(poll) Do We Choose Him or Does he choose us?

[Xethea]

Do We Choose Him or Does he choose us?

I have gotten a debate in person and online recently about this.
Do you believe we are predestined to be saved, as if God chose us before our existence and planned to save us or do you believe it's up to us alone to choose him or do you believe he tries to choose us but leaves the final answer up to us?

With whatever you believe, there are these common sayings I get in response when they debate.

if you believe he chooses in us and we can't avoid him and being saved because we are predestined, then isn't us choosing him forced on us and not wanting him by free will and doesn't that seem like he didn't really die for everyone because he isn't choosing the rest of the world to save them?

if you believe it is entirely up to us, then does that mean in our sinful nature we have good desires to do what is right without God in us to give us those desires before salvation?

Or if you believe he makes us want to as if he gives us the strength and desires to want to be saved, but we can still choose to live in sin and not be saved? That it is up to us in the end?

I have not given my answer here on this poll, but I'd like to hear yours and I may share mine.

 

[CharliRenee]

My thoughts on this are like the thoughts of many, they go on and on. I think the answer, like all other answers, is found in Him....

But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
1 Corinthians 1:30 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/1co.1.30.NASB

 

[eternally-gratefull]

The way I see it, We chose to be saved, by placing our faith in the work of God.

That is not chosing God.

We are unable to even understand God until after we are saved, thus we have no capacity to chose God.

 

[Xethea]

My thoughts on this are like the thoughts of many, they go on and on. I think the answer, like all other answers, is found in Him....

But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
1 Corinthians 1:30 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/1co.1.30.NASB

Which people would question then, so you are claiming it is by the strength of Jesus in us then that saves us? Because you said it is "by his doing." So then the option of us doing it by our free choice alone is out of question.

 

[calibob]

My thoughts on this are like the thoughts of many, they go on and on. I think the answer, like all other answers, is found in Him....

But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,
1 Corinthians 1:30 NASB
https://bible.com/bible/100/1co.1.30.NASB

He chose us first but he does not force us to reciprocate by choosing him. That's up to us. We've got to choose also.

 

[Xethea]

The way I see it, We chose to be saved, by placing our faith in the work of God.

That is not chosing God.

We are unable to even understand God until after we are saved, thus we have no capacity to chose God.

People tell me they see that if you choose God, then you are choosing what is good, and obviously we choose by desire- so then, if before we are saved as we are only of sin, does that me somewhere in us we have good desires in our sinful nature to do what is good or did God gives us that to choose him?

 

[Xethea]

The way I see it, We chose to be saved, by placing our faith in the work of God.

That is not chosing God.

We are unable to even understand God until after we are saved, thus we have no capacity to chose God.

So when we place our faith in God, is it us placing it with our strength, is that God placing it through us, or is that giving us the strength?
It has to be one or the other, or either some other demon, angel, animal and such is doing it. What caused us to place our faith in him?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

People tell me they see that if you choose God, then you are choosing what is good, and obviously we choose by desire- so then, if before we are saved as we are only of sin, does that me somewhere in us we have good desires in our sinful nature to do what is good or did God gives us that to choose him?

We can not know to do Good. God has to teach us his word (As Jesus said in John 6 and other places) faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word.

It is not a good act to have faith in God. It is a desperate act wrought out of those who have become poor in spirit (literally spiritually bancrupt) and realise their situation and out of hopelessness, as the tax collector. Call out for Gods mercy.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

So when we place our faith in God, is it us placing it with our strength, is that God placing it through us, or is that giving us the strength?
It has to be one or the other, or either some other demon, angel, animal and such is doing it. What caused us to place our faith in him?

No, It is us placing faith out of lack of strength, Because you have come to the end of yourself.

Jesus said blessed are the poor in spirit. The term literally means bancrupt. Hopless. Having nothing to offer. For theirs is the kingdom of God (it is they who out of total inablility and loss of all strength, call out to Jesus.

 

[Xethea]

We can not know to do Good. God has to teach us his word (As Jesus said in John 6 and other places) faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word.

It is not a good act to have faith in God. It is a desperate act wrought out of those who have become poor in spirit (literally spiritually bancrupt) and realise their situation and out of hopelessness, as the tax collector. Call out for Gods mercy.

Okay, so your answer is that God gives us the strength and desire but it is still up to us in the end. Correct?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Okay, so your answer is that God gives us the strength and desire but it is still up to us in the end. Correct?

I see God takes our strength away and bancrupts us. And when we relent to his will. We see our need and call out in desperation on God to have mercy on us..

The tax collector had not even enough strength to look up to heaven when he called on the name of the lord..

Where as the pharisee had so much strength, he puffed his chest and praise God he was not like the tax collector.

Who went home justified?

 

[Xethea]

No, It is us placing faith out of lack of strength, Because you have come to the end of yourself.

Jesus said blessed are the poor in spirit. The term literally means bancrupt. Hopless. Having nothing to offer. For theirs is the kingdom of God (it is they who out of total inablility and loss of all strength, call out to Jesus.

Your explanation must go either way of these options. Because either we choose or God chooses for us or God chooses us. Despite whatever goes on, is it that we do it alone, he does it alone or we do it together by his strength?

you say we lack the strength. So did God give us what we needed to choose then or even in that lacking faith did we choose him alone?

 

[Xethea]

I see God takes our strength away and bancrupts us. And when we relent to his will. We see our need and call out in desperation on God to have mercy on us..

The tax collector had not even enough strength to look up to heaven when he called on the name of the lord..

Where as the pharisee had so much strength, he puffed his chest and praise God he was not like the tax collector.

Who went home justified?

Ok. So to be clear, you sound like you are saying God helps us, gets us to a place and we choose him?

 

[Xethea]

He chose us first but he does not force us to reciprocate by choosing him. That's up to us. We've got to choose also.

Do you believe he chooses us, and some of us still refuse and go to hell? or do you believe everyone he chooses will be saved?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Your explanation must go either way of these options. Because either we choose or God chooses for us or God chooses us. Despite whatever goes on, is it that we do it alone, he does it alone or we do it together by his strength?

you say we lack the strength. So did God give us what we needed to choose then or even in that lacking faith did we choose him alone?

I said we chose. But not out of our own strength, but out of our weekness.

I was disagreeing with your point we have strength or chose god out of our strength, not that we chose God. .

Sorry if you misunderstood..

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Ok. So to be clear, you sound like you are saying God helps us, gets us to a place and we choose him?

It is called the lord drawing us to him.. As jesus said in John 6.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Do you believe he chooses us, and some of us still refuse and go to hell? or do you believe everyone he chooses will be saved?

People who go to hell because they chose to reject grace..Many of them God tried to draw also. See Israel. Where jesus himself said they were not willing

 

[Poinsetta]

I think He’s preparing a Kingdom and He is choosing us to be a part of it because we will be useful somehow and we will be good stewards of His power and Glory. So i think He is looking for ‘useful’ people in whom He can use to manifest and bring His Glory forth.

 

[calibob]

The way I see it, We chose to be saved, by placing our faith in the work of God.

That is not chosing God.

We are unable to even understand God until after we are saved, thus we have no capacity to chose God.

I can't and don't speak for others. My experience was when I was in my mid 20's I merely hoped god was real. I was not convinced then when I prayed to the God I was not sure was real to come into my life and prove it to me. He did. And everything began to change. I'm a sinner saved by grace but I asked HIM into MY life. I wasn't blinded walking down the road like Saul of Tarsus but I had to humble myself to Jesus of Nazareth first whom I didn't believe in and the Holy Spirit came upon me and within me. I've been praising the Lord ever since that night. I was born as sinner by nature but was changed. I asked and he responded. That's all I feel moved to say! PTL!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I said we chose. But not out of our own strength, but out of our weekness.

I was disagreeing with your point we have strength or chose god out of our strength, not that we chose God. .

Sorry if you misunderstood..

And I would add. We do not chose God out of our own goodness either. There is no good in us.