem to indicate the works God works in us giving us his faith to believe Him not seen as a desire to do his will .

I think the "perfect law of liberty" could be called the "law of faith" which is believing Him not seen that works in us. . not our own mirror image.

But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was. But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. James 1:22-27

James 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Taking away the letter of the law (death) making it one perfect work of God .

 

[presidente]

Are you a jew? Is Israel living in peace? Then why you claim Joel for you?
That you speaking in tongues and have visions says nothing. People in cults do also.
Do you not wonder that since 1901 these gifts are taught in combination with the baptism of the Holy Spirit? This baptism with the Holy Spirit was not taught before in the churchhistory. Take f.e. australia. Before 1908 you will not find people there which were baptised with the Holy Spirit in combination with speaking in tongues.

That is not true historically since there was at least one group in the 1800s that saw things pretty much the same way and various groups of churches that spoke in tongues. There was even speaking in tongues in Methodist revivals and I read one reference among early new light baptists.

There are some references to speaking in tongue throughout history, but many more references to visions, healing, prophesying. The second century churches had prophesying in the meetings. At least some of them, since there are references to it.

 

[presidente]

The gift of the Holy Spirit is for all believers. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit was only for the 12 Apostles and whom they laid hands on. Plus the gentiles in the outpouring in Acts 10.

Oh, yeah, and Paul. Oh, and those Paul laid his hands on. Keep moving the goal post. That's the problem with trying to make a doctrine out of a set of facts in scripture without considering the other facts. You have to keep moving the goal post... except for this. Except for that. Except for the Gentiles in Cornelius' house. Except for Paul. Except for those he laid hands on.

The exceptions disprove your rule, which the Bible doesn't teach anyway. You are trying to make a rule out of some examples without considering the others, then treating the ones that don't fit your rule as exceptions when people point them out.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

The gift of the Holy Spirit is for all believers. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit was only for the 12 Apostles and whom they laid hands on. Plus the gentiles in the outpouring in Acts 10.

that is your own private belief

there is nothing in scripture to form any type of reasoning or to cause a person to conclude, that you have any grasp whatsoever on what is actually occurring in Acts or for that matter, today

we have the 2 extremes

folks like you who think the well ran dry 2000 years back

and the flip side, folks who think it's a three ring circus and anything goes

you are both wrong and need to stop what you are doing

you sound more like an agnostic than anything resembling an actual believer in Christ IMO

 

[7seasrekeyed]

No, I did NOT have the Holy Spirit indwelling me BEFORE I believed in Yeshua/Jesus as Savior.

AFTER the baptism of the Holy Spirit, He feeds me the Word of God and gives me understanding and eventually, I bear fruit - the Fruit of the Holy Spirit which is love, joy, peace, long-suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness and temperance.

seems dave here, has some quasi Calvinistic tendencies

in other threads he has expressed the erroneous teaching of Calvinists that God gives his Spirit to people before salvation in order for them to be saved

that's one of the biggest pretzels they teach. twisted twisted twisted

 

[Lafftur]

@7seasrekeyed

Just FYI - I busted out laughing when I saw your new avatar today! LOL!

You are quite funny, I love your humor!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

@7seasrekeyed

Just FYI - I busted out laughing when I saw your new avatar today! LOL!

You are quite funny, I love your humor!

thanks!

when I saw it, I had to make it mine

 

[Lafftur]

In Texas, we don't wear mask..... we wear bandannas!!! Yee-haww! lol!