Amillennialists...Here's a chance to state your case.
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Jer 8: 30 The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord, saying, 2 “Thus speaks the Lord God of Israel, saying: ‘Write in a book for yourself all the words that I have spoken to you. 3 For behold, the days are coming,’ says the Lord, ‘that I will bring back from captivity My people Israel and Judah,’ says the Lord. ‘And I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.’ ”
Can someone explain when this happened/or will happen?
Noting, that although Judah was returned to the land after babylon, they were never truly restored. And Israel as it appears has never returned to her own land since assyria took her.
Can someone explain when this happened/or will happen?
Noting, that although Judah was returned to the land after babylon, they were never truly restored. And Israel as it appears has never returned to her own land since assyria took her.
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It seems like you just completely disregarded the points I made in my Post #637:
[quoting]
[re: Palm Sunday fulfillment of the 69 Weeks] that was the very day that:
--Jesus spoke the words of Luke 19:41-44 ("he beheld the city, and wept over it, Saying, 'If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes. [...]"); and
--Jesus did the action of Zechariah 9:9 ("thy King cometh unto thee" [unto Jerusalem / the city (see Dan9:24-"Seventy Weeks are determined upon thy [Daniel's] people, and upon thy [Daniel's] holy city...")]); and
--thus also fulfilling Exodus 12:2,3,5,6 ("In the tenth day of this month" ["the first month of the year to you"], "ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.") This fulfills the "be cut off" ("and after 62 Week shall he be cut off, but not for himself [or, and have nothing]" Dan9:26a [note: this verse has SEQUENTIAL THINGS in it, followed by the SEQUENTIAL THINGS in v.27a/b/c!])
The next thing in the SEQUENCE ^ was not the 70th Week, but the "shall destroy the city and the sanctuary" (also Dan9:26, here 26b+; i.e. the 70ad events).
____________
[...and the Matthew 22:7 & v.8 SEQUENCE that parallels this ^ , which was toward the bottom of that post]
I remain unconvinced of your argument. You'll have to work much harder, in order to show how that "sequence" issue does not matter.
TDW: The "SEALS" are "the beginning of birth PANGS" (and these "kick off" the 7-yr trib), ALL of which FOLLOW "the 70ad events [including "they shall be led away captive into all the nations" per Lk21:24!!]" (but not "immediately follow" 70ad )
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[for the readers of this thread, for reference ]
Re: the "vineyard" issue... [in view of what I'd said re: Isaiah 5:7 "the vineyard of the Lord of hosts is the house of Israel..." (and in Jesus' parables)]
...note how "vineyard" is talked about in:
--Matthew 20-21 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Matt23-25]
--Mark 12 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Mk 13]
--Luke 13:6 [note vv.14 & 17], Luke 20:9-16 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Lk21 (with only vv.12-24 speaking of the 70ad events)]
--not mentioned in John (or elsewhere)
]Re: the "vineyard" issue... [in view of what I'd said re: Isaiah 5:7 "the vineyard of the Lord of hosts is the house of Israel..." (and in Jesus' parables)]
...note how "vineyard" is talked about in:
--Matthew 20-21 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Matt23-25]
--Mark 12 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Mk 13]
--Luke 13:6 [note vv.14 & 17], Luke 20:9-16 [then the Olivet Discourse is in Lk21 (with only vv.12-24 speaking of the 70ad events)]
--not mentioned in John (or elsewhere)
Here is what Milton Terry says about figurative language used in prophecy:
Milton Terry - Professor of Hebrew and Old Testament exegesis and theology
Apocalypse of the Synoptic Gospels chapter 19 page 239.
Partial quotes, weblink below:
(1) The texts of Mark and Matthew are so closely parallel that we may safely accept them as in substance a portion of the best attested sayings of Jesus. The differences of phraseology are too slight to involve any important difference in the meaning.
(2) The language is appropriated in the main from the books of Isaiah and Daniel, but also from other prophets. The following passages are particularly in point :
For the stars of heaven and their constellations shall not shed forth their light;
Dark is the sun in his going forth,
And the moon shall not cause her light to shine (Isa. 13, 10).
And all the host of the heavens shall be melted,
And the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll,
And all their host shall fall,
As falls a leaf from the vine,
And as a fallen fig from the fig tree (Isa. 34:4).24
From these quotations it is apparent that there is scarcely an expression employed in Matthew and Luke which has not been taken from the Old Testament Scriptures.
(3) Such apocalyptic forms of speech are not to be assumed to convey in the New Testament a meaning different from that which they bear in the Hebrew Scriptures. They are part and parcel of the genius of prophetic language. The language of Isa. 13, 10, is used in a prophecy of the overthrow of Babylon. That of Isa. 24, 4, refers to the desolation of Edom. The ideal of "the Son of man coming in the clouds" is taken from a prophecy of the Messianic kingdom, which kingdom, as depicted in Dan. 7:13,14, is no other than the one symbolized in the same book by a stone cut out of the mountain (Dan. 2:34, 35).
It is the same kingdom of heaven which Jesus likened to a grain of mustard seed and to the working of leaven in the meal (Matt. 13, 31-33). The other citations we have given above show with equal clearness how both Jesus and his disciples were wont to express themselves in language which must have been very familiar to those who from childhood heard the law and the prophets "read in their synagogues every Sabbath" (Acts 13:27, 15:21).
A strictly literal interpretation of such pictorial modes of thought leads only to absurdity. Their import must be studied in the light of the numerous parallels in the Old Testament writers, which have been extensively presented in the foregoing part of this volume. But with what show of reason, or on what principle of "interpreting Scripture by Scripture," can it be maintained that the language of Isaiah, and Joel, and Daniel, allowed by all the best exegetes to be metaphorical when employed in the Hebrew Scriptures, must be
literally understood when appropriated by Jesus or his apostles ?
https://www.truthaccordingtoscriptu...logy/milton-terry-apocalypse.php#.XMuKzZrQiUl
Milton Terry - Professor of Hebrew and Old Testament exegesis and theology
Apocalypse of the Synoptic Gospels chapter 19 page 239.
Partial quotes, weblink below:
(1) The texts of Mark and Matthew are so closely parallel that we may safely accept them as in substance a portion of the best attested sayings of Jesus. The differences of phraseology are too slight to involve any important difference in the meaning.
(2) The language is appropriated in the main from the books of Isaiah and Daniel, but also from other prophets. The following passages are particularly in point :
For the stars of heaven and their constellations shall not shed forth their light;
Dark is the sun in his going forth,
And the moon shall not cause her light to shine (Isa. 13, 10).
And all the host of the heavens shall be melted,
And the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll,
And all their host shall fall,
As falls a leaf from the vine,
And as a fallen fig from the fig tree (Isa. 34:4).24
From these quotations it is apparent that there is scarcely an expression employed in Matthew and Luke which has not been taken from the Old Testament Scriptures.
(3) Such apocalyptic forms of speech are not to be assumed to convey in the New Testament a meaning different from that which they bear in the Hebrew Scriptures. They are part and parcel of the genius of prophetic language. The language of Isa. 13, 10, is used in a prophecy of the overthrow of Babylon. That of Isa. 24, 4, refers to the desolation of Edom. The ideal of "the Son of man coming in the clouds" is taken from a prophecy of the Messianic kingdom, which kingdom, as depicted in Dan. 7:13,14, is no other than the one symbolized in the same book by a stone cut out of the mountain (Dan. 2:34, 35).
It is the same kingdom of heaven which Jesus likened to a grain of mustard seed and to the working of leaven in the meal (Matt. 13, 31-33). The other citations we have given above show with equal clearness how both Jesus and his disciples were wont to express themselves in language which must have been very familiar to those who from childhood heard the law and the prophets "read in their synagogues every Sabbath" (Acts 13:27, 15:21).
A strictly literal interpretation of such pictorial modes of thought leads only to absurdity. Their import must be studied in the light of the numerous parallels in the Old Testament writers, which have been extensively presented in the foregoing part of this volume. But with what show of reason, or on what principle of "interpreting Scripture by Scripture," can it be maintained that the language of Isaiah, and Joel, and Daniel, allowed by all the best exegetes to be metaphorical when employed in the Hebrew Scriptures, must be
literally understood when appropriated by Jesus or his apostles ?
https://www.truthaccordingtoscriptu...logy/milton-terry-apocalypse.php#.XMuKzZrQiUl
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Believers won't be condemned. We'll be happy at that time, so the "terror" Paul spoke of at his judgment seat is for unbelievers.
I've heard the "Bema seat isn't judgment of criminals" argument before. It's not true,
When Pilate therefore heard that saying, he brought Jesus forth, and sat down in the bema seat in.19:13
Our work "in Christ" is like gold, silver, precious stones,
Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble 1Cor.3:12
And not only works are exposed to Christ's fire, but the person himself,
He himself will be saved, but only as through fire. vs.15
Unbelievers won't survive before Jesus's bema seat.
I've heard the "Bema seat isn't judgment of criminals" argument before. It's not true,
When Pilate therefore heard that saying, he brought Jesus forth, and sat down in the bema seat in.19:13
Our work "in Christ" is like gold, silver, precious stones,
Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble 1Cor.3:12
And not only works are exposed to Christ's fire, but the person himself,
He himself will be saved, but only as through fire. vs.15
Unbelievers won't survive before Jesus's bema seat.
No. I'm pointing out you have the Father and Son both coming like a thief in the night 1000 years apart. I cited Peter,
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away 2Pet.3:10, and you claim,
I'm not contradicting anything. This is your belief. You're saying the day of the Lord, which comes like a thief in the night, is not the return of Jesus, but comes 1000 years after Jesus's return. I disagree.
No, I'm pointing out repetitions that describe the same event.
The point is, you have Satan giving the beast all his power, deceiving the whole world and Jesus wiping them out, but then Satan deceiving the whole world 1000 years later and God wiping them out. Hello?
Because Israel's refuge in "the wilderness" (this world) is in Jesus Christ our Lord. Believers are nourished by Christ. 3 1/2 years is probably symbolic of Jesus's ministry on earth and his people are safe because of that. Jesus wasn't concerned about saving anyone flesh. The woman isn't given wings to hide in a cave somewhere. The one who endures spiritually is saved. Jesus never meant believers wouldn't be physically killed.
No, the problem is Christianity has reverted back to Judaisms interpretation of scripture, instead of reading the prophets with the mind of Christ.
Ok. Then Jesus doesn't have one thing to do with binding Satan from deceiving the world now. It's somewhere in the future. We're all deceived until Jesus binds Satan in the future. Pathetic.
Ok. God's people are only born of the Spirit, but they're not a spiritual nation. Pathetic.
Well Pilate sat on his Bema seat and rewarded Jesus with a death sentence. I'm done.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away 2Pet.3:10, and you claim,
I'm not contradicting anything. This is your belief. You're saying the day of the Lord, which comes like a thief in the night, is not the return of Jesus, but comes 1000 years after Jesus's return. I disagree.
No, I'm pointing out repetitions that describe the same event.
The point is, you have Satan giving the beast all his power, deceiving the whole world and Jesus wiping them out, but then Satan deceiving the whole world 1000 years later and God wiping them out. Hello?
Because Israel's refuge in "the wilderness" (this world) is in Jesus Christ our Lord. Believers are nourished by Christ. 3 1/2 years is probably symbolic of Jesus's ministry on earth and his people are safe because of that. Jesus wasn't concerned about saving anyone flesh. The woman isn't given wings to hide in a cave somewhere. The one who endures spiritually is saved. Jesus never meant believers wouldn't be physically killed.
No, the problem is Christianity has reverted back to Judaisms interpretation of scripture, instead of reading the prophets with the mind of Christ.
Ok. Then Jesus doesn't have one thing to do with binding Satan from deceiving the world now. It's somewhere in the future. We're all deceived until Jesus binds Satan in the future. Pathetic.
Ok. God's people are only born of the Spirit, but they're not a spiritual nation. Pathetic.
Well Pilate sat on his Bema seat and rewarded Jesus with a death sentence. I'm done.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
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Again, Blah Blah Blah
You refuse to acknowledge the fact your ignoring the rest of prophesy, I am not going to play your silly game of trying to use one passage to prove your point, when ALL of prophesy says something quite different. I must take prophesy as a whole.
Prophesy says that gentile kingdoms will rule until Christ returns. When he returns, he will crush the gentile kingdoms (daniel called them beasts) and totally destroy then, At that time he will set up his kingdom on Davids throne, Satan will be bound for 1000 years. And christ will rule with a rod of Iron, Nations will live in peace. And even the chaos of nature we see today will be gone (lions and lambs will sleep in same place. Etc etc) People from all over the earth will come to jerusalem to worhip Jesus, those who do not will be punished (no rain for a year) At the end of this 1000 years. Satan will be released. Once again decieve nations and once again gather armies, AT THIS TiME, Jesus will WIPE out the armies, and destroy this heavens and earth and make new one.
YOU HAVE to interpret the passage you keep trying to force people to see into THAT CONTEXT, failure to do so is to take scripture out of context.
Pilot had already judged jesus was innocent of all crimes (kronos) He only did this because he feared what would happen if he just let jesus go.
so what he did was come to the bema seat, and do like he they did in The coliseums when the battle was over, Give a thumbs up to allow the gladiator to live, or thumbs down for death.
Nice try, But you still fail to see the issue.
Those at the great white throne will be judged for their sins, and found guilty and judged ACCORDING to Gods law. ALL who appear at this judgment will be condemned to hell forever. NO ONE will escape. No child of God will be at this judgment, period!
People at the bema seat are only christians, who will be judged for how well they ran the race (as paul called it and rewarded accordingly.
You refuse to acknowledge the fact your ignoring the rest of prophesy, I am not going to play your silly game of trying to use one passage to prove your point, when ALL of prophesy says something quite different. I must take prophesy as a whole.
Prophesy says that gentile kingdoms will rule until Christ returns. When he returns, he will crush the gentile kingdoms (daniel called them beasts) and totally destroy then, At that time he will set up his kingdom on Davids throne, Satan will be bound for 1000 years. And christ will rule with a rod of Iron, Nations will live in peace. And even the chaos of nature we see today will be gone (lions and lambs will sleep in same place. Etc etc) People from all over the earth will come to jerusalem to worhip Jesus, those who do not will be punished (no rain for a year) At the end of this 1000 years. Satan will be released. Once again decieve nations and once again gather armies, AT THIS TiME, Jesus will WIPE out the armies, and destroy this heavens and earth and make new one.
YOU HAVE to interpret the passage you keep trying to force people to see into THAT CONTEXT, failure to do so is to take scripture out of context.
Pilot had already judged jesus was innocent of all crimes (kronos) He only did this because he feared what would happen if he just let jesus go.
so what he did was come to the bema seat, and do like he they did in The coliseums when the battle was over, Give a thumbs up to allow the gladiator to live, or thumbs down for death.
Nice try, But you still fail to see the issue.
Those at the great white throne will be judged for their sins, and found guilty and judged ACCORDING to Gods law. ALL who appear at this judgment will be condemned to hell forever. NO ONE will escape. No child of God will be at this judgment, period!
People at the bema seat are only christians, who will be judged for how well they ran the race (as paul called it and rewarded accordingly.
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Peter's wording "IN WHICH" refers to a long spans of time (involving a great many things that will transpire WITHIN that long spans of time). Here's some posts I made which touch on that "time period" [a few different posts gathered here, but see especially at the bottom section about 2Pet3:10-12]:
[quoting from my previous posts]
1 Corinthians 15:23-28 (note especially the bold I'm pointing out) -
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. [<---note how far apart, time-wise, these two listed items take place]
24 Then [G1534 - eita ] cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
The word "G1534 - eita - THEN" is a SEQUENCE word "with no time-element attached" to it (unlike another Greek word translated "then" which is "G5119 - tote" like is used in 2Th2:8 and other places). THIS word for "THEN" (G1534) is only with regard to "SEQUENCE"... and if you'll notice the THREE items LISTED here START with Jesus' own Resurrection some 2000 YEARS [+] before the NEXT LISTED item. So it is no problem at all for the THIRD LISTED item to be speaking of something that SEQUENTIALLY takes place 1000 years after the second listed item! (Note: the word "comes [cometh]" is not in the text. The text just reads "THEN [G1534] the end"... and it is NOT "THEN IMMEDIATELY the end," as the Amill-teaching [and others] skews it to mean! )
[and]
The Thessalonians were being [wrongly] convinced that "the Day of the Lord IS PRESENT"... THAT was what was on their distraught minds, that "the Day of the Lord IS PRESENT"
--not that it was "near / approaching," but "IS PRESENT"
--not Jesus Himself, but "the Day of the Lord" (a time period involving JUDGMENTS and VERY NEGATIVE things, just like they were already ENDURING... so this idea that it "IS PRESENT" was PERFECTLY *REASONABLE* to them... they were not dippy people)
--not that His Kingdom had arrived (SOMEwhere... over there, somewhere. No, they well knew of Jesus' teachings on that, Paul wasn't neglecting to tell them such truths)
--not that "a singular 24-hr day" had arrived
--and NOT [was on their distraught minds] anything about the "Caught Up/Away" Truth (absolutely no one had disappeared, and they were under NO SUCH DELUSION that that had taken place--the CONTEXT of their "thinking" was what Paul SAID, here, and that was, essentially, "don't let anyone convince you that THE DAY OF THE LORD [an EARTHLY TIME PERIOD involving JUDGMENTS, etc] IS PRESENT. [because] ONE THING must happen *FIRST*..." [according to the text here]. This is Paul's corrective to them [and this SEQUENCE is REPEATED 3x in this chpt 2, as well as being the SAME SEQUENCE as was shown in 1Th4-5!] And in verse 15 [at the other end of this entire context] says, basically, "believe what WE taught you INSTEAD!" And Paul had already acknowledged that they understood WHAT "the DOTL" involved and that [they knew perfectly that] it "so cometh as a thief IN THE NIGHT" in his previous letter to them, 5:2-3;
--In 2Th2:3-9a, he is elaborating on this and saying that "the DOTL [time period]" won't be present [to unfold upon the earth] until ONE THING happens *FIRST* ... *AND* the man of sin BE REVEALED [and that happens at the START of the 7-yr trib, in the "whose COMING/ARRIVAL/ADVENT/PRESENCE/parousia" of the man of sin "IN HIS TIME" parallels Daniel 9:27[26]'s "prince THAT SHALL COME"... "for ONE WEEK [7 yrs]" at the BEGINNING of it [2Th2:3-9a has the SAME "BEGINNING, MIDDLE, END" that Dan9:27a/b/c does!], aka the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; 1Th5:2-3; Matt24:4/Mk13:5 - "G5100 - tis - 'A CERTAIN ONE'," when Jesus will "STAND to JUDGE" at the START of the 7-yrs/70th-Wk when HE HIMSELF [in Heaven] will open the FIRST SEAL [aka the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR]" unfolding upon the earth)
So "the DOTL [time period]" will be present at the same time that "the man of sin" is present to DO ALL he is slated TO DO (over the course of the ENTIRE 7-yr period: [its ARRIVAL at] its BEGINNING, its MIDDLE, its END... ALL of that).
[and this correlates precisely with]
"... note additionally the TWO "PUNISH" words (in Isaiah 24:21-22[23]) which are SEPARATED by "and after many days" (meaning, that "punish" not only occurs at His Second Coming to the earth BUT ALSO the later GWTj [the TWO "punish" words in Isa24:21-22(23)]) and correlating [time-wise] with that of Revelation 19:19,21/16:14-16/20:5 at the time (context/setting) of His Second Coming to the earth. Meaning, there is still much "time" that will transpire on the earth following His Second Coming to the earth. And this is what the "IN THAT DAY" of Zechariah 14 shows [the MK time period].
So STARTING way back at the beginning of trib [the paragraphs above], and continuing [minus the man of sin after Christ's 2nd Coming to the earth] clear throughout the entire MK age. THAT is what the "IN WHICH" refers to in 2Pet3:10-12 [encompassing the entire span of time referred to (the DOTL time period)]
[end quoting]
[quoting from my previous posts]
1 Corinthians 15:23-28 (note especially the bold I'm pointing out) -
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. [<---note how far apart, time-wise, these two listed items take place]
24 Then [G1534 - eita ] cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
The word "G1534 - eita - THEN" is a SEQUENCE word "with no time-element attached" to it (unlike another Greek word translated "then" which is "G5119 - tote" like is used in 2Th2:8 and other places). THIS word for "THEN" (G1534) is only with regard to "SEQUENCE"... and if you'll notice the THREE items LISTED here START with Jesus' own Resurrection some 2000 YEARS [+] before the NEXT LISTED item. So it is no problem at all for the THIRD LISTED item to be speaking of something that SEQUENTIALLY takes place 1000 years after the second listed item! (Note: the word "comes [cometh]" is not in the text. The text just reads "THEN [G1534] the end"... and it is NOT "THEN IMMEDIATELY the end," as the Amill-teaching [and others] skews it to mean!
)[and]
The Thessalonians were being [wrongly] convinced that "the Day of the Lord IS PRESENT"... THAT was what was on their distraught minds, that "the Day of the Lord IS PRESENT"
--not that it was "near / approaching," but "IS PRESENT"
--not Jesus Himself, but "the Day of the Lord" (a time period involving JUDGMENTS and VERY NEGATIVE things, just like they were already ENDURING... so this idea that it "IS PRESENT" was PERFECTLY *REASONABLE* to them... they were not dippy people)
--not that His Kingdom had arrived (SOMEwhere... over there, somewhere. No, they well knew of Jesus' teachings on that, Paul wasn't neglecting to tell them such truths)
--not that "a singular 24-hr day" had arrived
--and NOT [was on their distraught minds] anything about the "Caught Up/Away" Truth (absolutely no one had disappeared, and they were under NO SUCH DELUSION that that had taken place--the CONTEXT of their "thinking" was what Paul SAID, here, and that was, essentially, "don't let anyone convince you that THE DAY OF THE LORD [an EARTHLY TIME PERIOD involving JUDGMENTS, etc] IS PRESENT. [because] ONE THING must happen *FIRST*..." [according to the text here]. This is Paul's corrective to them [and this SEQUENCE is REPEATED 3x in this chpt 2, as well as being the SAME SEQUENCE as was shown in 1Th4-5!] And in verse 15 [at the other end of this entire context] says, basically, "believe what WE taught you INSTEAD!" And Paul had already acknowledged that they understood WHAT "the DOTL" involved and that [they knew perfectly that] it "so cometh as a thief IN THE NIGHT" in his previous letter to them, 5:2-3;
--In 2Th2:3-9a, he is elaborating on this and saying that "the DOTL [time period]" won't be present [to unfold upon the earth] until ONE THING happens *FIRST* ... *AND* the man of sin BE REVEALED [and that happens at the START of the 7-yr trib, in the "whose COMING/ARRIVAL/ADVENT/PRESENCE/parousia" of the man of sin "IN HIS TIME" parallels Daniel 9:27[26]'s "prince THAT SHALL COME"... "for ONE WEEK [7 yrs]" at the BEGINNING of it [2Th2:3-9a has the SAME "BEGINNING, MIDDLE, END" that Dan9:27a/b/c does!], aka the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR; 1Th5:2-3; Matt24:4/Mk13:5 - "G5100 - tis - 'A CERTAIN ONE'," when Jesus will "STAND to JUDGE" at the START of the 7-yrs/70th-Wk when HE HIMSELF [in Heaven] will open the FIRST SEAL [aka the INITIAL "birth PANG [SINGULAR]" unfolding upon the earth)
So "the DOTL [time period]" will be present at the same time that "the man of sin" is present to DO ALL he is slated TO DO (over the course of the ENTIRE 7-yr period: [its ARRIVAL at] its BEGINNING, its MIDDLE, its END... ALL of that).
[and this correlates precisely with]
"... note additionally the TWO "PUNISH" words (in Isaiah 24:21-22[23]) which are SEPARATED by "and after many days" (meaning, that "punish" not only occurs at His Second Coming to the earth BUT ALSO the later GWTj [the TWO "punish" words in Isa24:21-22(23)]) and correlating [time-wise] with that of Revelation 19:19,21/16:14-16/20:5 at the time (context/setting) of His Second Coming to the earth. Meaning, there is still much "time" that will transpire on the earth following His Second Coming to the earth. And this is what the "IN THAT DAY" of Zechariah 14 shows [the MK time period].
So STARTING way back at the beginning of trib [the paragraphs above], and continuing [minus the man of sin after Christ's 2nd Coming to the earth] clear throughout the entire MK age. THAT is what the "IN WHICH" refers to in 2Pet3:10-12 [encompassing the entire span of time referred to (the DOTL time period)]
[end quoting]
Rather, teaching there is a 1000 years time period after Jesus returns where people may repent and be saved isn't true. It's heresy.
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mk.16:15-16
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mk.16:15-16
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Like I said you make god a liar
He said he would rule for 1000 years with a rod of iron in Jerusalem, and those who did not come will be punished.
Zech 14: 16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain. 18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations
Your issue is with God not me my friend. People have been repenting since adam first fell. To try to use this as a reason to ignore prophesy is a major flaw.
He said he would rule for 1000 years with a rod of iron in Jerusalem, and those who did not come will be punished.
Zech 14: 16 And it shall come to pass that everyone who is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. 17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain. 18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations
Your issue is with God not me my friend. People have been repenting since adam first fell. To try to use this as a reason to ignore prophesy is a major flaw.
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