Not By Works

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preston39

Senior Member
Dec 18, 2017
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In ancient times kings would seal their correspondences. A ring or stamp would be pressed into resin upon the document so that the recipient would know who sent it.

The same is with us, as when we were redeemed in Christ God set his seal upon us. He sent his holy spirit to indwell the believe and guide us into his truth and service.
He chose us to be in him before the foundation of the world.
Ephesians 1:4 (ESV)
4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him.

He sealed us with the promise that the covenant of eternal salvation affords. We do not wait to go to Heaven and then find out if we are saved. We were saved the moment we believed. John 3:16. We have immortal life because we believe. And that is what it means to have eternal salvation. We are saved from the second death, that of the soul that was dead in its sin prior to redemption of it.
O...,
I am now convinced you are a leftist.
You do not get to ...NOT ANSWER... my questions to you and expect me to answer your questions.
Until you answer outstanding questions .....post 303 comes to mind....please do not post to me...ok?...that is offensive.

Where do these leftest get this mind set.....geeeesssccch.
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
O...,
I am now convinced you are a leftist.
You do not get to ...NOT ANSWER... my questions to you and expect me to answer your questions.
Until you answer outstanding questions .....post 303 comes to mind....please do not post to me...ok?...that is offensive.

Where do these leftest get this mind set.....geeeesssccch.

What is leftist about her post???

Very strange
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
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This thread is not talking about what you do after you are saved, baptism, bible study, ministry, etc. So what on earth does, "Not By Works", mean to you? You do not seem to be able to separate being born again from your practice, our daily walk.

These are two separate events that happen to the believer, you are mixing, "saved by grace", with your daily walk, our practice. We are saved by grace. "Not By Works", why can you not say that we are saved by grace, "Not By Works", a simple idea but difficult to accept no doubt.
  1. Not by works( NOT VOID OF WORKS) but by grace thru FAITH.(eph 2:8-9)
  2. Justified by works and NOT BY FAITH ALONE.(james 2:24)
  3. Faith that Worketh in Love.(gal 5:6)
  4. Faith and Action Working TOGETHER.(james 2:22)

Salvation is by GRACE through FAITH and NOT BY WORKS(of ourselves).(#1)


It is NOT BY FAITH ALONE(#2)but it WORKS in LOVE(#3)thus FAITH & LOVE(works of obedience(romans 1:5) manifested in ACTION and in TRUTH)(1john 3:16-18)are working TOGETHER.(#4)


2 John 1:6 AND THIS IS LOVE: THAT WE WALK IN OBEDIENCE TO HIS COMMANDS. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you WALK IN LOVE.




THE FIRST PHASE OF SALVATION IS TO BELIEVE IN THE ONE THAT GOD HAS SENT AND IN HIS WORD OF TRUTH, THE GOSPEL OF OUR SALVATION.

(john 6:28-29, eph 1:13,romans 10:8-17).

THROUGH THIS FAITH WE WILL RECEIVE THE PROMISED HOLY SPIRIT(the Helper/Counsellor)(gal 3:14, john 14:16-17)


John 6:28-29 Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the WORKS GOD REQUIRES?” Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to BELIEVE in the one he has sent.”


THE SECOND PHASE IS THE WORKING OUT OF THAT SALVATION AND REMAINING/CONTINUING IN THE FAITH TO THE END THROUGH OBEDIENCE TO GOD’S WILL AND COMMANDMENTS, DOING GOOD WORKS. WALKING AS JESUS DID AND BEING A PART OF THE BODY OF CHRIST WHO DOES THE WORKS BEING LED BY THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST WHO IS THE HEAD.


Ephesians 5:23 For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, HIS BODY OF WHICH HE IS THE SAVIOR.


1 Corinthians 12:28 And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues.


1 Corinthians 3:9 For we are God’s fellow workers; you are God’s field, God’s building.


John 14:12 I tell you the truth, anyone who has FAITH in me WILL DO WHAT I HAVE BEEN DOING. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father


1 Corinthians 15:2 By this gospel you are saved, iF YOU HOLD FIRMLY TO THE WORD I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain.


Romans 1:5 Through him and for his name’s sake, we received grace and apostleship to call people from among all the Gentiles to the OBEDIENCE that comes from FAITH.


Philippians 2:12 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always OBEYED—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—CONTINUE TO WORK OUT YOUR SALVATION WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING.


Romans 6:16 Don’t you know that when you offer yourselves to someone to obey him as slaves, you are slaves to the one whom you obey—WHETHER YOU ARE SLAVES TO SIN, WHICH LEADS TO DEATH, OR TO OBEDIENCE, WHICH LEADS TO RIGHTEOUSNESS?


2 Corinthians 9:13 Because of the service by which you have proved yourselves, men will praise God for the OBEDIENCE THAT ACCOMPANIES YOUR CONFESSION OF THE GOSPEL OF CHRIST, and for your generosity in sharing with them and with everyone else.


Ephesians 4:11-13 It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to PREPARE God’s people FOR WORKS OF SERVICE, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the FULLNESS of Christ.


Romans 2:7 To those who by persistence in DOING GOOD seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.


Galatians 6:9 Let us not become weary in DOING GOOD, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.


Ephesians 2:10 For we are God’s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus TO DO GOOD WORKS, which God prepared in advance for us to do.


1 Timothy 6:18-19 Command them TO DO GOOD, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share. In this way they will lay up treasure for themselves as a firm foundation for the coming age, so that they may take hold of the life that is truly life.


Hebrews 5:8-9 Although he was a son, he learned OBEDIENCE from what he suffered and, once made PERFECT, he became the SOURCE OF ETERNAL SALVATION for all who OBEY HIM.


Matthew 19:16-17 Now a man came up to Jesus and asked, “Teacher, what good thing must I do TO GET ETERNAL LIFE?” “Why do you ask me about what is good?” Jesus replied. “There is only One who is good. If you want to enter life, OBEY THE COMMANDMENTS.”


Matthew 25:21 “His master replied, ‘Well done, good and faithful SERVANT You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. COME AND SHARE YOUR MASTER’S HAPPINESS!’


WE ARE SANCTIFIED BY THESE TRUTHS AS IT IS WRITTEN:

John 17:17 Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth.


James 1:22 BUT BE YE DOERS OF THE WORD AND NOT HEARERS ONLY deceiving your own selves.


Romans 2:13 (For it is not the hearers of the law who are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.


1 John 5:3 For this is the love of God: that WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS; and His commandments are not grievous.


1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue, but in deed and in truth.


Ephesians 3:19 and to know this LOVE that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all THE FULLNESS OF GOD.


THE THIRD PHASE OF SALVATION IS SALVATION FROM GOD’S WRATH. THIS IS DEPENDING ON GOD’S MERCY AND JUDGMENT(JUSTICE).


Romans 9:15 For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”


1 John 4:17 In this way, love is made complete among us so that we will have confidence on the day of judgment, because IN THIS WORLD WE ARE LIKE HIM.


Matthew 12:36-37 But I tell you that MEN WILL HAVE TO GIVE ACCOUNT ON THE DAY OF JUDGMENT for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned.”


John 16:8 When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father,(ref:john 14:12) where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment,(ref:hebrews 10:26-27) because the prince of this world now stands condemned.


Romans 2:5-10 But because of your stubbornness and your unrepentant heart, you are storing up wrath against yourself for the day of God’s wrath, when his righteous judgment will be revealed. God “will give to each person according to what he has done.” To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.


Romans 14:10 You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? FOR WE WILL ALL STAND BEFORE GOD’S JUDGMENT SEAT.


2 Corinthians 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.


Hebrews 9:27-28 Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, NOT TO BEAR SIN, BUT TO BRING SALVATION to those who are waiting for him.


1 Peter 4:17-18 For it is time for judgment to begin with the family of God; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for THOSE WHO DO NOT OBEY the gospel of God? And, “If it is hard for the righteous to be saved, what will become of the ungodly and the SINNERS.


John 7:17-18 If anyone chooses to do God’s will, he will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own. He who speaks on his own does so to gain honor for himself, but he who WORKS for the honor of the one who sent him is a man of truth; there is nothing false about him.


John 3:34 For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God gives the Spirit without limit.


John 8:47 He who belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
U...,
Why are you assuming the position as an interloper? (That is strange!!!)
Where is written that I cannot question something that is on public record... you made the statement in a very pejorative manner and I think it is only right you defend what you stated.
 

preston39

Senior Member
Dec 18, 2017
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Where is written that I cannot question something that is on public record... you made the statement in a very pejorative manner and I think it is only right you defend what you stated.

Not to you.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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No, we will not pay a price. We have been saved (by your own definitioin) just like you. So if your definition of saved is the truth, we will be there to rejoice with you. So don't be worried about us.
Maybe you're convicted by my words and make no mistake...the gospel you peddle is not found in scripture nor does it have power to save!!
 
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theanointedsinner

Guest
Maybe you're convicted by my words and make no mistake...the gospel you peddle is not found in scripture nor does it have power to save!!
God can speak through people's word? interesting
 
Dec 12, 2013
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You always ignore James 2.
The whole Bible not just your favorite parts.

James 2 AMPC
17 So also faith, if it does not have works (deeds and actions of obedience to back it up), by itself is destitute of power (inoperative, dead).
18 But someone will say [to you then], You [say you] have faith, and I have [good] works. Now you show me your [alleged] faith apart from any [good] works [if you can], and I by [good] works [of obedience] will show you my faith.
Take your false, lying accusations someplace else....you would think that for one that peddles a Catholic twist works dogma like you do that you would not lie as much.... I have addressed James 500 times or more in this thread....
 
Dec 12, 2013
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welcome Endoscopy to the thread where you only need to read the first 10 page (lots of back and forth arguing) of this forum, fast forward up to here and you know everything there is to know about this thread
He has been here more than once peddling his Presbyterian dogma...and the same argumentative dogma concerning James....his words are false...we have addressed James like 500 times...he also peddles some catholic creed above the very words of God!
 
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theanointedsinner

Guest
for those who forgot what an empty ignore box look like, here is the words: You are not currently ignoring any members.

memorize these seven words because that's the last time we will see those seven words for a long long time
 
U

UnderGrace

Guest
He has been here more than once peddling his Presbyterian dogma...and the same argumentative dogma concerning James....his words are false...we have addressed James like 500 times...he also peddles some catholic creed above the very words of God!
It is absolutely true....it has been addressed many times.
:(
 

Seohce

Senior Member
Jul 15, 2016
1,386
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1 Peter 1:13-16 Be Holy Therefore, PREPARE YOUR MINDS FOR ACTION; be self-controlled; set your hope fully on the grace to be given you when Jesus Christ is revealed. AS OBEDIENT CHILDREN, do not conform to the evil desires you had when you lived in ignorance. But just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; for it is written: “Be holy, because I am holy.”

3Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhortyou that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints. 4For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

5I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. 6And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

8Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. 9Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. 10But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves. 11Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core. 12These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they arewithout water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots; 13raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

14And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, 15to execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speecheswhich ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

16These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

17But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ; 18how that they told you THERE SHOULD BE MOCKERS IN THE LAST TIMES, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts. 19These be they who separate themselves, sensual, HAVING NOT THE SPIRIT.

26For as THE BODY WITHOUT THE SPIRIT is dead, so FAITH WITHOUT WORKS is dead also.

WHO ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURES HAVE NOT THE SPIRIT?

THEY ARE THE ONES WHO DIVIDE YOU BY SAYING THAT SALVATION IS BY FAITH "ALONE" THUS NULLIFYING THE WORDS OF GOD BY REJECTING HIS LAWS AND COMMANDS, AND TRAMPLING UNDER FOOT THE SON OF GOD, AND THOSE WHOSE FAITH IS DEAD BECAUSE OF DISOBEDIENCE. YOU WILL KNOW THEM BY THEIR TEACHINGS.( DOCTRINES/FRUITS )

17If any man will do his will, HE SHALL KNOW OF THE DOCTRINE, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself. 18He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.

26 FOR IF WE SIN WILLFULLY "AFTER" THAT WE HAVE RECEIVED THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and FIERY INDIGNATION, which shall devour the adversaries. 28He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: 29of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, WHO HATH TRODDEN UNDER FOOT THE SON OF GOD, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

24Therefore as the fire devoureth the stubble, and the flame consumeth the chaff, so their root shall be as rottenness, and their blossom shall go up as dust: BECAUSE THEY HAVE CAST AWAY THE LAW OF THE LORD OF HOSTS, AND DESPISED THE WORD OF THE HOLY ONE OF ISRAEL.

6Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things COMETH THE WRATH OF GOD UPON THE CHILDREN OF OBEDIENCE.

3For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect? 4God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written,

That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings,

And mightest overcome when thou art judged.
 
Dec 12, 2013
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we should give people the benefit of the doubt instead of judging
Therefore, let's do away with senseless doubting of other people's salvation
It is not unbiblical to judge one's dogma that they push and if said dogma does not equal the gospel message of salvation.......
 
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theanointedsinner

Guest
It is not unbiblical to judge one's dogma that they push and if said dogma does not equal the gospel message of salvation.......
whether apply useful, informative, or some other positive remark, cc.com limits only one per people responding to a post
 

VCO

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2013
11,995
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I do not pick holes in what the Lord has done. How can you pick holes in what the Lord has done. What I try to point out is the misinterpretation of what people believe the Lord has done and what people need to do to have EL.

There is your WORKS RIGHTEOUSNESS YET AGAIN. After you said, Who has ever said I will enter heaven on my own merit. Did I ever say that? That is why I am a Christian because I believe it is Jesus that ensures my entrance into heaven, not me. It is by the grace of Jesus Christ that I am saved in the KOG.

Jude 1:21 (HCSB)
21 keep yourselves in the love of God, expecting the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ for eternal life.

1 John 5:12 (NKJV)
12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life.

Titus 3:5-8 (HCSB)
5 He saved us— not by works of righteousness that we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit.
6 He poured out this ⌊Spirit⌋ on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,
7 so that having been justified by His grace, we may become heirs with the hope of eternal life.
8 This saying is trustworthy. I want you to insist on these things, so that those who have believed God might be careful to devote themselves to good works. These are good and profitable for everyone.

Romans 6:23 (ASV)
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.