Not By Works

[dcontroversal]

I love the name Jesus.....he has no problem with saying Jesus.....he saves all by faith void of works and law!

 

[Hizikyah]

Same here.....makes me hot and sick.......all self righteous, high and mighty with no ability to admit the truth.....

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 20:12-13, “And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]. And the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and Death and Sheol delivered up the dead which were in them. And they were judged, every man, according to their works.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]"every man" is word #1538 – hekastos - Strong's Concordance hekastos: each, every Original Word: ἕκαστος, η, ον Part of Speech: Adjective Transliteration: hekastos Phonetic Spelling: (hek'-as-tos) Short Definition: each, every one Definition: each (of more than two), every one.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 22:12, “And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 Corinthians 5:10, “For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Messiah, that each one may receive his reward according to what he has done in the body, whether righteous or evil.”[/FONT]


“[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]judgment seat” is word #G968 - béma: a step, raised place, by impl. A tribunal, Original Word: βῆμα, ατος, τό, Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter, Transliteration: béma, Phonetic Spelling: (bay'-ma), Short Definition: the space covered by a step of the foot, a tribunal, Definition: an elevated place ascended by steps, a throne, tribunal.[/FONT]

 

[Ellsworth1943]

Revelation 20:12-13, “And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before יהוה. And the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and Death and Sheol delivered up the dead which were in them. And they were judged, every man, according to their works.”


"every man" is word #1538 – hekastos - Strong's Concordance hekastos: each, every Original Word: ἕκαστος, η, ον Part of Speech: Adjective Transliteration: hekastos Phonetic Spelling: (hek'-as-tos) Short Definition: each, every one Definition: each (of more than two), every one.


Revelation 22:12, “And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be.”


2 Corinthians 5:10, “For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Messiah, that each one may receive his reward according to what he has done in the body, whether righteous or evil.”


“judgment seat” is word #G968 - béma: a step, raised place, by impl. A tribunal, Original Word: βῆμα, ατος, τό, Part of Speech: Noun, Neuter, Transliteration: béma, Phonetic Spelling: (bay'-ma), Short Definition: the space covered by a step of the foot, a tribunal, Definition: an elevated place ascended by steps, a throne, tribunal.

So have your works/faithfulness earned you admittance to Heaven?
Are you sure, with out a doubt, sure you have done enough?

 

[Hizikyah]

So have your works/faithfulness earned you admittance to Heaven?
Are you sure, with out a doubt, sure you have done enough?

How can you accuse me when I only posted Scripture?

Messiah is the judge if I enter it will be up to Him to say yes or no.

If I do enter it would not be possible to enter without His mercy, yet this does not make righteousness void, mercy does not say I am free of doing right. It says, I shall now turn and do right.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"

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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]*What is sin, that we may not continue in it?[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]
According to many of your doctrines here Jesus must be preaching falsehood?

[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif] [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]

[/FONT]

 

[Hizikyah]

Is this verse a lie?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 22:11-15, “He who does wrong, let him do more wrong; he who is filthy, let him be more filthy; he who is righteous, let him be more righteous; he who is set-apart, let him be more set-apart. And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood.”[/FONT]

 

[Ellsworth1943]

How can you accuse me when I only posted Scripture?

Messiah is the judge if I enter it will be up to Him to say yes or no.

If I do enter it would not be possible to enter without His mercy, yet this does not make righteousness void, mercy does not say I am free of doing right. It says, I shall now turn and do right.

Romans 3:28, "For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the Law.”


Romans 3:31, "Are we then doing away with the Law through the faith? By no means! Rather, we establish the Law!"


Romans, “6:1-2, "What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin* that grace may abound? By no means! How can we who died to sin still live in it?"


*What is sin, that we may not continue in it?


1 John 3:4, "Whoever commits sin, transgresses also the Law; for sin is the transgression of the Law."


According to many of your doctrines here Jesus must be preaching falsehood?



John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”

So by what you say, you , I, nor anyone can have assurance of salvation.
We all have to wait and see.

 

[vic1980]

So have your works/faithfulness earned you admittance to Heaven?
Are you sure, with out a doubt, sure you have done enough?

If we do this , we will continue on the narrow path...

2 Corinthians 13:5

Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Shalom

 

[vic1980]

Just a good reminder to all , that are in Christ.

2 Timothy 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.


Shalom

 

[Hizikyah]

So by what you say, you , I, nor anyone can have assurance of salvation.
We all have to wait and see.

Well none have been reborn as this is reborn:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 Corinthians 15:51-55, “See, I speak a secret to you: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible has to put on incorruption, and this mortal to put on immortality. And when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall come to be the word that has been written, “Death is swallowed up in overcoming. O Death, where is your sting? O grave, where is your overcoming?”

None have yet entered His rest any that claim to have already are making their own definition:

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[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]2 Thessalonians 1:5-10, “Clear evidence of the righteous judgment of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], in order for you to be counted worthy of the reign of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], for which you also suffer, since [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]shall rightly repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to give you who are afflicted rest with us when the Master [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]is revealed from heaven with His mighty messengers, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], and on those who do not obey the Good News of our Master [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהושע [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Messiah, who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Master and from the esteem of His strength, when He comes to be esteemed in His set-apart ones and to be admired among all those who believe in that Day, because our witness to you was believed.”

[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 14:13, "And I heard a voice from heaven saying to me: Write: Blessed are the dead, the ones dying in the Messiah from now on! Yes, says the Spirit: because they will rest from their labors, and their works do follow them!"

[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1 Corinthians 4:4-5, “For I know nothing by myself; yet by this I am not justified, for He Who judges me is [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]! Therefore, judge nothing before the time. Wait until Yahshua comes, Who will bring to light the things hidden in darkness, and will reveal the secret intentions of men's hearts; and then each man will receive praise from [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif].”

[/FONT]

Now with that said maybe the Creator has ttold someone personally they are guaranteed and the tickeet has already been stamped, but the Scriptures say Yahshua/Jesus is the judge and all men will appear before Him. I personaly leave Him to this role and accept His decision as the right one.


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Matthew 10:22, “And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Matt 24:12-13, “And because of the increase in lawlessness, the love of many shall become cold. But he who shall have endured to the end shall be saved.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 10:36, “For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of Yah you may receive what is promised.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 3:14, “For we have become partakers of Messiah if we hold fast the beginning of our trust firm to the end.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]James 1:12, "Blessed is the man who does endure trial, for when he has been proved, he shall receive the crown of life which the Master has promised to those who love Him."[/FONT]


It is my personal opinion that Billy Sunday's altar call is not the translation of our bodies into eternally living spirit bodies nor the judgement of Messiah.


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Romans 2:4-15, “Or do you despise the riches of His kindness, forbearance, and longsuffering; not realizing that [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה’[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]s kindness is meant to lead you to repentance? But according to your stubborn and impenitent mind you are storing up wrath for yourself for the day of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה’[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]s wrath, when the righteous judgment of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]will be revealed; when He will reward each one according to his works: to the ones on the one hand, who, by patient persistence in doing righteousness, seek for glory, honor and immortality, He will give eternal life. But to the ones on the other hand, who are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, He will give indignation and wrath. Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man who does evil: to the Yahdai(Jew) first, and also to the Greek (Gentile) But glory, honor, and peace to every man who works righteousness: to the Yahdai first, and also to the Greek. For there is no respect of persons with [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]. For all who have sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before Yah, but the doers of the Law will be justified. For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them.”


[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 20:12-13, “And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]. And the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and Death and Sheol delivered up the dead which were in them. And they were judged, every man, according to their works.” [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]"every man" is word #1538 – hekastos - Strong's Concordance hekastos: each, every Original Word: ἕκαστος, η, ον Part of Speech: Adjective Transliteration: hekastos Phonetic Spelling: (hek'-as-tos) Short Definition: each, every one Definition: each (of more than two), every one.


[/FONT]

Is the Messiah telling the truth? or does He have false or wrong doctrine?


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John 5:28-30, “Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the tombs shall hear His voice, and shall come forth – those who have done righteousness, to the resurrection of life, and those who have practiced evil matters, to a resurrection of judgment. Of Myself I am unable to do any matter. As I hear, I judge, and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own desire, but the desire of the Father who sent Me.”[/FONT]

 

[Ellsworth1943]

If we do this , we will continue on the narrow path...

2 Corinthians 13:5

Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Shalom

So your hope is based on YOU continuing on the narrow path?

 

[Hizikyah]

So your hope is based on YOU continuing on the narrow path?

How is self examination relying on ones self?

Is reading the word relying on ones self?

or is choosing not \t osteal something relying on ones self?

it is possible to seek His will and rely on Him. He gives us strength, mental faculty and chioces in life...

My point is there is a big difference between self reliance, opne thinking they are good enough to enter without mercy

and

seeking to do His will with the ability He gives us as humans...

or is it relying on ones sekf because they have faith? Is it your faith that makes you whole and forgiven? Are you relying on yourself?

 

[Ellsworth1943]

How is self examination relying on ones self?

Is reading the word relying on ones self?

or is choosing not \t osteal something relying on ones self?

it is possible to seek His will and rely on Him. He gives us strength, mental faculty and chioces in life...

My point is there is a big difference between self reliance, opne thinking they are good enough to enter without mercy

and

seeking to do His will with the ability He gives us as humans...

or is it relying on ones sekf because they have faith? Is it your faith that makes you whole and forgiven? Are you relying on yourself?

My assurance is based on one person. Not me or what I have or will do. I have eternal life because of what Jesus did on the cross. Her said if I would believe he would give me eternal life. I was able to believe only because He gave me the faith to believe. That was a one time event. He gave me the faith to believe and He will keep me no matter what I may do.
Now, because he gave me eternal life when I believed, I strive to keep all his commandments.
I do not keep His commandments to gain or keep my eternal life but because He gave me eternal life.
When I stand before the Father, He will see the blood of His son that has washed away my sins and I will be judged righteous. Not because of what I have done, but because of what Jesus did.

 

[Hizikyah]

My assurance is based on one person. Not me or what I have or will do. I have eternal life because of what Jesus did on the cross. Her said if I would believe he would give me eternal life. I was able to believe only because He gave me the faith to believe. That was a one time event. He gave me the faith to believe and He will keep me no matter what I may do.
Now, because he gave me eternal life when I believed, I strive to keep all his commandments.
I do not keep His commandments to gain or keep my eternal life but because He gave me eternal life.
When I stand before the Father, He will see the blood of His son that has washed away my sins and I will be judged righteous. Not because of what I have done, but because of what Jesus did.

I want to say I respect you and have love for you in Messiah, as H is the Master and we are all brothers and sisters seeking Him, and want to say I certianly thjank yAh for His mercy. I seek to gurad His commands because what He has done for me and I know His way is right. I have joy when I do, and despair when I do not. That is my mind and heart. So what happens to the person who says they are saved by His blood yet does not do what He says, is that person saved? Because Yahshua/Jesus says:

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."[/FONT]

 

[Limey410v2]

I want to say I respect you and have love for you in Messiah, as H is the Master and we are all brothers and sisters seeking Him, and want to say I certianly thjank yAh for His mercy. I seek to gurad His commands because what He has done for me and I know His way is right. I have joy when I do, and despair when I do not. That is my mind and heart. So what happens to the person who says they are saved by His blood yet does not do what He says, is that person saved? Because Yahshua/Jesus says:

John/Yahanan 12:48, "He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day."

The focus is on the rejection, not the obedience. He doesn't say, He who rejects me, or doesn't follow my words.

 

[Hizikyah]

The focus is on the rejection, not the obedience. He doesn't say, He who rejects me, or doesn't follow my words.

Looking at what is in this verse, not putting this on anyone but simply considering what is written;

So would you say not following His words is the rejection?

or

Once He is accepted with lips one follows His words are automatically followed without literally following them?

 

[Limey410v2]

Looking at what is in this verse, not putting this on anyone but simply considering what is written;

So would you say not following His words is the rejection?

or

Once He is accepted with lips one follows His words are automatically followed without literally following them?

No, rejecting Jesus as the Messiah is the unforgivable sin. Those that reject Him will perish. We are all disobedient to God, and yet because of His Grace and Mercy I have everlasting life, ergo, I will not perish.

 

[Seohce]

Galatians 3:26-29 Sons of God You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, slave nor free, male nor female, for YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS. If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

1 Corinthians 6:17 But he who unites himself with the Lord is ONE WITH HIM IN SPIRIT.

Ephesians 2:14-16 For he himself is our peace, who has MADE THE TWO ONE and has destroyed the barrier, THE DIVIDING WALL OF HOSTILITY, by abolishing IN HIS FLESH the law with its commandments and regulations. HIS PURPOSE was to create in himself ONE NEW MAN OUT OF THE TWO, thus making peace, and in this ONE BODY to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which HE PUT TO DEATH THEIR HOSTILITY.

THE NEW MAN IS NEITHER JEW NOR GENTILE BUT IS ONE IN SPIRIT BECAUSE…

Romans 5:5 And hope does not disappoint us, because GOD HAS POURED OUT HIS LOVE INTO OUR HEARTS by the Holy Spirit, whom he has given us.

2 John 1:6 And this is LOVE: that WE WALK IN OBEDIENCE TO HIS COMMANDS. As you have heard from the beginning, his command is that you WALK IN LOVE.

Romans 13:8-10 Love, for the Day Is Near Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for he who loves his fellowman has fulfilled the law. The commandments, “Do not commit adultery,” “Do not murder,” “Do not steal,” “Do not covet,” and whatever other commandment there may be, are summed up in this one rule: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” Love does no harm to its neighbor. Therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

WHOEVER UNDERSTANDS THESE TRUTHS WILL STOP CREATING DIVISION IN THE CHURCH WHICH IS HIS BODY OF WHOM HE IS THE SAVIOR.

THERE IS ONLY ONE BODY UNITED IN SPIRIT WITH THE LORD JESUS AS THE HEAD.

DID JESUS EVER TAUGHT DISOBEDIENCE TO GOD’S LAWS AND COMMANDS?

AGAIN, BECAUSE OF THE LOVE POURED OUT IN OUR HEARTS, WE ARE ABLE TO FULFILL THE LAW THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT WE HAVE RECEIVED AND THERE IS NOTHING IMPOSSIBLE WITH GOD BECAUSE WITHOUT GOD EVERYTHING IS VAIN.

SINCE WE HAVE FAITH WE ARE TO DO WHAT WE SEE OUR FATHER AND OUR LORD IS DOING SO THAT THE WORLD MAY KNOW THAT WE LOVE HIM AND THAT WE ARE TRULY HIS DISCIPLES.

THE BODY WITHOUT THE SPIRIT IS DEAD. A DEAD BODY IS VOID OF WORKS
JUST AS FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD.

SO THE BODY BEING LED BY THE SPIRIT OR HEADED BY CHRIST IS ALIVE AND DOES EXACTLY WHAT THE FATHER HAS COMMANDED THEM… TO “WALK IN LOVE”

 

[dcontroversal]

Is this verse a lie?

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Revelation 22:11-15, “He who does wrong, let him do more wrong; he who is filthy, let him be more filthy; he who is righteous, let him be more righteous; he who is set-apart, let him be more set-apart. And behold, I come quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give every man according as his work will be. I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End. Blessed are those who keep His Laws, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. For outside are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and worshipers of gods and everyone who professes to love, yet practices falsehood.”[/FONT]

Those who are the above have not been rendered innocent while having the righteousness of Christ applied by faith....VOID OF THE LAW ......you can deny all you like and at the end of the day you push a self saving works based law keeping dogma......

 

[Inquistor]

Our works cannot save us,for our works is as filthy rags,and there is none that does good,no not one,and all are sinners and come short of the glory of God.

So no matter what we do we cannot ever do good enough to receive salvation.

In that position the only thing we can do to correct this position is to have faith,that is why we are saved by faith for that is all we can do,for our works cannot do it.

All we have to do is believe.

Paul said we are not saved by works,but by accepting Christ,which he was addressing Gentiles,and their false religions,that thought they could have favor with God by their religious ways,but Paul said you are not saved by those works but by confessing Christ.

Paul was speaking from a fleshy perspective,not saved by works,and James is speaking from a spiritual perspective,accepting Christ,and being led of the Spirit,justified by works and not faith alone.

If a person does confess Christ,they only have to love people for love is the fulfilling of the law,which is what James is saying,and that is why he said if you do not feed someone when you can,then how do you have faith,and any work they would do apart from that,loving people,like if they go by Old Testament physical ordinances,or do something that another religion would do has no bearing on their salvation,but a waste of time.

Paul,not saved by works,James,but led of the Spirit loving people to have faith active in our life.

Fascinating observations and conclusion ...

Tell me, is the following scripture talking about FAITH ... or WORKS? Please EXPLAIN your answer!


John 15:13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one's life for one's friends.


Please note that the scripture immediately above is an active hyperlink!

 

[dcontroversal]

My assurance is based on one person. Not me or what I have or will do. I have eternal life because of what Jesus did on the cross. Her said if I would believe he would give me eternal life. I was able to believe only because He gave me the faith to believe. That was a one time event. He gave me the faith to believe and He will keep me no matter what I may do.
Now, because he gave me eternal life when I believed, I strive to keep all his commandments.
I do not keep His commandments to gain or keep my eternal life but because He gave me eternal life.
When I stand before the Father, He will see the blood of His son that has washed away my sins and I will be judged righteous. Not because of what I have done, but because of what Jesus did.

Amen and truth for sure.....his work and his power....he deserves all the glory for sure....