OSAS= House Built on Sand

[justpassinthrough]

Living faith. Faith is the direct result of believing in grace, works is the direct result of LIVING faith.
You cannot separate grace, faith, and works.

James 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1

• Faith comes to each of us by hearing God speak to us.

So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17



By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going. Hebrews 11:8

• This is when Abraham was first "saved", having heard "the gospel" in which he received the promise of God, the very substance of the thing he hoped for. This is when Abraham was first justified by faith.

And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” Galatians 3:8


Abraham received faith, when he heard The Lord said to him -


Now the Lord had said to Abram:
“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you;
And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”
Genesis 12:1-3

Abraham was justified [made righteous] when he obeyed this word from God, by which he himself received faith.



So Abram departed as the Lord had spoken to him... Genesis 12:4



Faith must have this action of obedience, to activate it, to produce the intended divine result, or faith will remain dormant, and lifeless, incomplete and unable to function, just as a body without a spirit is dead and unable to function, being incomplete.


Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect [complete]? James 2:22


For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works [obedience] is dead also. James 2:26




JPT

 

[UnderGrace]

Depends. How would you explain that verse? GBY

Yes it does indeed.

 

[notuptome]

Amen, men who PROFESS to know Christ but deny him in their works (Titus 1:16).

Use care since this is a fine line to draw. Those who are genuine born again Christians are not described in Titus 1:16. There is a difference between believers who are overcome with the cares of this world and those who have never been converted.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[LW97]

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1

• Faith comes to each of us by hearing God speak to us.

So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Romans 10:17



By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going. Hebrews 11:8

• This is when Abraham was first "saved", having heard "the gospel" in which he received the promise of God, the very substance of the thing he hoped for. This is when Abraham was first justified by faith.

And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” Galatians 3:8


Abraham received faith, when he heard The Lord said to him -


Now the Lord had said to Abram:
“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you;
And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”
Genesis 12:1-3

Abraham was justified [made righteous] when he obeyed this word from God, by which he himself received faith.



So Abram departed as the Lord had spoken to him... Genesis 12:4



Faith must have this action of obedience, to activate it, to produce the intended divine result, or faith will remain dormant, and lifeless, incomplete and unable to function, just as a body without a spirit is dead and unable to function, being incomplete.


Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect [complete]? James 2:22


For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works [obedience] is dead also. James 2:26




JPT

Amen.

 

[LW97]

Yes it does indeed.

It does what?

 

[justpassinthrough]

That truly describes many who profess to know Christ in this age. Do you believe that these are still saved even though they are entangled in the corruptions of the world?

I believe Peter points out in his example, that these people were saved and escaped the corruption of the world, then returned to the world and were entangled again.




JPT

 

[lightbearer]

Oh to the Contrary.
For we are now in Heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Through the Veil; that is to say His flesh. The Holy of Holies; The Body of Christ; the Temple of GOD. Christ in us the hope of Glory. We are dead nevertheless we live; yet not us but Christ lives in us, and the life we now live we live by the faith of the Son of God. So let's say not in our hearts, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (the Law; the word in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak) down from above: ) Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (the Law; the word in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word (the Christ; the Law in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak. The circumcision made without hands) is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach. The anointing which we have received of him abideth in us, and we need not that any man teach us: but as the same anointing teacheth us of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught us, ye shall abide in him. The Spirit of truth, he will guide us into all truth. Yet we still have a need? LORD we believe; thank you helping our unbelief!


(Rom 10:4-8; 1Jn 2:27)

This is not applicable

The Word of GOD is not applicable? You are mistaken. HIS Word shall not fail.

to sheep and shepherds, you can't have Christ. Have you already forgotten that He said "where I go you cannot come"

The WORD OF GOD SAYS NOT ME We are now in Heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Ephesians chapter 2.

The WORD OF GOD SAYS Through the Veil; that is to say His flesh. The Holy of Holies; Hebrews chapter 10.

The WORD OF GOOD SAYS we are The Body of Christ 1 Corinthians chapter 12

The WORD OF GOD SAYS we are the Temple of GOD. 1 Corinthians 3.

The WORD OF GOD SAYS Christ in us the hope of Glory. Colosians chapter 1.

THE WORD OF GOD SAYS
What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? We are dead nevertheless we live; yet not us but Christ lives in us, and the life we now live we live by the faith of the Son of God. Romans 6 and Galatians 2

The WORD OF GOD SAYS Say not in our hearts, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ (the Law; the word in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak) down from above: ) Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ (the Law; the word in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak) again from the dead.) But what saith it? The word (the Christ; the Law in our hearts and mouths. Which is the Faith in which we speak. The circumcision made without hands) is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach. Romans 10, Deuteronomy 30 and Colossians 2

The WORD OF GOD SAYS The anointing which we have received of him abideth in us, and we need not that any man teach us: but as the same anointing teacheth us of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught us, ye shall abide in him. The Spirit of truth, he will guide us into all truth. Yet we still have a need? LORD we believe; thank you helping our unbelief! 1John 2 and John 14.

CHRIST IS NOT YOUR BUDDY, HE IS YOUR GOD!

The WORD OF GOD SAYS Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you. Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.
(Joh 15:14-15 KJV)

 

[LW97]

Use care since this is a fine line to draw. Those who are genuine born again Christians are not described in Titus 1:16. There is a difference between believers who are overcome with the cares of this world and those who have never been converted.

Amen, that's exactly the point I made.

 

[justpassinthrough]

Thanks for the information, brother. Yet, I believe, like 3 John 11 says, that, if you go around sinning, you did not lose salvation, you were never saved.

Beloved, do not imitate what is evil, but what is good. He who does good is of God, but he who does evil has not seen God.
3 John 11


This does not say what you claim, sir.


He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 1 John 2:4


again


Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15

• Whoever hates his brother is a murderer

This plainly refers to two Christian brothers.


One brother, for whatever reason, hating his brother in Christ.



JPT

 

[lightbearer]

Matthew 3:2 says "repent ye, and believe the Gospel". So here we have all that is required, don't we?

Commonly preached through His disciples also.

And Peter said to them, Repent and be baptized, each of you on the name of Jesus Christ into remission of sins ( bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities) And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all those afar off, as many as the Lord our God shall call. And with many other words he earnestly testified and exhorted, saying, Be saved from this perverse generation.


Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached (sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.)unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.


Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.


Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet, Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest? Hath not my hand made all these things? Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? It is GOD that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure. To bless us, in turning away every one of us from our iniquities

(Act 2:38-40; 3:19-21,26; 7:48-51)

 

[PennEd]

Do you really believe that God does not minister and call every human heart to Himself? God loves every soul He has created with that same tender love that you felt in your heart.

God is not a Calvinist nor is God a universalist.

All of heaven rejoices when a single soul comes to repentance in Christ. Every soul is loved with a great love. That is why it is so heart breaking to see even a single soul perish lost into eternity.

Calvinism is a convenient way to avoid the burden we ought to have for the lost. Calvinism avoids personal responsibility for sin and evades the burden to win lost souls.

I rejoice that you have come to know the Lord as your personal Savior.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Since I've already said a half dozen times that I don't follow John Calvin, this is pretty much proof that labeling people and filing them in neat little boxes is a way to attempt to discredit the points made on an issue.

It is intellectually lazy. It would be like me saying "Oh Roger is an Armenian, therefore his views on certain issues are completely invalid." You would find that insulting and disingenuous, would you not?

The amount of human reasoning and deducing, and logic being applied on this subject is astounding. ALL of which seems right to man.

The idea that because I believe God chose me that I don't care about the lost, or don't urgently see the need to spread the Gospel, could not be further from THE TRUTH!

As a leader of a large and growing Bible study this is seen as THE most imperative mission we have. And I stridently push so that everyone understands this urgency. EVERYONE must be viewed as a brother and sister in Christ, or a POTENTIAL brother and sister in Christ.
I would NEVER presume to judge who God appoints to accept the Gospel.

So please, stop with the labeling. Thank you.

 

[UnderGrace]

It does what?

It does indeed matter how one explains that verse.

 

[mailmandan]

I don't supposed to add anything.

I was responding to LW97's post that claimed the example given in Peter's teaching were not saved.

Here is the scripture from Peter I quoted, to which LW97 claimed the people in the example Peter gave were never saved.

For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them. But it has happened to them according to the true proverb: “A dog returns to his own vomit,” and, “a sow, having washed, to her wallowing in the mire.” 2 Peter 2:20-22

• Peter plainly states these people were "cleansed" (from their sins) but returned to the filth of sin.
• Peter plainly states these people escaped the corruption of the world, but were "entangled again".

JPT

You need to go back and read post #1,729.

https://christianchat.com/bible-dis...use-built-on-sand.178412/page-87#post-3685095

 

[notuptome]

Since I've already said a half dozen times that I don't follow John Calvin, this is pretty much proof that labeling people and filing them in neat little boxes is a way to attempt to discredit the points made on an issue.

It is intellectually lazy. It would be like me saying "Oh Roger is an Armenian, therefore his views on certain issues are completely invalid." You would find that insulting and disingenuous, would you not?

The amount of human reasoning and deducing, and logic being applied on this subject is astounding. ALL of which seems right to man.

The idea that because I believe God chose me that I don't care about the lost, or don't urgently see the need to spread the Gospel, could not be further from THE TRUTH!

As a leader of a large and growing Bible study this is seen as THE most imperative mission we have. And I stridently push so that everyone understands this urgency. EVERYONE must be viewed as a brother and sister in Christ, or a POTENTIAL brother and sister in Christ.
I would NEVER presume to judge who God appoints to accept the Gospel.

So please, stop with the labeling. Thank you.

I did not say you were a Calvinist. I said God is not a Calvinist. I would like to ask do you believe that only those whom God has appointed are going to accept the gospel?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[Endoscopy]

Do you really believe that God does not minister and call every human heart to Himself? God loves every soul He has created with that same tender love that you felt in your heart.

God is not a Calvinist nor is God a universalist.

All of heaven rejoices when a single soul comes to repentance in Christ. Every soul is loved with a great love. That is why it is so heart breaking to see even a single soul perish lost into eternity.

Calvinism is a convenient way to avoid the burden we ought to have for the lost. Calvinism avoids personal responsibility for sin and evades the burden to win lost souls.

I rejoice that you have come to know the Lord as your personal Savior.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Keep in mind the Apostles Creed created in 390AD was created to define the beliefs a Christian MUST have. Outside of it was and is all kinds of issues there were and are disagreements on. It was was decided to agree to disagree. That still holds true today as shown by all of the gospel preaching denominations. Arminianism, Calvinism, and all other different views of what the Bible states is among these issues.

Therefore all need to POLITELY state their views and why but not denegrate the views of other Christians you disagree with.

If you research both Arminianism, Calvinism and other ism's you will find all point to scriptures backing up their belief.

 

[Zmouth]

I'm not sure where you are going with this so I'll just say that which I've seen.

The sun represents Jesus of course, and light is revelation truth about Him and His mission.

The moon represents opposition and is the symbol used by those teaching another Jesus. A prophet and not the very Son of God and Saviour Lord of His body on earth.

Just pointing out that the interpretation that the sun and moon as the two great lights doesn't hold water. If it did, then why does one see the moon in the daytime sky if it was set in the firmament to rule over the night. As written in John 3:12, If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things?

But anyways, if the LORD is a God of symbolism then I know that I don't know.

 

[dcontroversal]

Yeah, funny that we can make the Bible say anything we want it to. Nobody has been able to break the encrypted code of the bible to date, so we will all run around confused until Christ returns and tells us what it all means

That one little monkey wrench in the whole Calvinistic view of predestination -->MANY are called, but FEW CHOSEN! Exactly why people respond similar to your response....

 

[Slayer]

Predestined for purpose not predestined for salvation.


There is no other verse in the bible, that will somehow disprove that the lost need salvation.





JPT

We obviously interpret the Bible in different ways, so we end up with different beliefs. That's OK, the Church has always been divided. Everyone has their own truth, that's why we have thousands of denominations

 

[Slayer]

That one little monkey wrench in the whole Calvinistic view of predestination -->MANY are called, but FEW CHOSEN! Exactly why people respond similar to your response....

There's nothing wrong with Calvinism, but there's plenty wrong with your interpretation of scripture. You shouldn't allow your lack of understanding, one verse taken out of context to corrupt your whole view. You ignore a 100 verses because 1 seems to contradict them, that one verse simply means that Christs blood was enough to save many but only a few were predestined.

It sounds foolish to ignore 100 verses because one obscure verses appears to contradict it, but I guess one can make the bible say anything when they twist the scripture to suit their agenda.

 

[justpassinthrough]

We obviously interpret the Bible in different ways, so we end up with different beliefs. That's OK, the Church has always been divided. Everyone has their own truth, that's why we have thousands of denominations

I wouldn't know, since I haven't seen any scripture from you.


Peter teaches us how to make our calling and election sure -


But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
2 Peter 2:5-10

• Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble;

Do you understand what this word "stumble" refers to?






JPT