Can One’s Salvation Be Given Up?

[Aerials1978]

Are you straight up denying the scriptures? How do you explain the verses I posted in post #132? You’re the first person I’ve talked to who denies that Jesus and His disciples preached the gospel of the kingdom as scripture clearly states.

Is the book of Matthew not valid?

I’m denying you and your faulty reading and the application of them. And I highly doubt I’m the first person to deny your definition.

 

[Guojing]

I agree there are too many different church doctrines, but going towards a “Purist” movement can also produce faulty Biblical concepts as well. One is these being the two different salvations doctrine.

I think you misunderstood, there is only one salvation doctrine NOW, which is Paul's gospel (1 Cor 15:1-4)

But before Paul was saved and the ascended Christ revealed to him that particular gospel, God saved people based on their faith in what he commanded them to do.

Since Christ has not died on the cross yet, God had other requirements then for people to put their faith in.

 

[John146]

I’m denying you and your faulty reading and the application of them. And I highly doubt I’m the first person to deny your definition.

I’m not faulty posting exactly what the scripture says. And it specifically says the gospel of the kingdom. Do you deny the scripture says this? If not, what is it?

 

[John146]

I think you misunderstood, there is only one salvation doctrine NOW, which is Paul's gospel (1 Cor 15:1-4)

But before Paul was saved and the ascended Christ revealed to him that particular gospel, God saved people based on their faith in what he commanded them to do.

Since Christ has not died on the cross yet, God had other requirements then for people to put their faith in.

This guy denies that the gospel of the kingdom is even in scripture.🙄

 

[Guojing]

This guy denies that the gospel of the kingdom is even in scripture.🙄

Its understandable, many people were taught in churches that people before the cross "looked forward to the cross", so its natural that they consider the gospel of the kingdom as exactly the same as in 1 Cor 15:1-4.

 

[Aerials1978]

I think you misunderstood, there is only one salvation doctrine NOW, which is Paul's gospel (1 Cor 15:1-4)

But before Paul was saved and the ascended Christ reveal to him that particular gospel, God saved people based on their faith in what he commanded them to do.

Since Christ has not died on the cross yet, God had other requirements then for people to put their faith in.

As I had stated previously, I don’t adhere to that doctrine. I haven’t seen any scripture to that gives any truth to that. I believe the concept of what happens with Israel was a noble attempt, but like most things it progressed in a very convoluted theology.

 

[John146]

As I had stated previously, I don’t adhere to that doctrine. I haven’t seen any scripture to that gives any truth to that. I believe the concept of what happens with Israel was a noble attempt, but like most things it progressed in a very convoluted theology.

But you deny the gospel of the kingdom is even in scripture. You may not agree with our view point, but to deny the scripture...

 

[Aerials1978]

I’m not faulty posting exactly what the scripture says. And it specifically says the gospel of the kingdom. Do you deny the scripture says this? If not, what is it?

Yes you are. You take one phase and attribute that to something else. By trying to claim I’m denying scripture is an untruth. I reject your interpretation of it. See the difference?

 

[Guojing]

As I had stated previously, I don’t adhere to that doctrine. I haven’t seen any scripture to that gives any truth to that. I believe the concept of what happens with Israel was a noble attempt, but like most things it progressed in a very convoluted theology.

Hebrews 11 has a list on how different OT saints put their faith in God. They were given different instructions by God and they showed their faith by following exactly what God commanded them to do.

To give some examples, Noah build an ark, Abel offered the correct sacrifice, Abraham left his land to go to a new land that God commanded him to, Rahab hid spies, and so on and so forth.

 

[Aerials1978]

Hebrews 11 has a list on how different OT saints put their faith in God. They were given different instructions by God and they showed their faith by following exactly what God commanded them to do.

To give some examples, Noah build an ark, Abel offered the correct sacrifice, Abraham left his land to go to a new land that God commanded him to, Rahab hid spies, and so on and so forth.

I agree with that. What does that have to do with the topic at hand?

 

[Aerials1978]

But you deny the gospel of the kingdom is even in scripture. You may not agree with our view point, but to deny the scripture...

So you say.

 

[FlyingDove]

I can’t explain something that doesn’t exist.

Scripture disagrees:

Jesus preached the """gospel of the kingdom"""

Matt 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and """preaching the gospel of the kingdom""", and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Matt 9:35 And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and """preaching the gospel of the kingdom""", and healing every sickness and every disease among the people.

Mar 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, """preaching the gospel of the kingdom"""

This is 100% Jewish doctrine. Preached by a Jew to the Jews & pertains to promises made exclusively to the chosen peoples forefathers.

 

[Guojing]

I agree with that. What does that have to do with the topic at hand?

Didn't you state "I haven’t seen any scripture to that gives any truth to that"?

What is the that you were referring to in my post that you replied to? I stated

But before Paul was saved and the ascended Christ reveal to him that particular gospel, God saved people based on their faith in what he commanded them to do.

Since Christ has not died on the cross yet, God had other requirements then for people to put their faith in.

 

[Aerials1978]

Immd

Scripture disagrees:

Jesus preached the """gospel of the kingdom"""

Matt 4:23 And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and """preaching the gospel of the kingdom""", and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people.

Matt 9:35 And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and """preaching the gospel of the kingdom""", and healing every sickness and every disease among the people.

Mar 1:14 Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, """preaching the gospel of the kingdom"""

This is 100% Jewish doctrine. Preached by a Jew to the Jews & pertains to promises made exclusively to the chosen peoples forefathers.

I’m disagreeing with the premise of dispensationalism as it stands. Yes, Jesus ministered to Jews. I don’t think anyone denies that here. My issue is the concept of two different forms of salvation; one for the Jews and one for Gentiles.

And he died for all, that those who live should no longer live for themselves but for him who died for them and was raised again.
So from now on we regard no one from a worldly point of view. Though we once regarded Christ in this way, we do so no longer.
2 Corinthians 5:15-16

 

[Aerials1978]

Didn't you state "I haven’t seen any scripture to that gives any truth to that"?

What is the that you were referring to in my post that you replied to? I stated

I have multiple conversations going on. I apologize. I’m not understanding in what context you are referring to those people.

 

[Guojing]

I have multiple conversations going on. I apologize. I’m not understanding in what context you are referring to those people.

So what exactly are you disagreeing with?

Before Christ came to walk on earth and died on the cross, how does one put his faith in God in order to be saved?

 

[Aerials1978]

So what exactly are you disagreeing with?

Before Christ came to walk on earth and died on the cross, how does one put his faith in God in order to be saved?

One couldn’t be saved unless atonement was made on his or her behalf by the High Priest. Faith was that God would fulfill His covenant with His people to which He did.

 

[Guojing]

One couldn’t be saved unless atonement was made on his or her behalf by the High Priest. Faith was that God would fulfill His covenant with His people to which He did.

So what did the ot saints put their faith in, according to your view?

 

[Aerials1978]

So what did the ot saints put their faith in, according to your view?

Which person? Noah believe God would save him from the flood. Abraham believed God would give him land and offspring. They put their faith in what God said He was going going to do.

 

[Guojing]

Which person? Noah believe God would save him from the flood. Abraham believed God would give him land and offspring. They put their faith in what God said He was going going to do.

Yep so you do accept that there were different gospels given to different people at different time.

So why would the idea that the Jews in the 4 gospels had to put their faith that Jesus is their promised messiah and be Baptised, to be saved, be objectionable to you?