It Is satanic Heresy to Deny Eternal Security

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Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
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Dear Ricky,

If you wish to be with the Lord in glory, enjoying His company, you simply must trust Him as Savior. There is no promise of salvation for those who deem Him a chance-giver.

Can you not bring yourself to depend on Him for your eternal destiny?

You don't believe that He saves His people from their sins?
You see that all men will have an eternal destiny. That is what Christ did by His Incarnation, death and resurrection. He gave life, a physical existence back to the world, not just mankind. Your view actually denies the Incarnation and denies that heaven or hell even exist.

The topic is not what Christ did, but man's response to His universal call to come. To be joined with Him now and for an eternity. Hell is just as eternal as heaven.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
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Ok lets look at these verses;

Titus : Profess to know God ( believe in Him), but in works deny Him ( no salvation ).

You are the one who is lost, and can and do not understand the meaning in those verses I gave.

Titus 1:16
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate

It says clearly they profess they know God.

This is what profess means,

  • pro·fess
  • [ prō féss ]


  • declare something falsely: to make a statement falsely claiming that something is the case
  • declare something openly: to make a statement acknowledging something openly or publicly
  • express faith in particular belief: to follow a particular religion

They say they know God ( which would mean they believe in Him ), yet they still deny Him in their works.


Matthew 25:31-46
[SUP]31 [/SUP]When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
[SUP]32 [/SUP]And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
[SUP]33 [/SUP]And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
[SUP]34 [/SUP]Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
[SUP]35 [/SUP]For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
[SUP]36 [/SUP]Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
[SUP]37 [/SUP]Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
[SUP]38 [/SUP]When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
[SUP]39 [/SUP]Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
[SUP]40 [/SUP]And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
[SUP]41 [/SUP]Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
[SUP]42 [/SUP]For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
[SUP]43 [/SUP]I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
[SUP]44 [/SUP]Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
[SUP]45 [/SUP]Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
[SUP]46 [/SUP]And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.


Notice both groups in verses 37 and 44 refer to Jesus as Lord.

Both believe in Him as Lord, but one gets salvation ( eternal life ) the other do to denying Him by works get eternal punishment ( no salvation ).

If you believe it has nothing to do with salvation, then you are misguided because nobody gets punished in heaven.
I know you understand that he needs to redefine words so that his theory will hold at least some validity, and then he can knock that strawman down every time.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
Ok lets look at these verses;

Titus : Profess to know God ( believe in Him), but in works deny Him ( no salvation ).

You again show your vast confusion regarding what Christ did and man's response. Christ saved every single human being from death and sin. In order to be justified by faith one must believe that fact. But attaining eternal life is not something Christ does either alone or unilaterally. Once you get a few facts straight you might be able to understand scripture a little better
Are you speaking to me or Atwood here ?

Because I am not showing confusion anywhere. If one professes to know God, or call the Lord Lord then they have belief in Him to some extent.

However in their works they deny Him. Not accepting what He did for us, not repenting, not asking forgiveness and forgiving others of sins, and not helping others in need.

These are just some of the things the Lord Jesus Christ said that those who are His will do, because we do them out of that love.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
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Are you speaking to me or Atwood here ?

Because I am not showing confusion anywhere. If one professes to know God, or call the Lord Lord then they have belief in Him to some extent.

However in their works they deny Him. Not accepting what He did for us, not repenting, not asking forgiveness and forgiving others of sins, and not helping others in need.

These are just some of the things the Lord Jesus Christ said that those who are His will do, because we do them out of that love.
I am responding to Atwood. Post #3916. I think He was responding to the statements you made regarding Titus.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
Ok lets look at these verses;

Titus : Profess to know God ( believe in Him), but in works deny Him ( no salvation ).

You are the one who is lost, and can and do not understand the meaning in those verses I gave.

Titus 1:16
They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate

It says clearly they profess they know God.

This is what profess means,

  • pro·fess
  • [ prō féss ]


  • declare something falsely: to make a statement falsely claiming that something is the case
  • declare something openly: to make a statement acknowledging something openly or publicly
  • express faith in particular belief: to follow a particular religion

They say they know God ( which would mean they believe in Him ), yet they still deny Him in their works.
No it does not mean "they believe in Him." Believe does not occur and it does not even say they know God. Indeed they claim falsely that they know God. What does that have to do with persons who actually trust the Lord Jesus to save them???

nothing.


[SUP]44 [/SUP]Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord,
That also has nothing to do with trusting Christ as Savior. The fact that they address God by the term "Lord" at the judgment says absolutely nothing to imply they ever trusted Him as Savior.

Notice both groups in verses 37 and 44 refer to Jesus as Lord.

Both believe in Him as Lord, but one gets salvation ( eternal life ) the other do to denying Him by works get eternal punishment ( no salvation ).
Believe does not occur in the passage. Calling God Lord at the judgment implies absolutely nothing about them having trusted the Lord Jesus as Savior, which they never had. Calling God "Lord" in an address implies nothing about having trusted Him as Savior. Every knee shall bow & every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord; that includes every atheist, agnostic, works-truster, water-baptism truster, as well as real Christians.

You are in wonderland here, Kenneth.

If you believe it has nothing to do with salvation, then you are misguided because nobody gets punished in heaven.
You continue not to understand what salvation is. Salvation is about a sinner being helped out of his sinfulness. Thou shalt call His name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins. Neither "salvation," nor "save," nor believe occurs in Matthew 25. And "Now is the day of salvation." Salvation is not a gift that you get for good works at a judgment.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, NOT OF WORKS, lest anyone should boast.

If you want to understand the relationship between believe/faith & save/salvation, study verses that use that or equivalent language.


Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Gal 3:

This only would I learn from you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now perfected in the flesh? 4 Did ye suffer so many things in vain? if it be indeed in vain. 5 He therefore that supplieth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 7 Know therefore that they that are of faith, the same are sons of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all the nations be blessed. 9 So then they that are of faith are blessed with the faithful Abraham. 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under a curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one who continueth not in all things that are written in the book of the law, to do them. 11 Now that no man is justified by the law before God, is evident: for, The righteous shall live by faith; 12 and the law is not of faith; but, He that doeth them shall live in them. 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us; for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14 that upon the Gentiles might come the blessing of Abraham in Christ Jesus; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

Gal 3:22ff

But the scripture shut up all things under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. But before faith came, we were kept in ward under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. So that the law is become our tutor to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But now that faith is come, we are no longer under a tutor. For ye are all sons of God, through faith, in Christ Jesus.

Gal 5:5-6

For we through the Spirit by faith wait for the hope of righteousness. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything, nor uncircumcision; but faith working through love.

Philip 3:8-9
Yea verily, and I count all things to be loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but refuse, that I may gain Christ, and be found in him, not having a righteousness of mine own, even that which is of the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith:

Col 2:6
As therefore ye received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk in him, 7 rooted and builded up in him, and established in your faith, even as ye were taught, abounding in thanksgiving.

2 Tim 3:15b
the sacred writings which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
Titus 1:4
to Titus, my true child after a common faith: Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Saviour.

Heb 3:19ff
And we see that they were not able to enter in because of unbelief. Let us fear therefore, lest haply, a promise being left of entering into his rest, any one of you should seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed we have had good tidings preached unto us, even as also they: but the word of hearing did not profit them, because it was not united by faith with them that heard. For we who have believed do enter into that rest;

Heb 10:39
But we are not of them that shrink back unto perdition; but of them that have faith unto the saving of the soul.

Heb 11:7

By faith Noah, being warned of God concerning things not seen as yet, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; through which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.

1 Pet 1:3ff

Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a little while, if need be, ye have been put to grief in manifold trials, 7 that the proof of your faith, being more precious than gold that perisheth though it is proved by fire, may be found unto praise and glory and honor at the revelation of Jesus Christ: 8 whom not having seen ye love; on whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice greatly with joy unspeakable and full of glory: 9 receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

1 John 5:4-5

4 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that hath overcome the world, even our faith. 5 And who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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You again show your vast confusion regarding what Christ did and man's response. Christ saved every single human being from death and sin.
You again show your vast ability to just say things. There is no proof of such a claim in scripture.

God so loved the World that He gave His only Son that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should nor perish, but have everlasting life.

EVeryone is not saved:

for them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God sendeth them a working of error, that they should believe a lie: 12 that they all might be judged who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

For we are a sweet savor of Christ unto God, in them that are saved, and in them that perish; 16 to the one a savor from death unto death; to the other a savor from life unto life


12 And those by the way side are they that have heard; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word from their heart, that they may not believe and be saved.

It is clear that all are not saved. Christ is the door, if any man enter in he shall be saved. But all do not enter in.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
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Christianity has had the same understanding of scripture for 2000 years and your view cannot even be found in the ballpark.

You have repeated your mantra that goes nowhere
Christendom has had all kinds of variety of beliefs, heretics of all shades, and disagreements on a multitude of issues.

Saying that everyone is saved is Here is the ballpark & my view:

1 Peter 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
1 John 5:10-13
Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Ephesians 1:13
In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
John 6:40
For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believes on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one John 6:47
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
joy,
1 Peter 1:3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
John 1:12
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believes that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

JOHN 20:30
Many other signs therefore did Jesus in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book: 31 but these are written, that ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye may have life in his name.

Act 13:48
And as the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of God: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: 16 howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me as chief might Jesus Christ show forth all his longsuffering, for an ensample of them that should thereafter believe on him unto eternal life.
1 Tim 1:15-17
Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me as chief might Jesus Christ show forth all his longsuffering, for an ensample of them that should thereafter believe on him unto eternal life.

1 John 5:13
These things have I written unto you, that ye may know that ye have eternal life, even unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God.
Eph 1:10ff
to sum up all things in Christ, the things in the heavens, and the things upon the earth; in him, I say in whom also we were made a heritage, having been foreordained according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his will; 12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ: 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation,— in whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God’s own possession, unto the praise of his glory.
Luke 8:11-12
Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 And those by the way side are they that have heard; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word from their heart, that they may not believe and be saved.
Acts 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved, thou and thy house.
1 Cor 1:21
it was God’s good pleasure through the foolishness of the preaching to save them that believe.
Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh shall be justified.

14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; that whosoever believes may in him have eternal life.

John 3:14-18

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whosoever believes on him should not perish, but have eternal life. 1For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. 1He that believes on him is not judged: he that believes not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only Son of God.
John 5:24
2Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believes him that sent me, hath eternal life, and cometh not into judgment, but hath passed out of death into life.
John 6:47
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believes hath eternal life.

John 10:27
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who hath given them unto me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

1 John 5:10-12
He that believes on the Son of God hath the witness in him: he that believes not God hath made him a liar; because he hath not believed in the witness that God hath borne concerning his Son. And the witness is this, that God gave unto us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He that hath the Son hath the life; he that hath not the Son of God hath not the life.
Ps 37:5-6
Commit thy way unto Jehovah;
Trust also in him, and he will bring it to pass.
And he will make thy righteousness to go forth as the light,
And thy justice as the noonday.


Acts 15:8

And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; and he made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.

Acts 26:18b

that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among them that are sanctified by faith in me.

Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.

Rom 3:21-30

But now apart from the law a righteousness of God hath been manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God set forth to be a propitiation, through faith, in his blood, to show his righteousness because of the passing over of the sins done aforetime, in the forbearance of God; 26 for the showing, I say, of his righteousness at this present season: that he might himself be just, and the justifier of him that hath faith in Jesus. 27 Where then is the glorying? It is excluded. By what manner of law? of works? Nay: but by a law of faith. 28 We reckon therefore that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yea, of Gentiles also: 30 if so be that God is one, and he shall justify the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through faith.

Rom 4:1ff

:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believes on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. 6 Even as David also pronounceth blessing upon the man, unto whom God reckoneth righteousness apart from works, 7 saying,
Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin.

9 Is this blessing then pronounced upon the circumcision, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say, To Abraham his faith was reckoned for righteousness. 10 How then was it reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision: 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while he was in uncircumcision: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be in uncircumcision, that righteousness might be reckoned unto them; 12 and the father of circumcision to them who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham which he had in uncircumcision. 13 For not through the law was the promise to Abraham or to his seed that he should be heir of the world, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they that are of the law are heirs, faith is made void, and the promise is made of none effect: 15 for the law worketh wrath; but where there is no law, neither is there transgression. 16 For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, A father of many nations have I made thee) before him whom he believed, even God, who giveth life to the dead, and calleth the things that are not, as though they were. 18 Who in hope believed against hope, to the end that he might become a father of many nations, according to that which had been spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And without being weakened in faith he considered his own body now as good as dead (he being about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20 yet, looking unto the promise of God, he wavered not through unbelief, but waxed strong through faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully assured that what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 Wherefore also it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.

Rom 5:1-2
Being therefore justified by faith, let us have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ; through whom also we have had our access by faith into this grace wherein we stand; and let us boast in hope of the glory of God.
Rom 9:30:
What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith: but Israel, following after a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by works. They stumbled at the stone of stumbling; even as it is written,
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of stumbling and a rock of offence:
And he that believes on him shall not be put to shame.

Rom 10:4ff

For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to every one that believes. For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. But the righteousness which is of faith saith thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down:) or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
Ok lets look at these verses;

You again show your vast confusion regarding what Christ did and man's response. Christ saved every single human being from death and sin.
Heretical poppycock. That is pure Cassian, no Bible.

In order to be justified by faith one must believe that fact.
Believing facts saves no one. And if you believe that, you believe a lie.

But attaining eternal life is not something Christ does either alone or unilaterally.
Christ is eternal God and does not attain eternal life; He has it, always has, & always will.

As to men,

"Thou shalt call HIs name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins."

He is the Savior. The People are the saved.

For any reading this,
if you have reduced Christ to a chance-giver, trust Him as the Savior now. Now is the day of salvation.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
53
48
Because I am not showing confusion anywhere. If one professes to know God, or call the Lord Lord then they have belief in Him to some extent.
Absurd Kenneth. Every knee will bow & every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. Saving faith means depending on the Lord for salvation, not believing that He is Lord of the universe. Even the devil & the angels would have to acknowledge that He is Lord. That is not faith.

However in their works they deny Him.
And your works in posting here deny the Savior. You proclaim promote the false gospel of salvation by works. You deny the Savior and make Him merely chance-giver & judge.

These are just some of the things the Lord Jesus Christ said that those who are His will do, because we do them out of that love.
Now you are not on salvation but works that result from salvation. Those who are his: Once they are His they are saved.

Thou shalt call His name Jesus,
for He shall save Him people from their sins.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
1,960
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You again show your vast ability to just say things. There is no proof of such a claim in scripture.

God so loved the World that He gave His only Son that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM should nor perish, but have everlasting life.

EVeryone is not saved:

for them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God sendeth them a working of error, that they should believe a lie: 12 that they all might be judged who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

For we are a sweet savor of Christ unto God, in them that are saved, and in them that perish; 16 to the one a savor from death unto death; to the other a savor from life unto life


12 And those by the way side are they that have heard; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word from their heart, that they may not believe and be saved.

It is clear that all are not saved. Christ is the door, if any man enter in he shall be saved. But all do not enter in.
I understand your predicament. You need to change the meaning of words and concepts so that whatever it is that you believe scripture gives you support. But we know also that man can make scripture mean anything one desires to make it say as can easily be demonstrated. You are but just one example.

I have explained the Incarnation to you several times already. That you still do not understand is your problem, not mine nor scripture. Giving you the citations, of which there are many, is quite pointless when you changed the meaning of them so that it meets your reconstruction of scripture.

Just to give you a hint, I stated very clearly who was saved and how, and it was not about one's personal salvation, or more correctly the attaining of eternal life. The fact that you deny the Incarnation, per scripture, also makes your religion null and void as to any impact since no man can be "saved" as you understand the word, unless Christ first reverses the fall, the condemnation of death to Adam and all his decendents.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
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Ok lets look at these verses;

You again show your vast confusion regarding what Christ did and man's response. Christ saved every single human being from death and sin.
Your response......

Heretical poppycock. That is pure Cassian, no Bible.
apparently according to your Bible. We all know how you have rewritten the Bible just so you can preach a false doctrine. But scripture clearly teaches the Incarnation and Christ dying, being buried, and rose again to the justification of life to all men. Maybe you should restudy the Bible in light of what it actually says and not accordinig to your interpretation.



Believing facts saves no one. And if you believe that, you believe a lie.[/jquote] Never made the statement. Again, need to construct a strawman so that your false teaching might supposedly have some validity. It stated that it justifies one. Justification is not salvation as well as faith does not save either.



Christ is eternal God and does not attain eternal life; He has it, always has, & always will.
never stated that either. It is YOU, as a believer, who attains eternal life. I could give you many texts that make that statement, but I have already and you changed the meaning of the words and context so that it would not refute your false teaching. Again, just like you do here in your responses, you cannot even state correctly what I stated.

As to men,

"Thou shalt call HIs name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins."

He is the Savior. The People are the saved.
He is the Savior of the world, John 4:42, I John 4:14. He also propitiated the sins of the world, John 2:2.

For any reading this,
if you have reduced Christ to a chance-giver, trust Him as the Savior now. Now is the day of salvation.

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved.
more strawman statements again. Scripture does not teach OSAS and it also does not teach whatever you think the above statement means.
 

Cassian

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2013
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Christendom has had all kinds of variety of beliefs, heretics of all shades, and disagreements on a multitude of issues.

Saying that everyone is saved is Here is the ballpark & my view:

1 Peter 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
1 John 5:10-13
Whoever believes in the Son of God has the testimony in himself. Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar, because he has not believed in the testimony that God has borne concerning his Son. And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Ephesians 1:13
In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
John 6:40
For this is the will of my Father, that every one that beholdeth the Son, and believes on him, should have eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one John 6:47
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life.
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 3:18
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
joy,
1 Peter 1:3-5
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, 5 who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
John 1:12
But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believes that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

JOHN 20:30
Many other signs therefore did Jesus in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book: 31 but these are written, that ye may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye may have life in his name.

Act 13:48
And as the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of God: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: 16 howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me as chief might Jesus Christ show forth all his longsuffering, for an ensample of them that should thereafter believe on him unto eternal life.
1 Tim 1:15-17
Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief: howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me as chief might Jesus Christ show forth all his longsuffering, for an ensample of them that should thereafter believe on him unto eternal life.

1 John 5:13
These things have I written unto you, that ye may know that ye have eternal life, even unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God.
Eph 1:10ff
to sum up all things in Christ, the things in the heavens, and the things upon the earth; in him, I say in whom also we were made a heritage, having been foreordained according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his will; 12 to the end that we should be unto the praise of his glory, we who had before hoped in Christ: 13 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth, the gospel of your salvation,— in whom, having also believed, ye were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 which is an earnest of our inheritance, unto the redemption of God’s own possession, unto the praise of his glory.
Luke 8:11-12
Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 And those by the way side are they that have heard; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word from their heart, that they may not believe and be saved.
Acts 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved, thou and thy house.
1 Cor 1:21
it was God’s good pleasure through the foolishness of the preaching to save them that believe.
Gal 2:15-16
We being Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 yet knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, even we believed on Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by the works of the law: because by the works of the law shall no flesh shall be justified.

14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; that whosoever believes may in him have eternal life.

John 3:14-18

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whosoever believes on him should not perish, but have eternal life. 1For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. 1He that believes on him is not judged: he that believes not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only Son of God.
John 5:24
2Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believes him that sent me, hath eternal life, and cometh not into judgment, but hath passed out of death into life.
John 6:47
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believes hath eternal life.

John 10:27
But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who hath given them unto me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand.

1 John 5:10-12
He that believes on the Son of God hath the witness in him: he that believes not God hath made him a liar; because he hath not believed in the witness that God hath borne concerning his Son. And the witness is this, that God gave unto us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He that hath the Son hath the life; he that hath not the Son of God hath not the life.
Ps 37:5-6
Commit thy way unto Jehovah;
Trust also in him, and he will bring it to pass.
And he will make thy righteousness to go forth as the light,
And thy justice as the noonday.


Acts 15:8

And God, who knoweth the heart, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Spirit, even as he did unto us; and he made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.

Acts 26:18b

that they may receive remission of sins and an inheritance among them that are sanctified by faith in me.

Rom 1:16-17
For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.

Rom 3:21-30

But now apart from the law a righteousness of God hath been manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God set forth to be a propitiation, through faith, in his blood, to show his righteousness because of the passing over of the sins done aforetime, in the forbearance of God; 26 for the showing, I say, of his righteousness at this present season: that he might himself be just, and the justifier of him that hath faith in Jesus. 27 Where then is the glorying? It is excluded. By what manner of law? of works? Nay: but by a law of faith. 28 We reckon therefore that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yea, of Gentiles also: 30 if so be that God is one, and he shall justify the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through faith.

Rom 4:1ff

:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, hath found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not toward God. 3 For what saith the scripture? And Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned unto him for righteousness. 4 Now to him that worketh, the reward is not reckoned as of grace, but as of debt. 5 But to him that worketh not, but believes on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness. 6 Even as David also pronounceth blessing upon the man, unto whom God reckoneth righteousness apart from works, 7 saying,
Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin.

9 Is this blessing then pronounced upon the circumcision, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say, To Abraham his faith was reckoned for righteousness. 10 How then was it reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision: 11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while he was in uncircumcision: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be in uncircumcision, that righteousness might be reckoned unto them; 12 and the father of circumcision to them who not only are of the circumcision, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham which he had in uncircumcision. 13 For not through the law was the promise to Abraham or to his seed that he should be heir of the world, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if they that are of the law are heirs, faith is made void, and the promise is made of none effect: 15 for the law worketh wrath; but where there is no law, neither is there transgression. 16 For this cause it is of faith, that it may be according to grace; to the end that the promise may be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, A father of many nations have I made thee) before him whom he believed, even God, who giveth life to the dead, and calleth the things that are not, as though they were. 18 Who in hope believed against hope, to the end that he might become a father of many nations, according to that which had been spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And without being weakened in faith he considered his own body now as good as dead (he being about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20 yet, looking unto the promise of God, he wavered not through unbelief, but waxed strong through faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully assured that what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 Wherefore also it was reckoned unto him for righteousness.

Rom 5:1-2
Being therefore justified by faith, let us have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ; through whom also we have had our access by faith into this grace wherein we stand; and let us boast in hope of the glory of God.
Rom 9:30:
What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith: but Israel, following after a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by works. They stumbled at the stone of stumbling; even as it is written,
Behold, I lay in Zion a stone of stumbling and a rock of offence:
And he that believes on him shall not be put to shame.

Rom 10:4ff

For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to every one that believes. For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. But the righteousness which is of faith saith thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down:) or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach.


A lot of posting and citations but nothing in scripture supports OSAS. It is and has always been a man made theory that was first instituted by Calvin and his proponents eventually coined the phrase. It is based on the doctrine of predestination and is quite logical and understandable under that doctrine. However, predestination as understood by Calvin and all subsequent proponents cannot be found in scripture either. In fact, it is anthetical to scripture, which is why OSAS is also anthetical to scripture.
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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by resident heretic Cassian; just his word, which goes nowhere.

Once Saved, Saved! Eternal Security. The prove is conclusive.

Jehovah redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.

Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because
thou hast done it;

1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.

Col 3
When Christ, who is our life, shall be manifested, then you also with him shall be manifested in glory.

2 Thes 2:16
Now our Lord Jesus Christ himself, and God our Father who loved us and gave us eternal comfort and good hope through grace,

End of Rom 8:
And we know that to them that love God all things work together for good, even to them that are called according to his purpose. For whom
he foreknew,
he also foreordained to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom
he foreordained, them
he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom
he justified, them
he also glorified.


31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? 3He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not also with him freely give us all things? Who shall lay anything to the charge of God’s elect?
[NO, NOT CASSIAN!]

It is God that justifieth; who is he that condemneth?
[NO, NOT CASSIAN!]

It is Christ Jesus that died, yea rather, that was raised from the dead, who is at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us. Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or anguish, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Even as it is written,
For thy sake we are killed all the day long;
We were accounted as sheep for the slaughter.

Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities,
nor things present, nor things to come,

nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature
[NO, NOT CASSIAN!]
, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

< 1 Pet 1
Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to his great mercy begat us again unto a living hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, unto an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you, who by the power of God are guarded through faith unto a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

THE OVERCOMER
Revelation 3:5
The one who overcomes will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father… 1 John 5:4-5 For whatsoever is begotten of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. And who is he who overcomes the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? For everyone who has been born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.
And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of the throne saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he shall dwell with them, and they shall be his peoples, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God: and he shall wipe away every tear from their eyes; and death shall be no more; neither shall there be mourning, nor crying, nor pain, any more: the first things are passed away. And he that sitteth on the throne said, Behold, I make all things new.

And he saith, Write: for these words are faithful and true. And he said unto me, They are come to pass. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. He who overcomes shall inherit these things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. But for the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and fornicators, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part shall be in the lake that burneth with fire and brimstone; which is the second death.

< 2 Tim 4:18
The Lord will deliver me from every evil work and will save me unto his heavenly kingdom;

Rm 6:23b
the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 6:37
All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.
John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

2 Corinthians 1:22
And who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
Romans 11:29
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.
1 John 5:13
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.

Philippians 1:6
And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

PRAISE THE AUTHOR & PERFECTER OF OUR FAITH!

Thou shalt call His name Jesus,
For He shall save His people from their sins!!!
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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But scripture clearly teaches the Incarnation and Christ dying, being buried, and rose again
Of course.

to the justification of life to all men
False, that is your word, not God's. And it is noted that you proved nothing, you just up & said it.

It stated that it justifies one. Justification is not salvation as well as faith does not save either.
All can see that you say things Cassian, but prove nothing.

Sirs what must I do to be saved?
Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved. Faith is the only human requirement; belief is the only MUST I DO.

And I quoted already a ton of scripture.

It is YOU, as a believer, who attains eternal life.
Glad you admit it. When will you repent of your sin of disbelief and join me? You just go on saying things -- no Bible proof.

You claim, "He is the Savior of the world, John 4:42, I John 4:14. "

God does not say that in either verse you quote. He came to be the Savior and salvation is offered to all the world. But they don't all get saved. And you don't prove it.

He also propitiated the sins of the world, John 2:2.
You mean 1 John 2:2. But that does not say that Christ propitiated sins at all. The verb for propitiate does not occur there (hilaskomai) and "sins" is not the direct object there either. The propitiation is for or concerning the whole world. But that does not save the whole world, neither is "save" used there.

Salvation is by grace through faith, not of works, lest anyone should boast. And eternal security is reiterated in scripture. The evidence has been posted.
 
Jan 27, 2013
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Truth - and sight - is available only to those who have the courage to question whatever they think they know.
how can you question, a yes or no answer. ie [SUP]16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life
[/SUP]
either you believe or you dont. and if you believe, whos eternal security is given to you. ( the holy spirit, opens your eyes after , you answer, yes to this question. ) when you say no, who open your eyes,to god.
 
K

kennethcadwell

Guest
how can you question, a yes or no answer. ie [SUP]16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life
[/SUP]either you believe or you dont. and if you believe, whos eternal security is given to you. ( the holy spirit, opens your eyes after , you answer, yes to this question. ) when you say no, who open your eyes,to god.
This is a wonderful scripture, and I and some others do not discount this scripture.

Believing in Jesus Christ means more then just; He came in the flesh, was crucified on the cross for remission of sins, and that He rose on the third day.

If you believe in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you also believe in what He said we are to do, and the signs or works that follow a believer.
 
Jan 27, 2013
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This is a wonderful scripture, and I and some others do not discount this scripture.

Believing in Jesus Christ means more then just; He came in the flesh, was crucified on the cross for remission of sins, and that He rose on the third day.

If you believe in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you also believe in what He said we are to do, and the signs or works that follow a believer.
i agree, too, to this scripture, however learning and listening , from the holy spirit, is a different topic.


[SUP]

[/SUP]
[SUP]17 What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later,does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise.18 For if the inheritance is based on law, it is no longer based on a promise; but God has granted it to Abraham by means of a promise.
[/SUP]


[SUP]5 So then, does He who provides you with the Spirit and works miracles among you, do it by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith?

[/SUP]
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
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Believing in Jesus Christ means more then just; He came in the flesh, was crucified on the cross for remission of sins, and that He rose on the third day.

If you believe in Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, you also believe in what He said we are to do, and the signs or works that follow a believer.
Kenneth, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems to me that you do not understand what it means to believe in the Lord Jesus. Believing in the Lord Jesus is not answering, "Yes," to a preacher when he asks you if you believe that Jesus is the Son of God. It is not believing that He came, was crucified & rose on the 3rd day. It is not believing in what He said we are to do. In short, saving faith is not believing any number of facts. Believing in the Lord Jesus means that you trust Him with your life & destiny. It means you depend on Him to change your nature & give you eternal life. Depend, trust, not "believe this or that fact."

Can you not bring yourself to trust Him with your eternal destiny?

Thou shalt call HIs name Jesus, for He shall save His people from their sins.

Can you bring yourself to believe that?
 

Atwood

Senior Member
May 1, 2014
4,995
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Eternal Security is in the Old Testament

Ps 34
YHWH redeems the soul of his servants;
And none of them who take refuge in him shall be condemned.

Ps 52
But as for me, I am like a green olive-tree in the house of God:
I trust in the lovingkindness of God for ever and ever.
I will give thee thanks for ever, because thou hast done it;

compare NT:

1 Thes 5 end:
"And the God of peace himself sanctify you wholly; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved entire, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. Faithful is He Who calls you, Who will also do it.

He does the saving. The one who trusts the Savior is the saved, the savee.