Israel became a nation in 1948, so we are in the fig tree generation now, wouldn't you agree?
Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?
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I dont know if thats the case but what I DO KNOW is that I pay close attention to whats going on in the world and ANYONE with any sort of spiritual insight knows we are in the LAST of the LAST DAYS. Even atheist professors are saying things are going CRAZY!
I suspect Israel taking over Jerusalem in 1967 was also of some significance, but I dont want to burn my fingers and state it dogmatically.
But on principle I agree with you that Israel becoming a state again and many jews coming back to the holy land was a SURE SIGN that we are CLOSING IN on the return of Jesus. PLUS all the technology developments, weather changes, natural disasters, surveillance technology making it possible for the antichrist to effectively monitor and track down ANYONE who doesnt take the mark of the beast. etc!
WHY DID I GO ON SUCH A LONG TANGENT instead of just answering your question and saying "YES we are very close in my opinion and ISrael becoming a nation is playing a big part of it in my opinion"! SHEESH WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME! i am long-winded!
Okay, so you do agree its the flesh then. That is why the Law was never meant for us, both before we are saved, and after we are saved. Law + flesh = death.
False. The Spirit writes the law on the heart and mind. Seems you don;t accept that.
Hebrews 10:16-17, " 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,” 17 then he adds, “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”
So you have yet to answer my original question, "Do you believe that we still have the flesh in us now?"
I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth. Revelation 3:9-10
if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us; if we are faithless, he will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself. 2 Timothy 2:12-13
But how is it to your credit if you receive a beating for doing wrong and endure it? But if you suffer for doing good and you endure it, this is commendable before God. To this you were called, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should follow in his steps. 1 Peter 2:20-21
...Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you. Revelation 3:1-3
The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 24:50-51
if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us; if we are faithless, he will remain faithful, for he cannot disown himself. 2 Timothy 2:12-13
But how is it to your credit if you receive a beating for doing wrong and endure it? But if you suffer for doing good and you endure it, this is commendable before God. To this you were called, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an example, that you should follow in his steps. 1 Peter 2:20-21
...Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you. Revelation 3:1-3
The master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he is not aware of. He will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. Matthew 24:50-51
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
(btw, I'm fully agreeing with your reply to Grandpa, and his response to you.)
Responses like this are fairly "typical", from "stuck in the mud" believers. No offense to the Lamb of God.
They become "stuck" to the "Oneness" of the Father which is in Christ. Yet, somehow, don't feel a/the need/duty/responsibility/obligation, of going onwards, as they are confessed to the Father by Christ, to the "Oneness" of "He who sent Christ!"
Which, rather puts the whole "plan of salvation", into a much more "clearer" perspective!
No need to become defensive. What is at question here is not the "Justification" of the believer. What is at question is the "Sanctification" of the justified believer, the "endure to the end" part.
Calling of the sinner to repentance is by The Father
Repenting is the sinners choice
Forgiveness and Justification is through Yahshua, accepting this is the repentant sinners choice.
Baptism is an obedience to the command by the justified believer.
Tarrying, desiring, seeking out the anointing of the Holy Spirit is an act of obedience by the justified believer to the command of Yahshua.
Listening and yielding to the guidance of the Holy Spirit Is the Justified/Anointed believers choice. This is often referred to "dying daily" as Paul put it, or putting the old man on the cross.
This is the "Walk" The "Sanctification" process. This is where the Justified/anointed believer chooses grows into the fullness of Yahshua. To become "like him", by acts of acquiescence and obedience unto death.
This is the trick I already mentioned in my post
"You are not saved by works of the law!!" But then you turn around and say.. well in sanctification i mean yeah you gotta obey the torah and if you dont, well then you were never truly saved to begin with OR lost your salvation take your pick.
ITS WORKS SALVATION
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
You are correct Hevosmies!
Only ones saying it is "works salvation" are ones like yourself.
What it is?
Is works TOWARDS SANCTIFICATION. IOW? Works meet for "adoption."
But, don't take my word for it. Ask the Father to "take you in!"
Then, come back and call it "works for salvation."
Now you've finally asked a question that should help you.
What is the law that the Lord will write on their hearts and minds?
Is it the Ministration of Death and Condemnation that God writes there?
Or is it the Ministration of Righteousness and Life?
See 2 Corinthians 3:5-9
How is it that legalists don't even understand their own bibles but attempt to teach Christians the law????
U
UnderGrace
Guest
Its no mystery what they are saying.
I just don't know why they deny it to begin with. Maybe they don't understand the implication of their own theology???
Then you have to have a 10 page discussion with them to find out that Yes they do believe in works based Salvation.
Works based everything. And they try to teach!!!!
The strange thing is that you never hear them actually teaching Christianity. They can only teach what they know. Working.
1 Corinthians 1:30-31
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.
HAhahahahaha...Excellent!!
The debate is done, closure
IF only they could understand.
NayborBear
Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
If only you would understand.
It is not I nor anyone else teaching "works salvation!"
Just "witnessing" against you!
Only YOU, and your fellow "stuck in the mud" ilk, saying that is what is going on!
But, it isn't!
Without repentance and Justification a man cannot receive the anointing of the Holy Spirit which writes the Laws of God on his heart. So repentance and justification sets up the man to receive what brings him to the New Creation.
Rom 8:9-10 NIV
(9) You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
(10) But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness.
If a man has not gone through Repentance, Justification, Baptism and pressed in and waited expectantly for the anointing of the Holy Spirit, then he would still naturally/carnally rebel against the Law. "IF" as Paul says in the verses above a man has the Spirit of God dwelling in him, he doen not yet "belong to Christ" same as saying belong to the "anointed".
Paul uses the word "IF" conditionally because many who contend to belong to Christ do not and hence need to find where in the progression they left off and return and obediently follow that path.
SG
Did this "obey torah today[circumcision, fringes, not letting a razor touch corners of your head]" salvation package come from IKEA? Cause its in parts and its a do-it-yourself salvation!
Its aiight doe! if you get bored of assembling your salvation package you can always take a breather and return to the drawing board, come back and try again! Tools come with the box I heard! IKEA is very thoughtful. Swedish meatballs upstairs!
U
UnderGrace
Guest
As a great Christian writer (George MacDonald) pointed out, every father is pleased at the baby’s first attempt to walk: no father would be satisfied with anything less than a firm, free, manly walk in a grown-up son. In the same way, he said, “God is easy to please, but hard to satisfy.”
I think every one who has some vague belief in God, until he becomes a Christian, has the idea of an exam or of a bargain in his mind. The first result of real Christianity is to blow that idea into bits. When they find it blown into bits, some people think this means that Christianity is a failure and give up. They seem to imagine that God is very simple-minded! In fact, of course, He knows all about this. One of the very things Christianity was designed to do was to blow this idea to bits. God has been waiting for the moment at which you discover that there is no question of earning a pass mark in this exam or putting Him in your debt.
Then comes another discovery. Every faculty you have, your power of thinking or of moving your limbs from moment to moment, is given you by God. If you devoted every moment of your whole life exclusively to His service you could not give Him anything that was not in a sense His own already. So that when we talk of a man doing anything for God or giving anything to God, I will tell you what it is really like. It is like a small child going to his father and saying, “Daddy, give me sixpence to buy you a birthday present.” Of course, the father does, and he is pleased with the child’s present. It is all very nice and proper, but only an idiot would think that the father is sixpence to the good on the transaction. When a man has made these two discoveries God can really get to work. It is after this that real life begins.
- C.S. Lewis, from Mere Christianity
This can be a over philsophical topic, with very flowery sppech. Im looking bottom line. DO you have a spirit body or a flesh body?
John 3:5-6, " 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit."
If you were born of the spirit you would have a spirit body, so indeed humans still live in the flesh. While in the flesh the trial contines.
With that said those that have had a heart change by God's spirit will behave differently, as I have quoted many times:
Hebrews 10:16-17, " 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,” 17 then he adds, “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”
the flesh is against GOd;s law, the spirit guides us to it.
So physically yes we are flesh, if we have GOd's spirit we wont live for the flesh.