Not By Works

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
Ah, you make a very good point, as this point also exposes the false grace doctrine. The false grace message says sin (works of the flesh) still has dominion over you when you are born again of the Spirit and under grace.

But the true grace message says when you are born again of the Spirit and truly under grace sin shall not have dominion over you.

So when they say works do not matter, they also include the works of the flesh=sin in the whole mix of works as those that do not matter.

Sin is a work people, and sin does matter, that is also why Jesus came and was crucified. :)
The one with a fetish about sin speaks.....this is not about sin pal.....it is about being saved by faith apart from human merit and or effort.....
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
2 But his delight is in the law of the Lord; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
4 The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
Excellent verse that deal with our walk....NOT obtaining eternal salvation......!
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
There's a BIG difference between works getting salvation & works necessary to maintain salvation. The latter comes as a result of being changed & empowered by God. We can't boast of those, either.:)

Salvation is a once for all act....there is no maintaining salvation...he that began the good work will bring it to fruition......

Jesus it the beginner and finisher of our faith.......
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
Excuse me that I have had some real wacked teaching and some here sound just like it.... I was a mess under all that garbage..
I was not hostile, just making a statement.....and grace is a thread woven completely through the bible.....
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
OK I see you are addressing single posts and not the conversation of them.. your thread, do as you want.. next time, I'll make my own..

????????????? What are you talking about.......obviously I am going thru and addressing most statements made in each post...
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
So you KEEP yourself saved by your works?
Jesus keeps me saved. He does not need my help.
Amen to that...he is the beginner and finisher of my faith and he that began the good work will bring it to fruition.....ALL glory to God dia Jesus......
 
H

HisHolly

Guest
I know I see that.. my points were addressed by another, you picked a scab basically.. is all I'm saying.. I probably do it too after I thought about it..
????????????? What are you talking about.......obviously I am going thru and addressing most statements made in each post...
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
I'm trying to help you by preventing further deflections on your part. I know my shortfalls and am prayerfully working on them. In a spirit of love I pray you focus on your shortfalls. That said, I'm proclaim our salvation does not hang in the balance; Jesus' mission is complete.
Amen to that....He was clear....It is finished = paid in full..........The Heavenly Father dia Jesus has done all the work....we just need to enter into his rest dia faith.....once saved always saved....it is eternal...end of story!
 

DiscipleDave

Senior Member
Sep 4, 2012
3,095
70
48
It does not get any plainer..........Our righteous works have ZERO to do with Salvation!

English Standard Version
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Berean Study Bible
He saved us, not by the righteous deeds we had done, but according to His mercy, through the washing of new birth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Berean Literal Bible
He saved us, not by works in righteousness that we did, but according to His mercy, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit,

New American Standard Bible
He saved us, not on the basis of deeds which we have done in righteousness, but according to His mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewing by the Holy Spirit,

King James Bible
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
All these verses are specifically referring to How a person GETS SAVED. There are hundreds of other verses in Scriptures that plainly teach what a person MUST do once they ARE SAVED.

Col 3:8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. :9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;


This is NOT a suggestion, this is NOT saying try to put off these things, this Holy Inspired Word of God is teaching us CHRISTIANS what we MUST do now that you ARE SAVED. Woe to this generation who does not understand the simplicity of believing the Scriptures.

Heb_12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

NOT a suggestion, but what Scriptures plainly and simply instructs those who ARE SAVED to DO. Woe to this generation who believe this or that particular verse all the while make void hundreds of other verses because they do not line up with their doctrines that they hold on to.

People, wake up. Understand there is a big difference from "Getting Saved" and "Being Saved" Better start understanding this, or you will find that you are left behind.

Most Typical Christian of today believe and rely on all the verses about "Getting Saved" and altogether ignore, make void, or interpret away, all the hundreds of verses which plainly teach what a person MUST Do once they ARE SAVED.

Tit_3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.


NOT a suggestion, what we are suppose to do. What? if a person does Good Works in this generation they are judged as trying to get to Heaven through their good works? And don't let anyone teach in this generation to make sure to maintain Good Works, because if you do they will hang you at the stake and start fire to it, because you are teaching works for Salvation, you are evil if you teach to this generation that Faith and Works go hand in hand. EXACTLY what Scriptures plainly teach as well. But no this generation don't have any works, therefore to justify their own NOT having any works, persecute those who teach you are suppose to have works ALSO.

Surely if i tell you a Truth, you will say that i am boasting and the such, but so that you may grasp the TRUTH, i will tell it to you. whatsoever i ask in prayer, i do receive. (only one exception though) What am i now evil and wicked because i tell you that God grants to me whatsoever i ask in prayer? Do you also think the Apostles are evil and wicked as well for they testify to the same thing.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.


So let me understand, if i say that same thing, which is True, i am wicked and evil, but if the Apostle says it, he is right and Holy? How does the Apostle John get from Jesus whatsoever he asks Him for? Well he plainly tells us that too.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 23 And this is his commandment, That we should 1) believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ (FAITH), AND 2) love one another (WORKS), as he gave us commandment. 24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

i teach Faith + Works = Salvation, which i also live by. i have Faith and Works and anything i ask in prayer is given to me. Do you ask and receive not? Maybe because you believe in Faith ONLY, and have no works at all. Therefore is the reason your prayers are not answered. i teach what Scriptures teach. Those who believe Scriptures will believe what i teach, because what i teach is what Scriptures teach. Jesus and i are ONE. Light up the torches, there will be a fire tonight.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
 
Last edited:

Utah

Banned
Dec 1, 2014
9,701
252
0
Salvation is a once for all act....there is no maintaining salvation...he that began the good work will bring it to fruition......

Jesus is the beginner and finisher of our faith.......
Why do some peeps fail to understand this? Why???!!!
 

Utah

Banned
Dec 1, 2014
9,701
252
0
All these verses are specifically referring to How a person GETS SAVED. There are hundreds of other verses in Scriptures that plainly teach what a person MUST do once they ARE SAVED.

Col 3:8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. :9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;


This is NOT a suggestion, this is NOT saying try to put off these things, this Holy Inspired Word of God is teaching us CHRISTIANS what we MUST do now that you ARE SAVED. Woe to this generation who does not understand the simplicity of believing the Scriptures.

Heb_12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

NOT a suggestion, but what Scriptures plainly and simply instructs those who ARE SAVED to DO. Woe to this generation who believe this or that particular verse all the while make void hundreds of other verses because they do not line up with their doctrines that they hold on to.

People, wake up. Understand there is a big difference from "Getting Saved" and "Being Saved" Better start understanding this, or you will find that you are left behind.

Most Typical Christian of today believe and rely on all the verses about "Getting Saved" and altogether ignore, make void, or interpret away, all the hundreds of verses which plainly teach what a person MUST Do once they ARE SAVED.

Tit_3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.


NOT a suggestion, what we are suppose to do. What? if a person does Good Works in this generation they are judged as trying to get to Heaven through their good works? And don't let anyone teach in this generation to make sure to maintain Good Works, because if you do they will hang you at the stake and start fire to it, because you are teaching works for Salvation, you are evil if you teach to this generation that Faith and Works go hand in hand. EXACTLY what Scriptures plainly teach as well. But no this generation don't have any works, therefore to justify their own NOT having any works, persecute those who teach you are suppose to have works ALSO.

Surely if i tell you a Truth, you will say that i am boasting and the such, but so that you may grasp the TRUTH, i will tell it to you. whatsoever i ask in prayer, i do receive. (only one exception though) What am i now evil and wicked because i tell you that God grants to me whatsoever i ask in prayer? Do you also think the Apostles are evil and wicked as well for they testify to the same thing.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.


So let me understand, if i say that same thing, which is True, i am wicked and evil, but if the Apostle says it, he is right and Holy? How does the Apostle John get from Jesus whatsoever he asks Him for? Well he plainly tells us that too.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 23 And this is his commandment, That we should 1) believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ (FAITH), AND 2) love one another (WORKS), as he gave us commandment. 24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

i teach Faith + Works = Salvation, which i also live by. i have Faith and Works and anything i ask in prayer is given to me. Do you ask and receive not? Maybe because you believe in Faith ONLY, and have no works at all. Therefore is the reason your prayers are not answered. i teach what Scriptures teach. Those who believe Scriptures will believe what i teach, because what i teach is what Scriptures teach. Jesus and i are ONE. Light up the torches, there will be a fire tonight.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
I missed where those Scriptures say, or else.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
All these verses are specifically referring to How a person GETS SAVED. There are hundreds of other verses in Scriptures that plainly teach what a person MUST do once they ARE SAVED.

Col 3:8 But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth. :9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;


This is NOT a suggestion, this is NOT saying try to put off these things, this Holy Inspired Word of God is teaching us CHRISTIANS what we MUST do now that you ARE SAVED. Woe to this generation who does not understand the simplicity of believing the Scriptures.

Heb_12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

NOT a suggestion, but what Scriptures plainly and simply instructs those who ARE SAVED to DO. Woe to this generation who believe this or that particular verse all the while make void hundreds of other verses because they do not line up with their doctrines that they hold on to.

People, wake up. Understand there is a big difference from "Getting Saved" and "Being Saved" Better start understanding this, or you will find that you are left behind.

Most Typical Christian of today believe and rely on all the verses about "Getting Saved" and altogether ignore, make void, or interpret away, all the hundreds of verses which plainly teach what a person MUST Do once they ARE SAVED.

Tit_3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.


NOT a suggestion, what we are suppose to do. What? if a person does Good Works in this generation they are judged as trying to get to Heaven through their good works? And don't let anyone teach in this generation to make sure to maintain Good Works, because if you do they will hang you at the stake and start fire to it, because you are teaching works for Salvation, you are evil if you teach to this generation that Faith and Works go hand in hand. EXACTLY what Scriptures plainly teach as well. But no this generation don't have any works, therefore to justify their own NOT having any works, persecute those who teach you are suppose to have works ALSO.

Surely if i tell you a Truth, you will say that i am boasting and the such, but so that you may grasp the TRUTH, i will tell it to you. whatsoever i ask in prayer, i do receive. (only one exception though) What am i now evil and wicked because i tell you that God grants to me whatsoever i ask in prayer? Do you also think the Apostles are evil and wicked as well for they testify to the same thing.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.


So let me understand, if i say that same thing, which is True, i am wicked and evil, but if the Apostle says it, he is right and Holy? How does the Apostle John get from Jesus whatsoever he asks Him for? Well he plainly tells us that too.

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight. 23 And this is his commandment, That we should 1) believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ (FAITH), AND 2) love one another (WORKS), as he gave us commandment. 24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

i teach Faith + Works = Salvation, which i also live by. i have Faith and Works and anything i ask in prayer is given to me. Do you ask and receive not? Maybe because you believe in Faith ONLY, and have no works at all. Therefore is the reason your prayers are not answered. i teach what Scriptures teach. Those who believe Scriptures will believe what i teach, because what i teach is what Scriptures teach. Jesus and i are ONE. Light up the torches, there will be a fire tonight.

^i^

††† In His Holy and Precious Name, Jesus Christ †††

DiscipleDave
The above makes you a deceiver, a preacher of a gospel of a different kind with no power to save and one that is double cursed.....Galatians 1,3

and to be frank.....when you said yesterday or the day before that you speak for God and that Jesus will reference your name on the day of judgment as a witness.....this told everyone on this site that you are a false prophet, one who is not of God and one who is false.........
 
P

Persuaded

Guest
Why do some peeps fail to understand this? Why???!!!
I am reminded of a TV commercial years ago--------
A little girl was in the kitchen as her mom was baking, and as it was removed from the oven, she proudly said
"And I helped"
Some of these folks are looking forward to the time they stand before God and can say "And I helped"
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
I am reminded of a TV commercial years ago--------
A little girl was in the kitchen as her mom was baking, and as it was removed from the oven, she proudly said
"And I helped"
Some of these folks are looking forward to the time they stand before God and can say "And I helped"
I heard that.....me...I trust Jesus to finish what he started and anytime I try to help God it gets hosed up......
 
F

FreeNChrist

Guest
i teach Faith + Works = Salvation, which i also live by. i have Faith and Works and anything i ask in prayer is given to me. Do you ask and receive not? Maybe because you believe in Faith ONLY, and have no works at all. Therefore is the reason your prayers are not answered. i teach what Scriptures teach. Those who believe Scriptures will believe what i teach, because what i teach is what Scriptures teach. Jesus and i are ONE. Light up the torches, there will be a fire tonight.
So God told you something other than what He told the Apostle Paul, eh?

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—
not by works, so that no one can boast." Eph. 2:8-9
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
So God told you something other than what He told the Apostle Paul, eh?

"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—
not by works, so that no one can boast." Eph. 2:8-9
Now remember he speaks for God and God will reference him by his chat name on the day of judgment to condemn men to hell....GOD told him so.......must be right hey!


Originally Posted by DiscipleDave
Most disregard me, because that is what God told me this generation would do. He already told me, this generation would not receive the things that He told me. i even asked Him during that conversation, why then even tell them, if you know they will not hear it? He then told me "So they will not be able to plead ignorance when they stand before ME, they will have no cloak for their sins"

So then those MOST you refer to, will hear my name again on Judgement Day when Jesus says to them "My servant DiscipleDave told you the TRUTH which he testified came from ME, and you rejected what I told him" You that are the MOST have been warned.
 
Dec 12, 2013
46,515
20,401
113
More proof it is not according to works that men can do, but based upon faith, grace and a gift....the word "not of yourselves" is directed at the word faith........

Berean Study Bible
For it is by grace you have been saved through faith, and this not from yourselves; it is the gift of God,

Berean Literal Bible
For by grace you are saved through faith, and this not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,

New American Standard Bible
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;

King James Bible
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Holman Christian Standard Bible
For you are saved by grace through faith, and this is not from yourselves; it is God's gift--

International Standard Version
For by such grace you have been saved through faith. This does not come from you; it is the gift of God