Not By Works

[PeterJens]

This is an accusation PJ. Without innocence. The other poster didn't know even though posting that publically was wrong too.

satan accuses.

stones - things are never quite as they appear, and many will come as angels of light but
actually be something else entirely.

Walking in the light is simple. It is being on the inside the same as you are on the outside.
The problem with claiming to walk in the light, when the light switches on and something
else appears.

One basic reality of walking in Christ is humbleness, and realising the fruit of anger and
frustration disappear as God plants love within.

Now to the extreme right wing, gun totting, I am going to kick some ....... approach this
sounds like wimpy response, sweetness and light and they just want to pump lead into
it.

So when someone is actually like this, but wants to appear another way, you got to laugh.

Zero spiritual insight and understanding. And the disdain is appauling. But the Lord will always
bring to light that which is hidden, so beware how you walk and what you claim, because it
will not stay hidden.

 

[PeterJens]

to say that one is not sinless is not an accusation. it is a fact. using the Biblical definition of sin, missing the mark, falling short of a standard, knowing to do good, and not doing so, no one can truthfully say that they are sinless.

ya'll do know that on judgement day, God is not going to ask you your opinion. you get 2 choices. one, accept Christ's righteousness, two, perfectly keep the Law. if you forfeit one, you have to stand on two. and, according to James, the brother of the Lord, if you break one command, you break them all.

that is all it takes. one time. one mistake. one bad decision. forget the willfull vs. unwilful sin deception. use scripture. not your church or personal or denominational opinions.

The above is like ground-hog day. We are not really saved, we are just sinners in need
of a saviour. There is no victory, growth, holiness, purity.

So God will not ask us a question, because He already knows the answer about our lives.
Either we have believed God and accepted His forgiveness and walked in His will and ways
or we have not.

You can see simply from this testimony the totally different views of Christ some have.

Listen to Christ speaking

Well done, good and faithful servant! You have been faithful with a few things; I will put you in charge of many things. Come and share your master’s happiness!
Matt 25:23

So who are you going to listen to, Christ or mans construction of theology?

 

[PennEd]

So here you have it brothers and sisters. Do not be deceived by this individual preaching a sinless perfection doctrine that cheapens God's perfect standard and is designed to make the true believer feel guilt that he isn't perfect. Follow how this point went from post post and see the pride and really lying that this man engages in:

From post 41503:

Originally Posted by PJW

[/B]No. I have not committed any sins since my conversion.
I was "converted" from a sinner to a non-sinner.


I don't see the words "sin" or "hypocrisy" mentioned in Gal 2.
Peter's "blame" stemmed from his giving credence to continued submission to parts of the law that were no longer in effect.
Thousands of other Jews were still using the law in Jerusalem: do you think they were all sinners?


If the sign says, "Don't use hair dryer in the bathtub", do you suppose everyone is doing so?
To infer that all Peter's "brothers" commit sin is erroneous thinking.
If a supposed brother manifests his service to sin, our forgiveness of that man will be his first step into belief, as the sin itself showed he wasn't submitted to God in the first place.


My pride in in God, and His Son Christ Jesus, who has saved me from service to the destroyer of men.



Well there's your problem!! You must be reading a different Bible. Here is Galatians 2, where Paul calls Peter and the other Jews with him HYPOCRITES!

Galatians 2: 11 Now when Peter[a] had come to Antioch, I withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, FEARING those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, why do you[b] compel Gentiles to live as Jews?[c]15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

So whether intentional or not, you have just lied, and on Scripture! Please tell me how you can now rationalize this lie in your mind.


Not only was Peter being a hypocrite, but he was being untruthful (lying) about the Gospel!! How on earth are you able to twist in your mind that he wasn't sinning!?

Your comment about Jesus telling Peter to forgive brothers who sin is so warped and convoluted I don't think even you are buying it.

I honestly feel for you. You have such a low view of our Lord and His perfection.

Here is his response to my post:
I don't know what version of bible you are using, but it sounds...adulterated to promote somebody's personal doctrine.

Not only was Peter being a hypocrite, but he was being untruthful (lying) about the Gospel!! How on earth are you able to twist in your mind that he wasn't sinning!?



Your comment about Jesus telling Peter to forgive brothers who sin is so warped and convoluted I don't think even you are buying it.
I honestly feel for you. You have such a low view of our Lord and His perfection.


"Don't "feel for me", pity yourselves for having fallen for a religion that tolerates sin.
Jesus said the truth would set you free....of service to sin. (John 8:32-34)
If you ever get sick of offending God, He has made a way to quit offending.
Thanks be to God!"



His pride runs so deep, and he has become so deluded by this doctrine, that he cannot admit that he was wrong and lied about Peter being a hypocrite and misrepresenting the Gospel.

 

[PennEd]

Just so you can see how he said that Galatians 2 doesn't say Peter is being a hypocrite, here is the post:41493

Originally Posted by PennEd

You have COMPLETELY dodged answering any of my questions.
I'll try one more time.
1. Have you committed ANY of the sins I listed in the last post? IE..Driving over the speed limit, anger, fear, worry, impure thoughts, etc... ​HAVE YOU SINNED SINCE BEING SAVED? COMMITTING ANY OFFENSE?




No. I have not committed any sins since my conversion.
I was "converted" from a sinner to a non-sinner.


2. Paul accused Peter of the sin of hypocrisy. Did Paul make a false accusation (sin), or did Peter sin by being a hypocrite? Either way, are Peter and Paul in Christ even though one of them sinned?


I don't see the words "sin" or "hypocrisy" mentioned in Gal 2.
Peter's "blame" stemmed from his giving credence to continued submission to parts of the law that were no longer in effect.
Thousands of other Jews were still using the law in Jerusalem: do you think they were all sinners?


3. Jesus tells Peter to forgive his BROTHER EVERY time he sins. If a BROTHER NEVER sins, why does Peter, or Jesus, need to forgive them?


If the sign says, "Don't use hair dryer in the bathtub", do you suppose everyone is doing so?
To infer that all Peter's "brothers" commit sin is erroneous thinking.
If a supposed brother manifests his service to sin, our forgiveness of that man will be his first step into belief, as the sin itself showed he wasn't submitted to God in the first place.


Your pride has been noted. The question is can YOU note it?


My pride in in God, and His Son Christ Jesus, who has saved me from service to the destroyer of men.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I just saw something in that verse - you have been faithful with a FEW things...this suggests the person has not been faithful with everything.

And it seems to tie in to the verses that say about certain kings: and he did good in Gods eyes but NEVERTHELESS, he did not tear down ALL the idols of his father.

It also seems to tie I to the message to one of the 7 churches in Rev - you have a LITTLE strength...

In a way that is strangely comforting, it also seems to mesh with: to he who is given more, more is expected.

 

[PennEd]

Well PJW, here are a bunch of translations from Galatians 2:13. All but one of them use Hypocrite or hypocrisy, which IS sin:

New International Version
The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.

New Living Translation
As a result, other Jewish Christians followed Peter's hypocrisy, and even Barnabas was led astray by their hypocrisy.

English Standard Version
And the rest of the Jews acted hypocritically along with him, so that even Barnabas was led astray by their hypocrisy.

Berean Study Bible
The other Jews joined in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.

Berean Literal Bible
And also the rest of the Jews acted hypocritically with him, so that, by their hypocrisy, even Barnabas was carried away.

New American Standard Bible
The rest of the Jews joined him in hypocrisy, with the result that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy.

King James Bible
And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
Then the rest of the Jews joined his hypocrisy, so that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy.

International Standard Version
The other Jews also joined him in this hypocritical behavior, to the extent that even Barnabas was caught up in their hypocrisy.

NET Bible
And the rest of the Jews also joined with him in this hypocrisy, so that even Barnabas was led astray with them by their hypocrisy.

New Heart English Bible
And the rest of the Jewish believers joined him in his hypocrisy; so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.



So maybe you want to cling to the KJV. WEll that's an even harsher word used: DISSIMULATION

dis·sim·u·la·tion
dəˌsimyəˈlāSH(ə)n/
noun
[COLOR=#878787 !important]noun: dissimulation; plural noun: dissimulations[/COLOR]

• concealment of one's thoughts, feelings, or character; pretense.
  [COLOR=#878787 !important]"an attempt at dissimulation"[/COLOR]
  [TABLE="class: vk_tbl vk_gy"]
  [TR]
  [TD="class: lr_dct_nyms_ttl"]synonyms:[/TD]
  [TD]pretense, dissembling, deceit, dishonesty, duplicity, lying, guile, subterfuge, feigning, shamming, faking, bluff, bluffing, posturing, hypocrisy"he was capable of great dissimulation and hypocrisy"
  [/TD]
  [/TR]
  [/TABLE]
  
  Are you capable of admitting you were wrong? Or will your pride prevent you from confessing this sin also?

NOW, GETTING BACK TO THE QUESTION. SINCE PETER OBVIOUSLY SINNED HERE, IS HE SAVED? OR ARE YOU MORE PERFECT THAN PETER?

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I just saw something in that verse - you have been faithful with a FEW things...this suggests the person has not been faithful with everything.

And it seems to tie in to the verses that say about certain kings: and he did good in Gods eyes but NEVERTHELESS, he did not tear down ALL the idols of his father.

It also seems to tie I to the message to one of the 7 churches in Rev - you have a LITTLE strength...

In a way that is strangely comforting, it also seems to mesh with: to he who is given more, more is expected.

Sorry, this was responding to peterjens last post but what I saw in those verses tying together is actually what a subsequent post addresses that came in first before mine, where the poster says: its "designed to make us feel guilty for not being perfect."

Because the verses that were blocked together for me, which I posted, give the comfort that the sort of perfection others want you to believe you must have is not Gods expectation, but mans expectation.

Its hard to overcome for someone who grew up with a perfectionist parent who they could never do anything good enough around d.

 

[SovereignGrace]

So here you have it brothers and sisters. Do not be deceived by this individual preaching a sinless perfection doctrine that cheapens God's perfect standard and is designed to make the true believer feel guilt that he isn't perfect. Follow how this point went from post post and see the pride and really lying that this man engages in:

From post 41503:

Originally Posted by PJW

[/B]No. I have not committed any sins since my conversion.
I was "converted" from a sinner to a non-sinner.


I don't see the words "sin" or "hypocrisy" mentioned in Gal 2.
Peter's "blame" stemmed from his giving credence to continued submission to parts of the law that were no longer in effect.
Thousands of other Jews were still using the law in Jerusalem: do you think they were all sinners?


If the sign says, "Don't use hair dryer in the bathtub", do you suppose everyone is doing so?
To infer that all Peter's "brothers" commit sin is erroneous thinking.
If a supposed brother manifests his service to sin, our forgiveness of that man will be his first step into belief, as the sin itself showed he wasn't submitted to God in the first place.


My pride in in God, and His Son Christ Jesus, who has saved me from service to the destroyer of men.



Well there's your problem!! You must be reading a different Bible. Here is Galatians 2, where Paul calls Peter and the other Jews with him HYPOCRITES!

Galatians 2: 11 Now when Peter[a] had come to Antioch, I withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, FEARING those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, why do you[b] compel Gentiles to live as Jews?[c]15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

So whether intentional or not, you have just lied, and on Scripture! Please tell me how you can now rationalize this lie in your mind.


Not only was Peter being a hypocrite, but he was being untruthful (lying) about the Gospel!! How on earth are you able to twist in your mind that he wasn't sinning!?

Your comment about Jesus telling Peter to forgive brothers who sin is so warped and convoluted I don't think even you are buying it.

I honestly feel for you. You have such a low view of our Lord and His perfection.

Here is his response to my post:
I don't know what version of bible you are using, but it sounds...adulterated to promote somebody's personal doctrine.

Not only was Peter being a hypocrite, but he was being untruthful (lying) about the Gospel!! How on earth are you able to twist in your mind that he wasn't sinning!?



Your comment about Jesus telling Peter to forgive brothers who sin is so warped and convoluted I don't think even you are buying it.
I honestly feel for you. You have such a low view of our Lord and His perfection.


"Don't "feel for me", pity yourselves for having fallen for a religion that tolerates sin.
Jesus said the truth would set you free....of service to sin. (John 8:32-34)
If you ever get sick of offending God, He has made a way to quit offending.
Thanks be to God!"



His pride runs so deep, and he has become so deluded by this doctrine, that he cannot admit that he was wrong and lied about Peter being a hypocrite and misrepresenting the Gospel.

You do realize this is 'resurrection33' you are talking about?

 

[SovereignGrace]

Well, PJW is holier than Apostle Paul, who called himself the chief of sinners. How many inspired books has he written?

 

[loveme1]

Who am I to believe?

https://twitter.com/dcontroversal/status/797219436998443008

https://twitter.com/dcontroversal/status/782766332295077888

I wonder what type of example you lead. Paul lived a life which he said he was an
example to follow and be like as he was following Christ.

I wonder if you really know what this really is, because based on this testimony, you
have no clue.

It is easy to appear on cc and cause a stir, to stand for one position while actually living
another. But I do wonder what is the point?

Is it grandiosity, putting people in their place, manipulation and putting your finger up at
authority?

Your symbol for your twitter account says it all. Is this the example you want to be to
the world in Christ, as a good loving witness to the King of Kings?

What are the twitter links to?

 

[PennEd]

You do realize this is 'resurrection33' you are talking about?

You're sure brother? I wonder if that is true, and we ask him, and he lies, how he could justify that in his mind?

Of course simply making the account would be a deceptive lie in and of itself, so if ;he did that, he probably wouldn't have any issue lying again.

But maybe it's not him.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Who am I to believe?

https://twitter.com/dcontroversal/status/797219436998443008

https://twitter.com/dcontroversal/status/782766332295077888

I wonder what type of example you lead. Paul lived a life which he said he was an
example to follow and be like as he was following Christ.

I wonder if you really know what this really is, because based on this testimony, you
have no clue.

It is easy to appear on cc and cause a stir, to stand for one position while actually living
another. But I do wonder what is the point?

Is it grandiosity, putting people in their place, manipulation and putting your finger up at
authority?

Your symbol for your twitter account says it all. Is this the example you want to be to
the world in Christ, as a good loving witness to the King of Kings?

This is beneath you peter. Way beneath you. His account was hacked and you know that. And WHY would you post trash and cursing and not give WARNING about what someone will see when they click those links? Why would you do that to someone??

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

Its been a long time time since any one of you has truly and utterly disappointed me but you have just done so peter.

 

[SovereignGrace]

You're sure brother? I wonder if that is true, and we ask him, and he lies, how he could justify that in his mind?

Of course simply making the account would be a deceptive lie in and of itself, so if ;he did that, he probably wouldn't have any issue lying again.

But maybe it's not him.

Same age and same writings, imo.

 

[PennEd]

Same age and same writings, imo.

Yes. Possibly. There are several here I suspect, but aren't quite certain, have been here before and banned.

 

[preacher4truth]

You do realize this is 'resurrection33' you are talking about?

Both "'33" and "'63" are back.

 

[Stunnedbygrace]

I can't let this lie peter. The person who first posted that filth had the post removed. Then you went and dug it up and brought it back because it pleased you. You owe everyone an apology. Including the mods, who removed what you brought back. I am so angry and disappointed with you that I have to leave. Awful behavior peter

 

[loveme1]

I think it is time we all stopped the hating on.. imagine those in need coming in and reading this thread.. we are becoming disgraceful.. GOD help us love and forgive.. myself came close today to reporting a post.. I never have reported anyone here.. I would never report for different beliefs.. but remarks like using weed killer.. is passive aggressive hate.. we really must stop the hate.

Love and Truth in a patient manner for the Glory of Heavenly Father and Our Lord and Saviour.. come on Children of the Most High Let the Light shine to the world.. here and everywhere.

 

[PHart]

just once, just once, I wish someone would show 1 post in which someone wrote " we are saved and covered by grace. sin all you want, it does not matter."

you would think as many times as some claim that is being said, it would be easy to find a direct quote of it. but, for all their accusing, they seem to be unable to find that.

now, there very well could be an answer as to why they cannot find a quote of someone saying " sin does not matter ", but i'll leave that up to ya'll to figure out.

Anybody who says there is nothing you can do, say, or think, or believe that can forfeit your salvation is saying grace is a license to sin.

 

[PHart]

I think it is time we all stopped the hating on.. imagine those in need coming in and reading this thread.. we are becoming disgraceful.. GOD help us love and forgive.. myself came close today to reporting a post.. I never have reported anyone here.. I would never report for different beliefs.. but remarks like using weed killer.. is passive aggressive hate.. we really must stop the hate.

Love and Truth in a patient manner for the Glory of Heavenly Father and Our Lord and Saviour.. come on Children of the Most High Let the Light shine to the world.. here and everywhere.

'Ichabod'. You probably know what that means.

It's why I am not posting much here anymore.