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Yes.
And the same with salvation.
Any evangelist knows when preaching to a crowd,there are far more with unplowed hearts than those who the Holy Spirit has been working on.
Normally the salvation message is hurled out like a fireball into the human. Most do not receive,but those that do feel the fireball burn deep into them.
The same with the baptism in the Holy Ghost.
It is ONLY for the hungry. The serious "God pursuer"
To the satisfied,it is just a sport of mockery.
Shudder....gives me chills because i know what they are in fact doing.
Completely oblivious.
And the same with salvation.
Any evangelist knows when preaching to a crowd,there are far more with unplowed hearts than those who the Holy Spirit has been working on.
Normally the salvation message is hurled out like a fireball into the human. Most do not receive,but those that do feel the fireball burn deep into them.
The same with the baptism in the Holy Ghost.
It is ONLY for the hungry. The serious "God pursuer"
To the satisfied,it is just a sport of mockery.
Shudder....gives me chills because i know what they are in fact doing.
Completely oblivious.
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Because people like you tell him that because he don't speak in tongues he's not a serious pursuer of God or that he's not saved, and what he sees from the people who speak in tongues and claimed to be baptized in the Holy Spirit is that stuff in the videos, and those things going on in those videos are clear and obvious poppycock. Maybe if one of y'all wanted to love walking love and exhibit Christ to him and verify to him the confidence of the baptism of the Holy Spirit you might show him something different. By exhibiting some of the fruit of the Spirit.
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More like they are not deceived by erroneous teaching.
Speaking in tongues in the context of the prophecy as spoken by Isaiah and fulfilled in the book of Acts has no reason to occur anymore. It’s mission was completed. So anyone now thinking they speak in a language which should be intelligible by the way not babble is deceived and operating in the demonic realm.
Tongues were a sign for the unbelieving Jews, not for any other reason. It was a warning by God that the temple in Jerusalem would be destroyed. And it was in AD70
It’s interesting when people think tongues first appears in the NT. As soon as they quote from the NT you know immediately they are unlearned and ignorant of the bible and also deceived by lies.
Speaking in tongues in the context of the prophecy as spoken by Isaiah and fulfilled in the book of Acts has no reason to occur anymore. It’s mission was completed. So anyone now thinking they speak in a language which should be intelligible by the way not babble is deceived and operating in the demonic realm.
Tongues were a sign for the unbelieving Jews, not for any other reason. It was a warning by God that the temple in Jerusalem would be destroyed. And it was in AD70
It’s interesting when people think tongues first appears in the NT. As soon as they quote from the NT you know immediately they are unlearned and ignorant of the bible and also deceived by lies.
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Wow, I was kind of surprised from the reaction to this post, but praise God it looks like you brought everyone together to directly oppose what you're saying in unity. 
to be honest I think Acts 2 does describe what you're saying here. Let's read what it says.
2 When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. 3 And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.
5 Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. 6 And at this sound the multitude came together, and they were bewildered, because each one was hearing them speak in his own language. 7 And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? 8 And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language? 9 Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, 11 both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians—we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God.”
Now I can see a case being made that maybe different people were speaking in different tongues, like each group had someone speaking in their tongue, but to be honest I think the text supports what he is saying more. I do not believe this 1 event defines completely what tongues is, as in I think in different parts of the Bible tongues is described a bit differently that expands on what tongues is and is used in a believers life.
So as far as the way you worded it as if this is the only "tongues", as if this is what "tongues is", I do disagree with that. That does not have any bearing on my agreeing with you that I believe this is absolutely supported by the text here. In my opinion of course.
Whats funny to me is one who was "correcting" you completely inserted an interpreter into the text as if that was a FACT, and the text clearly and very specifically says " we hear, each of us in his own native”, yet rebukes you and complete inserts an interpreter??? Please point me to the part where that is written.
to be honest I think Acts 2 does describe what you're saying here. Let's read what it says.2 When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. 3 And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.
"Praise Jesus!!!"
5 Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. 6 And at this sound the multitude came together, and they were bewildered, because each one was hearing them speak in his own language. 7 And they were amazed and astonished, saying, “Are not all these who are speaking Galileans? 8 And how is it that we hear, each of us in his own native language? 9 Parthians and Medes and Elamites and residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia, 10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya belonging to Cyrene, and visitors from Rome, 11 both Jews and proselytes, Cretans and Arabians—we hear them telling in our own tongues the mighty works of God.”
Now I can see a case being made that maybe different people were speaking in different tongues, like each group had someone speaking in their tongue, but to be honest I think the text supports what he is saying more. I do not believe this 1 event defines completely what tongues is, as in I think in different parts of the Bible tongues is described a bit differently that expands on what tongues is and is used in a believers life.
So as far as the way you worded it as if this is the only "tongues", as if this is what "tongues is", I do disagree with that. That does not have any bearing on my agreeing with you that I believe this is absolutely supported by the text here. In my opinion of course.
Whats funny to me is one who was "correcting" you completely inserted an interpreter into the text as if that was a FACT, and the text clearly and very specifically says " we hear, each of us in his own native”, yet rebukes you and complete inserts an interpreter??? Please point me to the part where that is written.
L
I'll just share my experience here so that it may help someone..., who knows?
I used to attend charismatic churches, and sought after speaking in tongues which I never did do earnestly. Now I have heard folks speak in tongues millions of times, once I heard it interpreted that I was and am convinced was genuine. The man who did the interpretation usually was difficult to understand his normal speech was heavily laden with southern drawl and a heavy gravelly voice, but when he interpreted tongues that night his voice was clear and had a smooth clear tone. This was something to behold. It happened once in several years.
I have also been prophecied over on several occasions thus far one has proved out to be true.
I have never spoken in tongues but I have had prophetic dreams that did indeed come to pass, however I did not understand the vision until it happened. One example I dreamed that I was in the home of a person that I didn't know at the time and that home didn't even exist at the time in the room was all member of the music team and their families, except one person and it was the woman who lead the music team. A tornado that had a demonic female face on it was coming across the field behind the house, and the everyone there prayed together and the tornado went over and only made a lot of noise and shook the house violently and it seemed as though everyone was ok but we all left and went our separate ways. Later perhaps a few months, I was on that music team and the team leader had an affair with a married man and it cause a lot of chaos in the church. She was stepped down and a new leader appointed, that Christmas we were at her the new leaders house for a Christmas party, it was the house and the field and all the same people were in the room and I saw the images of the dream of the tornado because of the extreme similarities. For me that marks the beginning of the end of that Church. When troubles hit that everyone tried to stick it out but, that church disbanded, and a new church took over in it's place and I was a part of the new church that sprung up right there, and that church is quite successful there.
The dream was terrifying and stayed with me even though I didn't know what it was about or even if it was anything at all. Now it signifies all that happened.
The time that I was prophesied to, I was visiting a church up by where my family lives my cousin's church. Then after the service they asked to pray for me and my family, so the began praying and told me that the Lord had shodd my feet for a major move to some where but didn't know the place that the Lord was sending me. I asked them where and they said God would reveal in time. Then about a year later I was placed in a position where I was pressed to move to where I am now. So yes indeed the Lord did prepare a move for me and then put me on it. 350 miles the opposite direction from where I wanted to go. And I understand that this might sound weird to some people, but this is why I'm not a cessationist, I have personally witnessed too much to deny that the operation of the Holy Spirit is still in play. I have also witnessed a bunch of woo woo bologna so I know it when I see it.
All this being said, I have never spoken in tongues that I'm aware of; even with all of the evidences of the Holy Spirit working in my life, and working through me. so I do not believe that speaking in tongues is necessarily part of salvation.
I believe that the moment that you sincerely surrender to the lordship of Jesus Christ you are saved and sealed by the Holy Spirit and that from that very moment the Holy Spirit begins working in your life and that your engagement with the calling in the working of the Holy Spirit definitely determined the experiences you have.
The more you seek God and the kingdom of heaven the more experiences you will have with God.
I used to attend charismatic churches, and sought after speaking in tongues which I never did do earnestly. Now I have heard folks speak in tongues millions of times, once I heard it interpreted that I was and am convinced was genuine. The man who did the interpretation usually was difficult to understand his normal speech was heavily laden with southern drawl and a heavy gravelly voice, but when he interpreted tongues that night his voice was clear and had a smooth clear tone. This was something to behold. It happened once in several years.
I have also been prophecied over on several occasions thus far one has proved out to be true.
I have never spoken in tongues but I have had prophetic dreams that did indeed come to pass, however I did not understand the vision until it happened. One example I dreamed that I was in the home of a person that I didn't know at the time and that home didn't even exist at the time in the room was all member of the music team and their families, except one person and it was the woman who lead the music team. A tornado that had a demonic female face on it was coming across the field behind the house, and the everyone there prayed together and the tornado went over and only made a lot of noise and shook the house violently and it seemed as though everyone was ok but we all left and went our separate ways. Later perhaps a few months, I was on that music team and the team leader had an affair with a married man and it cause a lot of chaos in the church. She was stepped down and a new leader appointed, that Christmas we were at her the new leaders house for a Christmas party, it was the house and the field and all the same people were in the room and I saw the images of the dream of the tornado because of the extreme similarities. For me that marks the beginning of the end of that Church. When troubles hit that everyone tried to stick it out but, that church disbanded, and a new church took over in it's place and I was a part of the new church that sprung up right there, and that church is quite successful there.
The dream was terrifying and stayed with me even though I didn't know what it was about or even if it was anything at all. Now it signifies all that happened.
The time that I was prophesied to, I was visiting a church up by where my family lives my cousin's church. Then after the service they asked to pray for me and my family, so the began praying and told me that the Lord had shodd my feet for a major move to some where but didn't know the place that the Lord was sending me. I asked them where and they said God would reveal in time. Then about a year later I was placed in a position where I was pressed to move to where I am now. So yes indeed the Lord did prepare a move for me and then put me on it. 350 miles the opposite direction from where I wanted to go. And I understand that this might sound weird to some people, but this is why I'm not a cessationist, I have personally witnessed too much to deny that the operation of the Holy Spirit is still in play. I have also witnessed a bunch of woo woo bologna so I know it when I see it.
All this being said, I have never spoken in tongues that I'm aware of; even with all of the evidences of the Holy Spirit working in my life, and working through me. so I do not believe that speaking in tongues is necessarily part of salvation.
I believe that the moment that you sincerely surrender to the lordship of Jesus Christ you are saved and sealed by the Holy Spirit and that from that very moment the Holy Spirit begins working in your life and that your engagement with the calling in the working of the Holy Spirit definitely determined the experiences you have.
The more you seek God and the kingdom of heaven the more experiences you will have with God.
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Petercito, post: 3931056, member: 284931"]Tongues or languages were a sign for the Nation of Israel to repent. It is prophesied in the book of Isaiah which is quoted in and fulfilled in Acts. It was a particular message for the unbelieving Jews. The message was the same and understood by all the Jewish people from every Nation in their own language. It is not mindless babble or some mysterious language. Gifts of the Spirit of God we’re also a sign from God that Jesus was “The Anointed One” or The Christ”. Jesus was given the power and authority from His Father to do those miracles. Jesus gave His Apostles that authority as evidence or proof that they “the apostles” were eye witnesses of the the things Jesus did. The gifts of the spirit could only be passed on by the apostles, so once they died and thie last generation of the people who had been given any gifts by the apostles had died the gifts ceased with them. It is very clearly written in the bible if you bother to actually study and don’t have false preconceived ideas about what is being said
you know, I question why new members, in this case someone who only joined yesterday, believes that whatever they think they have to contribute, needs some edgy sarcasm with it. I refer to the bolded type above
news flash peter:
people here do study. yes, we actually do study. quite a number of us in fact, although I cannot speak for everyone of course
interestingly, many of us Bereans, once again having dilegently studied, are pleased to inform you that you are totally wrong and we have heard your 'position' on the gifts before
I can guarantee you that if you refrain from smearing people you do not know (unless of course you are an old member returning with a new name) with bigoted statements such as the above, you will receive polite replies
however, if you are here to pick a side, I am sure the other side will warmly welcome your cough cough comments written with the clear intention of appearing superior to those who are not cessationist in their view of the gifts
you know, I question why new members, in this case someone who only joined yesterday, believes that whatever they think they have to contribute, needs some edgy sarcasm with it. I refer to the bolded type above
news flash peter:
people here do study. yes, we actually do study. quite a number of us in fact, although I cannot speak for everyone of course
interestingly, many of us Bereans, once again having dilegently studied, are pleased to inform you that you are totally wrong and we have heard your 'position' on the gifts before
I can guarantee you that if you refrain from smearing people you do not know (unless of course you are an old member returning with a new name) with bigoted statements such as the above, you will receive polite replies
however, if you are here to pick a side, I am sure the other side will warmly welcome your cough cough comments written with the clear intention of appearing superior to those who are not cessationist in their view of the gifts
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yeah yah know Paul does not say that when he lists the gifts of the Spirit
however, it would be wise for ALL believers to understand what we are given in the Bible regarding how the devil works
I cannot find any scripture that tells me that there is a 'deliverance ministry' as so many practice it today. yes, there is the gift of discerning of spirits, but I don't think it is a separate ministry
people read about the armor Paul speaks of and seem to think he was either superstitious or clinically depressed and reach the conclusion that Christians cannot be harmed by satan
that, would be a WRONG conclusion
however, it would be wise for ALL believers to understand what we are given in the Bible regarding how the devil works
I cannot find any scripture that tells me that there is a 'deliverance ministry' as so many practice it today. yes, there is the gift of discerning of spirits, but I don't think it is a separate ministry
people read about the armor Paul speaks of and seem to think he was either superstitious or clinically depressed and reach the conclusion that Christians cannot be harmed by satan
that, would be a WRONG conclusion
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I didn't copy yr entire post because of the length of it but Paul states clearly not everyone speaks in tongues
I understand, from that, there are other gifts which they may have instead
clearly, many do speak in tongues and yet also exhibit other manifestations of the Holy Spirit
people do not know what they are talking about if they say you MUST speak in tongues. Paul does write he wishes everyone would
and I am certainly glad that I do, but at the same time, God decides and there are fakers out there as well
I understand, from that, there are other gifts which they may have instead
clearly, many do speak in tongues and yet also exhibit other manifestations of the Holy Spirit
people do not know what they are talking about if they say you MUST speak in tongues. Paul does write he wishes everyone would
and I am certainly glad that I do, but at the same time, God decides and there are fakers out there as well
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Great! But that is not a command, it is simply a statement that this will be one of the signs that follow those who go into all the world.
Has that happened? Yes, and it still is happening today.
But that is quite different than requiring tongues for every believer - or saying that you must speak in tongues to be a "real" Christian.
Has that happened? Yes, and it still is happening today.
But that is quite different than requiring tongues for every believer - or saying that you must speak in tongues to be a "real" Christian.
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There are things I believe wholeheartedly. Studied prayed sought listened. Because of this some of my stands may seem inflexible.
Yet the over-riding thing in my mind is, I'm human. Stupid arrogant blind ignorant. And because of that, I always leave at least 10% chance that I may in fact be wrong.
So, what if we're wrong?
Like on the tongues thing, many of you know me to be a staunch proponent. But I do from time to time ask myself, what if I am wrong? Then what I've involved myself in is foolishness. And yes as a human I'm prone to foolishness. But then I also think, wow, even in my foolishness, God honored my prayers anyways - and caused what I was praying over to come thru to His glory despite my foolishness! Wow. Even in my foolishness HE came thru.
But if you believe they have ceased... what if you're wrong? You've just blasphemed the Holy Spirit.
So, before any of you continue in your blasphemes, I invite you to ask yourself,
what if you are wrong?
Yet the over-riding thing in my mind is, I'm human. Stupid arrogant blind ignorant. And because of that, I always leave at least 10% chance that I may in fact be wrong.
So, what if we're wrong?
Like on the tongues thing, many of you know me to be a staunch proponent. But I do from time to time ask myself, what if I am wrong? Then what I've involved myself in is foolishness. And yes as a human I'm prone to foolishness. But then I also think, wow, even in my foolishness, God honored my prayers anyways - and caused what I was praying over to come thru to His glory despite my foolishness! Wow. Even in my foolishness HE came thru.
But if you believe they have ceased... what if you're wrong? You've just blasphemed the Holy Spirit.
So, before any of you continue in your blasphemes, I invite you to ask yourself,
what if you are wrong?
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And there's always 1 Cor 14 :
36 Or did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it has reached? 37 If anyone thinks they are a prophet or otherwise gifted by the Spirit, let them acknowledge that what I am writing to you is the Lord’s command. 38 But if anyone ignores this, they will themselves be ignored.[h] 39 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.
Pretty much confirms, if you don't believe this is God's command, you should be ignored.
36 Or did the word of God originate with you? Or are you the only people it has reached? 37 If anyone thinks they are a prophet or otherwise gifted by the Spirit, let them acknowledge that what I am writing to you is the Lord’s command. 38 But if anyone ignores this, they will themselves be ignored.[h] 39 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, be eager to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.
Pretty much confirms, if you don't believe this is God's command, you should be ignored.
The problem with this post is that you are not rightly dividing the word of God. You provide misinformation as well as clump together scriptures that convey an entirely inaccurate picture of what the word actually says regarding the gift of the Holy Ghost required for one's spiritual rebirth. And Spiritual gifts given to the church body.
The pouring of the Holy Ghost into the bodies of the Jewish people present at Pentecost was not an experience exclusive to them. The biblical record states that the Gentiles had the same experience and received the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues without anyone laying hands upon them (Acts 10:44-48). The Samaritans (Acts 8:14-18) as well as disciples from Ephesus (19:6) did receive the Holy Ghost with at least one specifically mentioning, and the other implying, they spoke in tongues after apostles laid their hands upon them. Therefore the biblical record attests to the truth that the gift of the Holy Ghost can be poured into someone spontaneously, upon the laying on of hands, or as Luke 11:13 conveys one can receive it upon asking the Lord for it.
Some quoted scriptures pertain to an individual's bodily infilling of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 1:8, 4:31-33, 8:18, 19:6) The actual gift of the Holy Ghost required for one's spiritual rebirth. And have nothing to do with the Spiritual gifts given by the Holy Ghost to further the churches mission to draw others who will become children of God.
As far as your assessment that one can ONLY receive a Spiritual gift by the laying on of one's hands is contradicted by the word. These gifts can be received through prayer. (1 Cor 14:13) Also, the Holy Spirit distributes them as He will. (1 Cor 12:7:11)
In addition, it makes no sense nor does the biblical record imply that Spiritual gifts would cease when the church's mission is still ongoing. Spiritual gifts will no longer be required when Jesus returns for His bride.
The pouring of the Holy Ghost into the bodies of the Jewish people present at Pentecost was not an experience exclusive to them. The biblical record states that the Gentiles had the same experience and received the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues without anyone laying hands upon them (Acts 10:44-48). The Samaritans (Acts 8:14-18) as well as disciples from Ephesus (19:6) did receive the Holy Ghost with at least one specifically mentioning, and the other implying, they spoke in tongues after apostles laid their hands upon them. Therefore the biblical record attests to the truth that the gift of the Holy Ghost can be poured into someone spontaneously, upon the laying on of hands, or as Luke 11:13 conveys one can receive it upon asking the Lord for it.
Some quoted scriptures pertain to an individual's bodily infilling of the Holy Spirit. (Acts 1:8, 4:31-33, 8:18, 19:6) The actual gift of the Holy Ghost required for one's spiritual rebirth. And have nothing to do with the Spiritual gifts given by the Holy Ghost to further the churches mission to draw others who will become children of God.
As far as your assessment that one can ONLY receive a Spiritual gift by the laying on of one's hands is contradicted by the word. These gifts can be received through prayer. (1 Cor 14:13) Also, the Holy Spirit distributes them as He will. (1 Cor 12:7:11)
In addition, it makes no sense nor does the biblical record imply that Spiritual gifts would cease when the church's mission is still ongoing. Spiritual gifts will no longer be required when Jesus returns for His bride.
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