Not By Works

[FollowHisSteps]

Do you do God’s will so that you will not lose your salvation? That’s rather selfish of you. Instead, you should do God’s will of bearing fruit for the pure joy of it and rest easily knowing you cannot lose your salvation that is freely and irrevocably given to everyone who has faith in Christ. May God bless you with His glorious truth.

If I did good things to be saved, that is not a bad thing.
Salvation is life, the continuation eternally of life. Good things are good, in and of themselves, they are also life.
Putting the two together is not wrong or evil.

But I do God's will because I love it and I trust Him, and I know His will is love and justice.
It also happens to be the kingdom of God and salvation.

So where is the losing of salvation? To lose salvation I would have to do evil and walk away from God, which
is self destruction, hurt, pain and unbelievably stupid going on knowing what life is, I do not want to do this.

All your other outworkings and words just do not enter my mind. They come from not seeing God or what
salvation, love and righteousness is.

The odd lie is to say I follow God because I am scared of not following God.
Do you see how nuts that sounds?

It comes from the world that says Gods ways are impossible and we are so bound to sin it is delusion
to believe God could love us and free us. But that is just unbelief in the cross and His word.
God bless you

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You’ve totally taking my words out of context. In other news, water is wet.

The HOPE of eternal life, which God, who CAN NOT LIE, promised before time began. (The apostle paul)


They do not believe you have eternal life, they preach conditional life, it is they who have no hope.. Our hope is in Gods promises, not in our own righteousness

 

[Smooth]

In regards to Matthew 7:21-23, (I will never forget, prior to my conversion several years ago while still attending the Roman Catholic church) I read Matthew 7:22 and thought to myself, oh my goodness! These many people accomplished all of that, "prophesied in His name, cast out demons, and did many wonderful works" but that still was not "good enough?" Then I thought to myself at that time, how am I going to "top that" and be "good enough?" Such is the mindset of someone who believes that obtaining salvation is based on works.

Matthew 7:21 - Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. *John 6:40 - For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in Him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.

These many people (unbelievers) in Matthew 7:22 had the wrong foundation. They were trusting in their works to save them and NOT IN CHRIST ALONE. Jesus NEVER knew them which means they were NEVER saved. Their hearts were not right with God, so their "attempted external obedience" (apart from the righteousness of God which is by faith and the blood of Christ) was stained with sin. *Seeking salvation by works is not the will of the Father.

John 17:3 - And this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent. The term "know" implies intimate, experiential knowledge, through a relationship with Him, not merely theoretical knowledge. These many people were not true converts. *Without faith it's impossible to please God no matter how many alleged wonderful works that these many people set out to conjure up through the flesh in a vain effort to obtain salvation based on works. This is why Jesus referred to these many people as "workers of iniquity." God does not see the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus (Romans 4:5-6; Philippians 3:9) in unbelievers, but He see's all of their sins which remain and have not been washed away by the blood of Christ.

Matthew 7:21-23 frightened me to the core. One day I met with my pastor and shared my fear with him. He smiled and enlightened me to the glorious truth that because I worried about it meant that I actually had nothing to worry about. God knows my heart (our hearts) and His grace is sufficient. ❤️🙏

 

[Smooth]

16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.
John 3

Amen. If you want to believe I oppose this, that is your understanding. I just rejoice in Jesus and His saving
grace and His work in my life, Amen.

You oppose it because you deem your works are necessary to maintain salvation.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

You’re self righteous in believing your works justify the maintaining of your salvation. Believing your works are greater than Jesus Christ’s is the epitome of self righteousness. This doesn’t necessarily mean you’re a bad person, but it definitely at the very least means you are incomprehensibly misguided. May God open your eyes to His glorious truth.

Hi Smooth,

I could empathise with this logic, but it is simply nonsense.
God has made me His child, filled me with the Holy Spirit and guides my path in His ways.
I cannot maintain something God has made, I can though pollute and dishonour His work.
You suggest I maintain something which I cannot, and I exalt my deeds above Christ, when
Christ is the source of my deeds in the Spirit.

So it is simply not a discussion point as your assertions are not true.
It is strange to me, that though you claim you are a work of God you talk as if you are
a work of something else which is dominated by another force. God bless you in the grace
of our Loving Lord Jesus Christ

 

[fredoheaven]

That's why you are wrong.

John 15:
1“I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. 2He cuts off every branch in me that bears no fruit, while every branch that does bear fruit he prunes a so that it will be even more fruitful. 3You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you. 4Remain in me, as I also remain in you. No branch can bear fruit by itself; it must remain in the vine. Neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in me.

5“I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. 7If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you. 8This is to my Father’s glory, that you bear much fruit, showing yourselves to be my disciples.

9“As the Father has loved me, so have I loved you. Now remain in my love. 10If you keep my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commands and remain in his love. 11I have told you this so that my joy may be in you and that your joy may be complete. 12My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. 13Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends. 14You are my friends if you do what I command.

Giving me a bible verses won't work on me. You have nothing to offer I guess. You can't even expound John 15. Now it my turn to give one verse that may speak for you.

King James Version
Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

 

[Smooth]

The victim of too much summary and not enough context. Who can blame the reader for taking
a different context than the one you meant to yourself but never wrote

It is like writing up an experiment and saying, we did the experiment and it worked.
Other than being a conclusion by the writer as to their feelings about the experiment it conveys nothing else.
dc loves these type of comments, which though that is sharing his attitudes adds nothing more.

I’m sorry you’re unable to grasp context.

 

[DeighAnn]

Yesterday, I posted verses that all state in some way that "salvation" can be lost. Since then, they are all getting disputed, by some nicely written papers I must admit. And though I will go back and read them all I really am having very much difficulty with it all. But here is my problem.
How could God have ALWAYS HAVE MEANT SOMETHING ELSE? Its like I am being told that " GOD OWN WORDS ARE TRYING TO DECEIVE ME". And I think this is starting to feel a bit like lots of truth but JUST A slight twist that changes the truth to a lie to ......This warning given at the beginning of the book,
Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And HE SAID unto the woman, YEA, HATH GOD SAID, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
Genesis 3:2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
Genesis 3:3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
Genesis 3:4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
Genesis 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
Genesis 3:6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
I find it hard to believe that God wrote the bible so that NO ONE except for those who really studid it in depth could ever pick out its "truths" from its "seemingly truths".

Apparently, I have a problem with "CONTEXT" and I am just reading into such seemly simple verses what ever I want, which seems to never be the message God is trying to convey. IF THIS IS TRUE, I WISH TO APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE AND EVERYONE WHO MAY HAVE READ ANY COMMENTS THAT MAY HAVE BEEN DECEIVING IN ANY WAY. I WOULD NEVER UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE TRY AND DECEIVE ANYONE ABOUT GODS WORD FOR ANY REASON. I WOULD TURN ON MY MOTHER AND FATHER BEFORE I WOULD EVER DO THAT. PLEASE KNOW THIS IS TRUE. I will, I promise, state my study results. It may take a while. But I will.

 

[Noose]

Giving me a bible verses won't work on me. You have nothing to offer I guess. You can't even expound John 15. Now it my turn to give one verse that may speak for you.

King James Version
Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Ok.
That doesn't work on me too. so what?
John 15 is clear enough.

 

[Smooth]

If I did good things to be saved, that is not a bad thing.

It most certainly is a bad thing. Actually it’s the worst of the worst. You’re putting your trust in yourself rather than solely in the atoning death and glorious Resurrection of Jesus Christ.

 

[fredoheaven]

Ok.
That doesn't work on me too. so what?
John 15 is clear enough.

Then clear enough what?

 

[FollowHisSteps]

You oppose it because you deem your works are necessary to maintain salvation.

Pardon. I oppose your ideas because I deem my life is needed to have salvation? Really, lol.
I walk with Jesus, I dwell in the Spirit, I bring praise to Him for who He is, Amen.

15 Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life in him.
1 John 3

We are either works of Christ to eternity or we are not.
Being born from on high has this terrible reality. I pray and hope you know His grace and love in your
life, because some of your sharing shows the Lord has done much in your heart. So I always have hope
as I do with all who I meet. We are called to be like Christ in His example

47 "As for the person who hears my words but does not keep them, I do not judge him.
For I did not come to judge the world, but to save it.
48 There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words; that
very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.
49 For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who sent me commanded
me what to say and how to say it.
John 12

 

[Noose]

Then clear enough what?

Clear that Jesus removes the unfruitful branches from Himself and burns them because no one can do anything apart from Him (Jesus).

 

[fredoheaven]

Clear that Jesus removes the unfruitful branches from Himself and burns them because no one can do anything apart from Him (Jesus).

Umm, so who did the burning and who are these unfruitful branches?

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

 

[FollowHisSteps]

It most certainly is a bad thing. Actually it’s the worst of the worst. You’re putting your trust in yourself rather than solely in the atoning death and glorious Resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Hi Smooth,

This is one serious problem with the approach you share.
Doing good can never be evil. God called Nineveh to repent and do good and they were not good people
or even people of faith.

Once you make good deeds evil you have changed kingdoms and theology. This is sin, and grevious to the Lord.
The Lord rewards good deeds and has always done so.

In Sodom and Gomorrah he searched for a righteous person.
In Noahs flood he searched for any good deeds and found only Noah.

5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time.
Gen 6

Smooth, you then take deeds and accuse by doing good one is trying to justify oneself against the
work of Christ. This is all simply missing the point about goodness comes from God and His blessing
in our hearts shinning through, part of us being created in the image of God.

We believe in Jesus because He is God and our redemption, as well as being the way, the truth and the life.
For me you are obviously very naive to think we do anything to justify ourselves, rather this is an offering
of praise and the fruit of hearts to our King, Amen.

 

[fredoheaven]

Clear that Jesus removes the unfruitful branches from Himself and burns them because no one can do anything apart from Him (Jesus).

Did Jesus himself removes them?

 

[Noose]

Umm, so who did the burning and who are these unfruitful branches?

If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Doesn't matter, they were cast out from the body of Christ and burned. The unfruitful branches are those that do not do good to others.

 

[fredoheaven]

Noose, be clear please.

Thanks

 

[fredoheaven]

Doesn't matter, they were cast out from the body of Christ and burned. The unfruitful branches are those that do not do good to others.

Why it doesn't matter? Is that so?

 

[Noose]

Did Jesus himself removes them?

Doesn't matter, the branches are not eternally attached to Christ, they can be cast out never to be reattached again.