The Rapture

[KJV1611]

I'm curious how Judas managed to accomplish everything the antichrist will accomplish. He died before Pentecost.


The physical temple will be rebuilt.


You will...

Y'all have a great night.

Judas isn't the antichrist. The man of sin is also called the son of Perdition. People like Judas are the man of sin.

 

[KJV1611]

Don't you think us Futurists are trying to help you Preterists?

I'm all ears, but when some one takes the finished work of Jesus Christ in Daniel 9:27 and perverts into the antichrist signing a 7 year peace treaty... I stop listening.

 

[Sully]

the first step is to forget everything we think we know

nah, pass on that.

 

[KJV1611]

nah, pass on that.

That's why you're where you are.

 

[Sully]

That's why you're where you are.

You're asking me to discard everything the Holy Spirit has taught me. Where are you?

 

[shrume]

I'm all ears, but when some one takes the finished work of Jesus Christ in Daniel 9:27 and perverts into the antichrist signing a 7 year peace treaty... I stop listening.

Dan 9:27 is not talking about Jesus Christ.

 

[J7]

In the dispensationalist view has God gathered the Jews back together in the land WITHOUT repentance? Is this biblical?

No. The repentance refers to God. God does not change his mind, 'repent'

although God did regret making man

 

[J7]

They were not just Jews, they were every tribe....please

KJV1611,



Do you realize what you just did?? You just agreed with me. The time of Jacob's trouble wasn't the Cross, it came 36 years later during the War with Rome. Notice only those found in the Book were delivered? These delivered were the 144K Christian Jews who were divinely led to Pella, of the Decapolis, a region where Jesus once passed and from whence people came to hear Him. Jesus was likely already working on this region to accept His church from His wrath to come upon all of Judea and Samaria.

You are correct in citing Dan 12. Here this is clearly the Great Tribulation, the War of the Jews, the end of the ages. It is here where Daniel is told to rest and arise at the "end of days" which meant the end of the nation of Israel.

 

[J7]

No.
Prophecy is completed.

Habbakuk prophesied that Nebuchadnezzar would ravage Judea. It happened.

When you say prophesy never actually completes you make God look like a mystic babbler

Again, prophecy is the word of God and the word of God is eternal. It does not become moot at a set point in time. Being eternal it echoes thru time. The Jews rejected their Bridegroom and got their come-uppance, now the gentiles are rejecting their Bridegroom and they will receive their come-uppance. The two positions, past vs future, are not mutually exclusive! Really, if you get down to the gnats rear about it, it's happening right now while we speak. Right this moment, somewhere in this world, someone is leaving it and finding themselves before Christ among a multitude of praising saints from the beginning of time, about to be screened for entrance into the Wedding Feast.

KJV, VCO, you're both right and you're both wrong. The eternality of God's word says these events are not exclusive of each other.














Gonna be on the road next day or two. Bless you guys for keeping this civil!

 

[J7]

PW the saints resurrected with Christ, not 36 years later... you've got JOSEPHUS on the brain lol.

'At that time' refers to AD30 to AD 73

 

[J7]

Well by your crazy logic the 70 weeks will run through the Millennium then, as the only reason for a rod of iron is to deal with sinfuul mankind

Daniel 9:24)
Seventy weeks are decreed upon thy people and upon thy holy city,
1)to finish transgression,
2)and to make an end of sins,
3)and to make reconciliation for iniquity,
4)and to bring in everlasting righteousness,
5)and to seal up vision and prophecy,
6)and to anoint the most holy.

For those who say the 70th week was fulfilled in 70AD:
1) is sin "finished"? No.
2) have people stopped sinning? No
3) has reconciliation been made? Arguable.
4) is everlasting righteousness here? No.
5) is prophesy sealed? depends on interpretation.
6) Is Christ king now? If you're an amill preterist, yes. Otherwise, no. The kingdom is not here yet.

 

[J7]

You've been reading too many Tim Lahaye novels

No it is NOT abominable, when it is the 70th WEEK of Daniel. THE LAST COVENANT SHALL BE FIRST, and THE FIRST COVENANT SHALL BE THE LAST TO FINISH.

Someone, how about the HIGH DEGREE of probability that the Antichrist after HE sets up HIS THRONE in the Holy of Holies, orders all the PRIESTS to be beheaded in full view of everyone to start with, followed everyone else who Refuses to bow to him as GOD.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 (NRSV)
[SUP]1 [/SUP]As to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we beg you, brothers and sisters,
[SUP]2 [/SUP] not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as though from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord is already here.
[SUP]3 [/SUP] Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day will not come unless the rebellion comes first and the lawless one is revealed, the one destined for destruction.
[SUP]4 [/SUP] He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, declaring himself to be God.
{LIVE ON CNN & all the other CABLE TV NEWS CHANNELS.}

 

[J7]

II don't think Daniel said that anyone would stop sinning, only that an end of sin would be made. Hebrews 9:26 tells us that Jesus did put away our sin. I'm not here to argue the point, people can take it or leave it.

Lol. You are telling people to take or leave their Faith.

Kind of lol, but really not lol at all.

Terribly sad really

 

[J7]

@Bogadile

You said that Jews accept that the 70 weeks are passed.

So how do they understand these verses then, how do they not see Christ in them?

[FONT=&quot]to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Do Futurists see Christ in these verses, or are they also awaiting a different Messiah?[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]

 

[VCO]

If you're waiting for the wedding, then you missed the wedding. We are right now THE BODY of CHRIST - the twain have become one flesh.

A Jewish Bridegroom is Married by the acceptance of the Proposal, (DRINKING FROM THE CUP). BUT THE WEDDING CEREMONY IS ALWAYS AFTER THE MANDATORY SEPERATION PERIOD, DURING WHICH THE BRIDEGROOM BUILDS A NEW DWELLING PLACE FOR HIS BRIDE, IN HIS FATHER'S HOUSE OR VERY NEAR TO IT. IT IS NOT LIKE OUR WEDDINGS HERE IN THE USA.

WE ARE STILL IN THE MANDATORY SEPERATION PERIOD.

After the marriage covenant had been established, the groom would leave the home of the bride and return to his father's house. There he would remain separate from his bride for a period of twelve months.7 This period of separation afforded the bride time to gather her trousseau and to prepare for married life.8 The groom occupied himself with the preparation of living accommodations in his father's house to which he could bring his bride.

At the end of the period of separation the groom would come to take his bride to live with him. The taking of the bride usually took place at night. The groom, best man and other male escorts would leave the groom's father's house and conduct a torch light procession to the home of the bride.9 Although the bride was expecting her groom to come for her, she did not know the exact time of his coming.10 As a result the groom's arrival would be preceded by a shout.11 This shout would forewarn the bride to be prepared for the coming of the groom.

After the groom received his bride together with her female attendants, the enlarged wedding party would return from the bride's home to the groom's father's house.12 Upon arrival there the wedding party would find that the wedding guests had assembled already. BIBLE STUDY MANUALS: JEWISH MARRIAGE CUSTOMS

ONLY THE FATHER CAN DECIDE WHEN THE SON IS DONE WORKING ON THE NEW DWELLING PLACE FOR HIS BRIDE.


Mark 13:32 (GW)
[SUP]32 [/SUP] “No one knows when that day or hour will come. Even the angels in heaven and the Son don't know. Only the Father knows.


Therefore JESUS IS WAITING for His Father to give that Permission. IF THE FATHER wants more time for us to lead more to salvation by our witnessing: SO BE IT. I have never seen the Picture below before, but I KNOW it was taken in the home of the Bridegroom's FATHER. BECAUSE those customs in Orthodox Judaism DO NOT CHANGE:

 

[KJV1611]

You're asking me to discard everything the Holy Spirit has taught me. Where are you?

I'm not asking you to do anything, I'm suggestion that you throw everything you think you know away and let the word of God teach you.

 

[VCO]

You've been reading too many Tim Lahaye novels

I have never read a single one of his books, and didn't even like his program, and would change the channel when he came on. I learned most of what I am telling you from Zola Levitt, a strict practicing JEW, who was led to the LORD by a Baptist Minister, and from Dr. John MacArthur, President of the Master's Seminary, and a few others.

 

[KJV1611]

Dan 9:27 is not talking about Jesus Christ.

You have to really twist the words and the grammar in Daniel 9:27 to make the antichrist fit that verse. Remember Jesus said:

Psalm 40:7 KJV
Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,

Volume in 1611 meant bulk, mass or quantity. The bulk of the bible is written about Jesus.

 

[KJV1611]

'At that time' refers to AD30 to AD 73

I was talking about the resurrection that happened once when Chirst rose.

 

[VCO]

Sure he's been revealed. He's the son of perdition (Judas), the fake Christian. I'd like to know how "The Antichrist" can sit on the throne of the temple of God seeing how the temple of God is the body of believers JOINED together with Christ. I don't believe that for one second.. no sir!

Zechariah 14:21 (HCSB)
[SUP]21 [/SUP] Every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah will be holy to the LORD of Hosts. Everyone who sacrifices will come and take some of the pots to cook in. And on that day there will no longer be a Canaanite in the house of the LORD of Hosts.


Maybe you need to loose your presuppositions, and go back to studying.