Why the Baptism with the Holy Spirit is not for Today

[presidente]

"If any one among the laity appearsto have received a gift of healing by a revelation, hands shall not be laid upon him, because the matter is manifest."

- The Treatise on the Apostolic Tradition of St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop ...
from
https://books.google.com/books?id=e... laid on him gift is manifest healing&f=false

 

[presidente]

There are gifts that continue and gifts that have ceased. That is what Paul taught and what history has amply demonstrated.

Are you saying that there are some people who do not know that partial knowledge was replaced by full knowledge?

That would be a self-contradictory position, wouldn't it?

 

[Dave-L]

How did you come to that conclusion? Was the church of Corinth made up of only apostles? Have you read 1 Corinthians 12...It talks about the gifts and how they are administered and make up the whole body of Christ (Church). If you take one out is that not weakening the body? I mean it seems to explain it quite clearly to me.

If I don't like my feet and want to cut them off then I can do so, but it will be my own fault when I can't walk....

We are all hat and no cattle today in our charismatic claims.

 

[Dave-L]

John the Baptist was speaking to a large audience of Jews. Other apostles did miracles beside the twelve. One of them taught that the Spirit gives gifts as He wills.

Jesus promised the 12 only.

 

[1ofthem]

We are all hat and no cattle today in our charismatic claims.

Did it say that in scripture anywhere that it ceased and was attainable only to the apostles?

 

[Dave-L]

Did it say that in scripture anywhere that it ceased and was attainable only to the apostles?

Scripture shows besides the two outpourings, only an apostle can give the gifts. And when they died the gifts ceased. And Paul had Timothy on medicine and other helpers sick and left behind in the Epistles.

 

[EternalFire]

But adding to Revelation by doing so.

Perhaps listening to Jesus will help: "And ought not this woman, a daughter of Abraham whom Satan bound for eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the Sabbath day?" (Lk 13:16).

 

[wolfwint]

“And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.” Deuteronomy 30:6 (KJV 1900)

You claime that the above vers is the proof that OT believers has the Holy Spirit in the same way as the believers since pentecost. This may be come from your understanding, but is not based on the word of God.
The same with your claime that speaking in tongues is baptizing with the Holy Spirit.

 

[Dave-L]

You claime that the above vers is the proof that OT believers has the Holy Spirit in the same way as the believers since pentecost. This may be come from your understanding, but is not based on the word of God.
The same with your claime that speaking in tongues is baptizing with the Holy Spirit.

Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit. This means all listed in Hebrews 11 were born again.

 

[Dave-L]

Perhaps listening to Jesus will help: "And ought not this woman, a daughter of Abraham whom Satan bound for eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the Sabbath day?" (Lk 13:16).

Jesus bound satan from the time he began teaching.

 

[presidente]

Scripture shows besides the two outpourings, only an apostle can give the gifts.

False doctrine that contradicts scripture. Paul had gifts. The only people we know who laid hands on him were Ananias and the prophets and teachers in Acts. Timothy received a gift through prophecy with the laying on of hands of the elders. interpretation is a gift, and one can pray to interpret. Paul taught that spiritual gifts are given as the Spirit wills. Peter says 'as every man hath received the gift', and surely there were some saints way up there in Anatolia who had never met an apostle.

You have been shown these scriptures. I wonder if there is a spiritual thing that keeps your eyes from being able to see the words of scripture or your mind from perceiving or retaining what they say.

And Paul had Timothy on medicine and other helpers sick and left behind in the Epistles.

Paul had an illness. The Galatians would have given him their own eyes if they could. Then he did great miracles and healed people.

 

[Dave-L]

False doctrine that contradicts scripture. Paul had gifts. The only people we know who laid hands on him were Ananias and the prophets and teachers in Acts. Timothy received a gift through prophecy with the laying on of hands of the elders. interpretation is a gift, and one can pray to interpret. Paul taught that spiritual gifts are given as the Spirit wills. Peter says 'as every man hath received the gift', and surely there were some saints way up there in Anatolia who had never met an apostle.

You have been shown these scriptures. I wonder if there is a spiritual thing that keeps your eyes from being able to see the words of scripture or your mind from perceiving or retaining what they say.

Paul had an illness. The Galatians would have given him their own eyes if they could. Then he did great miracles and healed people.

Ananias ministered to Paul but the Baptism was in being an Apostle.

 

[wolfwint]

Scripture shows besides the two outpourings, only an apostle can give the gifts. And when they died the gifts ceased. And Paul had Timothy on medicine and other helpers sick and left behind in the Epistles.

You are right, about the ending of the gifts, but your way to explaine it, leads you in a wrong direction.

 

[presidente]

Ananias ministered to Paul but the Baptism was in being an Apostle.

You are just making stuff up. You are also contradicting your previous posts. You seem to be getting more and more confused. John said 'baptize you with the Holy Ghost' to an audience of Jews, not just the twelve apostles (if all twelve were there.) Peter referred to it about Cornelius and that room full of Gentiles, also.

 

[Dave-L]

You are just making stuff up. You are also contradicting your previous posts. You seem to be getting more and more confused. John said 'baptize you with the Holy Ghost' to an audience of Jews, not just the twelve apostles (if all twelve were there.) Peter referred to it about Cornelius and that room full of Gentiles, also.

No, the Baptism was unique to the Apostles and Cornelius' house. And those they laid hands on.

 

[Dave-L]

You are right, about the ending of the gifts, but your way to explaine it, leads you in a wrong direction.

How so?

 

[EternalFire]

Jesus bound satan from the time he began teaching.

Yet somehow Satan, being supposedly bound, was able to continue afflicting this woman until Jesus healed her?

 

[Dave-L]

Yet somehow Satan, being supposedly bound, was able to continue afflicting this woman until Jesus healed her?

God uses Satan every day to bring his wrath on the ungodly. But the Gospel binds him from deceiving the nations where believers are.

 

[Absolutely]

Start raising the dead and I'll begin thinking your charismatic claims are true.

i already showed you that we don't know what miracles ALL THE APOSTLES operated in.
Your deal has holes blown in it an aircraft carrier could sail through

 

[EternalFire]

God uses Satan every day to bring his wrath on the ungodly. But the Gospel binds him from deceiving the nations where believers are.

If this is so, then the nation in which you reside must not be deceived. Please list the current nations that are not deceived.