Are you a Trinitarian, and if so, can you defend the doctrine?

[UnitedWithChrist]

The poll is simple.

Are you a Trinitarian, and if so, can you defend the doctrine from Scripture?

I am definitely a Trinitarian, and I can definitely defend the doctrine.

If you can defend the doctrine, please provide your Scriptural and reasoning. Additionally, please tell me about incidences where you successfully defended the Trinity.

If you can't defend the doctrine, I suggest that you learn how to defend it. It is the most commonly rejected doctrine of Christianity.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Here are five points that define the Trinity. Can you list Scriptures which prove each point?

1. There is one God, and his name is YHVH.
2. This one God reveals Himself in Three distinct Persons; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. The Father is God.
4. The Son is God.
5. The Holy Spirit is God.
6. These three Persons are co-eternal and co-essential, meaning that each Person has always existed, and they all share the same
essence.

 

[garee]

Here are five points that define the Trinity. Can you list Scriptures which prove each point?

1. There is one God, and his name is YHVH.
2. This one God reveals Himself in Three distinct Persons; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. The Father is God.
4. The Son is God.
5. The Holy Spirit is God.
6. These three Persons are co-eternal and co-essential, meaning that each Person has always existed, and they all share the same
essence.

I don't think their is actually a doctrine called the trinity as a law . Two works better for me. One God two attributes as examples of persons. God is not a man as us. One work of one faith accomplished by two . Two is the witness of God. Three does denote the end of the matter . Two denotes those sent out two by two .The church.

 

[Sackcloth-N-Ashes]

The poll is simple.

Are you a Trinitarian, and if so, can you defend the doctrine from Scripture?

I am definitely a Trinitarian, and I can definitely defend the doctrine.

If you can defend the doctrine, please provide your Scriptural and reasoning. Additionally, please tell me about incidences where you successfully defended the Trinity.

If you can't defend the doctrine, I suggest that you learn how to defend it. It is the most commonly rejected doctrine of Christianity.

At the end of Matthew 3 shows the Trinity. God the Son being baptized, God the Spirit coming upon the Son, and the Father speaking after the sky opens up.

 

[Deuteronomy]

Hello @UnitedWithChrist, here are the Lutheran Twins, with the help of St. Patrick, doing a bang-up job of explaining what the Trinity is not .. which actually helps us understand what it is (oh, and why using an analogy to help explain the nature of the Godhead is never a good idea). Enjoy

~Deut

 

[Deuteronomy]

Hello again @UnitedWithChrist, the Trinity is a doctrine of the church that was created to both circumscribe and safeguard all that the Bible teaches us about the mystery of the Godhead (which begins with the fact that there is one God who exists from and to everlasting as three distinct Persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit). What the doctrine of the Trinity does 'not' seek to do is to explain the mystery to us, because that is simply beyond any of us (at least it is on this side of the grave anyway).

This Biblical mystery is seen (in part) in the name of God, the name that we are to baptize new believers in, and that ~singular~ name of God is: "the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit" .. Matthew 28:19.

There is much more, of course, which I will try to touch on later (if someone hasn't already done so).

God bless you!

~Deut

Genesis 1​

26 God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”​

​

 

[Dave-L]

Most know the basics about the Trinity. Here are some unexpected and crippling truths antitrinitarians are not prepared for.


Uncommon proofs for the Trinity and Deity of Christ.


Tempted of the Devil and Jesus’ claim to being God.



“And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, Being forty days tempted of the devil. And in those days he did eat nothing: and when they were ended, he afterward hungered.” Luke 4:1–2 (KJV 1900)

“And he brought him to Jerusalem, and set him on a pinnacle of the temple, and said unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down from hence: For it is written, He shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee: And in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.” Luke 4:9–11 (KJV 1900)

“Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.” Matthew 4:7 (KJV 1900)

Right away the antitrinitarian will say the Devil meant the Father would bear Jesus up according to Ps 91. And it is the Father whom Jesus referred to.

But look again.

By saying this, does Jesus announce he is God? Yes. “For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.” Colossians 2:9 (KJV 1900)

So Jesus in whom dwells the fullness of the Godhead announced to the Devil he is God.

Further proof? The oldest manuscripts say so too.

And he is God; “Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe.” Jude 5 (ESV)



Another uncommon proof is Jesus’ humanity.

Many say Jesus is not God because he never claims to be. But he most does. Before one can prove he is not God, they must prove he is not human. Because if Mary is his mother, that makes him human. And if God is his Father, that makes him God. And since God has no beginning or end, that makes him the eternal Son of God begotten in eternity. And in time dwelling in his temple made without hands, as the Son of Man through Mary.

Some other proofs are:



The Greek Old Testament called the Septuagint was the bible of the young New Covenant Church. And the translators called YHWH (God) LORD. So the early church knew Jesus was YHWH because they called him Lord Jesus. People argue the word Lord meant many different things. But the way in which they used it determined the definition. Some of the oldest manuscripts call YHWH Jesus in the Old Testament.

“Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus, who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe.” Jude 5 (ESV).

Several well know proofs of Jesus’ divinity have stood the test of time. But these are some I use successfully.

 

[pottersclay]

In the very first sentence scripture of the Bible.

In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.

Elohim is plural and not singular.

 

[Noose]

Here are five points that define the Trinity. Can you list Scriptures which prove each point?

1. There is one God, and his name is YHVH.
2. This one God reveals Himself in Three distinct Persons; Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
3. The Father is God.
4. The Son is God.
5. The Holy Spirit is God.
6. These three Persons are co-eternal and co-essential, meaning that each Person has always existed, and they all share the same
essence.

Point #6 is what i would disagree with.
Trinity, is not the only doctrine that affirms points 1-5

 

[p_rehbein]

I am a Christian. As for the Holy Trinity, I fully believe in it. As for proof: The entire Gospel of John is all the proof needed for spiritual believers (those with the indwelling presence of the Holy Spirit).

 

[Dave-L]

Point #6 is what i would disagree with.
Trinity, is not the only doctrine that affirms points 1-5

Why point 6?

 

[Noose]

Why point 6?

Because it doesn't make sense to me. The moment you have three persons as divine, you'll have three Gods.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Hello @UnitedWithChrist, here are the Lutheran Twins, with the help of St. Patrick, doing a bang-up job of explaining what the Trinity is not .. which actually helps us understand what it is (oh, and why using an analogy to help explain the nature of the Godhead is never a good idea). Enjoy

~Deut

Amusing cartoon and it does point to a lot of the erroneous analogies folks come up with.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Because it doesn't make sense to me. The moment you have three persons as divine, you'll have three Gods.

This is based on the assumption that being = person, with the claim that there can only be one person per being.

This is reducing God down to rules in the creation.

God is a multi-personal Being.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

Point #6 is what i would disagree with.
Trinity, is not the only doctrine that affirms points 1-5

Do you deny that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit have each always existed as distinct persons?

or

Do you deny that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit share the same essence?

or

both

 

[Dave-L]

Because it doesn't make sense to me. The moment you have three persons as divine, you'll have three Gods.

The bible says God is one. = one being with three persons. All occupying the same space at the same time. If you think materialistically you won't be able to understand.

Did you know the Gadarene demoniac had 6,000 persons in the same space at the same time?

 

[Noose]

Do you deny that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit have each always existed as distinct persons?

or

Do you deny that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit share the same essence?

or

both

The Father is with respect to the Son and the son is only a son with respect to the Father. They can not both co-exist eternally.
What i mean is; the Father is only a father to someone He begets and the son is only a son when He is begotten. Before the son is begotten the title Father is not applicable and so is the son.

 

[Noose]

This is based on the assumption that being = person, with the claim that there can only be one person per being.

This is reducing God down to rules in the creation.

God is a multi-personal Being.

A person is also a being and with God it doesn't change. Three persons one being is an impossibility/ Three persons one essence is possible but that doesn't imply one God, it implies three Gods just like 7Billion humans one humanity implies 7 billion humans.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

The Father is with respect to the Son and the son is only a son with respect to the Father. They can not both co-exist eternally.
What i mean is; the Father is only a father to someone He begets and the son is only a son when He is begotten. Before the son is begotten the title Father is not applicable and so is the son.

Christianity teaches that the Son was eternally begotten. Sonship did not occur at a particular point in time, and the Son had no beginning. The Holy Spirit, in similar manner, eternally proceeds from the Father and Son.

God is Father by nature, and not by events that occurred in relationship to time.

 

[UnitedWithChrist]

A person is also a being and with God it doesn't change. Three persons one being is an impossibility/ Three persons one essence is possible but that doesn't imply one God, it implies three Gods just like 7Billion humans one humanity implies 7 billion humans.

I notice that you are continuing to define God in terms of the natural creation. That's the fundamental issue. The natural creation does convey some truths concerning God, but he is not reduced to laws that exist in creation.

And, God is a multi-personal being. Insisting that he cannot be is basically saying he is subject to observable facts in the creation.