Soul Sleeping? What does scripture say happens to us when we die.

[UnitedWithChrist]

By the way, I was informed by a knowledgeable dispensationalist that EW Bullinger's teachings are rejected by the vast majority of dispensationalists, and his influence is mainly limited to his followers.

Here's what he said "Traditional Dispensationalist all basically reject all the false teachings of Bullingerism . His false teaching is limited to his followers . "

 

[Deade]

Ok even after I have quoted scripture in front of your face and in purple you still refuse to agree with the scriptures I have quoted.
So with that in mind I agree to disagree with you. I don't care about your comparisons, I only care about the perfect truth of the word written in the Word of God. I can't think of a better source to do my research from other then the Bible.
I am a full blooded American and two of the books used to base the Strong's on by Mr Strong are The Thayers and the Brown-Briggs- Driver Lexicons, so I am confident with the accuracy of the research tools that I have chosen to use.

Consider this massorite, Jesus had an interim body simply for identification purposes. So His disciples would fully recognize Him. It may or may not have been fully spirit, but it seems to have gone through a closed doors (see John 20:19;26). But He was not glorified as of yet.

I believe His glorified spiritual body is composed entirely of spirit like our Heavenly Father (see John 4:24). It also will shine bright like the sun (see Rev. 1:12-17). We even have scripture that tells us we do not know how He looks now:

2 Cor. 5:16 "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more." This suggests we don't know how He looks, today.

I personally hope we don't have bodies to maintain, feed, keep warm, transport, etc. We even have scripture that we saints will shine also:

Dan. 12:2,3 "And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever." Praise His holy name!

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Consider this massorite, Jesus had an interim body simply for identification purposes. So His disciples would fully recognize Him. It may or may not have been fully spirit, but it seems to have gone through a closed doors (see John 20:19;26). But He was not glorified as of yet.

I believe His glorified spiritual body is composed entirely of spirit like our Heavenly Father (see John 4:24). It also will shine bright like the sun (see Rev. 1:12-17). We even have scripture that tells us we do not know how He looks now:

2 Cor. 5:16 "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more." This suggests we don't know how He looks, today.

I personally hope we don't have bodies to maintain, feed, keep warm, transport, etc. We even have scripture that we saints will shine also:

Dan. 12:2,3 "And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever." Praise His holy name!

You also believe man becomes God.

Anyone reading these words needs to consider this.

My understanding is that you subscribe to Herbert Armstrong's theology, and as an ex Armstrongite, I know that he rejected the bodily resurrection because he believed he was God in embryonic form. At his death, he expected to join the Godhead as a full-fledged God, in the same sense as God the Father, and Jesus Christ.

As I have said, this is a blasphemous, demonic teaching.

 

[Ahwatukee]

That is not so. The obvious attempt is to expose a false doctrine. It’s not personal. If you took it that way, I apologize.


They are not clear, my friend. In the first instance Paul states that we RATHER be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord. He is not teaching a doctrine here. The only affirmative statement is this:

“While we are at home in the body we ARE absent from the Lord”

He did not follow up with the phrase “to be absent from the body IS to be present with the Lord”.

He didn't? Well, here it is:

"Therefore we are always confident, although we know that while we are at home in the body, we are away from the Lord. 7For we walk by faith, not by sight. We are confident, then, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord.

So I'm sure that you can read the underlined above, which infers that, if you are away from the body and at home with the Lord, then there can only be one conclusion, ergo, to be present in the body is to be absent from the Lord and to be absent from the body is to be in the presence of the Lord. My point was/is that if you being away from the body equals being at home with the Lord, then you can't be sleeping in the ground, can you? Use some logic here.

Philippians supports this same idea when Paul said that he was torn between remaining in his body vs. departing and going to be with Christ, which he said was better by far. If Paul was to die and just sleep, how could that be better by far? It makes no sense. For the believer, when the body the spirit departs and goes to be in the presence of the Lord.

The other scripture in Philippians is another instance where Paul states a DESIRE. Not doctrine. He says:

“Having a DESIRE to depart and to be with Christ, which is far better”

Having the desire does not nullify what takes place at the time of death. In other words, he knows that when he dies that his spirit is going to depart and be with the Lord. These scriptures are clear in their meaning and you and others are simply circumventing them with week apologetics and resisting the truth. By saying "I desire to depart and be with Christ" is not a guess on Paul's part. The scripture shows that he is sure that his spirit will depart and be with Christ at the time of death. In other words, it not just a hopelfull dream that Paul would like to happen, but is exactly what happens and why he was torn between remaining the body or his spirit departing to be with Christ. What he was torn over is that, to depart would mean to be in the presence of Christ. But on the other hand, if he remained in the body, then it would mean more rewards for his fruitful labor and the strengthening of the faith of the Philippians.

In light of the scriptures Paul wrote in the first letter to the Thessalonians it is quite clear that we are to comfort one another with words found in the first letter to the Thessalonians because Paul was actually writing doctrinal revelation regarding those that sleep in the Lord.

That is not completely true! Paul started off regarding the resurrection of the dead in Christ, then he spoke about those who would still be alive when the resurrection took place, that they would be changed and caught up with those who had just resurrected. The spirits of those who have died in Christ will return with Him and will be reunited with their resurrect bodies. Those who are still alive at the time this event takes place, will be changed immortal and glorified and caught up with them.

I am not going to spend anymore time debating this with you, because I know the truth about it. We also have plenty of scriptures to support that the spirit is conscious aware after death, Moses and Elijah appearing with Christ when He was transfigured, the saints that are under the altar in heaven at the opening of the 5th seal, Jesus telling the thief that he would be with Him in paradise that very same day that they died and many more.

Therefore, you can continue to believe in soul-sleep, but I know the truth regarding this. Regarding 2 Cor.5:6 and Phil.1:21-23, you are basically turning a blind eye to their meaning, as they are very simple to understand. The teaching that at the time of death that the body, soul and spirit sleep in the dust in the earth is no scriptural. To believe that, one has to do away with all of the scriptures which reveal the conscious awarness of the spirit after the death of the body. The rich man and Lazarus is a good example of two men who died, yet there spirits were conscious and aware after the death of their bodies. However, since it is overwhelming proof, people turn it into a parable in order to get rid of it. And that because it destroys their soul-sleep theory.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

You also believe man becomes God.

Anyone reading these words needs to consider this.

My understanding is that you subscribe to Herbert Armstrong's theology, and as an ex Armstrongite, I know that he rejected the bodily resurrection because he believed he was God in embryonic form. At his death, he expected to join the Godhead as a full-fledged God, in the same sense as God the Father, and Jesus Christ.

As I have said, this is a blasphemous, demonic teaching.

By the way, that's why I created this thread:

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/will-glorified-believers-become-god.190806/

I used to belong to a cult that taught the demonic doctrine that man becomes God at the resurrection.

It sounds convincing at a surface level but it is the result of Scripture twisting.

I encourage everyone who holds this teaching to forsake it. It is sufficiently evil to result in ones' condemnation, I believe.

For a human to claim he will be God is blasphemous.

 

[UnoiAmarah]

Your source for the teaching you are proclaiming is not the Bible.

So is your Bible the book of life or the book of knowledge of good and evil?

..to the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them (Isaiah 8:19-20).

 

[Deade]

By the way, that's why I created this thread:

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/will-glorified-believers-become-god.190806/

I used to belong to a cult that taught the demonic doctrine that man becomes God at the resurrection.

It sounds convincing at a surface level but it is the result of Scripture twisting.

I encourage everyone who holds this teaching to forsake it. It is sufficiently evil to result in ones' condemnation, I believe.

For a human to claim he will be God is blasphemous.

Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"

So what do you think you will be like in the resurrection? Go ahead and call me blasphemous on this. Others do so on many of my teachings. To me it is still just your opinion. You seem to rely on established doctrine and many other's writings and talk down to us that don't hold to their dogma. I will pray you gain more humility and quit the cartoons like the windmill.

 

[Ahwatukee]

This is an excellent explanation, and exposes the shallow exegesis of those who teach soul-sleep.

I used to be one that held this position. It is convincing at a surface level, but a deeper exegesis exposes their errors.

It is like other teachings such as annihilationism, in that it is used by fringe Christians or cultists in an attempt to sway individuals to question other core Christian teachings.

I don't think soul sleep is a salvation issue, but the problem is that fringe groups and cultists will use it to dishearten Christians..in reality, I think Christians tend to research into the roots of the doctrines deeper and realize the problems with these teachings.

I thank God for you and others of whom He has revealed these same Biblical truths to. This willful denial of the truth is very frustrating. Once they adopt a false teaching, it seems that they are more concerned about fighting tooth and nail to protect it, even in the face of the scriptures that prove them to be wrong.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"

So what do you think you will be like in the resurrection? Go ahead and call me blasphemous on this. Others do so on many of my teachings. To me it is still just your opinion. You seem to rely on established doctrine and many other's writings and talk down to us that don't hold to their dogma. I will pray you gain more humility and quit the cartoons like the windmill.

I will be like Christ in his glorified humanity.

I will represent God in terms of exercising dominion over his new creation, under Jesus Christ and his Messiahship.

I will reflect the image of God in this manner, as Adam was created for.

I will not be spirit, like God.

By the way, Jesus was God. He has a dual nature, being both God and resurrected man.

Concerning criticizing your beliefs, claiming one will become God is a massive error. It is not a minor issue. If you ask any sound Christian what they think about someone who believes they will be just like God, in terms of being a member of the Godhead, they will tell you it is a blasphemous claim.

And, it is not a matter of humility. Some teachings define core Christianity, and no sane Christian is going to claim that they will become God.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

I thank God for you and others of whom He has revealed these same Biblical truths to. This willful denial of the truth is very frustrating. Once they adopt a false teaching, it seems that they are more concerned about fighting tooth and nail to protect it, even in the face of the scriptures that prove them to be wrong.

Thanks for your reinforcement. I used to believe in soul sleep, too...and you have hit on some of the major problems with their belief, particularly the remark about being "absent from the body" and being with the LORD.

It's obvious it's not talking about the resurrected state, because the person in the resurrected state is not "absent from the body". He has been united with the body and glorified at the resurrection.

So, it must be talking about a disembodied state between the death and the resurrection.

 

[Ahwatukee]

By the way, that's why I created this thread:

https://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/will-glorified-believers-become-god.190806/

I used to belong to a cult that taught the demonic doctrine that man becomes God at the resurrection.

It sounds convincing at a surface level but it is the result of Scripture twisting.

I encourage everyone who holds this teaching to forsake it. It is sufficiently evil to result in ones' condemnation, I believe.

For a human to claim he will be God is blasphemous.

I agree! Praise be to God that he brought you to the truth! Wanting to be God, is exactly what caused Satan's downfall. This is also a Mormon teaching. In fact there mantra is "As man is God once was and as God is man may become. What a deception!

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:"

So what do you think you will be like in the resurrection? Go ahead and call me blasphemous on this. Others do so on many of my teachings. To me it is still just your opinion. You seem to rely on established doctrine and many other's writings and talk down to us that don't hold to their dogma. I will pray you gain more humility and quit the cartoons like the windmill.

By the way, there is a reason why these doctrines have stood the test of time.

It is because they are true.

I don't drink the Koolaid of heretics anymore. These guys stumble on the scene 1900 years later and claim that they have restored the "true gospel".

By the way, it's not hard to figure out that Herbert Armstrong was a false prophet and false teacher. He made prophesies that didn't materialize. He said that Jesus would return in 1975 and he did not.

If someone prophesies and it does not come true, he is to be rejected, according to Deuteronomy 18. Funny how the cult members don't inform potential converts about these false prophesies. And, it's funny how they continue to follow the guy even after they hear about his false prophecies.

I still can't figure out why I continued with the group even after knowing about them. I was already indoctrinated by that point, and under Satan's deception, I think.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

Therefore, you can continue to believe in soul-sleep

I do not believe in “soul sleep”. I believe what the Bible says. We will all sleep in the Lord one day. How that happens and all the hidden things specific to it I leave to the Lord. I don’t try to meddle with the hidden things of scripture. And I definitely will not seek to a man regarding hidden things in scripture.

How can it be possible to go before those that sleep in the Lord IF THEY ARE ALREADY WITH THE LORD? (1 Thessalonians 4:14-15).

If you use common sense you will have no problem with the expressions that include desires and preferences.

If I tell you, I desire to be in heaven which is far better, I haven’t taught you anything. I made a statement of desire.

If I tell you, I’m confident that we would rather be absent from our bodies and to be present with the Lord, I haven’t taught you anything. I simply expressed an obvious thing that we would rather have.

Show me the scripture that says that we will go to be with the Lord immediately upon dying without the words expressing “will rather” and “I desire”.

 

[Micaiah-imla]

I don't drink the Koolaid of heretics anymore.

I drink the pure water of the word. You, sir, are the one drinking koolaid. You’re just arguing what flavor is better at this point.

 

[massorite]

Consider this massorite, Jesus had an interim body simply for identification purposes. So His disciples would fully recognize Him. It may or may not have been fully spirit, but it seems to have gone through a closed doors (see John 20:19;26). But He was not glorified as of yet.

I believe His glorified spiritual body is composed entirely of spirit like our Heavenly Father (see John 4:24). It also will shine bright like the sun (see Rev. 1:12-17). We even have scripture that tells us we do not know how He looks now:

2 Cor. 5:16 "Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more." This suggests we don't know how He looks, today.

I personally hope we don't have bodies to maintain, feed, keep warm, transport, etc. We even have scripture that we saints will shine also:

Dan. 12:2,3 "And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever." Praise His holy name!

Correct. John 4:24 does say that God is a spirit which is a bit confusing to me because scripture also says that we were made in the image of God and there is scripture that says that God has hands, a face and back parts
Exo 33:22 And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by:
Exo 33:23 And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen. So we know that God has a hand and a face and back parts. LOL I.E. a butt.
And Rev. 1:12-17 says that the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. So Christ has a body of some sort that can wear a garment, golden girdle, has feet and paps/chest.
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
But if God according to the scripture I just quoted had a spiritual body it would be a recignizable spiritual body not made of a corruptible body of flesh and blood/natural body. It would be an immortal spiritual body.
I looked up the word "know" in 2 Cor 5:16 and according to the Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon the word "know" is talking about "knowing as in knowing a thing" so it os my interpretation that the verse ia talking about how they knew Christ as a personand the Gospel He preached while He was here upon the earth but they no long know Him because He is gone to heaven and is no longer here on earth.
I personally hope we don't have bodies to maintain, feed, keep warm, transport, etc. We even have scripture that we saints will shine also:
My point exactly. Christ only ate the piece of fish to show that He could. That doesn't mean that His body needed food or water to live and a spiritual body wouldn't need any substance to survive because it would not be flesh and blood.
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
1Co 15:43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
1Co 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
The idea of an interim body is an interesting concept. Christ dies tell Mary Mag not to touch Him because He had not ascended up to the Father yet.
John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
This was the day Christ was raised from the grave but later after Mary Mag, Christ offered for Thomas to reach out and touch His wounds. Could it be that Christ ascended up to heaven between Mary Mag and the hiding disciples??? I don't think Scripture offers an answer for that question. Its puzzling to me.

 

[massorite]

I encourage Christians to study the bodily resurrection from sound sources of information, reviewing the biblical references they provide, and ask yourself whether there is continuity between the body prior to the resurrection and after the resurrection.

Also, read 1 Corinthians 15 and Romans 8 in this regard.

The body has been changed, but it is the same body. The comparison is between the seed and the plant, and Paul uses this comparison himself in 1 Corinthians 15.

It is glaringly clear, yet this guy rejects the bodily resurrection. And, this is an issue because God redeems his creation. Man's body is a part of his creation, and it will be redeemed as Romans 8 says.

He does the same thing with regards to the new heavens and new earth. There is a continuity between the old earth and the new earth, but at the same time, it has been transformed.

My guess is that he holds some kind of unusual belief that would be threatened if the bodily resurrection is true. That is generally why people hold on to error....it threatens some larger worldview issue that they have accepted.

The body has been changed, but it is the same body. The comparison is between the seed and the plant, and Paul uses this comparison himself in 1 Corinthians 15.
LOL How can a body be changed but still be the same???
The comparison is between the seed and the plant, and Paul uses this comparison himself in 1 Corinthians 15.
Joh 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
I believe John 12:24 is a good example of scripture to which you are implying.
But the problem is that when a seed is planted and dies it raises looking totally different then it looked like when was planted and died.
Its not just a tiny little seed anymore. It has been changed into a broadleaf plant that is green and produces many more little yellow seeds. and the composition of a kernel of corn is different then the corn stock
A kernel of corn is primarily composed of starch, at 62%. The corn kernel is also composed of protein and fiber (19%), water (15%), and oil (4%).
Chemical content of a corn stalk contains cellulose (35-50%), lignin (5-34%) and petosan around 20-41%. %.
So your interpretation of 1 Cor chapter 15 is off base. In the case of Christ His body looked the same but it was no where close to the same composition body He died with. It was changed into a Glroified/spiritual body.
1Co 15:38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
So the body given to the seed is not the same composition as the seed after the seed dies in the soil and transforms into a plant.

 

[massorite]

You also believe man becomes God.

Anyone reading these words needs to consider this.

My understanding is that you subscribe to Herbert Armstrong's theology, and as an ex Armstrongite, I know that he rejected the bodily resurrection because he believed he was God in embryonic form. At his death, he expected to join the Godhead as a full-fledged God, in the same sense as God the Father, and Jesus Christ.

As I have said, this is a blasphemous, demonic teaching.

Where are you coming up with all of this stuff??? I don't know who Herbert Armstrong is and I have never said that I believe that man becomes God. You are for what ever reason putting words in my mouth and that is the manipulating work of Satan. Scripture calls that kind of stuff "Witchcraft".

 

[Deade]

Correct. John 4:24 does say that God is a spirit which is a bit confusing to me because scripture also says that we were made in the image of God and there is scripture that says that God has hands, a face and back parts

Well yes a spirit can and does have a countenance (looks) although invisible to us unless they show themselves. They might take on flesh to do that just like on the plains of Mamre and ate & drank with Abraham (two angels and the pre-incarnate Jesus). I think Jesus normally looks more like He did on top of Mt. Horeb. We just don't know, yet. We know it wasn't the Father, no man has seen Him.

This was the day Christ was raised from the grave but later after Mary Mag, Christ offered for Thomas to reach out and touch His wounds. Could it be that Christ ascended up to heaven between Mary Mag and the hiding disciples??? I don't think Scripture offers an answer for that question. Its puzzling to me.

Here is my take on that: You argue the resurrection was on a Sunday, but it was actually on a Saturday evening. Christ was buried just before sundown: and 3 days/3 nights add up to a sundown resurrection. Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday. The Romans said it was Friday because of the sundown Sabbath was approaching. But it says in John 19:14 it was the preparation day (crucifixion day) which is the day before the annual Sabbath of the First Day of Unleavened Bread. Ask any Jew what the preparation day is. An annual Sabbath is called a high day.

John 19:31: "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away." The High Day was the 15 of Nissan, the day after Passover.

John 20:1: "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre."

Three days and three nights raises Him on Saturday evening. He had already risen unseen by early Sunday. Jesus was talking with Mary saying he had not ascended to His Father yet:

John 20:16-18: "Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her."

John 20:19: "Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you."

Later that same day He appeared to His disciples and they could touch Him. That is when He told Thomas to touch His wounds and then He ate with them. So, we can say for sure the ascension was on Sunday. We are given a picture of His ascension as the wave sheaf day: [look up wave sheaf day for yourself] when the first fruits were waved before God as a tribute. This was always done on the first Sunday after Passover. Christ the first fruits.

 

[massorite]

Well yes a spirit can and does have a countenance (looks) although invisible to us unless they show themselves. They might take on flesh to do that just like on the plains of Mamre and ate & drank with Abraham (two angels and the pre-incarnate Jesus). I think Jesus normally looks more like He did on top of Mt. Horeb. We just don't know, yet. We know it wasn't the Father, no man has seen Him.



Here is my take on that: You argue the resurrection was on a Sunday, but it was actually on a Saturday evening. Christ was buried just before sundown: and 3 days/3 nights add up to a sundown resurrection. Jesus was crucified on a Wednesday. The Romans said it was Friday because of the sundown Sabbath was approaching. But it says in John 19:14 it was the preparation day (crucifixion day) which is the day before the annual Sabbath of the First Day of Unleavened Bread. Ask any Jew what the preparation day is. An annual Sabbath is called a high day.

John 19:31: "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away." The High Day was the 15 of Nissan, the day after Passover.

John 20:1: "The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre."

Three days and three nights raises Him on Saturday evening. He had already risen unseen by early Sunday. Jesus was talking with Mary saying he had not ascended to His Father yet:

John 20:16-18: "Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master. Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her."

John 20:19: "Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you."

Later that same day He appeared to His disciples and they could touch Him. That is when He told Thomas to touch His wounds and then He ate with them. So, we can say for sure the ascension was on Sunday. We are given a picture of His ascension as the wave sheaf day: [look up wave sheaf day for yourself] when the first fruits were waved before God as a tribute. This was always done on the first Sunday after Passover. Christ the first fruits.

No I don't argue the day was Sunday and as you can see the word "Sunday" is not written anywhere in my post. I happen to believe that the true Sabbath is Saturday but it was changed when the Catholic Church allowed pagan ritual to inter into the church and Constantine helped to make that change. PleaseTry not to put words into my mouth

 

[Deade]

No I don't argue the day was Sunday and as you can see the word "Sunday" is not written anywhere in my post. I happen to believe that the true Sabbath is Saturday but it was changed when the Catholic Church allowed pagan ritual to inter into the church and Constantine helped to make that change. PleaseTry not to put words into my mouth

All the words after the bolded "Here is my take on that: " were transcribed from my article. So, I really didn't address the post to you from then on. I am sorry, if you got that inference.