The Tabernacle in the Wilderness

Wansvic · Aug 4, 2019

Consider a few things associated with the record of the Gentiles repentance unto life outlined in Acts 10:

Acts 10:47 - Peter asked the other Jews present if they thought it proper to forbid to administer water baptism to those who had received God's Spirit. Why question if it was ok to water baptize someone if water baptism is nothing more than a public display? In answer, God's designed water baptism is much more, it is a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins that opens the door to eternal life. (Mark 1:4)

Acts 11:16-18 - After the events noted in Acts 10, Peter explains to the Jewish leaders that he was not going to withstand God after seeing that God filled them with His Holy Spirit the same way He had them on the Day of Pentecost. What did Peter do in order not to withstand God? He administered water baptism to the Gentiles in the name of the Lord.

"When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life." Acts 11:18

Remember that THROUGH JESUS' NAME whosoever believes in Him shall receive remission of sins. (Acts 10:43) Following the command to get water baptized in Jesus' name one's sins are remitted.

Prior to the recorded event in Acts 10, Jesus stated that there would be a message preached concerning repentance, and remission of sins that would begin at Jerusalem. (Luke 24:47-49) He also said He would send the promise of the Father; meaning the Holy Ghost. What Jesus said definitely happened. The Holy Ghost was sent, and Peter preached the message for the first time at Pentecost in Jerusalem. (Acts 2:1-41)

Luke 24:47-49)
And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
And ye are witnesses of these things.
And, behold, I send the promise of my Father upon you: but tarry ye in the city of Jerusalem, until ye be endued with power from on high.

Acts 10:47-48
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.

Acts 11:16-18
Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.
Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?
When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

Wansvic · Aug 4, 2019

dcontroversal said:

...the word of God came unto John...And he came ... preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;
The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. Luke 3:2-4

And thou, child, (John the Baptist) shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord to prepare his ways;
To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins, Through the tender mercy of our God; Luke 1:76-78

dcontroversal · Aug 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

SO what......that does not say baptism saves, keeps saved or tops off salvation regardless of how any times you twist it or peddle it.......

Wansvic · Aug 4, 2019

Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth. John 17:17-19

Wansvic · Aug 4, 2019

dcontroversal said:

"And thou, child, (John the Baptist) shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord to prepare his ways;
To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins, Through the tender mercy of our God;" Luke 1:76-78

dcontroversal · Aug 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

So what.....John pointed to JESUS and said the LAMB of GOD which takes a way the sin of the world......Salvation is found IN CHRIST by faith....not water immersion......end of story

Wansvic · Aug 4, 2019

dcontroversal said:

Why do you think God would go through all the trouble of having John born and having him in the wilderness introducing the baptism of repentance for remission of sins if there was no significance in one getting water baptized? It is clear God designed water baptism. The emphasis on remission of sins is the whole point of getting water baptized.

It all comes down to rightly dividing the word of truth.

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." 2 Tim 2:15

eternally-gratefull · Aug 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

Why do you think God went through all the trouble of havuing abraham as an adult be circumcised, and teaching in the OT that circumcision was required.. if the nation of Isreal was to be blessed. And even a gentile who wanted to partake, had to be circumcised

Yet tell us plainly, that physical act which representing cleansing had absolutely no part in ones eternal salvation?

Only to teach a new ceremony (which was less painfull) in the NT, and declare it was REQUIRED before one could ever be saved.

That makes utterly no sense at all

bluto · Aug 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

Now pay attention wansvic. Mark 1:1-4. John's purpose was to prepare the way of the Lord, i.e Jesus Christ and this is brought out at Malachi 3:1, "Behold, I am going to send My "angel/messenger," and he will clear the way before Me. And the Lord/Jesus Christ whom you seek, will suddengly come to His temple; and the "angel/messenger" of the covenant in whom you delight, behold, He is coming." says the Lord of hosts."

So the angel/messenger is John the Baptist and at Mark 1:4 it says, "John the Baptist appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins." Now, watch this from Acts 19:1-7, Instead of quoting all the verses I will shorten it up but you can read it for yourself. Vs2 Paul said to them, Did you receive the Holy Spirit WHEN YOU BELIEVED? And they said NO, we have not even heard whether there is a Holy Spirit.

Vs3, And he said, into what then were you baptized? And they said, "Into John's baptism." Vs4, And Paul said, John baptized with the baptism of repentance, telling the people TO BELIEVE IN HIM who was coming after him, that is in Jesus." Vs5, And when they heard this, they were baptized in the name of Jesus. Vs6, And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they began speaking with tongues and prophesying."

So, the baptism of John was for the purpose of preparing the people to believe in Jesus Christ. John's baptism did not save anybody which is the point the Apostle Paul is making, (vs4). Now grant it, this instance at Acts 19 is rather unusual because the book of Acts is a narrative outlining the start of the Church. And as I said before Paul says that God did not send him to baptize but th preach the gospel as outlined at 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. And at 1 Corinthians 2:2, "We preach Jesus Christ and Him crucified." Not preach Jesus Christ and get water baptized as well. I hope and pray this makes sense to you.

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

dcontroversal · Aug 4, 2019

Wansvic said:

Wrong.....no offense but this shows a complete lack of understanding.....do you even know what John's purpose and ministry was about......serious.......and immersion in water DOES NOT remit sins.......it is a PICTURE that sates ONE has already DIED to sin, been put in the GROUND with JESUS and resurrected a NEW creation.......it is NO different than circumcision..........it is an OUTWARD sign of INWARD belief........

AND JOHN'S mission was to PREPARE the way for the coming MESSIAH....the one ANNOUNCING his ARRIVAL.........

Waggles · Aug 4, 2019

Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter
the kingdom of God.
John 3:5

end of story ….

7seasrekeyed · Aug 4, 2019

Waggles said:

actually no

explain what that means to you

what did Jesus really mean?

no I'm not kidding. anybody can plop down a verse and say end of story

no verse stands alone

Nehemiah6 · Aug 4, 2019

Waggles said:

1. Have you heard of "rightly dividing the Word of Truth" and can you see how you have failed to do so?

2. Do you know that water can be a metaphor for either the Word of God, or the Gospel, or the Holy Spirit?

3. Do you know the connection between the Gospel and the New Birth?

4. Do you know that the New Birth is SUPERNATURAL therefore the washing is internal, spiritual, and supernatural?

TITUS 3
4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;
7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

As Stephen told the Jews, the Holy Spirit is telling you through this passage that you do always RESIST the Holy Ghost.

dcontroversal · Aug 4, 2019

7seasrekeyed said:

The funny thing....he peddles that verse ignorantly to mean baptism and then faith for salvation.....while disregarding the fact that it is not even discussing baptism...........Jesus qualifies the statement by saying what he said ---->that which is born of flesh is flesh and that which is born of Spirit is Spirit

A man must be born into this world (conceived) and then be BORN from above spiritually to enter the Kingdom of God

Waggles · Aug 4, 2019

All your theology and excuse making only leads to unbelief which leads to disobedience ….

end of story.

bluto · Aug 4, 2019

Waggles said:

Oh my, how can you be so "Biblically" ignorant waggles? The end of the story is when Jesus Christ said "It is finished." Do you know anything about the "Wof" religious movement and a teacher named Kenneth Copeland?

Your just like him becasue he has a tape called "What Happened From the Cross to the Throne." He said that when Jesus Christ said, "It is finsihed" well it was not finished according to copeland. Jesus still had to go to the pit of hell and get tortued by Satan and his minions and then be born again in hell. Finally God the Father (according to Copeland) bellowed out, "Let Him/Jesus be." Leave Him alone.

So what's my point? Your basically saying the same thing in that it was not finished on that cross because one now has to get water baptized and speak in tongues to be saved. How come the thief on the cross next to Jesus who was saved never got water baptized or spoke in tongues yet Jesus said he would be in Paradise with Him. In fact, I'll bet the thief never even got baptized for repentence by John's baptisme.

What your doing is the same thing the Apostle Paul said at 2 Timothy2:18 where Hymenaeus and Philetus were teaching that the resurrection had already taken place. My point here is Paul said that, and thus they upset the faith of some." This is what your doing with this heretical obsession that a person is lost if they do not get water baptized or speaking in tongues. And btw, what is speaking in tongues according to Acts 2:2-13?

IN GOD THE SON,
bluto

7seasrekeyed · Aug 4, 2019

dcontroversal said:

yup

it's people go 'I have this scripture so go argue with God'

actually, they do say that here

seems any verse with the word water in it is in danger of being misused to mean baptism

mailmandan · Aug 5, 2019

7seasrekeyed said:

Amen! In regards to the word "water" in John 3:5, there are those who would argue that the natural sense of the passage parallels "water" with being born out of a mother’s womb (verse 4) and with "flesh" (verse 6). Simply stated in that case, Jesus told Nicodemus that in order to see the kingdom of God two births are necessary. The first is a physical, literal, "flesh" birth (which is, of course, accompanied by amniotic "water") and the second is Spirit.

There are also those who would argue that Jesus mentions "living water" in John 4:10, 14; 7:37-39 and in John 7:38-39, we read - "He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water. But this He spoke concerning the Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the source of living water and spiritual cleansing. If "water" is arbitrarily defined as baptism, then we could just as justifiably say, "Out of his heart will flow rivers of living baptism" in John 7:38. If this sounds ridiculous, it is no more so than the idea that water baptism is the source or the means of becoming born again.

Yet there are still others who would argue that "water" is used in the Bible as an emblem of the Word of God, and in such uses it is associated with cleansing or washing. (John 15:3; Ephesians 5:26) When we are born again, the Holy Spirit begets new life, Divine life, so that we are said to become "partakers of the divine nature" (2 Peter 1:4). The new birth is brought to pass through "incorruptible seed, by the Word of God, which lives and abides forever" (I Peter 1:23), but the Holy Spirit is the Agent who accomplishes the miracle of regeneration.

So to automatically read "baptism" into John 3:5 simply because it mentions "water" is unwarranted, yet that's what those who promote the false doctrine of baptismal regeneration (including Roman Catholics, Mormons and other works-salvationists) do in order to accommodate their biased church doctrine.

Wansvic · Aug 5, 2019

Consider a few things associated with the record of the Gentiles repentance unto life outlined in Acts 10:

Acts 10:47 - Peter asked the other Jews present if they thought it proper to forbid to administer water baptism to those who had received God's Spirit. Why question if it was ok to water baptize someone if water baptism is nothing more than a public display? In answer, God's designed water baptism is much more, it is a baptism of repentance for the remission of sins that opens the door to eternal life. (Mark 1:4, Lk 1:77, Lk 3:3, Luke 24:47, Acts 2:38; 10:43; Rom 3:25, Jn 20:23)

Acts 11:16-18 - After the events noted in Acts 10, Peter explains to the Jewish leaders that he was not going to withstand God after seeing that God filled them with His Holy Spirit the same way He had them on the Day of Pentecost. What did Peter do in order not to withstand God? He administered water baptism to the Gentiles in the name of the Lord.

"When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life." Acts 11:18

Remember that THROUGH JESUS' NAME whosoever believes in Him shall receive remission of sins. (Acts 10:43) Following the command to get water baptized in Jesus' name one's sins are remitted.

Prior to the recorded event in Acts 10, Jesus stated that there would be a message preached concerning repentance, and remission of sins that would begin at Jerusalem. (Luke 24:47-49) He also said He would send the promise of the Father; meaning the Holy Ghost. What Jesus said definitely happened. The Holy Ghost was sent, and Peter preached the message for the first time at Pentecost in Jerusalem. (Acts 2:1-41)

7seasrekeyed · Aug 5, 2019

Waggles said:

I wish you could hear yourself...or I guess see yourself since it's a post

what? you have no theology? you've been peddling your version for weeks along with wansie now and it is false to state that baptism is a part of salvation and cleanses from sin

baptism is SYMBOLIC and occurs AFTER salvation

the only story that ends is the one you folks are more than a little attached with

so, you and a few others have YOUR theology and YOUR understanding, that you have all been taught, and it's quite simply wrong

and all the huffing and puffing and all the hurtling of Bible verses does nothing but illustrate that you basically dismiss everyone who does not agree with what you say are the instructions for salvation

you know, it really does start to sound like you folks in your congregation (whatever it is called) better march in step or out the door you go

unreasonable

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