Not By Works
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This is shocking....sounds almost cultic
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NOT HARDLY, that is a False teaching. Obedience NEVER has been part of SALVATION; however IT IS PART OF OUR AGAPE LOVE, where we LOVE HIM and the Brethren.
HERE IS WHAT WE BELIEVE:
Hebrews 4:15-16 (ESV)
15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin.
16 Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need.
Hebrews 12:2 (ESV)
2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.
2 Timothy 1:9 (HCSB)
9 He has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace, which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began.
Titus 3:5-7 (HCSB)
5 He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
6 He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.
Romans 4:4-5 (NET)
4 Now to the one who works, his pay is not credited due to grace but due to obligation.
5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in the one who declares the ungodly righteous, his faith is credited as righteousness.
Ephesians 2:4-5 (HCSB)
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love that He had for us,
5 made us alive with the Messiah even though we were dead in trespasses. You are saved by grace!
Ephesians 2:8-9 (NJB)
8 Because it is by grace that you have been saved, through faith; not by anything of your own, but by a gift from God;
9 not by anything that you have done, so that nobody can claim the credit.
Romans 5:8-11 (HCSB)
8 But God proves His own love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us!
9 Much more then, since we have now been declared righteous by His blood, we will be saved through Him from wrath.
10 For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, ⌊then how⌋ much more, having been reconciled, will we be saved by His life!
11 And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ. We have now received this reconciliation through Him.
1 Peter 1:3-5 (HCSB)
3 Praise the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. According to His great mercy, He has given us a new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead
4 and into an inheritance that is imperishable, uncorrupted, and unfading, kept in heaven for you.
5 You are being protected by God’s power through faith for a salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.
Romans 11:6 (NASB)
6 But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works, otherwise grace is no longer grace.
Philippians 1:6 (HCSB)
6 I am sure of this, that He who started a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
2 Corinthians 3:5 (HCSB)
5 ⌊It is⌋ not that we are competent in ourselves to consider anything as coming from ourselves, but our competence is from God.
Philippians 2:13 (HCSB)
13 For it is God who is working in you, ⌊enabling you⌋ both to desire and to work out His good purpose.
Ephesians 1:11-14 (HCSB)
11 We have also received an inheritance in Him, predestined according to the purpose of the One who works out everything in agreement with the decision of His will,
12 so that we who had already put our hope in the Messiah might bring praise to His glory.
13 When you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and when you believed in Him [Long before you can do your first work, so Obedience is Part of your Agape Love, that you do after you are SAVED.], you were also sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.
14 He is the down payment of our inheritance, for the redemption of the possession, to the praise of His glory.
2 Timothy 2:19 (ESV)
19 But God’s firm foundation stands, bearing this seal: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity.”
John 10:27-28 (HCSB)
27 My sheep hear My voice, I know them, and they follow Me.
28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish—ever! No one will snatch them out of My hand.
2 John 1:2 (HCSB)
2 because of the truth that remains in us and will be with us forever.
🕆
We teach that Obedience has NEVER been part of Salvation, HOWEVER, Obedience is part of Our AGAPE LOVE, Rom. 5:5.
John 14:15 (HCSB)
15 “If you love Me [Born Again], you will keep My commands.
1 John 5:3 (HCSB)
3 For this is what love for God is: to keep His commands. Now His commands are not a burden,
Only Obedience that is done out of Agape LOVE, is accepted by GOD. It has NOTHING to do with SALVATION or maintaining it.
1 John 3:14-19 (HCSB)
14 We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers. The one who does not love remains in death.
15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him.
16 This is how we have come to know love: He laid down His life for us. We should also lay down our lives for our brothers.
17 If anyone has this world’s goods and sees his brother in need but closes his eyes to his ⌊need⌋—how can God’s love reside in him?
18 Little children, we must not love with word or speech, but with truth and action.
19 This is how we will know we belong to the truth and will convince our conscience in His presence,
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the book of James was written before the events in acts 21
so instead of your Long convoluted argument, why not a simpler one, James was addressing the jews as the first verse of James indicated, he believed that Jews needed to keep the law to be saved.
however his views in acts 15 and 21 indicated clearly that he believed gentiles who believed are exempted from the law
there is a special reason why the holy spirit place the book of James after Paul letters even though it was written before them. That book of James is doctrine during the tribulation
so instead of your Long convoluted argument, why not a simpler one, James was addressing the jews as the first verse of James indicated, he believed that Jews needed to keep the law to be saved.
however his views in acts 15 and 21 indicated clearly that he believed gentiles who believed are exempted from the law
there is a special reason why the holy spirit place the book of James after Paul letters even though it was written before them. That book of James is doctrine during the tribulation
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15“We who are Jews by birth and not sinful Gentiles 16know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in d Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
17“But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker.
19“For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!” - Galatians 2:15-21
See? There is no different message for the Jews than for the gentiles. Both are dead to the law.
I think the problem is you don't know what 'dead to the law' means.
17“But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker.
19“For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 21I do not set aside the grace of God, for if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!” - Galatians 2:15-21
See? There is no different message for the Jews than for the gentiles. Both are dead to the law.
I think the problem is you don't know what 'dead to the law' means.
v
Agree.. it is the only way to see that salvation is secure, by reading correctly they are saved.
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He is more speaking of no works that he is works, Or living faith which saves vs dead faith which has no power to save let alone do anything else
his audience were people who were hearers of the word and not doers, they came to church and some of them seemed like leaders. It they did not act like christians, they showed partiality to people of wealth and people who had, and the people who were poor they should have been loving they hid in the back as if they were a disease.
his focus is on testing your faith, as everything else in the first two chapters seemed to be.
if you (personally) claim to have faith, but have NO works, can your claimed faith save you.
people claim to have faith or claim to have things all the time, it does not make it true. If you search yourself and you find you show no signs your a believer, because their is no change, there is no sign you love there is no sign of true living faith in God, considering how if we are saved we are new creatures, their should be sign of changed, and we see should no longer be hearers only (not saying we should be perfect. But something should have changed) then we should question our faith our motives, our own decision, do we have real faith, or was it dead.
can a dead faith. No
people like legalists and John here want us to think James is saving we must continue in faith or we lose salvation. t no time in james words did he claim or even insinuate this is true,
he is speaking to hearers not doers. Not one time doers and now not doers (once saved now lost)
his audience were people who were hearers of the word and not doers, they came to church and some of them seemed like leaders. It they did not act like christians, they showed partiality to people of wealth and people who had, and the people who were poor they should have been loving they hid in the back as if they were a disease.
his focus is on testing your faith, as everything else in the first two chapters seemed to be.
if you (personally) claim to have faith, but have NO works, can your claimed faith save you.
people claim to have faith or claim to have things all the time, it does not make it true. If you search yourself and you find you show no signs your a believer, because their is no change, there is no sign you love there is no sign of true living faith in God, considering how if we are saved we are new creatures, their should be sign of changed, and we see should no longer be hearers only (not saying we should be perfect. But something should have changed) then we should question our faith our motives, our own decision, do we have real faith, or was it dead.
can a dead faith. No
people like legalists and John here want us to think James is saving we must continue in faith or we lose salvation. t no time in james words did he claim or even insinuate this is true,
he is speaking to hearers not doers. Not one time doers and now not doers (once saved now lost)
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Why is it so hard for people
james is speaking to licentious people who claim to be Gods children because they believed, (you believe you do good, even demons believe yet tremble) yet demons do not have faith nor do these people!
the problem is these people had no living faith, it was a dead faith, it’s like those who quote a sinners prayer and walk away thinking they are saved forever, now they can do whatever they want, they joined a club not a body, and they were never saved,
james is speaking to licentious people who claim to be Gods children because they believed, (you believe you do good, even demons believe yet tremble) yet demons do not have faith nor do these people!
the problem is these people had no living faith, it was a dead faith, it’s like those who quote a sinners prayer and walk away thinking they are saved forever, now they can do whatever they want, they joined a club not a body, and they were never saved,