Not By Works

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Nov 16, 2019
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Those who believe in Him will not perish and will receive eternal life.
Those who do not believe in Him will perish and not receive eternal life.

There. I fixed it for you and the Roman Catholic church. :)
Yes, those who stopped believing are among those who do not believe. That's self evident.
I've been meaning to ask you to post the Catholic version of 1 John 3:18.
Let's see if they are as honest in translating that verse as they are with vs. 16.
I'm very curious.
 

John146

Senior Member
Jan 13, 2016
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What elements is Peter talking about, the periodic table or the weak and beggarly elements of Galatians 4:9.

Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?

The kingdom of heaven was taken from the Jews and given to another nation. Is that a new kingdom of heaven?

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

It certainly can't be literal elements or the literal earth in your view either because the milennial reign takes place right after all these things are destroyed.
Did the heavens pass away or do you not take that literally? Did the earth burn up? This occurs right after the millennium. It’s all part of His second coming.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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Reba1

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14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.
does save the sick equal heal the sick
 
Nov 16, 2019
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The Bible tells us to hold fast to the gospel because not everyone does hold fast and instead believes in vain - without cause or without effect, to no purpose. Those who profess to have believed, but no longer believe never truly believed in the first place (belief was never firmly rooted and established) or else they would have continued to believe.
Why would someone exhort an unbeliever to hold fast to something they have never held fast to to begin with, and worse can't hold on to because God did not create them to hold on to it?
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Then why do you continue to ignore the bad behavior and criticize those who point it out for what it is?
We're to do that, as God tells us to do.
And look, truly, I've lived long enough to know that no adult comports themselves in the manner the most aggregious display. Posting style being what it is, we can presume the behavior is that of kids either skipping school, having dropped out, or are linking in on their computer when they're in school. Because those same offenders are rarely as active on weekends. And yet while school is in session there they are. And no, it doesn't line up with a work schedule because in today's world, especially America, many companies monitor employees on-line activity if their computers can access the full Net at all.
Therefore, they are forgiven, and have been every time they've taken a shot at me.
My posts point out the ridiculous repeated bad behavior of those offenders when they think they're covering what they don't have to share , and don't know as pertains to scripture, with vulgar remarks and personal attacks. And the absurd, "Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!" That's not an adult! Picture the behaviors in the off-line world and that member speaking that way to someone face to face. Not likely to happen. Lord knows, at least I'd hope not.


My dear lady, you misspeak the truth of the matter as anyone on the receiving end of the truth of what I described will attest. It isn't a judgment, it is an observation. The judgment you refer to is found in the scripture I posted.

Why do you defend or turn a blind eye to the offenders? And choose to jump on those they think to take great joy in offending?
You're not blind. You seem intelligent. Why do you miss the log in their eye so as to put the log in mine?

And certainly, I don't have to point it out any further. The evidence will show itself soon enough. :)
I am pretty sure @dcontroversal is not skipping school.:D

That right there demonstrates how poor your assessment is.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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I am pretty sure @dcontroversal is not skipping school.:D

That right there demonstrates how poor your assessment is.
She, like many before her have a vendetta and a score to settle.....many of them have gone bye bye..........all she has is mouth.....no actual input that has value.......exactly why it is a waste of time to engage her.......
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
Yes, those who stopped believing are among those who do not believe. That's self evident.
I've been meaning to ask you to post the Catholic version of 1 John 3:18.
Let's see if they are as honest in translating that verse as they are with vs. 16.
I'm very curious.
Asking for honesty....

Isn't it ironic don't ya think
It's a free ride when you think you can pay
It's like the good advice you just didn't take ...
 
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EleventhHour

Guest
She, like many before her have a vendetta and a score to settle.....many of them have gone bye bye..........all she has is mouth.....no actual input that has value.......exactly why it is a waste of time to engage her.......
Yes waste of time, agree
It just feeds the vindictive trolling behaviour.
 
Nov 23, 2013
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Did the heavens pass away or do you not take that literally? Did the earth burn up? This occurs right after the millennium. It’s all part of His second coming.
Let me see if I'm understanding you right. Jesus returns to earth to sit on the throne of David for 1000 years. Then after the 1000 years, the great tribulation starts. Then Jesus returns for the second coming. Is this how you believe?
 
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Reba1

Guest
So the prayers of the elders can save a man’s soul?
I never said anything close to that try again. What does the scripture say?

Jas 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
Jas 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

That verse does not say prayer of faith shall heal the sick., does it ? Maybe another translation ? Why is it written the way it is. Any one have thoughts or ideas on this point ? I am going to do some reading and see what i can find. Every so often when reading His Word something i have read often over the years just reads a bit different to me.
 
Nov 16, 2019
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Abiding in what we have heard from the beginning is the mark of genuine conversion.
Here is the literal translation.
Nothing here about always abiding because you are a true believer.

24Ye, then, that which ye heard from the beginning, in you let it remain; if in you may remain that which from the beginning ye did hear, ye also in the Son and in the Father shall remain" - 1 John 2:24

It plainly says the condition for remaining in the Son and the Father is that you let remain in you what you heard in the beginning. Nothing there about it remaining in you because you are a real believer. It really is prescriptive, not descriptive as osas claims it is.


1 John 2:19 is really a key verse, "They went out from us, they were not really of us. If they had been of us they would have...what?...would have remained with us." True Christians then are identified by abiding.
The Galatians were true believers, yet they did not continue in Christ. That means 1 John 2:19 does not mean what osas says it means. And please don't use another 'not really' osas argument and say the Galatians didn't really believe, or that they didn't really fall away. The letter plainly says they really did believe, and that they fell away.

"1 In the freedom, then, with which Christ did make you free" - Galatians 5:1

4 ye were freed from the Christ, ye who in law are declared righteous; from the grace ye fell away" - Galatians 5:4
 
Nov 16, 2019
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I never said anything close to that try again. What does the scripture say?

Jas 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
Jas 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.

That verse does not say prayer of faith shall heal the sick., does it ? Maybe another translation ? Why is it written the way it is. Any one have thoughts or ideas on this point ? I am going to do some reading and see what i can find. Every so often when reading His Word something i have read often over the years just reads a bit different to me.
Here is the literal translation:

"14 is any infirm among you? let him call for the elders of the assembly, and let them pray over him, having anointed him with oil, in the name of the Lord, 15 and the prayer of the faith shall save the distressed one, and the Lord shall raise him up, and if sins he may have committed, they shall be forgiven to him. 16 Be confessing to one another the trespasses, and be praying for one another, that ye may be healed" - James 5:14-16 YLT
 
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Reba1

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Amplified 13Is anyone among you suffering? He must pray. Is anyone joyful? He is to sing praises [to God]. 14Is anyone among you sick? He must call for the elders (spiritual leaders) of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord; 15and the prayer of faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up; and if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. 16Therefore, confess your sins to one another [your false steps, your offenses], and pray for one another, that you may be healed and restored. The heartfelt and persistent prayer of a righteous man (believer) can accomplish much [when put into action and made effective by God—it is dynamic and can have tremendous power]. 1

Geneva with notes
5:14 9 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with g oil in the h name of the Lord:
9 He shows peculiarly, to what physicians especially we must go when we are diseased, that is, to the prayers of the elders, which then also could cure the body, (for so much as the gift of healing was then in force) and take away the main cause of sickness and diseases, by obtaining healing for the sick through their prayers and exhortations.​
(g) This was a sign of the gift of healing: and now seeing we have the gift no more, the sign is no longer necessary.​
(h) By calling on the name of the Lord.​
5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed i sins, they shall be forgiven him.
(i) He has reason in making mention of sins, for diseases are often sent because of sins.​
NIV
13 Is anyone among you in trouble? Let them pray. Is anyone happy? Let them sing songs of praise.

14 Is anyone among you sick? Let them call the elders of the church to pray over them and anoint them with oil in the name of the Lord.

15 And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise them up. If they have sinned, they will be forgiven.

NIV​
 
Nov 16, 2019
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Did the heavens pass away or do you not take that literally? Did the earth burn up?
Jesus said the 'all has been accomplished' part is what had to be fulfilled between when he was speaking and the end of heaven and earth in order for even so much as a jot or a tittle to be dropped from the law. That's how we know the 'all has been accomplished' part has been done. Because much more than just a jot and a tittle has passed from the law (animal sacrifice for sin, for example).