Five Fold Ministry

[Wansvic]

There seems to be a correlation between the five fold ministry (apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor and teacher) and man's five senses; vision, hearing, taste, smell and touch.

I would appreciate any insight/revelation members may have on the topic.


"And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:11-16

 

[tourist]

I believe that are many ministries besides the obvious ones you have listed. Yes, our senses certainly come into play in carrying out these ministries but there are many that lack one or more senses and yet, despite this handicap, carry out their ministry duties admirably.

 

[Miri]

Hi Wan. I have been reading a book which is probably controversial, depending on whether you still believe in prophesy or not and the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

There is a fascinating section on how the writer thinks that just as we have 5 physical senses, we also have 5 spiritual senses.

So we taste physically but we also taste spiritually. John for example where he tastes the scroll and it tastes like honey. (I’ve had that experienced myself about tasting the word of God like it is a delicious delicacy something to digest and ingest). That’s what got me interested in the book.

Others include we hear physically but also hear the word of God in a spiritual sense.

We see physically but see also as understand but some people also see things in the spirit.

Etc etc

Here is an extract the book is by Jonathon Welton called School of Seers. It’s rather incredible. But I understand many would be put off just by the title but it’s worth an eye popping read even if you don’t agree the spiritual gifts are for today (I do, by the way).


“So we fix our eyes not on what is seen, but on what is unseen, for what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal” (2 Corinthians 4: 18).

We have in this passage four different words that are important to understand: seen, unseen, temporary, and eternal. The seen is what we call the physical realm, that which is visible to the physical eye. This realm can be studied and experienced through our natural five senses of taste, touch, sound, sight, and smell. The unseen is another realm. Like the physical realm, it also can be experienced with the five senses. The five senses of our physical body do not interact with the unseen realm, but we have five senses in our spirit that interact with this realm. The physical realm and spiritual realm are what Paul was writing about when he refers to the seen and unseen.

 

[Lafftur]

There seems to be a correlation between the five fold ministry (apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor and teacher) and man's five senses; vision, hearing, taste, smell and touch.

I would appreciate any insight/revelation members may have on the topic.


"And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love." Eph 4:11-16

Hello Wansvic,

So, to correlate the five fold ministry with our 5 senses, I would say..................

Apostles = Sight because they get the "vision" and run with it!
Prophet = Hearing because they hear God's voice and get the message to deliver!
Evangelist = Taste because they have tasted and know God is good and proclaim what they have tasted!
Pastor = Smell because they do A LOT of praying for the needs of the people and offer up praise and worship which all three - prayers, praise and worship are a sweet aroma in the nostrils of God!
Teacher = Touch because they teach the Word of God in a way that shows the listener "how to apply it to their life" - how to do the works of God and "touch" the lost world.

Great thread! It caused me to dig a bit deeper in order to answer your question! Thanks!

 

[Dino246]

Without wanting to be a wet blanket, I think any correlation between five-fold ministry and the five senses is purely coincidental. As Scripture doesn't link them, any alleged correlation will be the invention of the commentator... and I guarantee that different people will link them differently.

 

[Lafftur]

Without wanting to be a wet blanket, I think any correlation between five-fold ministry and the five senses is purely coincidental. As Scripture doesn't link them, any alleged correlation will be the invention of the commentator... and I guarantee that different people will link them differently.

Oh, come on, Dino...........sometimes the Word of God can be......

 

[Lafftur]

Here's some more fun with the five fold ministry..........

They're kinda like an "assembly line."

1st Apostles enter the darkness by bringing a heavy anointing of God's Light that shuts down the spiritual darkness/demonic activity from being able to operate.

2nd Prophets can now deliver God's message that prepares the hearts of the people by turning the hearts of the children to the fathers and the hearts of the fathers to the children - so the spirit of disobedience and rebellion is not allowed to hinder the listeners.

3rd Evangelists can now deliver the gospel message - the good news of salvation through Jesus Christ/Yeshua the Messiah and get everyone born again, water baptized and filled with the Holy Spirit.

4th Pastors can now provide a home church where believers can be "planted" and tended to in a way that helps them to grow. Provide for ways to meet their needs - like a shepherd - take care of them.

5th Teachers can now feed the believers Gods' Word so that believers can grow up, mature and increase in the knowledge, wisdom and understanding of God.

Just fun things to think about - not necessary to know regarding salvation. It's just fun to ponder and consider all the wonderful aspects of God's Word.................

 

[Demi777]

Usually when i hear someone talk about that 5 fold ministry is used as beating someone up ministry.
Yours is much more peaceful

 

[GraceAndTruth]

Correlation? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

 

[Lafftur]

Correlation? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Might I recommend that you choose to laugh..............although, you could laugh so hard that you cry! LOL!

 

[tourist]

Correlation? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Laughing or crying is an emotion but perhaps correlated with the 5 senses.

 

[GraceAndTruth]

IF YOU ARE READING BOOKS ABOUT THE BIBLE TO BETTER UNDERSTAND THE BIBLE, YOU PROBABLY DO NOT HAVE THE GREATEST TEACHER OF ALL TIME.........THE HOLY SPIRIT.

 

[Lafftur]

IF YOU ARE READING BOOKS ABOUT THE BIBLE TO BETTER UNDERSTAND THE BIBLE, YOU PROBABLY DO NOT HAVE THE GREATEST TEACHER OF ALL TIME.........THE HOLY SPIRIT.

Hello GraceAndTruth,

So true, The Holy Spirit is the GREATEST Teacher of all time.

John 16:13 King James Version (KJV)
13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.


1 John 2:27 King James Version (KJV)
27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

The Holy Spirit knows each of us so very well.........

 

[Miri]

I would probably be the one right at the back of the queue, wondering
if anything will be left when I get to the front! Lol

 

[Wansvic]

Hi Wan. I have been reading a book which is probably controversial, depending on whether you still believe in prophesy or not and the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

There is a fascinating section on how the writer thinks that just as we have 5 physical senses, we also have 5 spiritual senses.

So we taste physically but we also taste spiritually. John for example where he tastes the scroll and it tastes like honey. (I’ve had that experienced myself about tasting the word of God like it is a delicious delicacy something to digest and ingest). That’s what got me interested in the book.

Others include we hear physically but also hear the word of God in a spiritual sense.

We see physically but see also as understand but some people also see things in the spirit.

Etc etc

Here is an extract the book is by Jonathon Welton called School of Seers. It’s rather incredible. But I understand many would be put off just by the title but it’s worth an eye popping read even if you don’t agree the spiritual gifts are for today (I do, by the way).

I am not put off by the title of the book you reference because Prophets were called Seers in the Old Testament. I have never heard of the author you mention. But I think it is worth looking into. Thanks for sharing.
P.S. I certainly believe in spiritual gifts. The bible gives a clear record of spiritual gifts having been given for the perfecting of the saints (Christians) while living here on earth. The Word also clearly states those gifts will continue until that which is perfect has come, that being Jesus Christ when He returns for His bride. After we are with Him we will no longer have need of spiritual gifts.

 

[Wansvic]

Hello Wansvic,

So, to correlate the five fold ministry with our 5 senses, I would say..................

Apostles = Sight because they get the "vision" and run with it!
Prophet = Hearing because they hear God's voice and get the message to deliver!
Evangelist = Taste because they have tasted and know God is good and proclaim what they have tasted!
Pastor = Smell because they do A LOT of praying for the needs of the people and offer up praise and worship which all three - prayers, praise and worship are a sweet aroma in the nostrils of God!
Teacher = Touch because they teach the Word of God in a way that shows the listener "how to apply it to their life" - how to do the works of God and "touch" the lost world.

Great thread! It caused me to dig a bit deeper in order to answer your question! Thanks!

I too am studying this topic. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Wansvic]

Without wanting to be a wet blanket, I think any correlation between five-fold ministry and the five senses is purely coincidental. As Scripture doesn't link them, any alleged correlation will be the invention of the commentator... and I guarantee that different people will link them differently.

Although I have found no specific scripture connecting the two topics, the following scripture does speak to natural and spiritual concepts:

"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:" Romans 1:20

The concept does have merit when one considers that God created both man and the individual ministries with precision. God does nothing haphazardly. All of His designs work in harmony and give deeper understanding.

If you will recall Jesus used parables depicting nature to convey spiritual truths to help people understand. Different body parts work alone or along with others (such as smell and taste) in perfect harmony to attain a specific result. The same can be seen in the Five Fold Ministry Offices.

Definitely going to study further because the flicker of revelation is just on the horizon.

 

[Blain]

This is actually a very interesting topic to discuss and there are many different views on it but from my understanding they are all connected and yet also separate as they tend to go within each other. I like to think of it like this, in the faith of Christianity there many denominations and within each denomination is a separate set of doctrines and beliefs and within those set of doctrines and beliefs there many different views and understanding of those doctrines and beliefs.

In the same way each five fold ministry has a tree to follow such as the initial skills a person was born with and how God would use that or how like you said physical and spiritual senses come into play and ect.
For some we are solely one ministry others are intertwined with more than one such as a teacher and evangelist and others are used in all areas.

For instance I have always been a writer at heart and can speak my thoughts and my heart much better in written form and so God took that and used me here on cc, so he took my initial skill and made use of it. However what I gained when I came to him was not my initial skills, I am known as a prophet but not just a prophet I am also known as a seer meaning I can see and feel things in the spirit and is a different kind of prophet but also a normal prophet. I have more than once just been on cc talking about heaven when suddenly in my minds eye I can vividly see what appears to be a heavenly feast filled with foods and drinks of grand measure some are foods we all have had here on earth others are things that don't exist here on earth but as I gaze at it it's as if I am tasting it somehow and I know that if anyone were to taste this food for real we would never crave human food again.

Sometimes even sound and touching comes into play like how I can describe the grass in heaven as if I am actually there touching the silky smooth and lavishing grass. However he used me in all areas of the ministry not just my initial spiritual gifts mainly because of my willingness.

Personally I don't think we are all limited to just any one of these ministries, so long as we have a willing and eager heart I believe he will use that willingness to the fullest extent, after all it isn't the strong he seeking nor is it the pure or the perfect he only needs a willing heart and no matter what weaknesses we have or what we may be lacking he takes the wheel from there and uses his children to do amazing things

 

[Nehemiah6]

I would appreciate any insight/revelation members may have on the topic.

Well since the apostles and prophets are with us only in the written Word of God, the term *Five Fold Ministry* is incorrect. You can now call it a *Three Fold Ministry* (evangelists, pastors, and teachers).

1. There are only TWELVE apostles of the Lamb (Rev 21:14).
And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb...

TWELVE TRIBES
TWELVE APOSTLES
TWELVE FOUNDATIONS
TWELVE THRONES FOR TWELVE APOSTLES RULING THE TWELVE TRIBES OF ISRAEL

2. The apostle John -- who wrote Revelation -- was the LAST genuine prophet (Rev 22:18).
For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book...

 

[presidente]

I notice the twelve were lled postles just as they were sent on an evanfelustic jpurney in one gospel and just after they had returned in another. Acts first calls Paul and Barnabas 'apostles' in chapter 13 after the Spirit speaks to the prophets and teachers in Antioch. They preached, did miracles, and churches were formed through their ministry.

Paul called the church in Corinth the seal of his apostleship. They had become a church through his ministry. Not by putting together a better program and drawing membership from First Baptist. Paul said they had not many fathers, for through the Gospel he had become their father.

There are those who would say apostles are fatherly types, but overlook the evangelistic component that Paul had become their father through the gospel.

There is the idea these days that apostles are another layer of church hierarchy over pastors, or that they are just Christian 'movers and shakers.'