Xmas

[kaylagrl]

On the contrary, I am not trying to deceive people, my questions and answers to questions come from the Bible and if you feel any deceit then you must believe that the Bible is deceitful.

I could say the same of you, why are you being deceitful and not allowing the Truth to be spoken. Haven't you tried to contradict the simple fact that the magi were pagan worshippers, and even if they were misguided, as many are, they were still on a mission of death from Herod?

Do you know what JW beliefs are? Do you know what it is to become a JW? I said previously that I was not a JW, and you won't accept that, so I guess you won't accept anything I say, and if that ain't bigotry I don't know what is.

No,your answers are not from the Bible are you are JW, or have recently left and still hold their views. The whole nine, satan sent the star,your belief on the trinity and hell. All those beliefs you espouse here are from the JW. So why are you being deceitful and hiding who you really are?!

The magi were not pagan. I gave you Bible verses to refute that. Quite handily. Yes,I do know who JW are and they have many false beliefs. The star sent by satan is one. Do you believe that Jesus is divine???

 

[kaylagrl]

Maybe because the scriptures DON'T back you up.

Oh but they do! As I pointed out the magi were not pagan.

 

[dokimos]

I am actually intellectually gifted. I do not need to hang onto pagan rituals to fill my world with wonder and intelligence, I get it from the Bible, not from the mouths of the demons that sway the feeble minds of the masses.

May God bless you and keep you first off.

I have to say I am so worried for you, for your spirit man, in how you are conducting yourself in responses. The Bible is our guideline to test every spirit, but we can not live on the Bible alone.

This Christmas thing is something even some seemingly seasoned Christians cannot seem to let go of, they will defend it to the death, it is an idol. You cannot change their mind, it is the Spirit's job to reveal these spiritual truths. Do not upset your witness with haughty posturing. Pleading with you on this. We must regulate our knowledge with love.

I am sorry if this comes off as a harsh response, I just do not want to see someone with biblical knowledge waste their witness. May the Spirit of the Lord bless and sanctify you. May you be in good spiritual and physical health to be used by Jesus.

 

[marakorpa]

Nowhere in the Bible are we told to celebrate with feasts and the giving of gifts, the birth of Jesus, which could not have even taken place at the time we celebrate it based on the events of the Bible.

It is a tradition of man, and even secular or alternative faith ancient traditions groups acknowledge Christmas as primarily a Norse/Roman/Pagan holiday that Judeo Christians and Roman Catholics adopted.

Exactly!!!!! Finally, someone who is prepared to accept the facts. The simple fact of the shepherds watching their flocks is sufficient, as in that area in December it is below freezing.
Some may think it is a simple thing to have a "few little errors" in a religious commentary, but when you consider that there are more "Errors" than truths in any religious commentary in Christendom is should be time to seek the truth and not just bury your head in the sand.

 

[marakorpa]

Oh but they do! As I pointed out the magi were not pagan.

Pray tell! Who practices divination, who are the astrologers or days gone and current, not astronomers, don't get confused, now will you. If just those three pagan practices do not put the "wise" men in place for the badge, what does?

 

[marakorpa]

That is about it for Xmas from me, how about we try another wonderful "Tradition" Easter maybe?

 

[Laish]

Oh but they do! As I pointed out the magi were not pagan.

Hey Kaylagrl leave the Russelite to him self . You have thrown your pearls before the swine .
Just pray for the man and move on. They have much more to worry about than if the magi were believers or not . They deny the deity of Christ Jesus ,the deity and personhood of the Holy Spirit.
That and they can’t even get the personal name or God correct.
It also seems odd that a overseer would let a publisher on the net to do this kind of stuff .
Just probably a lone wolf JW .
Blessings
Bill

 

[wolfwint]

Who Sent the Star?

Obviously, you have seen the story of the Star and the Three Kings, or wise men visiting the newborn baby Jesus as he lay in the manger. According to the story, God used the star to lead them to the stable in Bethlehem. Children have memorized the names of those three kings , Melchior, Caspar, and Balazar However, does the popular account match what the Bible actually says? It doesn't in a number of ways, the story is inaccurate.

First, who were these men? In the original Greek, the Bible calls them neither kings nor wise men. They were magi or astrologers. They were evidently practicers of the pagan art of divination based on the stars. The Bible record reveals neither the names not the number of those visitors.

Second: when did the men visit. It was not when Jesus was a newborn baby in the manger as Matthew says "When they went into the house they saw the young child with Mary, its mother." Matt: 2 :11. Not a newborn baby, but a young child. Mary and Joseph were no longer spending nights in a stable, they were living in the house.

Thirdly: who sent the star to lead the astrologers? Religious leaders commonly teach that God sent the Star. Remember, the star did not first lead the astrologers to Bethlehem, it led them to King Herod in Jerusalem. They revealed Jesus' existence to the jealous and powerful murderer and gave him strong reason to hate the child who was to become King. matt2.. Craftily, Herod told them to report back to him on the precise location of this child giving the false claim that Herod wanted to honour the child as well.

The Star then led the astrologers to Joseph and Mary. So the astrologers were on a course that would have doomed the young child had God not intervened. God did intervene. So enraged was Herod when the astrologers did not report back to him he ordered all the male children two years of age and younger in and around Bethlehem to be killed. Matt: 2 ,16.

Now, would God have used pagan magic practising (men) who practised the occult arts so forbidden by God's own law, to be his messengers? Would God use a star to lead conspirators to his only begotten son so that Herod could kill him?

Well, we have in first line to consider, that the Holy Spirit gave Matthew the words he should write down. And he wrote them down as an historical fact.
Without to explain the reason and background ( in the mostcorrect

Your first point is correct. It is not really clear from where they came. And it seems they were astrologies.
But the almost in CC are not following RCC Theologie. So why you treat us as RCC members?

Your second point is correct. They came not in the same time to Jesus than the shepherds. There was time between.

Thirdly. The star thing. Is an mirracle. It came at least 2 times to led the astrologes. This is simply reportet as it was. To put more meaning in is simply eisegese. Except you got an extra revelation about it.

Everybody here knows that 25th is not the birthday of Jesus Christ.
But there is no sin to renember it as his birthday. Ore to celebrate it.
Nobody is forced to have the man made rituals ore customs to celebrate it.
Also you should consider that the almost all members on CC are born again christians which following Jesus and knowing the truth.
The most so called nominal christians, which are following the trafitions and have no relationship to Jesus, you will not find here.Maby you should go to an RRC side for to teach them.

You are call yourself intelligent and giving this as an reason to follow that what you are wrote.
Intelligence is not everything. Important is that what the Holy Spirit reveals.
And the way you write and dishonor believers shows that you are not used from the Holy Spirit.
For what you are really on CC?

 

[kaylagrl]

Exactly!!!!! Finally, someone who is prepared to accept the facts. The simple fact of the shepherds watching their flocks is sufficient, as in that area in December it is below freezing.
Some may think it is a simple thing to have a "few little errors" in a religious commentary, but when you consider that there are more "Errors" than truths in any religious commentary in Christendom is should be time to seek the truth and not just bury your head in the sand.

Seek the truth as per JWs beliefs? No,I don't think so. This is a Christian site last time I checked.

 

[dokimos]

Seek the truth as per JWs beliefs? No,I don't think so. This is a Christian site last time I checked.

I am not a JW I just know that I have strong convictions about holidays like Christmas and Halloween. There is a lot tied in that can be a spiritual danger.

 

[kaylagrl]

Pray tell! Who practices divination, who are the astrologers or days gone and current, not astronomers, don't get confused, now will you. If just those three pagan practices do not put the "wise" men in place for the badge, what does?

They were NOT pagan. The Bible clearly says they worshiped Jesus,a pagan wouldn't do that. They brought Him expensive gifts,a pagan wouldn't do that. They received a dream from God and OBEYED the dream,a pagan wouldn't do that. You are wrong on all counts my friend. You are twisting Scripture to say something it does not. Simply ignoring facts does not make you right.

 

[kaylagrl]

That is about it for Xmas from me, how about we try another wonderful "Tradition" Easter maybe?

Yes,why don't you tell us what JWs believe about Easter. And while you're at it explain why JWs use to celebrate Christmas and suddenly stopped.

 

[kaylagrl]

Hey Kaylagrl leave the Russelite to him self . You have thrown your pearls before the swine .
Just pray for the man and move on. They have much more to worry about than if the magi were believers or not . They deny the deity of Christ Jesus ,the deity and personhood of the Holy Spirit.
That and they can’t even get the personal name or God correct.
It also seems odd that a overseer would let a publisher on the net to do this kind of stuff .
Just probably a lone wolf JW .
Blessings
Bill

Thanks brother,I was about to make my way round to that. Well said! But I do dislike his bullying and being untruthful as to why he is here. I thought that needed to be pointed out. You've done a perfect job.

 

[garee]

They were NOT pagan. The Bible clearly says they worshiped Jesus,a pagan wouldn't do that. They brought Him expensive gifts,a pagan wouldn't do that. They received a dream from God and OBEYED the dream,a pagan wouldn't do that. You are wrong on all counts my friend. You are twisting Scripture to say something it does not. Simply ignoring facts does not make you right.

I would think Pagans can bring expensive gifts. If they were believers which in the end they could of been. What gave them the faith to make it possible, as sign, or prophecy? Was there prophecy that foretold of His coming and the light guided them to fulfil prophecy ?

Not sure if they received prophecy through a dream.

 

[kaylagrl]

I am not a JW I just know that I have strong convictions about holidays like Christmas and Halloween. There is a lot tied in that can be a spiritual danger.

I did not say you were a JW. But the one who started this thread is and is being untruthful about it. Do you think that is right? I hope not.

Whatever your convictions are then you should live by those. Christmas is a time to spread the Gospel,Halloween is not. People hear the Gospel message at Christmas like no other time of year. It is an opportunity to witness to loves ones and friends. I use to travel and sing/preach the Gospel. I did it for 20yrs all over Canada and the US. I can tell you that Christmas services were packed like no other time of year. It is a great tool for witnessing. Whether the carols or the plays,all tell the story of the Saviors birth. If you feel you are in danger celebrating this holiday then don't. But for most of us it is a time of love,peace,giving and sharing the Good News to those who would otherwise never step foot in a church or hear a Christian song on the radio. Live the way you feel you ought but do not call others un-Christian because they hold Christmas as a time to celebrate the Saviors birth.

 

[kaylagrl]

I would think Pagans can bring expensive gifts. If they were believers which in the end they could of been. What gave them the faith to make it possible, as sign, or prophecy? Was there prophecy that foretold of His coming and the light guided them to fulfil prophecy ?

Not sure if they received prophecy through a dream.

Pagans would not worship or bring gifts to the Christchild. The magi were not pagans. Nor was the star sent by satan. That is a JW belief. They use to celebrate Christmas then suddenly changed. The OP can tell us why I'm sure.

 

[garee]

Nowhere in the Bible are we told to celebrate with feasts and the giving of gifts, the birth of Jesus, which could not have even taken place at the time we celebrate it based on the events of the Bible.

It is a tradition of man, and even secular or alternative faith ancient traditions groups acknowledge Christmas as primarily a Norse/Roman/Pagan holiday that Judeo Christians and Roman Catholics adopted.

We know why the Catholics have developed it having to do with a Queen of heaven . Hoping the flesh would profit for something.

Yes a pagan tradition seeing we are not informed to celebrate the birth . But like all oral traditions of men as private interpretations or heresies if they do not make the grace of God without effect they can be enjoyed. After time sometimes that which was enjoyed can turn sour Christmas can be a sad time for some depending on their memories.

 

[dokimos]

I did not say you were a JW. But the one who started this thread is and is being untruthful about it. Do you think that is right? I hope not.

Whatever your convictions are then you should live by those. Christmas is a time to spread the Gospel,Halloween is not. People hear the Gospel message at Christmas like no other time of year. It is an opportunity to witness to loves ones and friends. I use to travel and sing/preach the Gospel. I did it for 20yrs all over Canada and the US. I can tell you that Christmas services were packed like no other time of year. It is a great tool for witnessing. Whether the carols or the plays,all tell the story of the Saviors birth. If you feel you are in danger celebrating this holiday then don't. But for most of us it is a time of love,peace,giving and sharing the Good News to those who would otherwise never step foot in a church or hear a Christian song on the radio. Live the way you feel you ought but do not call others un-Christian because they hold Christmas as a time to celebrate the Saviors birth.

I don't think lying is right, no.

I do not like that my church is so worldly and saturates the building in trees and forgets that we adopted the holiday from people who were completely opposed to God. It's that alone that makes me steer away from it. Whatever makes the church money is what they will do.

 

[kaylagrl]

We know why the Catholics have developed it having to do with a Queen of heaven . Hoping the flesh would profit for something.

Yes a pagan tradition seeing we are not informed to celebrate the birth . But like all oral traditions of men as private interpretations or heresies if they do not make the grace of God without effect they can be enjoyed. After time sometimes that which was enjoyed can turn sour Christmas can be a sad time for some depending on their memories.

Yes Christmas can be sad. Over the years I have lost loved ones on or close to the season. But my parents had and still have a tradition of inviting people to Christmas dinner that have no family or are lonely on Christmas for whatever reason. We had a blind lady come to our church. No one seemed to befriend her. My parents asked her to Christmas dinner. Before long others in the church began asking her out and before long she had many offers and lots of friends. Christmas is a time to minister to the lost and hurting and we need to make sure we do just that.

 

[kaylagrl]

I don't think lying is right, no.

I do not like that my church is so worldly and saturates the building in trees and forgets that we adopted the holiday from people who were completely opposed to God. It's that alone that makes me steer away from it. Whatever makes the church money is what they will do.

I'm not sure how Christmas trees make the church money... Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying. Nothing wrong with a Christmas tree. Any "supposed" link to pagan beliefs is long gone. Atheists are trying to stop Christmas because it's too Christian,that ought to tell you that the world connects the holiday to Christ.

As another poster pointed out there are many things that have pagan origins and names that we support with our money. Many have Nike shoes, the days of the week have pagan names,weddings rings and anniversaries. Christmas is a tool for ministry and that opportunity ought to be taken.