Is that the power of Holy Spirit?

[miknik5]

well. you know...praying in tongues is for personal use

and most definitely builds up each person

we can only bring to the table what we partook of ourselves

Yep....I know
But you also do know if there is no one to interpret it, it is between you and THE LORD

 

[miknik5]

Tell me what the whole point would be if believers together were in a disorderly fashion falling upon the floor, no preaching of THE TRUTH of The GOSPEL, no outward glorifying GOD with words for HIS GRACE AND MERCY most visibly seen in HIS SON?

If an unbeliever comes in and witnesses this?

Are they led to believe?
Or rather the opposite?

 

[Lifted_by_the_word]

This isn't the power of the Holy Spirit it's likely the same spirit as the so called 'Kundalini Awakening.'
When this spirit enters you, it forces you on your knees or fall to the ground beside the person who has their hands on you to worships it.
Guess I'll be the bad guy and say the churches today are corrupt and is spiritual Babylon.



[h=1][/h]

 

[Willie-T]

Tell me what the whole point would be if believers together were in a disorderly fashion falling upon the floor, no preaching of THE TRUTH of The GOSPEL, no outward glorifying GOD with words for HIS GRACE AND MERCY most visibly seen in HIS SON?

If an unbeliever comes in and witnesses this?

Are they led to believe?
Or rather the opposite?

I spent so many years among "dead" Holy Mumblers, that I instantly recognized God's presence the first time I encountered Him moving in this beautifully free way. The first thought I had was, "Thank You for showing me You are still alive in Your church."

 

[miknik5]

I spent so many years among "dead" Holy Mumblers, that I instantly recognized God's presence the first time I encountered Him moving in this beautifully free way. The first thought I had was, "Thank You for showing me You are still alive in Your church."

Dead?

How can they be made alive?

 

[miknik5]

These holy mumblers. How can they be made alive to GOD?
Aren't they washed?

Isnt everyone washed?

why are we even separating ourselves since ALL have been reconciled to GOD and therefore made alive to GOD?

 

[Willie-T]

Dead?

How can they be made alive?

By letting Jesus live in their lives instead of practicing useless rituals. What was the very expression Jesus used to describe the ritual-followers in His time? That's right, "White-washed tombs, full of dead men's bones."

 

[PinkDiamond]

Tell me what the whole point would be if believers together were in a disorderly fashion falling upon the floor, no preaching of THE TRUTH of The GOSPEL, no outward glorifying GOD with words for HIS GRACE AND MERCY most visibly seen in HIS SON?

If an unbeliever comes in and witnesses this?

Are they led to believe?
Or rather the opposite?

I agree with you that this type of service is harmful to unbelievers. However, there is no reason to think that an orderly demonstration of the gifts of the spirit during worship and a good sermon are mutually exclusive. As Lauren has pointed out repeatedly in her posts that there is supposed to be order and not chaos. People do often twist or pervert spiritual gifts as she said. Just like there are true and false conversions there are true and false demonstrations of spiritual gifts. We don't throw out the idea of conversion because of the fake converts.

If you think about it what is more convicting and awe inspiring for an unbeliever to witness than a true demonstration of the Holy Spirit? Also, it makes sense to me that if Christians are truly being led by the Holy Spirit ( including the minister), that the minister would have a message of truth to share with his congregation. As for falling down, I would imagine there have been genuine and non genuine incidents. I don't think it's that far fetched to imagine a person being overcome by the sense of majesty and holiness of God and falling to their knees. The Holy Spirit is powerful. As Christians we are often overcome when in the presence of God. Not to mention there have been countless recorded stories of revivals ( the great awakening comes to mind) in which many in attendance during those meetings were prostrate under conviction of sins and later found salvation. (Those weren't Pentecostal or charismatic meetings). Those prostrate weren't manufacturing that.

I do agree that at times these things seem manufactured. I don't flow with everything I've ever witnessed. You have to assess each situation independently and use discernment. Simply writing off speaking in tongues as being disorderly because you don't understand the tongues isn't right.

 

[miknik5]

By letting Jesus live in their lives instead of practicing useless rituals. What was the very expression Jesus used to describe the ritual-followers in His time? That's right, "White-washed tombs, full of dead men's bones."

HE also said do not call unclean what HE has made clean

Are you able to declare unclean those you have decided are unclean based on the outward cup? Can you really see the inward cup?

 

[Willie-T]

HE also said do not call unclean what HE has made clean

Are you able to declare unclean those you have decided are unclean based on the outward cup? Can you really see the inward cup?

You do know that you just "reversed" the message given to Peter, don't you?

Basically, on that rooftop, Peter was telling the Lord that he ALWAYS did things in decency and order, and would not be caught dead worshiping any other way but through the practice of the learned and perfected Jewish customs and rituals that everyone knew were the only accepted and approved way to worship.

 

[Willie-T]

You do know that you just "reversed" the message given to Peter, don't you?

Basically, on that rooftop, Peter was telling the Lord that he ALWAYS did things in decency and order, and would not be caught dead worshiping any other way but through the practice of the learned and perfected Jewish customs and rituals that everyone knew were the only accepted and approved way to worship.

(Wife came in, and the 5-minute rule got me)

.... and God was telling him, "If I have chosen to do things differently with some people than you have known in your life... by having them fall, or shake, or faint, or laugh, or whatever, don't you, Peter, dare to call my expression in their lives, wrong."

As Gamelil (sp) said, "Be careful, you MIGHT be fighting against God."

 

[kaylagrl]

Yeah, its called charismatic or pentecostal movement.

I think the falling and other things are result of auto/suggestion, hypnosis and nerves made vulnerable by shouting, loud music and hysterical atmosphere.

Yeah I grew up in the Pentecostal church and I take offence to that. Now there are independent pentecostal churches that go ape in their services. There is no order and they have "holy laughter" which was a fad that went though those type of churches and regenerates every few years. But when tongues is in order it is not wrong. And it certainly isn't "hysterical". Ive been in hundreds of Pentecostal churches and if you know what the Bible says,as Lauren posted,you will know the difference between flesh and the Spirit.

For instance my aunt as a young woman had terrible issues with her nerves. It got to a point that they put her in a mental ward at the hospital but was so upset my grandparents took her out. One night she was in a church service and the Spirit hit her. She danced all the way round the church and when she sat down she was delivered of her nervous and anxiety problems that very night. That was the Holy Spirit. She didn't do it to bring attention to herself, thats for certain.

 

[kaylagrl]

yea the "Holy Spirit laughing" phenomenon doesn't make sense to me.....laughing does not edify the person or others...I mean sure maybe if someone is down the Holy Spirit can give joy and make them laugh but this whole "group laugh" type experience is very disturbing.....like videos on youtube with kenneth hagin is something dark about that.....almost like putting people in a trance like state/mesmerized.....The Holy Spirit is more concerned with healing people emotionally, spiritually and physicially, not making a scene like comedy central or what not.....

The holy laughter is a fad that comes through every several years. Its been happening for years. For the most part it is nonsense.

 

[LaurenTM]

So it's more about attacking me than defending the truth?

What about the gift of discernment? Are you not able to discern between real and fake?

I am not anti Holy Spirit but I am very anti abuse of the Holy Spirit.

Many of the charismatic and Pentecostal types are not going to touch this thread because they do not want to own the falling down laughing slain in the spirit stuff the young lady asked about. Note she uses the term priest to describe the one doing the placing of their hands on the persons. Wonder if they are catholic churches to which she is alluding? Given the part of the world from which she writes is seems likely.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

what do you call deliberate twisting of what I say Roger? huh? what is THAT? and you do if often

I didn't attack you

you just have no defense for what you believe...or I should say DON'T believe

without discernment, a person is lost in this world today...which makes your particular pick and choose as to what you do and do not believe all the more alarming

let's not play games

many people here know what you actually think and if insist, I'll go along and post it

I see all kinds of folks touching the thread...what a silly thing to say

 

[LaurenTM]

Yep....I know
But you also do know if there is no one to interpret it, it is between you and THE LORD

I ONLY pray to God

so, yeah

 

[LaurenTM]

This isn't the power of the Holy Spirit it's likely the same spirit as the so called 'Kundalini Awakening.'
When this spirit enters you, it forces you on your knees or fall to the ground beside the person who has their hands on you to worships it.
Guess I'll be the bad guy and say the churches today are corrupt and is spiritual Babylon.

oh good grief

you may know a little something about eastern religions

but apparently not very much about the Holy Spirit


did you use scissors or shears to cut out all the parts about the Holy Spirit in your Bible?

 

[kaylagrl]

I spent so many years among "dead" Holy Mumblers, that I instantly recognized God's presence the first time I encountered Him moving in this beautifully free way. The first thought I had was, "Thank You for showing me You are still alive in Your church."

Insert eye roll here ________ but I sang in a church,it was Baptist actually,that took off and had a Jericho march around the church. Baptists! They took me by surprise thats for sure. People got saved in that service. It was pretty amazing. Sorry in advance that my stories all relate to ministry,I was too stupid to do any other job. So skip by my posts if it annoys you. {not you in particular brother Willie}

 

[Willie-T]

The holy laughter is a fad that comes through every several years. Its been happening for years. For the most part it is nonsense.

I don't get into "Laughing" either. But I also know that I honestly would not bet my life on being so cock-sure it is not of God.

 

[miknik5]

You do know that you just "reversed" the message given to Peter, don't you?

Basically, on that rooftop, Peter was telling the Lord that he ALWAYS did things in decency and order, and would not be caught dead worshiping any other way but through the practice of the learned and perfected Jewish customs and rituals that everyone knew were the only accepted and approved way to worship.

Peter went where he wouldn't have gone
and after that he ate with the "Gentiles". Those whom he initially considered unclean, uncircumcised, who had no part in the things of HOD until GOD sent him to go where he wouldn't have

 

[Willie-T]

Insert eye roll here ________ but I sang in a church,it was Baptist actually,that took off and had a Jericho march around the church. Baptists! They took me by surprise thats for sure. People got saved in that service. It was pretty amazing. Sorry in advance that my stories all relate to ministry,I was too stupid to do any other job. So skip by my posts if it annoys you. {not you in particular brother Willie}

Why should it bother me? I've seen it happen. But, unfortunately, I have also seen far too many "Frozen-Chosen" brothers fight it, tooth and nail, making sure none of that stuff would ever get in "their" building.