3 Tactics Calvinists Use Against Non-Calvinists

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Whispered

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www.christiancourier.com
I am curious about your terminology "Omni-Benevolence". Can you inform me including scripture?
The Book of Psalms chapter 100:5For the Lord is good;his steadfast love endures forever, and his faithfulness to all generations
The Book of Psalms chapter 145:17The Lord is righteous in all his ways and kind in all his works.

Question: "What does it mean that God is omnibenevolent?"

Answer: The word omnibenevolent comes from the Latin word omni, meaning “all,” and the word benevolent, meaning “good” or “charitable.” When we say that God is omnibenevolent, we are saying that God is absolutely good and that no action or motive or thought or feeling or anything else about Him is not purely good. He is “all-good.” The Bible provides many testimonies of God’s goodness, including Jesus’ own, when He asserted that no one is truly good except God Himself (Mark 10:18). This can only mean that, although human beings can do good things, only God is omnibenevolent, or wholly good.

To believe in a perfect being, one must accept that God can be omnibenevolent. If God is completely self-sustaining, independent of need, the “un-caused cause” and “un-moved mover,” He must also be perfectly good. If God were simply a good and powerful being, but not perfectly good, there would be an element of contingency. That is, we could conceive of a being of potentially greater benevolence—and someone with greater goodness would be greater than God. Since the goodness of anything is measured by its perfection, God must be perfectly good in order to also be omniscient and omnipotent. All three aspects of His person must be in place for us to conceive of any one of the three.

The most common objection to the assertion that God is omnibenevolent, as well as omnipotent and omniscient, is the problem of evil. If God is all-knowing and all-powerful and perfectly good, why does evil exist? Philosophers debate this question endlessly. Some solve the problem by saying that Lucifer’s and then, later, man’s free will was the cause of evil and that God was not involved in causing evil. One might then ask, “Why then did God create a being who could choose evil?” and the typical answer to that is “because He wanted beings who would be able to make choices”; i.e., He did not want robots.

Philosophically speaking, God’s omnibenevolence is a complicated issue. The problem of evil is a complex one. However, we do know that, for God to be God, He must be omnibenevolent, omnipotent, and omniscient. And, really, the issue comes down to believing the Bible, which presents God as always good (Psalm 106:1; 135:3; Nahum 1:7). His message to sinners, through Christ, is “good news” (Luke 2:10); His revelation of Christ is called the appearing of “the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior” (Titus 3:4, ESV). It is the goodness of God that leads us to repentance (Romans 2:4), goodness is one of the results of His indwelling Spirit (Galatians 5:22), and He brings goodness to fruition in our lives through faith (2 Thessalonians 1:11).
 

ForestGreenCook

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The Book of Psalms chapter 100:5For the Lord is good;his steadfast love endures forever, and his faithfulness to all generations
The Book of Psalms chapter 145:17The Lord is righteous in all his ways and kind in all his works.

Question: "What does it mean that God is omnibenevolent?"

Answer: The word omnibenevolent comes from the Latin word omni, meaning “all,” and the word benevolent, meaning “good” or “charitable.” When we say that God is omnibenevolent, we are saying that God is absolutely good and that no action or motive or thought or feeling or anything else about Him is not purely good. He is “all-good.” The Bible provides many testimonies of God’s goodness, including Jesus’ own, when He asserted that no one is truly good except God Himself (Mark 10:18). This can only mean that, although human beings can do good things, only God is omnibenevolent, or wholly good.

To believe in a perfect being, one must accept that God can be omnibenevolent. If God is completely self-sustaining, independent of need, the “un-caused cause” and “un-moved mover,” He must also be perfectly good. If God were simply a good and powerful being, but not perfectly good, there would be an element of contingency. That is, we could conceive of a being of potentially greater benevolence—and someone with greater goodness would be greater than God. Since the goodness of anything is measured by its perfection, God must be perfectly good in order to also be omniscient and omnipotent. All three aspects of His person must be in place for us to conceive of any one of the three.
to sent them to hell
The most common objection to the assertion that God is omnibenevolent, as well as omnipotent and omniscient, is the problem of evil. If God is all-knowing and all-powerful and perfectly good, why does evil exist? Philosophers debate this question endlessly. Some solve the problem by saying that Lucifer’s and then, later, man’s free will was the cause of evil and that God was not involved in causing evil. One might then ask, “Why then did God create a being who could choose evil?” and the typical answer to that is “because He wanted beings who would be able to make choices”; i.e., He did not want robots.

Philosophically speaking, God’s omnibenevolence is a complicated issue. The problem of evil is a complex one. However, we do know that, for God to be God, He must be omnibenevolent, omnipotent, and omniscient. And, really, the issue comes down to believing the Bible, which presents God as always good (Psalm 106:1; 135:3; Nahum 1:7). His message to sinners, through Christ, is “good news” (Luke 2:10); His revelation of Christ is called the appearing of “the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior” (Titus 3:4, ESV). It is the goodness of God that leads us to repentance (Romans 2:4), goodness is one of the results of His indwelling Spirit (Galatians 5:22), and He brings goodness to fruition in our lives through faith (2 Thessalonians 1:11).
I believe that God would have still been good and perfectly just to have let the bad choices that mankind chose send themselves to hell if he had not chose to save any of them. God is always good. We love God, because he first loved us, 1 John 4:19. and choose us before the foundation of the world.. In the old testament God commanded Israel, in some cases, when they went to battle, to kill every man, woman, child and animals. That is very hard for our finite mind to comprehend, yet it was good in Gods sight.
 

brighthouse98

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Apr 16, 2015
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United, ah you might wish to read what I wrote. lol I showed you the great difference between the 2 Covenants,so as usual you had no reply to all the scriptures I showed you. I have forgot more scripture then you will ever be able to remember. LOL And I never mentioned calvin,you did LOL Since you wish to judge me,I will return your favor by saying this( Phil 3:18) sadly. I looked to reason, but you wish to become a Matt 7:6 so be it I will end speaking to you.
 

fredoheaven

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Nov 17, 2015
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That’s the backwards belief of decisional regeneration that free willers have developed. Their position is that a man, with a heart of stone, must squeeze faith and repentance from it to be born again. Then, they receive a heart of flesh.

The Reformed position is that God gives the person a heart of flesh, and this new heart produces faith and repentance as a fruit.

The free willer position is incoherent and results in boasting. The focus is on them and their decision and not God and his glory. I can see some baby Christian thinking that’s how it happened but not an older believer who is growing in the LORD.

But I’m wasting my breath saying this :) I know these old traditionalists will not change. They’ve been marinading in their synergistic juices too long.

I suggest folks read Ephesians 2:1-10 carefully. The focus is on what God does and not what man does.
I just have to believe the grace of God that saves. in Christ alone, no boasting my friend. Then your position must be wrong. Also am wasting my breath that you will not change even the scripture of truth says so.:)
 

fredoheaven

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Nov 17, 2015
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That is pretty far fetched, without scripture to back it up. You must interpret Eph 2 differently than I do. Verse 5 says "Even when we were DEAD, spiritually, in sins, hath he quickened us together with Christ. A spiritually dead man cannot respond to the things of the Spirit. Where is the scripture that says "a natural man, 1 Cor 2:14, can be convicted by the Holy Spirit before he is born again"? Show me a scripture that says by hearing the word preached is the cause of us to be born again. Scripture proves scripture.
Ephesians 2:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

Notice how subtle you are, you change the word of God. Sorry, that tactics is already trite. You have been exposed to it. You must be circling around my friend.
 

ForestGreenCook

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Ephesians 2:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

Notice how subtle you are, you change the word of God. Sorry, that tactics is already trite. You have been exposed to it. You must be circling around my friend.
You must have a mental block in your mind that will not let you understand that a spiritually dead man cannot accept things of the Spirit, as Eph 2:5 plainly states.
 

UnitedWithChrist

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I just have to believe the grace of God that saves. in Christ alone, no boasting my friend. Then your position must be wrong. Also am wasting my breath that you will not change even the scripture of truth says so.:)
The Scripture teaches my position.

And free-willers insist that their heart of stone can generate faith and repentance leading to reception of a heart of flesh that seeks to love and obey God. This is an incoherent view. Good luck with that one :)

Rather, God takes out the heart of stone, giving a heart of flesh, which leads to faith and repentance.

However, the free-willer will insist that can't be the way that it is. :) He will not be deprived of his synergistic glory.

Salvation is 100% a work of the LORD, from beginning to end. That is why there is no room for boasting in Reformed theology.
 

UnitedWithChrist

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Scripture please....
I've already given them.

However, I will refer you to these:

Jeremiah 31:31-34 31 “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the Lord. 33 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
(ESV)

Ezekiel 36:25-27 25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. 26 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.
(ESV)

Notice the passive sense...it is something God does, and not something man does.

Additionally, I do not accept faulty explanations you have presented in the past on these matters.

"It's just figurative language" is a juvenile response. Of course, it is figurative. Man doesn't have a literal heart of stone, but it means his heart is hard and unyielding. A heart of flesh isn't talking about the literal heart but it's talking about the center of his being, and is talking about a heart that is toward God. Symbols and figurative speech mean something.

And I don't know if it was you or someone else who claimed this is ONLY talking about Israel, which is dispensational garbage.

Some dispensationalists are even bold enough to say the New Covenant isn't for the church. Hogwash!

So, you guys keep on denying it and boasting in yourselves as the determining factor in your salvation. For one thing, I'm not sure who is saved and who is not..it seems like saved people would realize that it was all about God and none about them.
 

John146

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Jan 13, 2016
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I've already given them.

However, I will refer you to these:

Jeremiah 31:31-34 31 “Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the Lord. 33 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34 And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”
(ESV)

Ezekiel 36:25-27 25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. 26 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules.
(ESV)

Notice the passive sense...it is something God does, and not something man does.

Additionally, I do not accept faulty explanations you have presented in the past on these matters.

"It's just figurative language" is a juvenile response. Of course, it is figurative. Man doesn't have a literal heart of stone, but it means his heart is hard and unyielding. A heart of flesh isn't talking about the literal heart but it's talking about the center of his being, and is talking about a heart that is toward God. Symbols and figurative speech mean something.

And I don't know if it was you or someone else who claimed this is ONLY talking about Israel, which is dispensational garbage.

Some dispensationalists are even bold enough to say the New Covenant isn't for the church. Hogwash!

So, you guys keep on denying it and boasting in yourselves as the determining factor in your salvation. For one thing, I'm not sure who is saved and who is not..it seems like saved people would realize that it was all about God and none about them.
The plain text is not about the Church, the spiritual Church, etc...Jeremiah and Ezekiel is both prophesying about the nation of Israel, not the Church. The Church was a mystery until after the resurrection. It’s not garbage, but truth. The Church has not replaced Israel. We have not taken their covenant. The New Testament does not include these promises of Jeremiah and Ezekiel.
 

UnitedWithChrist

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The plain text is not about the Church, the spiritual Church, etc...Jeremiah and Ezekiel is both prophesying about the nation of Israel, not the Church. The Church was a mystery until after the resurrection. It’s not garbage, but truth. The Church has not replaced Israel. We have not taken their covenant. The New Testament does not include these promises of Jeremiah and Ezekiel.
Notice, folks, that he is denying the New Covenant is for the Church.

That is what some dispensationalists do.

Realize that if they are correct and consistent, Jesus' work of atonement doesn't apply to non-Jews.
 

John146

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Notice, folks, that he is denying the New Covenant is for the Church.

That is what some dispensationalists do.

Realize that if they are correct and consistent, Jesus' work of atonement doesn't apply to non-Jews.
These passages are not talking about the New Testament, but the covenant God has made with Israel. The old covenant was about Israel, and so is this one discussed in Jeremiah and Ezekiel. Easy to see this matches with Romans 11.

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: (All Israel will be saved when the Lord returns and establishes His throne in Jerusalem and will be their God, and they shall be His people.)
27 For this is my covenant unto them, (the nation of Israel) when I shall take away their sins.

There is a clear separation between Israel and the Church.
 

UnitedWithChrist

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These passages are not talking about the New Testament, but the covenant God has made with Israel. The old covenant was about Israel, and so is this one discussed in Jeremiah and Ezekiel. Easy to see this matches with Romans 11.

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: (All Israel will be saved when the Lord returns and establishes His throne in Jerusalem and will be their God, and they shall be His people.)
27 For this is my covenant unto them, (the nation of Israel) when I shall take away their sins.

There is a clear separation between Israel and the Church.

According to dispensationalists.

And, their doctrine is false and can be proven so.

I would suggest this audio.
http://www.knowyourbiblerecordings....EU1MUgklBHWE35cTiCmlDFDF0Y1c_I5u61R7_5Soi6ADg
 

ForestGreenCook

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The plain text is not about the Church, the spiritual Church, etc...Jeremiah and Ezekiel is both prophesying about the nation of Israel, not the Church. The Church was a mystery until after the resurrection. It’s not garbage, but truth. The Church has not replaced Israel. We have not taken their covenant. The New Testament does not include these promises of Jeremiah and Ezekiel.
You do realize that God changed Jacob's name to be called "Israel" in Gen 33:28. Jacob/Israel is representative of the elect, Christs church.
 

UnitedWithChrist

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Great! I point you to Scripture, you point me to a sermon from a Calvinist. 🙄
He refers to Scripture. Why should I regurgitate a well-ordered sermon?

The reality is that dispensationalists don't have a leg to stand on, especially since they deny the New Covenant applies to the Gentile believer, and facets of their beliefs were "revelations" by a charismatic teenager, especially the Rapture.

Reference:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_MacDonald_(visionary)
 

John146

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You do realize that God changed Jacob's name to be called "Israel" in Gen 33:28. Jacob/Israel is representative of the elect, Christs church.
The same elect people who are enemies of the gospel? Yes. They are beloved because God chose them to bring forth the promised seed.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.