Not By Works

[posthuman]

Him who is worthy.

Woe to the worthless shepherd, who deserts the flock!
(Zechariah 11:17) ​

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I AM the Good Shepherd​

(John 10:11)​

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For thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I, even I, will both search My sheep, and seek them out.​

As a shepherd seeketh out his flock in the day that he is among his sheep that are scattered; so will I seek out My sheep, ​

and will deliver them out of all places where they have been scattered in the cloudy and dark day.​

(Ezekiel 34:11-12)​

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lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.
(Matthew 28:20) ​

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And He will lift up an ensign to the nations from far, and will hiss unto them from the end of the earth: and, behold, they shall come with speed, swiftly
(Isaiah 5:26) ​

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When He has brought out all His own, He goes on ahead of them, and His sheep follow Him because they know His voice. But they will never follow a stranger; in fact, they will run away from him because they do not recognize a stranger’s voice.
(John 10:4-5)​

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what does it say? ​

"The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart," ​

that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim
(Romans 10:8)​

 

[Budman]

Sunny and about 50 here today, mid Missouri

I hate you.

 

[Budman]

If you have no desire to OBEY God you're not saved......

Are you obeying God while you sin every day?

 

[Budman]

If your born again would you even ask such a question?

Or would your obediance to God be motivated by your Love for him?

Obedience after salvation does not affect a Christian's eternal destiny. To believe that would make God a liar.

 

[Budman]

WE GOT HAMMERED LAST NIGHT with a FOOT of New SNOW here in Lincoln, NE. But it would have been a lot more, because it rained all afternoon, before it turned to SNOW. Where you from ?

I live in the downriver Detroit area.

Good news is, we didn't lose power (thank-you, LORD!) and, so far, we didn't get the snow they predicted.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Yes sir I absolutely agree he died for everyone

To be honest, I'm not quit sure about the other part of your question........if everyones name is written, it would seem I would have to believe in predestination ( some born for hell and some for heaven)

If everyones name is written, why would you have to believe in double predestination? A persons name is blotted out when they die in unbelief.

I lean more towards the names of the born again written at time of conversion......

Then names getting blotted out would never make sense, because then once a name was written in, that person would have the seal of the spirit and eternal life, his name would never be blotted out.

And I entreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which laboured with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellowlabourers, whose names are in the book of life.
Philippians 4:3 KJV

It does not say when those names were written, thats taking scripture out of what is actually said.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Maybe you could actually answer my question.



Do the lost need salvation?





JPT

You never gave context

Are they lost sheep or lost goats, do not expect an answer when you give an open ended question like that.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

My point was John teaching that "remaining" is an indicator they are saved...........those who leave....not saved
Thanks for your responses

Again, taking to far,

You still have to use the words never, otherwise you lost context and meaning of the passage,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Assuming you believe in the possibility for a believer to backslid, like King David......lust... adultery....murder etc. If David had died do you think he would still went to heaven?

He was considered a man after Gods heart as a teenager when he was chosen

Did God change his mind?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Are you obeying God while you sin every day?

Hey bud, i think his context was desire...

I certainly do not desire to sin Everyday,

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I live in the downriver Detroit area.

Good news is, we didn't lose power (thank-you, LORD!) and, so far, we didn't get the snow they predicted.

It is still windy here, and about a 40 degree drop in temps!

 

[Budman]

but I do know what OSAS means.

It means that ONCE you're SAVED....
You will ALWAYS BE saved....and no one can take that from you...
NO MATTER WHAT.

We have posters right here on this thread that believe this...

Darn tootin' I believe it.

 

[Budman]

Hey bud, i think his context was desire...

I certainly do not desire to sin Everyday,

Well, since that bunch loves to tie obedience to salvation, I assumed such. But if that was not what he meant, I apologize.

 

[posthuman]

Yes bro, this is called being led by the Spirit.



For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Romans 8:14

if you are led by the Spirit how is it you think you follow the Spirit to somewhere the Spirit doesn't go before you?

it is not Jesus who go after the lost sheep, but us.

Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by Himself; He can do only what He sees his Father doing, ​

because whatever the Father does the Son also does.​

(John 5:19) ​

No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws them
(John 6:44)​

 

[posthuman]

one of my cats - she's 24yrs old, at least ((?)) - had a stroke overnight & can't use one of her hind paws

now i have to go to work

thank you for remembering the little one, Nebula, in your prayers, if you would

 

[Budman]

It is still windy here, and about a 40 degree drop in temps!

It's about 5:30 am here, and the wind seems to be finally dying down. Still gusty though. It's creepy hearing one's house creak and groan for hours on end!

 

[FollowHisSteps]

I certainly believe David would have went to heaven.
If a Christian tells a lie, has a heart attack and immediately dies, is that Christian lost?
Remember, the Bible says ALL liars will have their part in the lake of fire. (Revelation 21:8)

I like this question, Budman.
You believe in absolute grace without taking someones true commitment into account.

Scripture applies grace through time. David fell into lust with Bathsheba, committed adultery and murdered
the husband with the sword of the Hittites. Yet when confronted, he repented.

His heart stayed true to God and committed, though his flesh lead him astray.
Grace decides between the two, which is why we have repentance and confession, and the battle with sowing
to the Spirit or to the flesh. What we truly are is only revealed before the throne. As Paul says,

wait till the Lord comes. He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will expose the motives of men's hearts. At that time each will receive his praise from God.
1 cor 4:5

A believer who uses grace as an excuse to stay in sin, Paul describes like this

In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus.
Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires.
Rom 6:11-12

Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves, you are slaves to the one whom you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?
Rom 6:16

So a believer who offers themselves as a slave to sin, it will lead to their spiritual death.
It will take time, and eat them up, but their faith will crumble to dust.

But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves to God, the benefit you reap leads to holiness, and the result is eternal life.
Rom 6:22

It sounds like many believers have sown to sin, and are reaping death while claiming this is eternal life
and they can look forward to blessings from God. This is simply a denial of scripture and Pauls laying out
of the way of promise, sow to the Spirit, reap eternal life.

 

[Budman]

New to the game and without understanding the players and who is who and gonna instruct or make pointed comments about what gets said..........see how this goes....

I think some of the "new" members are actually "old" members resurrected!

 

[Budman]

You believe in absolute grace without taking someones true commitment into account.

Grace is unmerited favor - no manner how one tries to spin it. It simply means you can't earn it, especially through one's behavior. To do so would change what it is entirely. The same applies to salvation as a gift. If one gives a gift and then adds even a single condition to it, it destroys the notion it was a gift at all.

A believer who uses grace as an excuse to stay in sin, Paul describes like this

If you sin every single day (and you do) that is the epitome of staying in sin. You choose to do it. Sins are not accidental. You choose to rebel, you choose to not obey - period.

Now answer my question: If a Christian tells a lie, has a heart attack and immediately dies, is that Christian lost?

 

[FollowHisSteps]

Both the ones believing it and the ones teaching it....
Fools and bewitched
Double cursed

Are there people of the circumcision party here on this thread?
Have any said we must follow the rules of the temple, and the ceremonies of Israel?
Is any trying to justify themselves before God through their obedience to the Mosaic law?

If there are none, who are you referring to?

I realise some know scripture so poorly, taking Pauls rebuke and applying it to others may seem wise,
but it shows how empty ones heart is, if this is the only answer you can give to overcoming sin through
the power of the Holy Spirit within the believer.

For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.
Rom 6:14

It sounds like some are declaring sin can be your master because you are under grace.
Not what scripture is declaring at all, but rather the opposite.