That is for them to determine and for God to convict. God knows what is in their hearts. Their actions and fruits, however, show to everyone whether they chase after riches or not. A pastor who has big mansions, private jets and live like a celebrity certainly loves money and not God. I can know that just by observing their lifestyles.
Why pastors and preachers should not be receiving salaries
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I am not generalizing, I am raising a common trend that applies to many, if not most.
The Gospel is being blasphemed by unbelievers because they see Christian preachers as conmen who are out to get their money. If pastors never asked for money blasphemy and rejection of Gospel will not exist for this reason. If a pastor truly loves God, will he ask for money and cause the Gospel to be rejected by unbelievers because of his act of asking money? No, yet most pastors don't care about how their actions are affecting the public's perception of God's word.
Paul was willing to sacrifice most of his benefits as an apostle, even his right to receive support from the church and sold his own tents so he doesn't take too much from the church. His fervent love for God is blatantly obvious. None of the apostles ever had a net worth of 25 million, on the contrary, they paid with their lives to get the Gospel around the world. So did many of the early teachers that followed after the apostles' examples, ALL of them made some form of personal sacrifice (wealth, family, life etc) for God and the Gospel.
I don't know if he is a wolf in sheep's clothing, but I do wonder how Billy Graham (and those like him) can justify his immense wealth and say he truly loved God on judgment day, when he sacrificed absolutely NOTHING for Him.
The Gospel is being blasphemed by unbelievers because they see Christian preachers as conmen who are out to get their money. If pastors never asked for money blasphemy and rejection of Gospel will not exist for this reason. If a pastor truly loves God, will he ask for money and cause the Gospel to be rejected by unbelievers because of his act of asking money? No, yet most pastors don't care about how their actions are affecting the public's perception of God's word.
Paul was willing to sacrifice most of his benefits as an apostle, even his right to receive support from the church and sold his own tents so he doesn't take too much from the church. His fervent love for God is blatantly obvious. None of the apostles ever had a net worth of 25 million, on the contrary, they paid with their lives to get the Gospel around the world. So did many of the early teachers that followed after the apostles' examples, ALL of them made some form of personal sacrifice (wealth, family, life etc) for God and the Gospel.
I don't know if he is a wolf in sheep's clothing, but I do wonder how Billy Graham (and those like him) can justify his immense wealth and say he truly loved God on judgment day, when he sacrificed absolutely NOTHING for Him.
No, I myself never got involved in a scam. But I have seen many examples around me of how pastors/church leaders who were paid salaries were in it for greed and taught damnable lies by manipulating Scriptures. There were two grave cases:
The first one happened in a mega church which my ex-classmate attended. The church leaders collected large amounts of funds from believers through regular salaries and tithes, and then misused the funds to grow their secular businesses. The church laity was totally unaware of it for years. Then the secular government came in and exposed the financial scandal, the media reported it and Christianity was shamed in front of the public.
The second one was even worse, and was a full blown cult. The cult leaders made their cult religion attractive by promising material wealth, access to sex, and power and status in the cult community for those who would fully commit themselves to furthering the cult. The cult leaders asked the believers for large sums of money which they used to make themselves rich as one of their many stringent and unreasonable religious requirements, then proceeded to teach them a twisted false gospel. Cult followers were required to follow every single teaching and practice imposed on them by the leaders, with no questions asked. The followers were so brainwashed and deceived that some eventually mutilated themselves physically based on a misconception of the teaching of Jesus which said "If your eyes offend you, pluck it out" etc. They also started separating from their unbelieving families by twisting Jesus' teaching of "if you do not hate your father, mother..." into literal hatred. They treated anyone outside of their cult as potential "devils". This twisted mindset led to them murdering people on the street for disagreeing with their doctrines. Again, it was the secular government which intervened after the murder happened and they discovered just how the cult leaders taught a series of damnable lies to control their followers. The ultimate aim of these cult leaders was to become rich by exploiting people with Christianity and external literature authored by them, they first drew followers in with material and worldly enticements and then finally controlled their followers' minds through cultist doctrines which relied on their own interpretations of the Bible. The government disclosed just how scandalous and immoral the lives of those leaders were. All these grossly details were reported in the media and Christianity had a very bad reputation in an entire country since then.
The first one happened in a mega church which my ex-classmate attended. The church leaders collected large amounts of funds from believers through regular salaries and tithes, and then misused the funds to grow their secular businesses. The church laity was totally unaware of it for years. Then the secular government came in and exposed the financial scandal, the media reported it and Christianity was shamed in front of the public.
The second one was even worse, and was a full blown cult. The cult leaders made their cult religion attractive by promising material wealth, access to sex, and power and status in the cult community for those who would fully commit themselves to furthering the cult. The cult leaders asked the believers for large sums of money which they used to make themselves rich as one of their many stringent and unreasonable religious requirements, then proceeded to teach them a twisted false gospel. Cult followers were required to follow every single teaching and practice imposed on them by the leaders, with no questions asked. The followers were so brainwashed and deceived that some eventually mutilated themselves physically based on a misconception of the teaching of Jesus which said "If your eyes offend you, pluck it out" etc. They also started separating from their unbelieving families by twisting Jesus' teaching of "if you do not hate your father, mother..." into literal hatred. They treated anyone outside of their cult as potential "devils". This twisted mindset led to them murdering people on the street for disagreeing with their doctrines. Again, it was the secular government which intervened after the murder happened and they discovered just how the cult leaders taught a series of damnable lies to control their followers. The ultimate aim of these cult leaders was to become rich by exploiting people with Christianity and external literature authored by them, they first drew followers in with material and worldly enticements and then finally controlled their followers' minds through cultist doctrines which relied on their own interpretations of the Bible. The government disclosed just how scandalous and immoral the lives of those leaders were. All these grossly details were reported in the media and Christianity had a very bad reputation in an entire country since then.
Let's focus on two key statements:
"Look at the luxurious and greedy lifestyles of those who preach false gospels"
"Do you know what the cult in the name of Jesus... used to attract them? Material wealth, sex, power and status."
Why should anyone care about the lifestyles of those who preach a false gospel? Just identify them as preachers of false gospels (with evidence, not circular or circumstantial reasoning) and leave it at that.
"Look at the luxurious and greedy lifestyles of those who preach false gospels"
"Do you know what the cult in the name of Jesus... used to attract them? Material wealth, sex, power and status."
Why should anyone care about the lifestyles of those who preach a false gospel? Just identify them as preachers of false gospels (with evidence, not circular or circumstantial reasoning) and leave it at that.
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L
Being paid for doing a job is not the love of money, that's a false dichotomy.
It was to Timothy that Paul wrote the passage that I quoted to you, ending in "a worker is worth his wages."
You can continue contradict the words of scripture and twist them to fit your fleshly jealousies if you want, but I caution you that this approach to scripture is dangerous.
Ok I am now done with this foolishness. Please don't follow up with me with any non sequiturs, false dichotomies, or twisted scripture, or illogical conclusions.
It was to Timothy that Paul wrote the passage that I quoted to you, ending in "a worker is worth his wages."
You can continue contradict the words of scripture and twist them to fit your fleshly jealousies if you want, but I caution you that this approach to scripture is dangerous.
Ok I am now done with this foolishness. Please don't follow up with me with any non sequiturs, false dichotomies, or twisted scripture, or illogical conclusions.
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Not all false preachers preach wealth-corrupted doctrines. Not all wealthy preachers preach false doctrine. Not all preachers of false doctrines are wealthy.
You're ranting at the wrong people. Identify the preachers whom you think are corrupted by wealth, and write to them. They aren't going to read your posts here.
You're ranting at the wrong people. Identify the preachers whom you think are corrupted by wealth, and write to them. They aren't going to read your posts here.
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Except preaching the Gospel was never meant to be a job per se in the secular sense, it is a sharing of free gift from God not to be used for profit of any sort and true preachers who love God will not burden people beyond what is necessary for their basic needs.
I am also done with this stubbornness of refusing to admit the deceitfulness of wealth. Whether one loves money or not is evident by what they do, and asking for money from people is but one action that shows a love for money. Tell a second person that asking for money does not mean you love money and see how they will react. Please don't reply me with strawman arguments either.
I am also done with this stubbornness of refusing to admit the deceitfulness of wealth. Whether one loves money or not is evident by what they do, and asking for money from people is but one action that shows a love for money. Tell a second person that asking for money does not mean you love money and see how they will react. Please don't reply me with strawman arguments either.
Show me an example whereby a false preacher is not rich, I bet that is less than 1% of all false preachers. I am not ranting at anyone, anyone who reads this and loves God will either examine themselves and repent (if they are guilty of greed), or they will argue with me to justify their greed. There is no in between.
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Oh, for that matter I am not jealous of anyone's riches. I myself saw how wealth corrupted people and it is the last thing on my mind to be LIKE THEM. I don't even value the same things as those who seek after riches value to begin with, they can keep their wealth for all I care. One day it will be them who will be jealous of those who truly loved God and received the best things from God Himself.
Jesus said to His apostles when He sent them out to preach the good news:
“Freely you have received, freely give.”
It’s ludicrous then pastors today don’t bother following this principle set by their own Lord and turn preaching into a secular job. Then they say they don’t love money, but yet they ask for money from people in the pews. A logical contradiction they can’t see, obviously. May those who have ears to hear the truth hear, and be honest with God about WHY they preach the Gospel to begin with.
“Freely you have received, freely give.”
It’s ludicrous then pastors today don’t bother following this principle set by their own Lord and turn preaching into a secular job. Then they say they don’t love money, but yet they ask for money from people in the pews. A logical contradiction they can’t see, obviously. May those who have ears to hear the truth hear, and be honest with God about WHY they preach the Gospel to begin with.
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Even if preachers in past generations turned preaching into a job, it is not a secular job.
Congregations turned preaching into a job by demanding that a single person do the bulk of it (which is not scripturally sound) and by directing funds to pay the preacher instead of providing directly for the preacher's needs (about which Scripture says nothing). A preacher asking for money for covering church expenses is perfectly reasonable, though it is better that the asking be done by another elder.
Paul waived his right to be supported by the congregations he taught. Consider that statement carefully; he had the right to be supported by them! So do modern preachers; it is biblically sound for one who preaches the gospel to make a living from the gospel.
The logical contradiction is yours; you reject the idea that people who work should be supported through that work. Do YOU work for free?
Congregations turned preaching into a job by demanding that a single person do the bulk of it (which is not scripturally sound) and by directing funds to pay the preacher instead of providing directly for the preacher's needs (about which Scripture says nothing). A preacher asking for money for covering church expenses is perfectly reasonable, though it is better that the asking be done by another elder.
Paul waived his right to be supported by the congregations he taught. Consider that statement carefully; he had the right to be supported by them! So do modern preachers; it is biblically sound for one who preaches the gospel to make a living from the gospel.
The logical contradiction is yours; you reject the idea that people who work should be supported through that work. Do YOU work for free?
L
Don't get upset at me because your flesh is riled up against scripture, and I was honest with you about it. Maybe you should confess it so that the Lord will forgive it. repent.
what Paul wrote to Timothy in his first letter, about how to operate the church is scripture. And he said pay those who diligently work in the ministry, preaching and teaching.
what Paul wrote to Timothy in his first letter, about how to operate the church is scripture. And he said pay those who diligently work in the ministry, preaching and teaching.