Not By Works
- Thread starter dcontroversal
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NoNameMcgee
Guest
makes me think of
1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
§Great scripture.
The door to heaven has been closed to many here that post the Word of God
by some Christians who believe that only they have the truth and everyone else is lost.
Yes, thankful for salvation from death.
Our life in Christ starts at the point of Salvation, He indwells us and we live our lives with Him.
We get to be a participant in what he is doing!. My peace comes from trust. I trust him, no matter what happens to my flesh, my Spirit is one with Him.
I get to rest in that.
That is why I love Him so much, because I know that He no longer holds my sin against me, and I know how much He truly loves me.
Jesus not only came so we could have life in Him, but so that God could come down and have life with us. Relationship.
I live out of the abundance of what He has done, I thank Him for the inheritance that I don't deserve!
Scripture teaches that we have EVERYTHING for life and godliness.
EPH 1:3
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Notice he says ALL, not some
2 Peter 1:3
According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
Notice he says ALL things, not some
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PHart
Guest
That's right. That's why the person who says he is born again must have works. Not to buy them salvation, but because that's what born again people do. Born again people overcome the world. People who say they are born again and know him, but who do not obey God, are liars. That's what John said, not me.
"4The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him" (1 John 2:4 NASB)
But so many people in the church today think their cold dead loveless works-less confession of faith is going to save them on the Day of Judgment, because as they say, "salvation is sooo not of works", oblivious to the fact that if they really did have the salvation that is secured solely by faith apart from works they'll have works on the Day of Judgment to prove it.
AMEN......last time I checked....JESUS begins and FINISHES our faith...to say one can BELIEVE (JESUS start a work of faith) and then LOSE that....flat calls JESUS a LIAR and WEAK......IT is a SLAP in the face of JESUS and is blasphemy to the core....
JESUS said I WILL finish the GOOD work I BEGAN in YOU
IF he has BEGAN a work of FAITH he will FINISH it and bring it to fruition.....there is NO USED to believe and now I DON'T to the extent one can lose salvation.....it is ignorant to say that and denies the two referenced verses in this post!
Sure Fran......I have never been afraid of anyone.....and if push comes to shove as a Marine I can be very lethal....yeah I know..........
If you live by the sword,
You shall die by the sword.
Mathew 26:52
You'd push and shove me?
I'll bet you wouldn't...
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PHart
Guest
Which is the Calvinist argument, which I respect. At least Calvinists believe that it is only those who presently believe and will believe to the very end, and have the works to prove it, that have eternal life.
I don't try to persuade Calvinists away from what they believe. If they believe they can never stop believing (and are therefore always saved) then good. At least if or when the day comes that they are struggling with unbelief they will know to scurry back to their faith in Christ and not entertain demonic teachings that say they are still saved even if they stop believing.
No, he would not!
That comment was never meant to be taken literally - and you know it...
Amen! Saving belief in Christ continues and is not some shallow, temporary belief that has no root, produces no fruit and withers away.
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NoNameMcgee
Guest
For anyone
Matthew 25:1-13
25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.
hm..
what would compare these 5 virgins to?
_________________________________
nonbelievers?
____________________________________
those who were luke warm and lost their salvation?
____________________________________
reprobates?
Matthew 25:1-13
25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.
2 And five of them were wise, and five were foolish.
3 They that were foolish took their lamps, and took no oil with them:
4 But the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.
5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept.
6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him.
7 Then all those virgins arose, and trimmed their lamps.
8 And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves.
10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.
11 Afterward came also the other virgins, saying, Lord, Lord, open to us.
12 But he answered and said, Verily I say unto you, I know you not.
13 Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.
hm..
what would compare these 5 virgins to?
_________________________________
nonbelievers?
____________________________________
those who were luke warm and lost their salvation?
____________________________________
reprobates?
Christ works through us... for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.
Galatians 2:20
I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.
Romans 8:1-39
There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. ...
Romans 5:1-21
Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God. More than that, we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance, and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us. ...
Hebrews 4:10
For whoever has entered God's rest has also rested from his works as God did from his.
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PHart
Guest
Sure, if you want him to, and because you want him to, you will continue in faith in Christ. Calvinist's believe you will always want to.
But the important thing is Calvinists believe that works must be attached to faith in Christ, or you were never born again to begin with. So can we wrap this thread up, now that we all agree saving faith works and that there is no such thing as a born again person who has not been changed into someone who is growing up into the stature of Christ? And so it is that salvation is indeed secured apart from works but works are required to accompany salvation, or you were never born again by faith apart from works to begin with as you think you were.
Can we unplug the coffee pot and shut off the lights and go home now?
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UnderGrace
Guest
That is the truth.
We do not have God's perspective on who is a believer and who is not a believer.
The believer is sealed so how can they become an unbeliever?
They cannot.
We do not have God's perspective on who is a believer and who is not a believer.
The believer is sealed so how can they become an unbeliever?
They cannot.
Okay, this really makes no sense, you know? Whether one is Calvinist or not we are saying a true believer does not stop believing, whereas you say only the Calvinist is safe believing that?
Its not an argument, its reality.
Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:
1 Corinthians 1:8 He will sustain you to the end, so that you will be blameless on the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
If I have the Spirit of the Creator of the universe living in me (which I do), His promises will not fail.
S