How do I lose my SALVATION?

[Ignorun]

20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. 21 For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.”

Yep. Did a whole study on this. These are the same dudes in several passages in Scripture. Like this one:
Matthew 12:
An Unclean Spirit Returns
43 “When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest, and finds none. 44 Then he says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’ And when he comes, he finds it EMPTY, swept, and put in order. 45 Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first. So shall it also be with this wicked generation.”


These guys were made clean BUT THEY WEREN'T FILLED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT! They rejected the knowledge they were given.

And it would have been better for them if they NEVER had the knowledge and were cleaned to begin with. Now juxtapose them, with these guys:

1 Corinthians 6:
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor [b]homosexuals, nor [c]sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such WERE some of you. But you were WASHED, but you were [d]SANCTIFIED, but you were JUSTIFIED in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the SPIRIT of our God.

See the difference between the 2? One group were never filled with the Holy Spirit. They were made clean by the KNOWLEDGE of Christ, but they didn't have HIM!!

Hope that clears it up for Sparky! Ruff! Ruff!

You sure left 2 Peter real quick. You assumed much in few words and left it real quick.
They escaped...through knowledge...went back...just as dogs return to vomit.
Peter says they had knowledge. You deny truth. You reject the teaching of Jesus apostle, that is same as rejecting Jesus!
Peter says they escaped the pollution. How did they escape? Peter says THROUGH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.
In the beginning of the same letter, Peter says all things are given unto us that pertain unto life and godliness THROUGH THE THE KNOWLEDGE OF HIM...2.1.3
Those in in 2.20 had that knowledge. But they went back. They had all that pertains to life and godliness, they escaped pollution, but they went back to the pollution.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

You sure left 2 Peter real quick. You assumed much in few words and left it real quick.
They escaped...through knowledge...went back...just as dogs return to vomit.
Peter says they had knowledge. You deny truth. You reject the teaching of Jesus apostle, that is same as rejecting Jesus!
Peter says they escaped the pollution. How did they escape? Peter says THROUGH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.
In the beginning of the same letter, Peter says all things are given unto us that pertain unto life and godliness THROUGH THE THE KNOWLEDGE OF HIM...2.1.3
Those in in 2.20 had that knowledge. But they went back. They had all that pertains to life and godliness, they escaped pollution, but they went back to the pollution.

Having knowledge does not mean having salvation.

The pharisees had the knowledge of God. They had no salvation, if they did they would have recieved their messiah.

Those people did not go back. They acted their true nature,

 

[Ignorun]

Having knowledge does not mean having salvation.

The pharisees had the knowledge of God. They had no salvation, if they did they would have recieved their messiah.

Those people did not go back. They acted their true nature,

Peter says they had knowledge. Peter says the knowledge pertains to life and godliness. Peter says they escaped the pollution of the world and then returned to it all. He said it is just AD a dog going back to vomit.
You can say a hundred times
Having knowledge doesn't mean having salvation, it still wouldn't change what Peter said.

 

[PennEd]

You sure left 2 Peter real quick. You assumed much in few words and left it real quick.
They escaped...through knowledge...went back...just as dogs return to vomit.
Peter says they had knowledge. You deny truth. You reject the teaching of Jesus apostle, that is same as rejecting Jesus!
Peter says they escaped the pollution. How did they escape? Peter says THROUGH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST.
In the beginning of the same letter, Peter says all things are given unto us that pertain unto life and godliness THROUGH THE THE KNOWLEDGE OF HIM...2.1.3
Those in in 2.20 had that knowledge. But they went back. They had all that pertains to life and godliness, they escaped pollution, but they went back to the pollution.

You can lead a donkey or is it dog.... To water.....

You have a blessed day!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Peter says they had knowledge. Peter says the knowledge pertains to life and godliness. Peter says they escaped the pollution of the world and then returned to it all. He said it is just AD a dog going back to vomit.
You can say a hundred times
Having knowledge doesn't mean having salvation, it still wouldn't change what Peter said.

And you can say it 100 times it does to make you right. So back it off your attitude, This is a discussion forums we are discussing the bible you will not like everyone because not everyone will agree with you.

You did not prove the pharisees did nto have knowledge, well they did
You did not prove they were saved (anyone who comes to a group of believers and starts hanging out with them by defenition has escaped the polution of the world)

Again,

Peter said a dog returns to his own vomit. He does it BECAUSE HE IS STILL A DOG.

Peter also said the sow, which escaped the polution of his pen and was washed, will return to wallow in the mire and get dirty again, Because it is HIS NATURE

Salvation means the dog died, and was born again as a new creature, he can not act like a dog. Because he is no longer a dog.

The sow. Died, and was made a new creature. He escaped the polution also. However, under his NEW NATURE he does not return and make himself unclean again.

 

[Ignorun]

And you can say it 100 times it does to make you right. So back it off your attitude, This is a discussion forums we are discussing the bible you will not like everyone because not everyone will agree with you.

You did not prove the pharisees did nto have knowledge, well they did
You did not prove they were saved (anyone who comes to a group of believers and starts hanging out with them by defenition has escaped the polution of the world)

Again,

Peter said a dog returns to his own vomit. He does it BECAUSE HE IS STILL A DOG.

Peter also said the sow, which escaped the polution of his pen and was washed, will return to wallow in the mire and get dirty again, Because it is HIS NATURE

Salvation means the dog died, and was born again as a new creature, he can not act like a dog. Because he is no longer a dog.

The sow. Died, and was made a new creature. He escaped the polution also. However, under his NEW NATURE he does not return and make himself unclean again.

I didn't introduce the Pharisees, you did. I never said they were saved or not. I'm staying with the text that I brought up. Something Penned couldn't do. You responded. You jumped in, no problem, but Im not going to be side railed from the text...2 Peter 2.

Back to 2 Peter 2. 20.
How did they escape?
Peter answers it, THROUGH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE LORD AND SAVIOR JESUS CHRIST.
They had knowledge. They had escaped the pollution. But they went back to the pollution.
Peter says about that knowledge...it pertains to life and godliness, 1.3.
But you say they didn't have life and godliness.
But Peter says, they had the knowledge. They had escaped...they had the life and godliness, then they went back.

The bible is clear.

(I will respond to your knowledge and Pharisees. I know as a collective body or group, the Pharisees were condemned. But you are assuming NONE, not a single one, ever obeyed or believed. Paul was a Pharisee, he had knowledge, he was saved.)

 

[Ignorun]

Tell what to Peter?

That a born again Child of God, with a NEW nature, can't morph into a dog, and assume a dog's nature?

If we could, would it look like this?

What Child of God is not born again?

 

[dcontroversal]

One can lose salvation when the following truths no longer apply...

a. When saved to the uttermost becomes partially saved for a little bit

b. The gifts of God becone revocable

c. Jesus becomes an inept liar that cannot finish and complete the work of faith he began

d. When Jesus loses that which the Father has given him

e. When eternal and everlasting actually mean temporary

f. When God decides to not PASS OVER the blood

g. When being justified eternally by faith before God is changed to being justified by self based upon our deeds

h. When God no longer has respect to the offering of Christ once for all

i. When the blood of Jesus no longer has power

j. When God decides to disrespt his word and condemn those who are in Christ

k. When God no longer keeps us by his power because his power has failed

l. When God becomes a liar and does not keep his word

m. When the faithful of Christ fails and he becomes unfaithful

Just to name a few!!

 

[jb]

How do I lose my SALVATION?

Reject the truth and permanently go back into sin. Jer 13v24, 17v1, Ezek 18v24, Heb 3v16-19, 6v4-8, 10v26-31, and so forth.

 

[RickyZ]

I scuba and one of the things my dive buddy says to me "the deeper the water is, the more forgiveness there is",.... when it comes to buoyancy... He is right because if we dive water that is less than 60 feet, I put in too much air.... I am right to the surface.... and without decompression a person can get the bins....
According to statistics, the known depth or the sea/ ocean is 10,994 meters/36,070 feet.

This makes me think of the GREAT SCRIPTURE:
Micah 7:19 New International Version (NIV)
19 You will again have compassion on us;
you will tread our sins underfoot
and hurl all our iniquities into the depths of the sea.

G-d's Word holds true EVERY TIME! With that great of depth I would have been dead anyway... But even yet I still have time to equalize before hitting the surface... BECAUSE THERE IS ALWAYS FORGIVENESS!!!!

So why do people think G-d wants to send saved people to Hell an long with the people that rejected Him?

This has never made sense to me...

How do I lose my SALVATION?

To make a long story short (actually I've tried twice to share it but the mods won't let it post), here's the lesson learned:

The MOMENT we lose our ability to tell God no, is the moment God can no longer trust that we follow Him willingly.

Only accepting Christ can save you. Only denying Him can change that.

And the ability to deny Him is something God will never take away from us.

 

[dcontroversal]

Reject the truth and permanently go back into sin. Jer 13v24, 17v1, Ezek 18v24, Heb 3v16-19, 6v4-8, 10v26-31, and so forth.

False....Where sin abounds Grace abounds the more.....rewards may be lost and forfeit yet salvation is secure, even if so as by fire and or the destruction of the flesh......

A child by birth will always be a child by birth and one born from above does not sin (the spirit is born of incorruptible seed).......!!

 

[calibob]

One can lose salvation when the following truths no longer apply...

a. When saved to the uttermost becomes partially saved for a little bit

b. The gifts of God becone revocable

c. Jesus becomes an inept liar that cannot finish and complete the work of faith he began

d. When Jesus loses that which the Father has given him

e. When eternal and everlasting actually mean temporary

f. When God decides to not PASS OVER the blood

g. When being justified eternally by faith before God is changed to being justified by self based upon our deeds

h. When God no longer has respect to the offering of Christ once for all

i. When the blood of Jesus no longer has power

j. When God decides to disrespt his word and condemn those who are in Christ

k. When God no longer keeps us by his power because his power has failed

l. When God becomes a liar and does not keep his word

m. When the faithful of Christ fails and he becomes unfaithful

Just to name a few!!

BLASPHEMY OF THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE ONLY UNFORGIVABLE SIN!

 

[John146]

False....Where sin abounds Grace abounds the more.....rewards may be lost and forfeit yet salvation is secure, even if so as by fire and or the destruction of the flesh......

A child by birth will always be a child by birth and one born from above does not sin (the spirit is born of incorruptible seed).......!!

Amen brother!

What people do not understand is the circumstances in life believers may face. Some believers remain babes in Christ and do not grow in the word. Maybe it's not their fault. They have no discipleship nor bible believing church to attend. They never grow in their knowledge of who they are in Christ. They may fall back into the world's way of living. They may even reject the fact that they are a child of God. The enemy is a great deceiver.

 

[dcontroversal]

Amen brother!

What people do not understand is the circumstances in life believers may face. Some believers remain babes in Christ and do not grow in the word. Maybe it's not their fault. They have no discipleship nor bible believing church to attend. They never grow in their knowledge of who they are in Christ. They may fall back into the world's way of living. They may even reject the fact that they are a child of God. The enemy is a great deceiver.

Exactly....a son by birth will always be a son by birth and lacks the understanding that is it but a babe in arms....feed them milk their whole life and they will remain a babe and very limited in their growth and or the potential of what growth brings......!

 

[calibob]

Exactly....a son by birth will always be a son by birth and lacks the understanding that is it but a babe in arms....feed them milk their whole life and they will remain a babe and very limited in their growth and or the potential of what growth brings......!

I many cases they may have limited comprehension. Even today some people in industrialized nations with terrific educational systems can't read. They can be easily deceived and so can their teachers. I think the lord will judge in a sliding scale based upon their ability to understand or be deceived. Those teachers who have knowledge of true right from wrong will be judged much more harshly than the huddled masses that innocently believe corrupt leaders.

 

[Nehemiah6]

If we leave Jesus and turn from him we loose salvation.

It would appear that you do not really understand what salvation means or entails.

So for you it is back to the drawing board, or back to square one.

 

[dcontroversal]

I many cases they may have limited comprehension. Even today some people in industrialized nations with terrific educational systems can't read. They can be easily deceived and so can their teachers. I think the lord will judge in a sliding scale based upon their ability to understand or be deceived. Those teachers who have knowledge of true right from wrong will be judged much more harshly than the huddled masses that innocently believe corrupt leaders.

Jesus said as much and implied this on more than one occasion.....!

 

[notuptome]

I only need consider that it was God who loved me not me who loved God to know that nothing can and nothing will separate me from Him. John 3:16 God loved the word and God sacrificed His Son to atone for the sins of those in the world. The world did not atone for itself nor did the world love God.

If you do not love God you are not saved. Love is not an emotion but love requires sacrifice.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[obedienttogod]

Yes, I know God is not pleased

But we can not lose salvation beause of that sin. James said if we break even 1 law we are guilty of all. Anyone who commits 1 sin in a day is just as worthy of condemnation as a person who commits 100 sins in that same day, According to God. They are both GUILTY as charged.

And you also have to look at John, Who makes it clear. A person born of God can not live in sin, If they do sin (like the world) then they are of their father the devil, and have never known god.

To say one can lose salvation because they sin to much is putting the onus of salvation on y9our ability and your power to earn salvation, and removes credit and the power of God to do what he promised to do. Which is to save you completely and make you into a new creation

Obviously, not a single one of us can earn our salvation. Not a single one of us can buy our salvation. Not a single one of us can negotiate our salvation. And the mere fact we can believe that Jesus is what He claims to be, does not give us our salvation since we know the fallen angels believe that He is what He claims to be.

Simply put, I like to look at how God dealt with humanity before the Law was given. In my opinion, outside of the shed Blood by Jesus, I relate this period from Abraham until the Hebrews became Egyptian slaves, to our current condition with God. If we look closer at Abraham, we can see some disturbing trends. After his nephew Lot departed for Sodom, God told Abram to look in all directions and promised this was all of his land, and that his seed would be numerous like the sand (Genesis 13). (Genesis 14) begins with war and Sodom was defeated and the victors took Lot. his family, all of his goods. This was just after God made a promise to Abram, but the moment Abram heard about Lot, he took 318 trained men and at night time murdered everyone of Lot's captors. Now, you would think God would require Abram to seek forgiveness. No, Jesus in the form of Melchizedek God's High Priest, took bread and wine and blessed Abram with Communion.

Then in (Genesis 15), God forms a Covenant with Abram. So what was Abram's first reaction? He listened to Sarai, about God not going to bless her with the promised seed, and he tried to create the promise through a handmaid. 13 years later (Genesis 17), God appears to Abram and tells him to be "perfect." When Abram falls down before God, God changes his name from Abram to Abraham and then tells him to keep his Covenant and changed Sarai's name to Sarah. And Abraham laughs to himself concerning God's promise that a 100 year old man is going to be a father. And as we know, at the age of 99, Abraham was circumcised. And then God fulfilled His promise with Isaac.

But the interesting thing to me, is that God promised Abram land and his seed would be numerous and immediately he goes and murders those holding Lot captive (sin number 1). Then God has Communion with Abram and blesses him. Then later God makes a covenant with Abram and he turns around and tries to create that promise on his own with a handmaiden (sin number 2). 13 years later, God changes Abram's name to fulfill His promise and Abraham laughs at God (sin number 3).

But the moment we read Abraham is circumcised, we do not read where Abraham sins again. Obviously we know he could have, he did before each time God blessed him and God still fulfilled his promise to him.

Now, I do not believe in a license to sin concept, but I know as a human I am going to sin. I also know that if God makes a promise, He will keep it. And even though I know the promise of God by the act of Jesus upon the cross, I still feel better repenting of my sins. I do not feel that we should ever stop repenting, even with the promise we have in God. And I do not believe God is upset each time I repent, even though it seems like a million times per day. I still believe in the Lord's Prayer, concerning to be forgiven daily, we must first forgive those doing us wrong on a daily basis. It's not a mental issue that keeps me repenting, it's that I do not want to become callous by not seeking repentance and eventually just believe that I do have a license to sin.

 

[obedienttogod]

Point taken! I'm pretty sure YOU have misunderstood Paul, AND Peter for that matter.

But I am not distorting the message of Paul like Peter mentioned. I do not believe Paul was claiming we do have a license to sin. I believe Paul was claiming we as humans will sin, but we have promise made by God. But I also believe we just cannot feel like we can go on a shopping spree of sinning and believe I can do this every day. I do not believe that was Paul's message. And if you do, this is where I believe Peter is claiming we are distorting scripture.