GOD'S SABBATH AND THE REAL TRUTH OF COL 2:14-17 WHO DO WE BELIEVE GOD or MAN?
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SDA fail to show a verse in NT that regulate sabbath law
SDA observe sabbath base oN man Made law.
OT sabbath not kindle fire
SDA sabbath kindle fire (drive a car oN sabbath)
so SDA sabbath is man Made law
SDA observe sabbath base oN man Made law.
OT sabbath not kindle fire
SDA sabbath kindle fire (drive a car oN sabbath)
so SDA sabbath is man Made law
I believe in the truth of the Bible, if the word yome is correctly understood, and that science will prove it.
Then you dont beleive the Scriptures:
The 7,000 Year Plan of YHWH; from Adam to Yahshua/Jesus was a total of 4,000 years Below is the Biblical chronology of this:
From Adam to Abraham:
Adam to Seth 130 years (Genesis 5:3)
Seth to Enos 105 years (Genesis 5:6)
Enos to Cainan 90 years (Genesis 5:9)
Cainan to Mahalaleel 70 years (Genesis 5:12)
Mahalaleel to Jared 65 years (Genesis 5:15)
Jared to Enoch 162 years (Genesis 5:18)
Enoch to Methuselah 65 years (Genesis 5:21)
Methuselah to Lamech 187 years (Genesis 5:25)
Lamech to Noah 182 years (Genesis 5:28-29)
Noah to the Flood 600 years (Genesis 7:6)
Flood to Arphaxad 2 years (Genesis 11:10)
Arphaxad to Salah 35 years (Genesis 11:12)
Salah to Eber 30 years (Genesis 11:14)
Eber to Peleg 34 years (Genesis 11:16)
Peleg to Reu 30 years (Genesis 11:18)
Reu to Serug 32 years (Genesis 11:20)
Serug to Nahor 30 years (Genesis 11:22)
Nahor to Terah 29 years (Genesis 11:24)
Terah to Abraham 70 years (Genesis 11:26)
So Adam to Abraham is 1948 years (This same genealogy is in Luke 3:34-38)
From Abraham to Egypt:
Abraham to Isaac 100 years (Genesis 21:5)
Isaac to Jacob 60 years (Genesis 25:26)
Jacob to Egypt 130 years (Genesis 47:28)
So Abraham to Egypt is 290 years
From Egypt to Exodus:
Jacob and his family went to Egypt
Jacob went to Egypt (Genesis 46:8,11)
Levi went to Egypt (Jacob's son) (Genesis 46:8,11)
Kohath went to Egypt (Levi's son) (Genesis 46:8,11)
Kohath had a son named Amram (Exodus 6:18)
Amram had a son named Moses (Exodus 6:20)
Moses to the Exodus 80 years (Exodus 7:7, Acts 7:21-23, 29-30)
From Egypt to Exodus: X = (Kohath to Amram to Moses + 80)
In Wilderness 40 years (Numbers 32:13,
Wilderness to death Joshua 30 years (Joshua 14:7,10, 24:29)
Exodus to death Joshua is 70 years
The Period of Judges:
Under King Cushanrishathaim 8 years (Judges 3:8)
Under Othniel 40 years (Judges 3:10-11)
Under King Eglon 18 years (Judges 3:14)
Under Ehud 80 years (Judges 3:15,30)
Under King Jabid 20 years (Judges 4:1-3)
Under Deborah 40 years (Judges 4:4, 5:31)
Under Midianites 7 years (Judges 6:1)
Under Gideon 40 years (Judges 6:7, 8:22,28)
Under Abimelech 3 years (Judges 8:32-35, 9:22)
Under Tola 23 years (Judges 10:1-2)
Under Jair 22 years (Judges 10:3)
Under Ammonites 18 years (Judges 10:5-8)
Under Jephthah 6 years (Judges 12:7)
Under Ibzan 7 years (Judges 12:8-9)
Under Elon 10 years (Judges 12:11)
Under Abdon 8 years (Judges 12:13-14)
Under Philistines 40 years (Judges 13:1)
Under Samson 20 years (Judges 13:24, 15:20, 16:30-31)
Under Eli/Samuel 40 years (I Samuel 4:15,18, 7:15, 8:1,4-7,19-22, 9:1-2)
So Judges to Samuel is 450 years (Acts 13:20)
The Period of the kings of Judah:
Under King Saul 40 years (Acts 13:21)
Under King David 40 years (I Chron 29:26-27)
Under King Solomon 40 years (I Kings 11:42-43)
Under King Rehoboam 17 years (I Kings 14:21)
Under King Abijam 3 years (I Kings 14:31,15:1-2)
Under King Asa 41 years (I Kings 15:8-10)
Under King Jehoshaphat 25 years (I Kings 22:41-42,50)
Under King Jehoram 8 years (II Chron 21:5)
Under King Ahaziah 1 yr (II Chron 22:1-2)
Under Queen Athaliah 6 years (II Chron 22:10-12)
Under King Joash 40 years (II Chron 23:13,15, 24:1)
Under King Amaziah 29 years (II Chron 25:1)
Under Uzziah 52 years (II Chron 26:3)
Under Jotham 16 years (II Chron 27:1)
Under Ahaz 16 years (II Chron 28:1)
Under Hezekiah 29 years (II Chron 29:1)
Under Manasseh 55 years (II Chron 33:1)
Under Amon 2 years (II Chron 33:20-21)
Under King Josiah 31 years (II Chron 34:1)
Under King Jehoahaz 3 mon (II Chron 36:1-2)
Under King Jehoiakim 11 years (II Chron 36:3-7)
Under King Jehoiachin 3 mon (II Chron 36:9)
Under King Zedekiah 11 years (II Chron 36:11-21)
So the period of the kings of Judah are 513 years
SUMMARY OF THE TIME FROM ADAM TO YAHSHUA
Adam to Abraham 1948 years
Abraham to Egypt 290 years
From Egypt to Moses: (X=Kohath to Amram to Moses) X = 63 years
Moses to the Exodus 80 years
Exodus to death Joshua 70 years
Judges to Samuel 450 years (Acts 13:20)
Kings of Judah 513 years
Babylonian Captivity 586 BCE
So from Adam to Yahshua is 4000 years
Adam to Yahshua is 4000 years + 2017 years since Yahshua, this puts us at 6017 years since the creation of Earth. Yet how are we not currently in the “Messianic Millennium” of what the 7[SUP]th[/SUP] day/Sabbath represents?
2Peter/Kepha 3:8, “But, beloved ones, let not this one matter be hidden from you: that with יהוה one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.”
Hosheyah 6:1-3, “Come, and let us turn back to יהוה. For He has torn but He does heal us, He has stricken but He binds us up. After two days He shall revive us, on the third day He shall raise us up, so that we live before Him. So let us know, let us pursue to know יהוה. His going forth is as certain as the morning. And He comes to us like the rain, like the latter rain watering the earth.”
“After two days He shall revive us, on the third day He shall raise us up”
Rev 20:4-6, "And I saw thrones – and they sat on them, and judgment was given to them – and the lives of those who had been beheaded because of the witness they bore to יהושע and because of the Word of יהוה, and who did not worship the beast, nor his image, and did not receive his mark upon their foreheads or upon their hands. And they lived and reigned with Messiah for a thousand years and the rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended) – this is the first resurrection. Blessed and set-apart is the one having part in the first resurrection. The second death possesses no authority over these, but they shall be priests of יהוה and of Messiah, and shall reign with Him a thousand years."
It has been “2 days” or 2,000 years since Messiah Yahshua came as a Lamb, Scripture says in “the third day He shall raise us up” So then why has Yahshua not already returned? The time/fullness of the Gentiles and the revealing of the man of sin has not yet been completed, thus things are being held back:
Romans 11:24-25, “For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree, how much more shall these who are the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree? For I do not wish you to be ignorant of this secret, brothers, lest you should be wise in your own estimation, that hardening in part has come over Yisra’yl, until the completeness of the Gentiles has come in.”
Genesis 48:17-20, “And when Yosĕph saw that his father laid his right hand on the head of Ephrayim, it was evil in his eyes; and he took hold of his father’s hand to remove it from the head of Ephrayim to the head of Menashsheh. And Yosĕph said to his father, “Not so, my father, for this one is the first-born, put your right hand on his head.”" But his father refused and said, “I know, my son, I know. He also becomes a people, and he also is great. And yet, his younger brother is greater than he, and his seed is to become the completeness of the nations.” And he blessed them on that day, saying, “In you Yisra’yl shall bless, saying, ‘The Mighty One make you as Ephrayim and as Menashsheh!” Thus he put Ephrayim before Menashsheh.”
Yes the SDA does make then own regulations.
However no humans made this:
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Genesis 2:1-3, “Thus the heavens and the earth were completed, and all their array. And in the seventh day the Mighty One completed His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made. And the Mighty One blessed the seventh day and set it apart, because on it He rested from all His work which the Mighty One in creating had made.”[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Exodus 20:8-11, “Remember the Sabbath day, to set it apart." Six days you labour, and shall do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]your Strength. You do not do any work – you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart.”
For gentile an Hebrew alike:
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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Isayah 56:1-7, "This is what YHWH says: Keep the judgments, and do justly; for My salvation is near, soon, to come, and My righteousness to be revealed. Blessed is the man who does this, and the son of man who lays hold on it; who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them; and keeps his hand from doing any evil. Do not let the son of the Gentile, who has joined himself to YHWH, speak, saying; YHWH has utterly separated me from His people. Nor let the eunuch say; Behold, I am a dry tree. For this is what YHWH says: To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths, and choose those things which please Me, and hold fast to My covenant: I will give to them, in My House, even within My walls, a place and a Name equal to that of sons and of daughters; I will give them the Name of The Everlasting: YHWH; which will not be cut off. Also the sons of the Gentile who join themselves to YHWH, to serve Him, and to love the Name of YHWH, to be His servants--everyone who keeps the Sabbaths without polluting; defiling, them and who holds fast to My covenant--I will bring them to My holy mountain, and make them joyful in My House of prayer..."[/FONT]
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What you don't understand is that the earth existed long before the Jewish nation and Adam.
1. So you admit that SDA make new regulation, or SDA sabbath is man Made law.
2. You quote some verses that convert gentile and jew are alike, why SDA sabbath law not alike Jews law?
Hmmm inconsistancy.
If we are dead indeed, we are not sinning. So there is no need for a law!
Thus being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. For he that is dead is free from sin. And if the Son has made you free you are indeed! For this purpose the Son of GOD was manifested; to destroy the works of the Devil; that the body of sin would be destroyed.
(Rom 6:2,4,6-7.11-14, 22)
They two shall be one flesh; I speak of Christ and the Church. So walk in newness of life. Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin. Dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord. For we are dead nevertheless we live yet not us but Christ liveth in us and the life we now live in the flesh we live by the faith of the Son of GOD. Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace; the Body of Christ; the Temple of GOD. For HIS Spirit dwelleth in you. It is HE that works in us both to will and do HIS good pleasure.
Thus being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. For he that is dead is free from sin. And if the Son has made you free you are indeed! For this purpose the Son of GOD was manifested; to destroy the works of the Devil; that the body of sin would be destroyed.
(Rom 6:2,4,6-7.11-14, 22)
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I will let Jesus define these words and provide the example to follow. His Walk is the proven perfect example for mankind.
so, as your buddy refuses to address my Luke 16 question , you skipped answering posthuman's question, on the previous page.
you know, honesty is a big Christian value. like truthfully admitting you have been proven wrong. ( twice in 4 days , mark r about the Jesus crucified on Wed. )
will be waiting on honesty. we'll see if it comes.
I know you don't care about the truth regarding The instructions Jesus gave before coming to earth as a man. First it was the number, now it is something else, and when your intent is exposed here, you will move on to the next, and on to the next, and on to the next.
different topic, same tactic. It is always the same with you. Deflect, change the subject, omit, ignore.
The true Jesus and Biblical God are one. Until you come to terms with that Biblical Truth, you are just another on the broad path.
I agree. That is why I believe in His Word's even when it is regarding His Sabbath that is almost universally rejected by "Those who come in His Name".
Not only did He create it, before becoming a man. He sanctified it. He walked in it, and He told me He created His Sabbath for me. (Human) And like you said, He knows His Law better than anyone.
That is why it is written: 4 For Christ is the end(intent) of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
And again;
1 John 2:5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.
Jesus bucked the religious traditions which caused those that follow them to "Transgress the Commandments of God".
Shouldn't we do the same today?
Seeing as Jesus is the end of the law and he "bucked the religious traditions" by working on the Sabbath, what is your conclusion?
yes, that's a good idea
one thing i notice is that Jesus didn't have extended debates
Jesus is the intent of the Law. We need look no further for our example of God's Will. He was the perfect human and that it our example.
"Look onto Jesus, the Author and Finisher of my faith".
This is why we are instructed to "Walk even as He Walked".
The Pharisees didn't believe in the God of Abraham. They had created their own image of God. They had created a Sabbath from their own corrupted minds. Jesus didn't do this.
You do not understand God's Instruction regarding the Sabbath just as the Pharisees didn't understand them. It is not against God's Sabbath to study and work to understand God on His Sabbath. It is not against God to take a Sabbath walk in fellowship and eat a strawberry along the way. It is not against God's Sabbath to help a brother or a brothers animal who has fallen into a pit on God's Sabbath. Not in Moses time, not in Jesus time as a man, and not now.
So when a person reads and believes everything Jesus says, they have an understand that is different than those who do not.
This is a perfect example of this Spiritual fact. Jesus said the Pharisees were liars and children of satan. Since I believe these Words, I don't believe what the Pharisees say about Jesus. That He sinned against God by breaking the Sabbath.
You also believe Jesus broke God's Sabbath, same as the Pharisees.
It was the Pharisees traditions to corrupt this Commandment to mean something it does not. You are doing the same thing regarding the Sabbath, by implying Jesus destroyed the law "end of the law", and agreeing with the Pharisees that Jesus violated His Fathers Sabbath Commandment.
So it was either against the God of Abraham to help a brother in need on God's Sabbath or it wasn't. You seem to side with the Mainstream Preachers of both His time, and those of today who reject the Sabbath Jesus created for man, and have created something different in their own minds. For me, I trust Jesus. Like you said, He created His Laws, He should know what they mean, and who they are created for.
Jesus refers to Himself as, Lord of the Sabbath: Matt 12:8, Mk 2:28 & Lk 6:5
Matt 12:5 Have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
Matt 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day. Mk 2:28 & Lk 6:5
(NOTE: Jesus = Jehovah/YHVH of the OT. Is the Author/giver of the Mosaic Laws)
Jn 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Heb 1:10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
(NOTE: Jesus Christ, Law giver & creator of our universe. Our Creator is greater then the creation. And any Laws He later attached to it)
Matt 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Matt 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Heb 3:11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.
(NOTE: Who are they, that shall not enter in? Those that didn't believe/trust/place thier FAITH in God)
Heb 3:18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
(NOTE: The FAITHLESS unbelievers will not enter into God's rest?)
Jesus the Creator & Lord of the Sabbath, Has power, authority & the right, to dispense it, any way He sees fit. To include abolishing Sabbath observance & replacing it with the Lord’s Day, Sunday as a day of worship/rest.
The Sabbath was originally given as a day for man to rest from working. The Lord's Day has been given to those who trust him. Thru belief/faith placed in His redemptive sin atoning sacrifice. No one achieves righteousness thru works/keeping laws to include Sabbath observance.
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Rom 4:13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
Rom 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
Matt 12:5 Have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?
Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
Matt 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day. Mk 2:28 & Lk 6:5
(NOTE: Jesus = Jehovah/YHVH of the OT. Is the Author/giver of the Mosaic Laws)
Jn 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Heb 1:10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
(NOTE: Jesus Christ, Law giver & creator of our universe. Our Creator is greater then the creation. And any Laws He later attached to it)
Matt 11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Matt 11:29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
Heb 3:11 So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.
(NOTE: Who are they, that shall not enter in? Those that didn't believe/trust/place thier FAITH in God)
Heb 3:18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
(NOTE: The FAITHLESS unbelievers will not enter into God's rest?)
Jesus the Creator & Lord of the Sabbath, Has power, authority & the right, to dispense it, any way He sees fit. To include abolishing Sabbath observance & replacing it with the Lord’s Day, Sunday as a day of worship/rest.
The Sabbath was originally given as a day for man to rest from working. The Lord's Day has been given to those who trust him. Thru belief/faith placed in His redemptive sin atoning sacrifice. No one achieves righteousness thru works/keeping laws to include Sabbath observance.
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Rom 4:13 For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
Rom 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
Rom 10:3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.
Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
interestingly, Jesus made alterations in the law
looks to me like
Matthew 5: 31. "It was also said, 'Whoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorce,' 32. but I tell you that whoever puts away his wife, except for the cause of sexual immorality, makes her an adulteress; and whoever marries her when she is put away commits adultery
looks to me like
Matthew 5: 31. "It was also said, 'Whoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorce,' 32. but I tell you that whoever puts away his wife, except for the cause of sexual immorality, makes her an adulteress; and whoever marries her when she is put away commits adultery
I'm not sure what you mean when you say Jesus was the intent of the law. Do you mean Jesus was the fulfilment of the law?
Most of that is not scripture, but your own words and you are missing the mark by a mile.
Wow!!
Maybe for another jesus I don't know. But for my Jesus, the Jesus of the Bible, who created everything including His Word, I would say He extended the debate for thousands of years, over generation after generation. From Cain all the way to the Pharisees, and it continues to this day.
Gen.4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
Matt. 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
Rom. 2:4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:
I don't think you thought that statement through very well.