Not By Works
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EleventhHour
Guest
No. And it is Sinning Willfully not Sin willfully. Sin is in the present tense and is plural. It would be state of being. Who someone is. A person that is not living through Christ. The Word, Christ in the heart and mouth. God's Laws in their hearts, and in their minds. For God has said, "I will live in them and walk them. I will work in them both to will and do My good pleasure.
Context? Yes I know. That is what has been laid out in the posts you have been responding to.
Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. For if we (the assembling of ourselves, the Sanctified) are sinning wilfully (trampling underfoot the Son Of GOD) after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins ( the blood of the covenant wherewith he, the willful sinner was sanctified) , But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God (the Sacrifice for sins), and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
(Heb 10:26-29)
The gift aspect of eternal life and the security of said giftContext.
Now what is it about John 3:16 that isn’t good enough for you?
You were stating Hebrews 10:26 was misunderstood in the posts you have been responding to, Not John 3:16. So Prove it please.Context.
Now what is it about John 3:16 that isn’t good enough for you?
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EleventhHour
Guest
I would like to see what you put together. Quote me when you post it.
Absolutely!!
It’s regarding people who have been taught about Jesus and refuse to believe in Him.
John 5.24 refutes your theological views that Christians come under judgment.
Focus my friend. Hebrews 10:26-29. Prove what was posted wrong within the context of the passages. After that we can move to John if you wish. Tis my favorite Gospel.
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EleventhHour
Guest
Okay I have just had an even better grasp of this verse...
This is my last time discussing this with you but I think my understanding refutes your loose salvation dogma.
Would you agree that under the Levitical system there two types of sin those done in ignorance and presumptive sin?
Numbers 15:26
In regards to Hebrews 10:26, To "sin willfully" in the Greek carries the idea of deliberate intention that is habitual, which stems from rejecting Christ deliberately. This is continuous action, a matter of practice. Now we don't walk along our daily life and "accidentally" fall into a pit called sin. We exercise our will but, the use of the participle clearly shows ongoing, willful, habitual action. The unrighteous practice sin (1 Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21); not the righteous, who are born of God (1 Corinthians 6:11; 1 John 3:9). *Hermeneutics.
If the word 'sanctified' in Hebrews 10:29 is used to describe saved people who lost their salvation as eternal IN-securists teach, then we have a contradiction because the writer of Hebrews in verse 10 said "sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and in verse 14, we read, "perfected for all time those who are sanctified." (Hebrews 10:14) I've heard eternal IN-securists try to get around the truth here by either saying forever doesn't really mean forever or "once for all and for all time" ONLY applies to "the offering of the body of Jesus Christ," but not to the person who is sanctified. *Yet in Hebrews 10:10, we clearly read ..WE have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. In Hebrews 10:14, we read - For by one offering He has perfected for all time THOSE who are sanctified. To go from sanctified back to un-sanctified would be in contradiction here.
*NOWHERE in the context does it specifically say the person who "trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant" was "saved" and/or "lost their salvation." The reference to "the blood of the covenant that sanctified him" in verse 29 "on the surface" appears to be referring to a Christian, but this overlooks the fact that the word translated "sanctified" (which is the verb form of the adjective "holy") which means "set apart," and doesn't necessarily refer to salvation.
Strong's Concordance
hagiazó: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Original Word: ἁγιάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: hagiazó
Phonetic Spelling: (hag-ee-ad'-zo)
Definition: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Usage: I make holy, treat as holy, set apart as holy, sanctify, hallow, purify.
*In 1 Corinthians 7:14, Paul uses it to specifically refer to non-Christians who are "sanctified" or "set apart" by their believing spouse. (And by this Paul does not mean that they are saved). A non-Christian can be "set apart" from other non-Christians without experiencing salvation as Paul explained. So the word "sanctified" means to be "set apart." If the word "sanctified" simply meant saved, then you would have to say that the seventh day was saved (Genesis 2:3), the tabernacle was saved (Exodus 29:43), Moses saved the people after coming down off the mountain (Exodus 19:14), the priests and the Levites saved themselves (1 Chronicles 15:14), the Father saved the Son (John 10:36), the Son saved Himself (John 17:19) and many other things that do not line up with scripture.
In verse 39, the writer of Hebrews sets up the CONTRAST that makes it clear to me that he was referring to make believers/nominal Christians, not saved people: But WE are not of those who draw back to perdition, but OF THOSE who believe to the saving of the soul. Those who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul and those who believe to the saving of the soul do not draw back to perdition.
So after considering the CONTEXT, it seems most likely that "he was sanctified" should be understood in the sense of someone who had been "set apart" or identified as a professing believer in the Christian community of Hebrew believers, but later renounces his identification with other believers, by rejecting the "knowledge of the truth" that he had received, and trampling under foot the work and the person of Christ himself. This gives evidence that his identification with the Hebrew Christian community of believers was only superficial and that he was not a genuine believer.
If the word 'sanctified' in Hebrews 10:29 is used to describe saved people who lost their salvation as eternal IN-securists teach, then we have a contradiction because the writer of Hebrews in verse 10 said "sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all" (Hebrews 10:10) and in verse 14, we read, "perfected for all time those who are sanctified." (Hebrews 10:14) I've heard eternal IN-securists try to get around the truth here by either saying forever doesn't really mean forever or "once for all and for all time" ONLY applies to "the offering of the body of Jesus Christ," but not to the person who is sanctified. *Yet in Hebrews 10:10, we clearly read ..WE have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. In Hebrews 10:14, we read - For by one offering He has perfected for all time THOSE who are sanctified. To go from sanctified back to un-sanctified would be in contradiction here.
*NOWHERE in the context does it specifically say the person who "trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant" was "saved" and/or "lost their salvation." The reference to "the blood of the covenant that sanctified him" in verse 29 "on the surface" appears to be referring to a Christian, but this overlooks the fact that the word translated "sanctified" (which is the verb form of the adjective "holy") which means "set apart," and doesn't necessarily refer to salvation.
Strong's Concordance
hagiazó: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Original Word: ἁγιάζω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: hagiazó
Phonetic Spelling: (hag-ee-ad'-zo)
Definition: to make holy, consecrate, sanctify
Usage: I make holy, treat as holy, set apart as holy, sanctify, hallow, purify.
*In 1 Corinthians 7:14, Paul uses it to specifically refer to non-Christians who are "sanctified" or "set apart" by their believing spouse. (And by this Paul does not mean that they are saved). A non-Christian can be "set apart" from other non-Christians without experiencing salvation as Paul explained. So the word "sanctified" means to be "set apart." If the word "sanctified" simply meant saved, then you would have to say that the seventh day was saved (Genesis 2:3), the tabernacle was saved (Exodus 29:43), Moses saved the people after coming down off the mountain (Exodus 19:14), the priests and the Levites saved themselves (1 Chronicles 15:14), the Father saved the Son (John 10:36), the Son saved Himself (John 17:19) and many other things that do not line up with scripture.
In verse 39, the writer of Hebrews sets up the CONTRAST that makes it clear to me that he was referring to make believers/nominal Christians, not saved people: But WE are not of those who draw back to perdition, but OF THOSE who believe to the saving of the soul. Those who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul and those who believe to the saving of the soul do not draw back to perdition.
So after considering the CONTEXT, it seems most likely that "he was sanctified" should be understood in the sense of someone who had been "set apart" or identified as a professing believer in the Christian community of Hebrew believers, but later renounces his identification with other believers, by rejecting the "knowledge of the truth" that he had received, and trampling under foot the work and the person of Christ himself. This gives evidence that his identification with the Hebrew Christian community of believers was only superficial and that he was not a genuine believer.
Only if the sinful aspects are bold, unabashed, and unrestrained, like in an unbeliever who doesn't care about God and salvation and has no compelling force of righteousness buffeting him inside. You know, the lifestyle and attitude of wanton sin that characterizes the unbeliever, not the believer.
This fellow you described, he may have works of service but it sounds like he lacks works of obedience.
I kept myself from going there before, but in truth, works of service aren't really what we're talking about when describing the works of the true saved person. We're really talking about works of obedience (and of course, the fruit of the Spirit). Those more accurately characterize the life of the true believer and distinguish him from the unsaved unbeliever.
Being in the ministry I'm sure you know I'm referring to the 'obedience is better than sacrifice' thing talked about in the Bible.
In Matthew 7:21-23 & Luke 13:23-27 we see people trying to persuade Jesus to accept them at his coming based on the abundance of their ministry service and their association with Jesus and his people, but Jesus rejects them on the basis of their lack of obedience.
My security is in the perfect ministry of Christ and His sacrifice.
That's why I keep trusting in it.
And let me clarify, I'm not saying the least infraction puts the believer back under the wrath of God. Returning to unbelief does that. And even then, only after God turns you over to your unbelief because you have refused all opportunities to come back.
As long as the believer continues in the believing he started out in he remains in the security of Christ's salvation where nothing can touch him.
You have to stay on point.
That was not the argument being made.
I showed you from Galatians that the Jews do not have to keep the law of Moses for justification any more than the gentiles do. No different kingdom and gospel for them.
What did James say exactly at the conclusion of the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15? He was the head of the Jerusalem HQ by then.
19 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:
You are injecting your own version by insisting that Jews are also excused from the Law of Moses. It is not in scripture. Acts 21:20-25 confirmed the difference between Jews and Gentiles when it comes to obeying the Law.
No you did not. What you did was made the comment, " It’s regarding people who have been taught about Jesus and refuse to believe in Him." without proving it within the context of the passage.
It is not just a people that have been taught about Jesus and refuse to believe in Him. Hebrews 10:26 is about those who are experiencing salvation and then they throw it all away, Sinning willfully, trodding underfoot the Son of GOD, doing despite unto the Spirit of Grace which they have been Given.
Starting in verse 10. Here look please.
By the which will we are sanctified (Hebrews 9:12-14 A purged conscience, sanctified to the purifying of the flesh (vs 9:13) from dead works, a purged conscience, the inner man renewed (vs 9:14), the taking away of sin (10:4) to serve the Living God) through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins, : But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. Whereof (to this perfectedness) the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before, This is the covenant (perfectedness of them that are sanctified) that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
(Heb 10:4-16 KJV)
WE are sanctified. For by one offering he hath PERFECTED them (the WE) that are SANCTIFIED. How are WE that are SANCTIFIED PERFECTED? To this (whereof) the Holy Ghost also is a witness to US. HE saith, This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them.
Having therefore, brethren (the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED), boldness into the entrance into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us (the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) , through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; And having an high priest over the house of God (the Body of Christ, the Temple of God through the veil that is His flesh); Let us (the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience (the taking away of sin), and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us (the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised. And let us (the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of OURSELVES (the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. For if we ( OURSELVES, the BRETHREN, the WE, them whom have been PERFECTED and SANCTIFIED) are sinning wilfully (Not a single act but a state of being, who we are) after that we have received the knowledge of the truth ( A purged conscience, sanctified to the purifying of the flesh (vs 9:13) from dead works, a purged conscience, the inner man renewed (vs 9:14), the taking away of sin (10:4) to serve the Living God, Perfected, Gods Laws in the Heart and mind through Christ), there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? (which the been given)
(Heb 10:19-29)