Some truth about speaking in tongues, the Holy Ghost, spiritual gifts and 1 Corinthians 14

[garee]

Agreed, however the Church at Corinth was not a mission condition.

The entire reference point of Paul was about languages and foreign dialects/languages also in the assembly.

The entire reference point of Paul was about languages and foreign dialects/languages . It has it foundation in Isaiah 28 and has to do with atheist Jews who refuse to hear the gospel. Like Cain in Genesis or Easu who saw no value in the things not seen . They made a mockery of the word of God over and over . God with stammering lips (mocking deriding) Sent as sign to confirm their unbelief (No faith ).

Once the sign is confirm as to who and what it points to .Then its smooth sailing the rest of the doctrine will fall into place.

A say the sign confirms unbelief(no faith ) What do you say .and not what do other say? Make the foundation of tongues of no effect?

 

[7seasrekeyed]

The problem i see is, that the way how this is taught since Agnes Ozman in 1901 I cant find in the bible.
That God uses tongues speaking in mission condition is no problem for me. In mission condition he uses many miracles.
But the teaching that tounges is combined with the baptism of the Holy Spirit i cant find in any scripture taught. Even not in the 1. Letter to the corinthians.

no one but you has said a thing about the Azuza Street revival

the rest of us are using the Bible

the Bible, actually has several examples of tongues accompanying the infilling of the Holy Spirit

sorry if you cannot find it. maybe you redacted it

 

[7seasrekeyed]

The entire reference point of Paul was about languages and foreign dialects/languages . It has it foundation in Isaiah 28 and has to do with atheist Jews who refuse to hear the gospel. Like Cain in Genesis or Easu who saw no value in the things not seen . They made a mockery of the word of God over and over . God with stammering lips (mocking deriding) Sent as sign to confirm their unbelief (No faith ).

Once the sign is confirm as to who and what it points to .Then its smooth sailing the rest of the doctrine will fall into place.

A say the sign confirms unbelief(no faith ) What do you say .and not what do other say? Make the foundation of tongues of no effect?

no offense, but this post could pass for an unknown language...as per your usual contributions LOL!

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Once a peron determines what the sign confirms.(Unbelief) then they can turn the doctrine right side up . Yet for that they will still pretend the sign represent s a blessing and not what is clearly does.

this is remarkable also

unknown language also

I turned my Bible over as you say above? but nothing happened. it still says the same thing

 

[wolfwint]

Agreed, however the Church at Corinth was not a mission condition.

The entire reference point of Paul was about languages and foreign dialects/languages also in the assembly.

Yes, but anyhow it has stopped. So i never heared that the signgifts were given without the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
But from the bible I see

no one but you has said a thing about the Azuza Street revival

the rest of us are using the Bible

the Bible, actually has several examples of tongues accompanying the infilling of the Holy Spirit

sorry if you cannot find it. maybe you redacted it

Then maby you should little bit study History. Before Topeka and Azusa there was no teaching in the USA concerning this.
Of course today you have such a broad Spektrum of pentecostal and charismatic teachings that it is difficult to follow.
Well this all had their beginning first in Azusa, then some charismatic Events came along during the last Century.

So is infilling the same as be baptised?
So all speaking in tongues?
I suppose all believers in the corinthians Church we're baptised with the Holy Spirit, in spite of their fleshly life.
For Paul it was normal that not all getting the Gift of speaking in tongues.
No Single time Paul ore anybody else taught that baptised with the Holy Spirit has something to do with the Gift of speaking in tongues. Ore is the follow sign to be baptised with the Holy Spirit.
( if you have some scripture, please show me. out of Acts, this is no teaching)
And when you then Study that along with this teaching came strange Things like uncontroable laughing, acting and noising like animals, laying on the floor with shakings, then God i should believe this is from God? The same you find in gentiles Religions too.

 

[KelbyofGod]

Hi, godsgirl83,
maby the solution lays in the fact, that our God is useing in mission conditions much more supernatural events, then among already believers.

Sorry for the added then deleted thumbs up. I was intending to reply. However I do appreciate your presence and posting.

There are a few other reasons that you may see God do more on mission trips vs. at home in church.

On mission trips the "givers" know that the people need various unknown things and they are probably diligently praying that God will give them whatever it is they need. Back home there us usually not that level of earnestness in prayer. (Different level of sincerity = different level of answer)

This is also part of the reason you see throughout the bible a drop off of God's move... He usually starts during a time of struggle (while the people are praying earnestly for God to move). Then he moves and things get better. Then the people slack off. Unsurprisingly, God still responds to the intensity of their desire and efforts. Less intensity = less seeking = less outcome.

Another factor is that "to whom much is given, much is required". The people to whom God is sending missionaries do not know to seek God, so they are not initially required to do the prayer and fasting normally required. God moves for them anyway because his love covers for their ignorance. But as people learn that God is real, they kinda need to grow up and do what it takes. As Jesus said to his disciples "this kind cometh not out but by prayer and fasting". These aren't just churchy terms. They are workable and, they are necessary if we hope to be involved in other people's deliverance.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[KelbyofGod]

In regards to those at the Azusa street revival having speaking in tongues, or even those in the church who were testifying to me .... Honestly that made little/no difference to whether or not I was going to speak in tongues.

They told me (and I understood) that I needed to be baptized (in water) in Jesus' name for remission (washing away) of sins. I believed and submitted myself to that much. That part was easy. In practical terms, I asked to get dunked... and the pastor dunked me. I really didn't have to do much. I could understand the process and I could see how it was going to happen.

But when it came to tongues, that was another matter. I had no idea how this was going to happen. I knew one thing though. I was NOT going to make it up... Not for these people, and not for God himself. And I told him as much. God himself would have to move on me and get it done. He did.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[LW97]

I am very sure that the spiritual gifts still exist today. There is NO scripture that confirms that it may have ceased.

 

[stonesoffire]

Microscopes are not considered a tool for hearing the gospel just as philosophy is not. Those who believe not have no way to understand the spiritual not seen" faith" Nothing will show in a Xray.

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Did they find the foundation to the doctrine of tongues at the speech center of the brain (Isaiah 28) ? Can't find God through a microscope. We do not know him after the rudiments of this world used as sign of the things seen..the eternal Holy Place.

First question would be why as a sign against unbelievers of the whole world does he mock this people who refuse to hear the gospel ?

Once a peron determines what the sign confirms.(Unbelief) then they can turn the doctrine right side up . Yet for that they will still pretend the sign represent s a blessing and not what is clearly does.

This points to those "sign seekers" (Charismatics) hoping it will confirm the opposite of what the doctrine does reveal, looking for a little pride and call it self edification.

2 Corinthians 4:18 While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

lol....uh...can we find God through an MRI?

Garee.....no one was looking for God in this study. Its of the brain and how tongues affected it.

 

[stonesoffire]

no offense, but this post could pass for an unknown language...as per your usual contributions LOL!

We need a smh emoji Sp? animated too.

 

[garee]

lol....uh...can we find God through an MRI?

Garee.....no one was looking for God in this study. Its of the brain and how tongues affected it.

Its of the brain and how tongues affected it not a way of confirm a person has the Holy Spirit or the idea of sign gifts

It would seem someone is trying to prove or disprove the tongues doctrine by looking at brain activity. It not a spiritual lie detector.

Is it the interpreter of spiritual things of God. Why even chase after the idea.? What the hope in having brain activity monitored on a electronic device.? Why not simply define what the sign confirms using the bible as the test rather than chasing around a bush ?

 

[garee]

I am very sure that the spiritual gifts still exist today. There is NO scripture that confirms that it may have ceased.

There is no scripture that say the spiritual (non visible ) gifts have ceased.

There simply never were any sign gifts as that which confirm the unseen. New prophecy has ceased. And that includes any manner of prophecy to include tongues, drawing straws, or sending Donkeys with prophecy to stop the madness of false prophets like Balaam . Many manners.

The Bible the book of prophecy is sealed up till the end. Sealed with seven seals. Need more that God has revealed? For what purpose?

 

[KelbyofGod]

Another thing I'll post to those that say tongues is being done wrongly now.

Since you acknowledge that tongues is a biblical thing (In other words... its existence is testified as being real in the bible, and at least one chapter attempts to explain what it is and how it is to be used properly ) my question is "Would you willing and able to show us how to do it properly....by your personal use of it??"

The Bible the book of prophecy is sealed up till the end. Sealed with seven seals. Need more that God has revealed? For what purpose?

1 Corinthians 14:3 KJV
But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. <--still needed

Love you and God loves you,
Kelby

 

[KelbyofGod]

Garee,
My apologies in that the first part of my last post was not intended to be attached to your quote. It was a thought I had been pondering generally and actually thought I'd deleted it.

Love in Jesus,
Kelby

 

[garee]

Another thing I'll post to those that say tongues is being done wrongly now.

1 Corinthians 14:3 KJV
But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort. <--still needed

Love you and God loves you,
Kelby

Yes, still needed, still a living word that does not return void.

 

[7seasrekeyed]

Yes, but anyhow it has stopped. So i never heared that the signgifts were given without the baptism with the Holy Spirit.
But from the bible I see


Then maby you should little bit study History. Before Topeka and Azusa there was no teaching in the USA concerning this.
Of course today you have such a broad Spektrum of pentecostal and charismatic teachings that it is difficult to follow.
Well this all had their beginning first in Azusa, then some charismatic Events came along during the last Century.

So is infilling the same as be baptised?
So all speaking in tongues?
I suppose all believers in the corinthians Church we're baptised with the Holy Spirit, in spite of their fleshly life.
For Paul it was normal that not all getting the Gift of speaking in tongues.
No Single time Paul ore anybody else taught that baptised with the Holy Spirit has something to do with the Gift of speaking in tongues. Ore is the follow sign to be baptised with the Holy Spirit.
( if you have some scripture, please show me. out of Acts, this is no teaching)
And when you then Study that along with this teaching came strange Things like uncontroable laughing, acting and noising like animals, laying on the floor with shakings, then God i should believe this is from God? The same you find in gentiles Religions too.

well you may not speak in tongues and you may think 'it' has stopped but 'it' most certainly has not stopped

since you will not be asking in faith any time soon, you won't receive the gift(s)

your sarcasm is dully noted

 

[7seasrekeyed]

We need a smh emoji Sp? animated too.

haha

here are several from which to choose

here is the 'are you for real?' look of 'can you breathe on your own?'

and of course the famous Judge Judy face palm accompanied by words of disbelief

here's a cutie for when you are having your coffee and reflecting on the total lack of biblical ability to support the tongues has ceased opinion

here is the dismissive not even worth responding to hs

here is the 'you scary and speak blasphemies' look reserved for those about to be banned or shunned

and finally, when you want to make sure they understand they are not speaking anything from the Bible, God or the Holy Spirit

just copy/paste

reserved for those who are not cessationists
unauthorized use indicates plagerism, much like certain people posting ideas that are not their own and taking credit anyway

 

[7seasrekeyed]

"FollowHisSteps, post: 3907855, member: 281227"]Open hearts and a spirit of worship

I have always found this is the approach we are called to have in Christ and how the
Holy Spirit shows himself amongst His people.

Just because contributors claim to know the Lord, and push others around, declaring who
is right and who is wrong, probably declares their lack of authority and their attempt at
bullying.

Paul is so blessed and he humbles me.

22 Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is for believers, not for unbelievers.
23 So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and some who do not understand or some unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind?
24 But if an unbeliever or someone who does not understand comes in while everybody is prophesying, he will be convinced by all that he is a sinner and will be judged by all,
25 and the secrets of his heart will be laid bare. So he will fall down and worship God, exclaiming, "God is really among you!"
1 cor 14

Praise God if this is our church, I long for that day, send it soon dear Lord Jesus, Amen.


above highlighted quote is a sad reality

just the flesh acting out?

again, it is the anger that accompanies these posts that draw attention to the fact that something else is going on IMO

the naysayers say but one thing. they will tell you that Paul said they would stop...they just forget that he also stated that knowledge and prophecies would stop...meaning no need because the perfect is come

the perfect is not scripture. knowledge has not ceased. so the logical conclusion is that neither have tongues

further, salvation is not the baptism of the Holy Spirit. nowhere does scripture say such a thing

 

[garee]

well you may not speak in tongues and you may think 'it' has stopped but 'it' most certainly has not stopped

since you will not be asking in faith any time soon, you won't receive the gift(s)

your sarcasm is dully noted

Have you loked at the foundation of the doctrine of tongues. Its in the Old testament Isaiah 28. What does the sign confirm?

 

[Dino246]

Have you loked at the foundation of the doctrine of tongues. Its in the Old testament Isaiah 28. What does the sign confirm?

What did it confirm in Acts 10?