Sabbath

Yahshua · Sep 21, 2018

The law was placed in the ark of the covenant, and then a lid was placed on it called The "Mercy" Seat. So since the law was first given there has always been a covering of mercy. At the base of The Almighty's throne is His law as proof of his supreme right to judge, but mercy has always been at the discretion of the same one seated on that throne.

"I will have mercy upon whomever I will..." (Exodus 33:19; Roman's 9:15)

Hevosmies · Sep 21, 2018

I dont "keep" the sabbath.

Sometimes I wonder if I should, despite Colossians 2:16

Due to Matthew 24 talking about end times to His disciples who are persecuted for Jesus' name and it says to pray that it doesn't happen on the sabbath.

I just think the SDA interpretation of it is going a bit too far, and in contradiction to colossians 2:16. What if you work at a job where you must work on the sabbath?
Its always been my understanding that the sabbath was a jewish thing

Karraster · Sep 21, 2018

Hevosmies said:

I'm not SDA or Hebrew Roots. I just started reading the Bible for myself, without a Baptist preacher telling me/interpreting for me. Observing Sabbath is in the New Testament...if you can read it without prejudice.

Hevosmies · Sep 21, 2018

Karraster said:

Where is it commanded in the N.t? No where. Its observed somewhere yeah

gb9 · Sep 21, 2018

Hevosmies said:

here is the N.T. command for Christ followers to keep the Sabbath :

Yahshua · Sep 21, 2018

gb9 said:

Your post was funny lol...but still wrong. Aren't Christ's teachings on the Sabbath for his disciples to follow?

Yahshua · Sep 21, 2018

Let me ask it another way to make the point; are Christ's teachings for his disciples to follow?

Christ didn't specifically use "thou shalt..." at all, and rarely did he say, "this is a new commandment I'm giving you...", but does that mean the things he taught his disciples were somehow disqualified or reduced to simply good sayings that his followers can apply if they choose to?

JaumeJ · Sep 22, 2018

The seventh day , for me, is no long simply a commandment, it is an honor because God gave it to all who will accept it as a gift.

I would hate to miss out on His Sabbath or theseventh Thousand years, for both are to be spent with Him……….

Have a wonderful sabbath, and if you believe in your heart that the seventh day should be observed on the first day, no problem, happy sabbath.

posthuman · Sep 22, 2018

Hevosmies said:

col 2:16 does not say don't keep sabbath. it says don't allow anyone to judge you over it.

it's wise and well to keep sabbath. maybe one day if God shows us His favor we can have a sabbath thread about that, instead of yet another one full of people saying we ought to be judged by sabbath keeping and other people saying no, scripture says exactly the opposite. maybe one day we will have a sabbath thread that's actually good for something instead of altogether destructive.

i never give up hope

Studyman · Sep 22, 2018

posthuman said:

"why was the Law completely ignored here"

Let's look at ALL of the scriptures describing this event about a man that you judge and preach was a rapist, liar and murderer, who according to the faith chapter of Hebrews is an example of faith, and see if God ignored His Law here as you preach.

2 Sam.
9 Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.
10 Now therefore the sword shall never depart from thine house; because thou hast despised me, and hast taken the wife of Uriah the Hittite to be thy wife.

11 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun.

12 For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, and before the sun.

13 And David said unto Nathan, I have sinned against the LORD. (This is called confessing ones sin to God) And Nathan said unto David, The LORD also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die.

So you preach God completely ignored His Law here. Implying once again, that God is an unjust God and respecter of persons. But the scriptures you omitted seems to tell a different story.

Lev. 26:
40 If they shall confess their iniquity, and the iniquity of their fathers, with their trespass which they trespassed against me, and that also they have walked contrary unto me;
41 And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity:

42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.

So it would seem that once again, you are mistaken.

God didn't ignore His Law with David as you preach at all, He followed it as the scriptures posted clearly point out.

And Further more:

2 Sam. 12:14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die.

God knew back then that religious man would use this event of David as an excuse to reject God's Word and as justification for their own wicked rebellion. Which you have demonstrated very nicely in this post. Another miracle for those to see who believe in the perfection and foresight of God's Word.

And lastly, the punishment for this sin that you preach God completely ignored was a punishment that you couldn't bear. David's punishment was harsh, but he didn't blame God, or call God unjust, or call for the "removal" of His Word's as you imply the Christ did.

2 Sam.. 12:
21 Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread.
22 And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether GOD will be gracious to me, that the child may live?

24 And David comforted Bathsheba his wife, and went in unto her, and lay with her: and she bare a son, and he called his name Solomon: and the LORD loved him.

Maybe you should become more familiar with the scriptures before you make such judgments against God and His People.

Gen. 9:
21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.
22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.

23 And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness.

Lev. 18:
6 None of you shall approach to any that is near of kin to him, to uncover their nakedness: I am the LORD.
7 The nakedness of thy father, or the nakedness of thy mother, shalt thou not uncover: she is thy mother; thou shalt not uncover her nakedness.

Yahshua · Sep 22, 2018

posthuman said:

Interestingly enough, that's exactly how this thread started...until people started claiming the Sabbath wasn't for gentiles; themselves feeling judged by what they were reading of those who try to honor the day with their words.

Then the usual false implications, accusations and labeling begin, like:

"You're trying to make it a prescription!"

"You're trying to add works to salvation!"

"Where in the scriptures did the gentiles obey the sabbath!?"

"Those laws were put away!"

"You all are asda/pharisees/legalist/Hebrew roots....!"

Most of the times threads like this start with proponents sharing what scripture says, for edification.

So if we assume for a moment that every single person who contributes here loves Yah and wants to get closer to him, AND we remember that the Holy Spirit actually does perform his job description of "correcting/reproving, teaching and guiding" from the inside, exactly WHO is it that's causing those feelings inside? Who is it that's judging?

Acts 2 details Peter, after the disciples received the Holy Spirit, preaching to those around them...and it says when he was finished that those who heard him were "cut to the heart". What does this phrase mean in context? And who cut them? Was it Peter?

It's literally what the Holy Spirit was sent to do.

Cut to the heart = Circumcise the heart

Who are we actually wrestling against (i.e. striving with), "Israel"?

JaumeJ · Sep 22, 2018

Foolish people belive the Ten Commandments are fulfilled. They read Jesus Christ's teachings but reject all meaning.

Once more hes Pharisees are blinded by the veil of Moses not knowing the diffference between obeying the laws of Love made up by the laws which Jesus has left for all to follow.

If people are going to teach that obeying God is against mercy and grace, these people are just as guilty as the Israelis when they continuaously trurned away from obeying God……

The law now is according to grace, mercy justice, faith and the understanding given allby the words of the Master, Jesus Chrit.

Do not tell anyone he is sinnng by obeing the Fadther in Jesus Christ…...you will one day be sorry for this sinful teaching.

Dan_473 · Sep 22, 2018

Shamah said:

Part of the question I was asking was weather the Covenant that Jesus talks about the Last Supper when he says this is the New Covenant in my blood, is that the same as the New Covenant mentioned in Jeremiah 31 and Hebrews 8.

As I said it probably is, but it does raise some interesting issues.

When issue I find interesting is that we would expect to find the law of God written on the hearts of the House of Israel and the house of Judah. But I do not see this happening with Jewish people today.

I believe you are assuming that a person can be under only one Covenant with God at a time. I disagree with that. I think that would be a good thing to resolve before we move further.

Dan_473 · Sep 22, 2018

Shamah said:

I disagree, the law and the prophets have been fulfilled. That's what Jesus said he came to do, and I believe he was successful.

Studyman · Sep 22, 2018

Dan_473 said:

Allow me to ask you another question.

When the Christ was born, fulfilling what was written of Him in the Law and Prophets regarding His Birth, at this time had He fulfilled His Ministry, and His death and resurrection? Or were those prophesies from the Law and Prophets fulfillment later on in His life?

Dan_473 · Sep 22, 2018

Studyman said:

Those prophecies came later in his life. And of course there are prophecies that Jesus did not fulfill, that will be fulfilled at his second coming or after that.

I think it's interesting to Note 2 that Jesus fulfilled the law, yet he did not perform every Duty prescribed by the law, because some of them would not apply to him. For example levirate marriage.

posthuman · Sep 22, 2018

Studyman said:

"why was the Law completely ignored here"

Let's look at ALL of the scriptures describing this event about a man that you judge and preach was a rapist, liar and murderer, who according to the faith chapter of Hebrews is an example of faith, and see if God ignored His Law here as you preach.

2 Sam.
9 Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.
10 Now therefore the sword shall never depart from thine house; because thou hast despised me, and hast taken the wife of Uriah the Hittite to be thy wife.

11 Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will raise up evil against thee out of thine own house, and I will take thy wives before thine eyes, and give them unto thy neighbour, and he shall lie with thy wives in the sight of this sun.

12 For thou didst it secretly: but I will do this thing before all Israel, and before the sun.

13 And David said unto Nathan, I have sinned against the LORD. (This is called confessing ones sin to God) And Nathan said unto David, The LORD also hath put away thy sin; thou shalt not die.

So you preach God completely ignored His Law here. Implying once again, that God is an unjust God and respecter of persons. But the scriptures you omitted seems to tell a different story.

Lev. 26:
40 If they shall confess their iniquity, and the iniquity of their fathers, with their trespass which they trespassed against me, and that also they have walked contrary unto me;
41 And that I also have walked contrary unto them, and have brought them into the land of their enemies; if then their uncircumcised hearts be humbled, and they then accept of the punishment of their iniquity:

42 Then will I remember my covenant with Jacob, and also my covenant with Isaac, and also my covenant with Abraham will I remember; and I will remember the land.

So it would seem that once again, you are mistaken.

God didn't ignore His Law with David as you preach at all, He followed it as the scriptures posted clearly point out.

And Further more:

2 Sam. 12:14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die.

God knew back then that religious man would use this event of David as an excuse to reject God's Word and as justification for their own wicked rebellion. Which you have demonstrated very nicely in this post. Another miracle for those to see who believe in the perfection and foresight of God's Word.

And lastly, the punishment for this sin that you preach God completely ignored was a punishment that you couldn't bear. David's punishment was harsh, but he didn't blame God, or call God unjust, or call for the "removal" of His Word's as you imply the Christ did.

2 Sam.. 12:
21 Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread.
22 And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether GOD will be gracious to me, that the child may live?

24 And David comforted Bathsheba his wife, and went in unto her, and lay with her: and she bare a son, and he called his name Solomon: and the LORD loved him.

Maybe you should become more familiar with the scriptures before you make such judgments against God and His People.

Gen. 9:
21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent.
22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.

23 And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid it upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces were backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness.

Lev. 18:
6 None of you shall approach to any that is near of kin to him, to uncover their nakedness: I am the LORD.
7 The nakedness of thy father, or the nakedness of thy mother, shalt thou not uncover: she is thy mother; thou shalt not uncover her nakedness.

he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death.

(Leviticus 24:17)

the man that committeth adultery with [another] man's wife,

[even he] that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife,

the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

(Leviticus 20:10)

if in the field the man finds the girl who is engaged,

and the man forces her and lies with her,

then only the man who lies with her shall die.

(Deuteronomy 22:25)

Studyman · Sep 22, 2018

posthuman said:

If this were the only Word's your Bible says, if there were no other scriptures in the Law and Prophets regarding sin and punishment, then you might have a leg to stand on.

But I posted scriptures where this same God tells us "IF" we do this, or IF we do that, then there is "MERCY" available for us. Like the Mainstream Preachers of Christ's Time, you have "Omitted" the Weightier parts of God's Law, like Mercy, Judgment and Faith".

This is why the Messiah said "Man does not live by bread alone, but by "EVERY WORD" of God." David was guilty of sin just like you are guilty of sin. And David was given Mercy just like you claim God gave you Mercy.

God took David's sin away. But you are still accusing him. God gave David Mercy but you call him a liar, and a rapist, and a murderer.

God says He forgets the sin of the repentant. But you are still condemning Him all these centuries later.

And you refusal to even acknowledge the price David paid for His sin is amazing to me, as well as your indifference of the price the Christ paid for taking David's sin away.

This is pretty bad Post.

posthuman · Sep 22, 2018

Studyman said:

you're proving my point.

the Law is unshakingly clear: a murderer, a rapist, an adulterer must be put to death.
there's no 'sacrifice' for murder & rape & adultery, and there is no 'if he shows he's sorry' clause in the Law.

David wasn't pardoned by the Law. He was pardoned by someone greater than the Law, who was able to set the Law aside.
his sins weren't 'covered' ((atoned)) -- they were removed
the Law does not remove sin: the sacrifices cover ((atone for)) it. this is testifying of Christ, as all scripture does, and it is testifying that in Him there is a setting aside of the Law: a commutation of the righteous justice the Law demands.

posthuman · Sep 22, 2018

Studyman said:

don't lie, dude.
liars do not enter the kingdom.

the son of the adulterous rape paid the price, not David.
and that is not what the Law commands.
that is a picture of Christ.

Sabbath

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