Not By Works
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The entire chapter of 1Chronicles 16 gives us a picture of the church if one has eyes to see. Takes some understanding of symbols.
There are 4 points I want to show.
Verse 22
~1Ch 16:22 Saying, TouchH5060 notH408 mine anointed,H4899 and doH7489 my prophetsH5030 noH408
harm.
I've heard Christians use this verse to say they cannot be touched with a critical eye, but the anointed is not us.
The Hebrew Word for Messiah. This is a prophetic chapter...breathed by Holy Spirit to show Messiah and His body.
H4899
[FONT=Arial (Arabic)][FONT=Arial (Arabic)][FONT=Arial (Arabic)]מָשִׁיחַ
[/FONT]mâshı̂yach
maw-shee'-akh
From H4886; anointed; usually a consecrated person (as a king, priest, or saint); specifically the Messiah: - anointed, Messiah.
Total KJV occurrences: 39
2. The book of Revelations states not to add to it or take away.. This is the revealing of Jesus Christ...don't add, dont' take away.
3.
1Co 3:10 As an expert builder using the grace that God gave me, I laid the foundation, and someone else is building on it. But each person must be careful how he builds on it.
1Co 3:11
After all, no one can lay any other foundation than the one that is already laid, and that is Jesus the Messiah.
4.
Luk_6:48
He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
"whose house are we"
5. Luk_6:49
But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.
Earth is symbolic of men. Dust of the earth.
The results of laying the house upon the right foundation..the rock, is works.
Which are:
~
1Ch 16:7 On that very day, David composed this psalm of thanksgiving to the LORD just for Asaph and his companions:
David's Song of Thanks
1Ch 16:8 Give thanks to the LORD, calling on his name. Make what he has done known among the people.
1Ch 16:9 Sing to him, sing psalms to him, and think about all of his miraculous deeds.
1Ch 16:10 Find joy in his holy name; let the hearts of those who keep on seeking the LORD rejoice.
1Ch 16:11 Seek the LORD and his strength. Always look to him.
1Ch 16:12 Keep remembering the awesome deeds that he has done, along with his miracles and the rulings that he has handed down,
1Ch 16:13 you descendants of his servant Israel, you descendants of Jacob, the ones he has chosen.
1Ch 16:14 He is the LORD our God. His justice is in all of the land.
If we do these things...
Joh_12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
[/FONT]
[/FONT]
There are 4 points I want to show.
Verse 22
~1Ch 16:22 Saying, TouchH5060 notH408 mine anointed,H4899 and doH7489 my prophetsH5030 noH408
harm.
I've heard Christians use this verse to say they cannot be touched with a critical eye, but the anointed is not us.
The Hebrew Word for Messiah. This is a prophetic chapter...breathed by Holy Spirit to show Messiah and His body.
H4899
[FONT=Arial (Arabic)][FONT=Arial (Arabic)][FONT=Arial (Arabic)]מָשִׁיחַ
[/FONT]mâshı̂yach
maw-shee'-akh
From H4886; anointed; usually a consecrated person (as a king, priest, or saint); specifically the Messiah: - anointed, Messiah.
Total KJV occurrences: 39
2. The book of Revelations states not to add to it or take away.. This is the revealing of Jesus Christ...don't add, dont' take away.
3.
1Co 3:10 As an expert builder using the grace that God gave me, I laid the foundation, and someone else is building on it. But each person must be careful how he builds on it.
1Co 3:11
After all, no one can lay any other foundation than the one that is already laid, and that is Jesus the Messiah.
4.
Luk_6:48
He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
"whose house are we"
5. Luk_6:49
But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.
Earth is symbolic of men. Dust of the earth.
The results of laying the house upon the right foundation..the rock, is works.
Which are:
~
1Ch 16:7 On that very day, David composed this psalm of thanksgiving to the LORD just for Asaph and his companions:
David's Song of Thanks
1Ch 16:8 Give thanks to the LORD, calling on his name. Make what he has done known among the people.
1Ch 16:9 Sing to him, sing psalms to him, and think about all of his miraculous deeds.
1Ch 16:10 Find joy in his holy name; let the hearts of those who keep on seeking the LORD rejoice.
1Ch 16:11 Seek the LORD and his strength. Always look to him.
1Ch 16:12 Keep remembering the awesome deeds that he has done, along with his miracles and the rulings that he has handed down,
1Ch 16:13 you descendants of his servant Israel, you descendants of Jacob, the ones he has chosen.
1Ch 16:14 He is the LORD our God. His justice is in all of the land.
If we do these things...
Joh_12:32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.
[/FONT]
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Who is "you all"? I have not said that anybody gives another license to sin. My post was against the idea that those here who believe in and rely on and live by the grace and mercy of Christ do not view the weakness of the flesh as a license to sin.
Who gives them self license to sin? The person who sins. Who sins? Everyone. Who asks for forgiveness of their sins? Sinners who repent of their sins. All sins but one are already forgiven for the one who repents. I do see both sides of the issue, and take exception to those who preach that Jesus can lose those that are given to Him, when He said He would not let any slip/be snatched from His hands.
Who gives them self license to sin? The person who sins. Who sins? Everyone. Who asks for forgiveness of their sins? Sinners who repent of their sins. All sins but one are already forgiven for the one who repents. I do see both sides of the issue, and take exception to those who preach that Jesus can lose those that are given to Him, when He said He would not let any slip/be snatched from His hands.
We may not even be committing willful sins...but we in our humanity are sin. It's our nature. The foundation of Jesus Christ is a new nature that He gives us. We just aren't always mindful of this when we start out, nor are we mature and have laid down all at His feet.
It's a process and it's His Work, Holy Spirit works in us to do and to be.
It's a process and it's His Work, Holy Spirit works in us to do and to be.
E
Your right, I have a one dimensional view, Christ is my view. Christ is my hope. Christ is my focus, And Christ is my shepherd. When I stray, he comes and gets me, and being his sheep. I hear his voice and I follow.
You have what I call a two dimensional view. It is not just on Christ, But on yourself.
God gave abraham a covenant of Grace Abraham was not even awake when God confirmed it, And God did not give Abraham any conditions, He said I WILL.
That is the new covenant, It replaces the old covenant, which says if you do these things, I will do those things. That covenant was double ended, It depended on God, and the person having the ability to do what God demanded.
What did God demand?
"Confirm and OBEY EVER WORD written in this law"
No one who ever experienced Gods true love would ever want a divorce.
All I can fathom is you have never experienced it, thats why you can not comprehend it..
but I will not judge, Only go off what I see.
Nope. I believe Gods love is so great and so powerful so wonderful and so unimaginal that anyone who has ever truly experienced it will never want to walk away from it.
and by the way, John said they were never saved, (they were never of us), Your argument is with him, not me..
What is the difference? it is still lost. it is still something someone had, then they no longer have it, by their own actions of what you call "giving it back" they lost it.
Wrong dude, the Abraham covenant was not on free choice, it was based on Gods promise.
Mans choice could not stop Israel from becoming a nation, Mans choice could not stop it from getting its land, Mans choice could not stop it from giving birth to the savior. and mans choice can not stop God from fulfilling his promise of all the world being blessed by the seed of Abraham (the new covenant).
if they think they are hopelessly lost, then they must still believe in Jesus, which means your view that they have fallen because they now reject Jesus and do not even believe he exists has been a false view all along.
second, I gave my view yesterday, I in fact gave two possibilities, Only one of which they were never saved. So again, You have slandered me, Do you ever get sick of sinning my friend? I have no problem discussing the word with you out of love, But if your going to continue to slander me with your lies.. We can have no discussion..
Well here we go again, Your lies and your hate has twisted you into this person that can not fathom anything I say anymore.
You think I would say I have done no wrong? Unlike others, I do not think I can hide from God, when I make a mistake, I go to him because he is my abba father, I do not have to hide my sin from him, I openly confess my sin.
Your arguing against a doctrine which you think I believe, you are not trying to discuss my view at all.. Yesterday you correctly said we need to stop using key words like OSAS and WORKS, because it is preventing us from having real conversation, yet here you are going against your own advice and arguing a doctrine and view you think I believe, and not what I really think.
by the way, i di dnot condemn that persons family member to hell yesterday like you said I did. Are you ever going to apologize for your slander?
You have what I call a two dimensional view. It is not just on Christ, But on yourself.
God gave abraham a covenant of Grace Abraham was not even awake when God confirmed it, And God did not give Abraham any conditions, He said I WILL.
That is the new covenant, It replaces the old covenant, which says if you do these things, I will do those things. That covenant was double ended, It depended on God, and the person having the ability to do what God demanded.
What did God demand?
"Confirm and OBEY EVER WORD written in this law"
No one who ever experienced Gods true love would ever want a divorce.
All I can fathom is you have never experienced it, thats why you can not comprehend it..
but I will not judge, Only go off what I see.
Nope. I believe Gods love is so great and so powerful so wonderful and so unimaginal that anyone who has ever truly experienced it will never want to walk away from it.
and by the way, John said they were never saved, (they were never of us), Your argument is with him, not me..
What is the difference? it is still lost. it is still something someone had, then they no longer have it, by their own actions of what you call "giving it back" they lost it.
Wrong dude, the Abraham covenant was not on free choice, it was based on Gods promise.
Mans choice could not stop Israel from becoming a nation, Mans choice could not stop it from getting its land, Mans choice could not stop it from giving birth to the savior. and mans choice can not stop God from fulfilling his promise of all the world being blessed by the seed of Abraham (the new covenant).
if they think they are hopelessly lost, then they must still believe in Jesus, which means your view that they have fallen because they now reject Jesus and do not even believe he exists has been a false view all along.
second, I gave my view yesterday, I in fact gave two possibilities, Only one of which they were never saved. So again, You have slandered me, Do you ever get sick of sinning my friend? I have no problem discussing the word with you out of love, But if your going to continue to slander me with your lies.. We can have no discussion..
Well here we go again, Your lies and your hate has twisted you into this person that can not fathom anything I say anymore.
You think I would say I have done no wrong? Unlike others, I do not think I can hide from God, when I make a mistake, I go to him because he is my abba father, I do not have to hide my sin from him, I openly confess my sin.
Your arguing against a doctrine which you think I believe, you are not trying to discuss my view at all.. Yesterday you correctly said we need to stop using key words like OSAS and WORKS, because it is preventing us from having real conversation, yet here you are going against your own advice and arguing a doctrine and view you think I believe, and not what I really think.
by the way, i di dnot condemn that persons family member to hell yesterday like you said I did. Are you ever going to apologize for your slander?
ive only repeated what is written in the bible,,
you need to take the log out of your own eye.. And whilst your at change your name coz theres nothing royal about declaring You can not grow in scripture .. still waiting for you to repent of this..
this could be your chance for some royal redeeming quality...
anyway im of out got christian duties to do goodbye hope you fall out of your delusion too
you need to take the log out of your own eye.. And whilst your at change your name coz theres nothing royal about declaring You can not grow in scripture .. still waiting for you to repent of this..
this could be your chance for some royal redeeming quality...
anyway im of out got christian duties to do goodbye hope you fall out of your delusion too
You are better than your post, we all know you are.
E
Oh we cannot know a persons heart today!?!?
but all day, yesterday, you claim you can tell when someone was not really saved in the church
The fact your own hypocrisy eludes you is cause for much Godly concern....this is the early warning signs of a deluded, double minded man...being tossed to and fro not sure what to believe in.....
but all day, yesterday, you claim you can tell when someone was not really saved in the church
The fact your own hypocrisy eludes you is cause for much Godly concern....this is the early warning signs of a deluded, double minded man...being tossed to and fro not sure what to believe in.....
Can someone please try to show this man he does not have an understanding of anythign I am saying,, I am trying to love this man like PennEd said I should, but it is getting very difficult when all this mad does is slander and attack..
Listen EG...there is no condemnation anymore upon His body. Don't take the comments personal. If they are wrong, it's against Jesus not you. That alone frees us to love others. I have my troubles too with it, but we have Holy Spirit as our helper. So rest back into Him, take upon you His mantle...His wholeness...and relax.
God is with us all. We may be different streams but we all lead back to the River of life.
God is with us all. We may be different streams but we all lead back to the River of life.
E
OMG, Do you hate me that much dude?
You are making a complete and utter fool of yourself, all because you have a vendetta against me. How stupid is that? do you not see what you are doing?
Saying fruit is not PROOF of salvation does not mean there should be no fruit at all.
I have said 1000 times a person who is saved, out of the result of that salvation will prpduce fruit.
You want to keep up this nonsense, I will report you, and suggest everyone else does too.. Your war is not going to gain you any brownie points, and if you think it is going to hurt me, You do not know me at all (well I think that has actually already been proven with most of your posts today)
You are making a complete and utter fool of yourself, all because you have a vendetta against me. How stupid is that? do you not see what you are doing?
Saying fruit is not PROOF of salvation does not mean there should be no fruit at all.
I have said 1000 times a person who is saved, out of the result of that salvation will prpduce fruit.
You want to keep up this nonsense, I will report you, and suggest everyone else does too.. Your war is not going to gain you any brownie points, and if you think it is going to hurt me, You do not know me at all (well I think that has actually already been proven with most of your posts today)
You said someone was not saved yesterday and continued saying you knew when someone was not saved all day, yesterday.......then today tell us you do not know a persons heart only God does....
There are pages of documented posts by YOU, stating bearing fruit and works are not ever needed to prove you are a christian, and anyone expecting to see that is a fruit inspector and looking for evidence of salvation ....a apple tree is still an apple tree even if it is dead and produces no fruit...you state this and agree with others that state it and have for pages and pages......
BUT today...........
you state both works and bearing fruit must be immediate in the life of a Christian....even a baby christian...
Now you can huff and puff my house down all you want to, but a word of advice is in order here....clean up your own house before huffing and puffing others down....
E
if you see a brother sin, You call him out on it in a non judgmental way.
If you see a brother sin and let him continue in that sin, You have enabled the sin of your bother.
One of the problems in CC is people are too afraid to call others out when they are in blatant sin.
Other than that I agree with you, As I said earlier, He can not affect me and his lies can not hurt me,, But they do hurt the testimony of God in a christian chatroom.
Is it a sin to state what one believes when it's not quite in agreement with our own thought EG?
We can only say what we believe.
Also, do we really need to defentd the one who is the only defender of all truth?
Holy Spirit is the helper of all who are born again. We aren't. We should be able to compare things if we are one with His body...and be open to hear exactly what is said.
But, not all are there yet. I can say it...but can I live it? Only if I remain in the Spirit.
I love you EG...really I do. And DCon...I love the way you stand for the foundation of the truth of Jesus.
We can only say what we believe.
Also, do we really need to defentd the one who is the only defender of all truth?
Holy Spirit is the helper of all who are born again. We aren't. We should be able to compare things if we are one with His body...and be open to hear exactly what is said.
But, not all are there yet. I can say it...but can I live it? Only if I remain in the Spirit.
I love you EG...really I do. And DCon...I love the way you stand for the foundation of the truth of Jesus.
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nobody is coming to the aide of a double minded man that is unstable in all his ways as you are...your denial is pathological and you need help....
You think I have not encountered people like you before...that think you are all it, that can mow down others and then hide behind the word and act like they've e done nothing wrong...
The truth about what I have posted about you today is on display for all to see...your a little boy crying wolf in this post....because until now, nobody on this site, would get in your face about your duplicity and own slander and, malice and rage...
The sooner you start owning yourself the sooner you will be free....
You think I have not encountered people like you before...that think you are all it, that can mow down others and then hide behind the word and act like they've e done nothing wrong...
The truth about what I have posted about you today is on display for all to see...your a little boy crying wolf in this post....because until now, nobody on this site, would get in your face about your duplicity and own slander and, malice and rage...
The sooner you start owning yourself the sooner you will be free....